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Thread: ESE's works engine tuner

  1. #34456
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    8th February 2007 - 20:42
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    You are right Flettner. I had a huge argument with RK several years ago , as he simply refused to provide any evidence whatsoever in a back to back dyno test that the " crinkle cut "
    head with identical squish and CC made any difference in power.
    And here in the video , once again , we have a stock head that is being replaced by a RK mod version with 1/2 the squish depth and obviously higher compression .
    The guy even measured the chamber shape ( not the actual cc as would have been way more scientific ) and I would guess its probably at a minimum up one com point .

    If I did a head with 1/2 the squish depth ie 1.8 down to 0.9 , and went from say 13:1 to 14 : 1 com ratio OFF COURSE it will have way better throttle response , feel good for a butt dyno , and would show a good gain
    in a real dyno shootout.
    This is COMPLETELY FUCKING OBVIOUS , but seems to escape all the Merican Catalogue Buying Warriors.

    The crinkle cuts would reduce somewhat , the added flame front turbulence created by the higher MSV , and add heat soak/reflection area to the squish band thus inducing deto .
    Those are comments made from a lifetime of experience in trying to increase the first factor , and trying just as hard to reduce the second.
    Am I a narcissistic wanker , of course , just ask RK or NoLuc for completely unbiased opinions on that.
    Ive got a thing thats unique and new.To prove it I'll have the last laugh on you.Cause instead of one head I got two.And you know two heads are better than one.

  2. #34457
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    25th March 2004 - 17:22
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    Thing is, you can't dyno test anodising.

    You can however remove it, much to my pleasure I found last weekend removing the blue off the Chinese YZ kickstarter for my Red GasGas.. some Selley's oven cleaner gel for a few min, scrub, repeat.
    Joy.
    Don't you look at my accountant.
    He's the only one I've got.

  3. #34458
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    8th December 2014 - 14:39
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    intake and exhaust resonance

    Wobbly
    Thank you very much for your response about the intake and exhaust resonance and where best we might use them on different types of engines. I believe I recall Blair said the 3rd harmonic resonance worked the best. Since snowmobiles have a fair amount of room and with a centrifugal clutch you might use the first harmonic resonance?
    In the old days the RK head would fall into the category of snake oil and the men that sold them were called snake oil salesmen and believe me some of them were very good at talking you out of your money. Had one tell me that putting grooves in the crank wheels would gain 1 or more HP by atomizing the fuel better. We could find no gain on the dyno.

  4. #34459
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    25th March 2004 - 17:22
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    Ahh, but were the grooves Counter rotating or Contra rotating? (?!!?)

    Dyno = where Optimism meets Murphy's Law.
    Don't you look at my accountant.
    He's the only one I've got.

  5. #34460
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    23rd March 2015 - 21:24
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    the MX industry is full of big claims with no proofs.

    Ever seen a dyno chart directly from FMF or some other company selling 'tuning' parts? Yet they sell like crazy and the only feedback you find is "revs to the moon" or "pulls like no other" - if your wallet is 500$ lighter of course that exhaust changes the world for you...

  6. #34461
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    20th January 2010 - 14:41
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    Quote Originally Posted by koenich View Post
    the MX industry is full of big claims with no proofs.

    Ever seen a dyno chart directly from FMF or some other company selling 'tuning' parts? Yet they sell like crazy and the only feedback you find is "revs to the moon" or "pulls like no other" - if your wallet is 500$ lighter of course that exhaust changes the world for you...
    Pipes are one of the few i would say are dyno'ed
    here is a tour of Pro Circuit


    FMF
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYmyAzRB-ts https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJ8Iwrz-WmU
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  7. #34462
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    23rd March 2015 - 21:24
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    sure, sometimes they are by magazines. but if you want to sell say a pipe, why not post the dyno chart on your webshop? none of the big companies does this, just some words they'll spread the power band blabla and revs to the moon. Tyga has one on their page and one of the most beautiful (but also expensive) pipes for a YZ250: http://tyga-performance.com/product_...oducts_id=3867

    Flettner, get into that business. But absolutely necessary to anodize parts

  8. #34463
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    20th January 2010 - 14:41
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    Quote Originally Posted by koenich View Post
    sure, sometimes they are by magazines. but if you want to sell say a pipe, why not post the dyno chart on your webshop? none of the big companies does this, just some words they'll spread the power band blabla and revs to the moon. Tyga has one on their page and one of the most beautiful (but also expensive) pipes for a YZ250: http://tyga-performance.com/product_...oducts_id=3867

    Flettner, get into that business. But absolutely necessary to anodize parts
    Here is their Dyno room at 8 minutes


    Cool Yoshimura factory tour complete with photos of Croz


    Akvrapovic tour
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  9. #34464
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    23rd March 2015 - 21:24
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    sure Husa, I have no doubt they all have dynos (or at least hope) and some capable operator. my point was that they don't advertise with results but rather some words. as Wob said, Murican shoppers is all you need...just browse through VitalMX forum

  10. #34465
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    20th April 2011 - 08:45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flettner View Post
    Ok, we have talked about this before, RK tech heads with the crinkle cut combustion chamber....
    Why are people so keen to spend money on something thats workings appear unexplainable?
    Halve the squish clearance, reduce the combustion volume and add something the customer can actually see, and you're in business.
    Next year you can omit the crinkles, use a different anodizing color, and business will be better than ever
    Click image for larger version. 

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  11. #34466
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    20th January 2010 - 14:41
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    Quote Originally Posted by koenich View Post
    sure Husa, I have no doubt they all have dynos (or at least hope) and some capable operator. my point was that they don't advertise with results but rather some words. as Wob said, Murican shoppers is all you need...just browse through VitalMX forum
    I am sure there is lots of that. There are hundreds of other dubious go faster goodies to there to take weekend warriors money. that want shiny magpie parts
    But for pipe manufacturers, it would be waste of time to advertise hp as the next company would just say they make 1 hp more to try and get sales not only that the pipes have to work with all the other mods.
    FMF and Pro circuit are professional organizations that sell on race results.
    MX races are not often won in the dyno room. They are won based on what is faster around the track for an entire race.
    There was an ad that ran for years for a US pipe maker that showed his butt dyno that worked off lap times. Bassini
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  12. #34467
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    18th April 2017 - 23:08
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muhr View Post
    Now to the question, are there any guys that have been rebuilt to dry-clutch that i can get some inspiration from on smart solutions?

    Edit: Perhaps the easiest thing is to steal gears and cage mounts from a kz (unfortunately, the gears are a little longer)
    Today a friend was over and left an old bottom end with a dry clutch that he had lying around, gave up the idea of rebuilding a wet clutch when he had one. Also got a little cute rod for the project.

    Quote Originally Posted by SwePatrick View Post
    Ratio 6, that is air/fuel ratio?

    And E85 is known to beeing able to give you 7-8% percent more power than ordninary pumpfuel, so that´s about correct.
    Yes. The stated numbers are from manufacturers the optimal amount for maximum combustion, it is possible to adjust all values based on your preferences.
    Engine numbers are only schematic and should be adjusted. the idea was to find a way to define the minimum octane, which is quite reservatively done.
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    No amount of experimentation can ever prove me right; a single experiment can prove me wrong.

  13. #34468
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    28th August 2015 - 00:01
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    Model engines used a combustion chamber with much more limited cuts. The idea was to improve scavenging. Both the origonal designer and the manufacturer who "borrowed" the idea claimed around 1000 more rpm.

    Lohring Miller

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  14. #34469
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    20th June 2020 - 07:10
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    Case reed proposition

    I have an air cooled twin engine that shares the same bore and stroke as a more modern liquid cooled engine. The liquid makes very good power. I am essentially taking most characteristics from the liquid and applying them to my anemic air cooled turd. I have ground off the Cooling fins around the exhaust duct and welded up the area for auxiliary exhaust ducts before welding fins back on. Also welded up the floor and the bottom corner radii with aluminum sticks ( thanks for the tip wobbly ) will be doing the 75% nozzle on this and reshaping the duct to oval. The air cooled is a cylinder reed with very little intake area and no good way to add larger reed blocks due to the design limitations and rear studs. I know... I know I could cut the pistons and so on but I would rather have a nice inner transfer radius and a case reed air cooled. I have cut the reed blocks off of the liquid engine and am planning on welding them to the air cooled engine. Even though the bore and stroke is the same, the liquid has a taller case and shorter cylinder than the air cooled counterpart, due to the intake design amongst other reasons I am sure. There is not enough room between the crank bearings on the air cooled engine with the shorter upper case half ( the case splits horizontally ) for the liquid reed blocks to have straight unblocked flow into the crank case. The rectangle area of the aluminum after the pedals on the reed blocks is 2480mm2. If I keep the height the same and reduce the width to the width of the case between the bearings it would be 1953mm2 at the case. My idea was to make the reduction in width with a block of aluminum welded between the reed blocks that I cut from the liquid engine and the air cooled case. I know this would also add to the case volume and or intake length? ( If that makes sense to anyone I will be surprised ) This finally leads me to my question. Is it acceptable to have a smaller intake area after the reed petals at the crankcase, or would it be a better idea to transition the rectangle into a square of the same area? I ask this because I know the inner area of the reed block already is not the same as what is going through the reeds.

  15. #34470
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    8th February 2007 - 20:42
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    You need to be looking at the effective window area of the reed block - having alot of extra area after the reed windows does not aid pressure recovery.
    Ive got a thing thats unique and new.To prove it I'll have the last laugh on you.Cause instead of one head I got two.And you know two heads are better than one.

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