ESE's works engine tuner

[sniemisto]

Thanks a lot for everybody’s input.

I prepared this cylinder time before I started reading pit-lane and this thread. I will now proceed with good info shared in here.

I do final matching of sim file power level to dyno result with adjusting combustion efficiency. In my case its as low as 0.72. I’m not sure if that is the best way. That way false dyno results have effect on combustion efficiency factor. That is affecting at least EGT of sim run. Maybe not that big issue in this case..

[TZ350]

I do final matching of sim file power level to dyno result with adjusting combustion efficiency. In my case its as low as 0.72. I’m not sure if that is the best way.

EngMod2T's sim is power at the crankshaft. It was a good idea but instead of abusing "combustion efficiency" I think EngMod2T has a dedicated adjustment method for adjusting your sim results to match your dyno and the power losses in the drive train.

Anyway I just look at the sim's KW line instead of the HP one. I have found that for my engine the EngMod2T's sim KW curve pretty much predicts the DynoJets HP curve. Lazy, crude and rude but works a treat.

[wobbly]

As TeeZee said EngMod is power at the crankshaft , and the difference from many , many racebike tests is that the DynoJet reads 12 to 15% lower than the crank number due to losses
in the transmission/chain and tyre contact patch - even though its already fudged upwards..
Dont adjust the Combustion Efficiency to fudge the crank number to be lowered to equal to the dyno result.
Take the dyno numbers , add a factor and create an EngMod dyno curve as the comparrison - this is in Post 2T.
Your real CE would lie somewhere between .85 for a low bmep and .95 for a real full house engine build - in a smaller bore high com on good fuel.

Extrude Hone was tested by Kevin Cameron many years ago when it first came onto the market - it lost power in every case with a two stroke.
I think DynoTech magazine found the same result , years ago as well.

[Condyn]

Extrude Hone was tested by Kevin Cameron many years ago when it first came onto the market - it lost power in every case with a two stroke.
I think DynoTech magazine found the same result , years ago as well.

I believe Dynotechs technical editor was Kevin Cameron.

[Brett S]

Internal stinger or just what the heat actually does?



Its PM07-18 from Panthera Motorsport
$6,340.00 USD – $6,980.00 USD

It looks to be more just the welds affecting the thermal imaging camera rather than an internal stinger?
IR temp guns often have a refractive? index adjustment to allow for different metals/finishes/emmisivity etc.
In this case the dull weld area is showing hotter, when you would think with its extra themal mass would make it look colder when getting heated up.

[wobbly]

DynoTech Research - independant testing facility doing main Snowmobiles with an on line magazine subscription service.
I visited them when researching dyno facilities for the BSL500 - a very professional setup .
They were the first to actually document the real bad issues around loss of a fuels Vapour Pressure.
This is now why I insist on storing all fuel in 5L containers with no air space , and adding oil then using one at a time to prevent loss of the light front ends.
Amazing how much difference it makes. , not having blobs of un atomised fuel running thru an engine , making every apperance of being rich , when in reality its lean as hell.

[husaberg]

It looks to be more just the welds affecting the thermal imaging camera rather than an internal stinger?
IR temp guns often have a refractive? index adjustment to allow for different metals/finishes/emmisivity etc.
In this case the dull weld area is showing hotter, when you would think with its extra themal mass would make it look colder when getting heated up.

You are of course right son of Ken.
I was far too busy getting mesmerised by all the pretty colours that i never even noticed the massive enteral weld it loos like the chamber was made like an FMF or similar out of two large pressings


that said it still doesn't explain the grid-like pattern.
Unless they are dolly marks?

[husaberg]

I believe Dynotechs technical editor was Kevin Cameron.

Looks like some Kevin gems are here all right
http://www.dynotechresearch.com/blog...hosenYear=2012

Extrude Hone was tested by Kevin Cameron many years ago when it first came onto the market - it lost power in every case with a two stroke.
I think DynoTech magazine found the same result, years ago as well.

I remember something about it years ago it was being used by the likes of some after market head producer for production stuff but could match a decent dude with a dye grinder
it was reminded by about the rig made by peter Wiliams dad to flow test a G50 or 7R head.
They were not allowed to buy a flow bench as it wasn't made by MAtchless AJS AMC or whoever they were at the time.
So he made a bench with a venturi out of an airbrush and it sicked through only and blotted on the areas of the head with no flow
He got (I think) a 10% increase out of a well-developed engine.

i googled and it looks like he was adding ink upstream of the fuel-air mix.

He was spraying ink into the airstream of the air/fuel mix going into the combustion chamber, and dynoing the results on an actual engine (using fuel/air, not air/ink !)
He found that if he could swirl the mix into the combustion chamber such that he didn't get any ink on the walls in the process, the bhp went up and up.
This added hp after hp on their already existing engine, all it needed was suitable gas flowing direction to achieve this - the porting specialists art.
The output rose from ~30 bhp to over 40 bhp over the years, although the engine was short stroked at some stage

That said Duckworth had some quip about how he could tell as much with an educated finger.

“Just by sticking my finger in the hole I can tell immediately whether air would like to go through it”.


https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/a...eith-duckworth
plus this

In complete contrast with the tape-operated automatic equipment, there is still no substitute for the human eye when it comes to “fettling” cylinder heads and inlet ports. Duckworth himself modifies the first of the chamber designs from his own knowledge, after which a man with a steady eye and a hand tool makes each one just like the last one. A Tracemaster copy milling machine is another recent arrival, capable of copying a pattern to plus or minus less than one thou " Duckworth says they're “hoping to rough combustion chambers out” with it, although it doesn’t mean the end of the hand-work."

Unrelated by still fun
Ford’s association with Cosworth became even closer in 1966, when a joint project was announced, not only for a new Formula Two engine designed to the 1,600-c.c. limit (a production block being required by the regulations this time), but also for a Formula One unit. This time FordÂ’s investment was an announced £100,000 and there is the added bonus of what Duckworth calls “encouragement”, not to mention the use of metallurgical laboratory facilities.
There is the oft-quoted remark that although £100,000 may sound like a lot of money, it had cost Ford £1m simply to put synchromesh on the bottom gear in the Cortina range.

[Pursang]

Oops! Redundant comment. (Always refresh before posting)

[koenich]

You are of course right son of Ken.
I was far too busy getting mesmerised by all the pretty colours that i never even noticed the massive enteral weld it loos like the chamber was made like an FMF or similar out of two large pressings


that said it still doesn't explain the grid-like pattern.
Unless they are dolly marks?

As already mentioned to some extent such a camera is measuring infrared radiation, which is highly depending on the surface finish/angle of capturing if it's a shiny surface. To do it right you'd need to black out the whole pipe and best case calibrate your camera with some surface temp couples...

[Brett S]

You are of course right son of Ken.
I was far too busy getting mesmerised by all the pretty colours that i never even noticed the massive enteral weld it loos like the chamber was made like an FMF or similar out of two large pressings

that said it still doesn't explain the grid-like pattern.
Unless they are dolly marks?

The black cylinder head is also very hot when they turn on the thermal imaging, which cannot be correct.

No idea on that dot matrix, i've never used a thermal imaging camera, only IR temp guns.
The dots don't seem to move when the exhaust moves relative to the camera, so must be something to do with the camera?

Edit: you can also see the white panther logo on the black clutch cover. They are the same temp.

[Brett S]

DynoTech Research - independant testing facility doing main Snowmobiles with an on line magazine subscription service.
I visited them when researching dyno facilities for the BSL500 - a very professional setup .
They were the first to actually document the real bad issues around loss of a fuels Vapour Pressure.
This is now why I insist on storing all fuel in 5L containers with no air space , and adding oil then using one at a time to prevent loss of the light front ends.
Amazing how much difference it makes. , not having blobs of un atomised fuel running thru an engine , making every apperance of being rich , when in reality its lean as hell.

Since you've said this in the past, i've always wondered if (depending on how the racing rules are written) you could pressurise your fuel with say propane to keep the light fractions from leaving the fuel? Might need a stronger fuel container though? It could even saturate the fuel with good stuff?

[Condyn]

https://www.drumpreserve.com/mobile/...?code=featured

Take a look here. I think Jim (from dynotech) owns this company as well. Use nitrogen. It has been cited that Isopentane can be used to restore the lost Reid Vapor Pressure due to its high RVP number. I remember searching for other chemicals with high numbers and think acetone was very high as well. Always wondered if that would work.

We always RVP test our fuel after learning about the terrible fuel storage practices. Many VP 5 gallon cans are stale upon first opening and testing. C12 VP has always been good for me. Also seems to be the most common fuel at the track. (Snowmobiles I am talking) 114 is usually terrible.

Wobbly is indeed right, storing the fuel in small containers instead of cracking open your pail after every race to top off would be highly beneficial. An RVP test after every time you open the can will result in a lower number.

[wobbly]

I have always used dry nitrogen ( as we use for tyre pressure ) on my dyno fuel drum to maintain the RVP.
But I dont understand how using Isopentane or Acetone could be used unless there are no regs on fuel additives .
The vast majority dont get that leaving a fuel ( pumpgas even more than leaded ) if left in the bike or kart tank overnight , open to atmosphere , is virtually fucked the next day.
Using 1/2 a 20L drum after opening it several times , then opening the airspace to woosh away the next day, is also useless , I hate to think how many engines have been lost due to this small factor.
The lead in race fuel/Avgas doesnt evaporate away , so that can be restored somewhat even by adding some 98 pumpgas to aid in lifting the RVP and thus atomisation.

[SwePatrick]

A question!, version one vs version two(stinger/end of pipe).
I have done this change as version one was from 'taking what i had', now i have optimized it to be like version two, and now it suddenly want a lot more fuel.(from 220 main and 45 pilot to 240 main and 58 pilot, alcohol fuel)

Would a twostroker be that sensitive?