Gun Poll

[davereid]

I don't normally quote myself but I was interested to know the answer.

In 2004/2005 (last set of available comparable figures) the rate of death by firearm per 100,000 was:

United States - 10.25

New Zealand - 1.97

(Sources: Center for Disease Control.
AN ANALYSIS OF TRENDS IN FIREARM CASUALTIES IN
NEW ZEALAND
Chaz Forsyth and Clayton Weatherston)

Guns are NOT a crime or public safety issue

Guns are a lethality issue

They actually do kill people

Absolutely they do - thats how they give the small, the female, the elderly and the weak equality against the young, the strong the violent and the criminal.

The fact that they are used in suicide is regretable, as is the fact that accidents occur.

Of course people also kill themselves deliberately and have accidents in cars, motorcycles, swimming pools, with lengths of rope and fixing the toaster.

None of which means we should ban toasters.

Irrelevant data at best, a deliberate corruption of the facts at worst.

[AD345]

"There are none so blind as though who will not see"

I bet we are BOTH thinking that..LOL

I'm not trying to convert ya - and you sure as hell won't change my opinion about gun control - but the debate is fun.

Those facts are not corrupted - they are just facts.

If you round the US rate down to 10 per 100,000 and the NZ rate up to 2 per 100,000 - you are still 500 (!!!) times MORE likely to die from a firearm if you are a US citizen than if you are an NZ citizen.

Sounds like our current laws are pretty good to me.

[davereid]

If you round the US rate down to 10 per 100,000 and the NZ rate up to 2 per 100,000 - you are still 500 (!!!) times MORE likely to die from a firearm if you are a US citizen than if you are an NZ citizen.

Well, 5 times anyway...

[AD345]

Well, 5 times anyway...

yeah - my bad, got confused between 5 times and 500%

[Timber020]

Screw the statistics, I have a friend who is a police statistician and they just have to tune things to make the results read a or b, black or white. The gun debate is just two huge industries leaning on each other like punch drunk boxers while people pour money into the fight from both sides. Neither fighter wants to win or loose because they get paid for just appear to be in the fight.


The laws in NZ for the most part are a good balance. I do think guns should be registered to owners and people should have more solid footing for defending there own property using force, but from what I have seen, we do alright (between the US and Aus's failed systems)
Having a gun in your house to defend yourself is one thing, thinking that somehow anything is going to be better by carrying them around on your person is just massive dillusion. I have done it due to friends having to go places and leaving me there gun to take home. (one time I ended up carrying an mp5 for hours, fn crazy) Guns change the way you think when you have one on you like that, and the guys who really want to carry them are generally the last type of guys you would want carrying them.

If you think a guns going to make you feel safer as you go about your life, just stay in bed, obviously the world is to big and scary for your intestinal fortitude. Better stop riding your bike because your a target without bullbars, after all if everyone drove a kenworth we would all be safer........right?

[MisterD]

Just a question for the firearm afficianados: Realistically, how far are we away from a firearm that is unable to be fired by anyone other than it's owner?

I think I've seen prototype examples of guns that must be aimed away from a smart key carried by the owner, so can't be used against them...what else is there? Some kind of biometric thing?

If this were possible, would or should it change anything?

[davereid]

Realistically, how far are we away from a firearm that is unable to be fired by anyone other than it's owner?

Smith & Wesson had a gun years ago called the "magna key".

If you werent wearing the correct magna ring, it would not fire.

I've just googled it but can't find it.

It was very unpopular as it was perceived as making the gun less reliable.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

My gun cabinet is secured with a "Presco" proximity tag system.

It can't be opened without the tag, so unauthorised people can't get access.

But I can open the safe just like a cupboard - if my tag is near enough, the safe unlocks itself, relocking if I move away.

The tags are quite small - like a small card or dog tag, and only need to be near the reader to work.

[Swoop]

I do think guns should be registered to owners

Much like the Canadian firearms registry system?
A bloated, multi-billion dollar way of wasting taxpayer money without solving a single crime?

[Skyryder]

Just a question for the firearm afficianados: Realistically, how far are we away from a firearm that is unable to be fired by anyone other than it's owner?

I think I've seen prototype examples of guns that must be aimed away from a smart key carried by the owner, so can't be used against them...what else is there? Some kind of biometric thing?

If this were possible, would or should it change anything?

There's a system that requires the handgun to recognise a signal from a chip worn by the owner before the fire will will discharge. Came across this a few days back but can not find it at the moment. Have no idea of range etc.

There are also some proto types with an electronic primer. There has been some experimaentation with sniper rifles with these electronic primers as there is less vibration without a fireing pin.

Skyryder


Skyyrder

[scumdog]

Much like the Canadian firearms registry system?
A bloated, multi-billion dollar way of wasting taxpayer money without solving a single crime?

True.

last I heard it was $800,000,000 overbudget with a 35%+- compliance rate, -figures likely to change.

And the cost is sky-rocketing.

[sAsLEX]

Rivers kill people. Lets ban rivers.




ps I had a happy day in the hunting store buying my christmas presents.

[sAsLEX]

There's a system that requires the handgun to recognise a signal from a chip worn by the owner before the fire will will discharge. Came across this a few days back but can not find it at the moment. Have no idea of range etc.

There are also some proto types with an electronic primer. There has been some experimaentation with sniper rifles with these electronic primers as there is less vibration without a fireing pin.

Skyryder


Skyyrder

SAw that a few years ago. Designed for Police. Wear a insignificant looking ring on the firing hand....... wouldn't take to smart a criminal to take a ring though...... but that is an oxymoron in the general sense.


I work with some electrically operated ordnance. But mine is big, there is portability and duration issues with rifles with electronic firing pulses.