Pure acceleration

**marty** · 27th February 2005, 16:18

read this amazing thing today.

One top fuel dragster makes more HP than the first 4 rows at the Indy 500

At full throttle, a Top Fuel dragster is burning 1 gallon of nitro methane a second - a fully loaded 747 consumes the same amount of jet fuel at full power, and produces 25% less energy

A stock 426 hemi V8 cannot produce enough HP to drive a top fuel supercharger

the flame front for a nitro methane engine is 7500 degrees F

The magnetos supply spark at 44 amps, similar to a home arc welding kit in each cylinder

Once rolling, to accelerate to 300mph, the dragster pulls 4g. The launch acceleration though is nearer to 8g

A top fuel dragster reaches 300mph before you finish reading this sentence

Assuming nothing blows up, a top fuel run costs around $1000 a second!

to put this into perspective - consider your Honda RC211V Moto GP bike. top speed of 320kmh-ish. You are riding this bike. Hard. A mile up the road, waiting, is a top fuel dragster. You have a flying start for the 1/4 mile race. You accelerate, hitting the traps where the dragster is waiting, at 320km/h. At the moment that you hit the staging line, the dragster starts its run. You keep cranking hard, but very shortly a whine from behind becomes a roar from beside, and within 3 seconds, the dragster has caught and passed you in a wave of heat and noise, beating you to the finish line by a full second, and doing 200km/h faster than you are.

You sulk home and buy a scooter...

**avgas** · 27th February 2005, 16:42

while the top fuel dragster stalls 600m later, and is pushed home.
Things in perspective people - even the y2k isnt too bad fuel economy.

**bugjuice** · 27th February 2005, 18:06

interesting facts there..
I've also heard that each engine gets rebuilt ever (few?) run(s)..

**dangerous** · 27th February 2005, 18:14

Marty, have you got the link there I did have it but was lost when I went to the new puter.
Now you forgot to say the the spark puugs have burnt out half way down the strip and the engine then deisels its way to the finish line.

**scumdog** · 27th February 2005, 19:34

Start to finish the dragsters engine only does about 980 revolutions....

900hp jet-sprint boat engine block machined from a block of solid alloy? $1,000,000+!!!

**TwoSeven** · 27th February 2005, 20:13

You cant compare a top fuel dragster to a normal motorcycle - so the whole argument is pointless. Its like comparing an F111 to a cessna.

1) Motorcycles have a lower max accel because there is a point at which the front wheel will try and climb its way round the rear sprocket. Cars (top fuels) have a higher point. So you have to at least compare a bike to a top fuel bike

2) Top fuel bikes only hit about 230 miles per hour - not 300mph. Not that much higher than a tuned up 1000cc road bike.

3) which means that there isnt really a whole lot in it. Still, 0-60mph in 0.7 seconds sure does beat 3.2 seconds for the road bike

**onearmedbandit** · 27th February 2005, 20:59

Originally Posted by TwoSeven

You cant compare a top fuel dragster to a normal motorcycle - so the whole argument is pointless. Its like comparing an F111 to a cessna.

1) Motorcycles have a lower max accel because there is a point at which the front wheel will try and climb its way round the rear sprocket. Cars (top fuels) have a higher point. So you have to at least compare a bike to a top fuel bike

2) Top fuel bikes only hit about 230 miles per hour - not 300mph. Not that much higher than a tuned up 1000cc road bike.

3) which means that there isnt really a whole lot in it. Still, 0-60mph in 0.7 seconds sure does beat 3.2 seconds for the road bike

Dude, we're in the same town, want to hook me up with whatever you're smoking?? I don't know what 1000cc road bikes you've been riding (albeit 'tuned up' ones) but I think that statement in itself is a little off track. Take this for example, latest PB mag tests a TTS Supercharged GSXR1000 putting out 200bhp, and with extended gearing hits a genuine 192.635 mph, a lot and I mean a farkin lot short of 230mph. Now Ghostriders 499bhp ayabusa is supposed to top 400kmh (248mph) but I wouldn't call 499bhp a 'tuned up' example.

**speedpro** · 27th February 2005, 22:11

Originally Posted by bugjuice

interesting facts there..
I've also heard that each engine gets rebuilt ever (few?) run(s)..

Actually if everything goes right they put new big end bearings in for every run. The reason being that the old ones will have started getting squished out like plasticene. This is one way of seeing if all cylinders are doing their thing, equal squishedness. Mains will at least get looked at. Rods are good for probably 5 runs and are marked and noted every run. Valve springs are replaced every run, they're probably titanium, valve lift would be round the 1" mark and the cam profiles are stupendous, and the motor will turn about 9000rpm. Heads come off, pistons come out and if neccessary a new liner and/or piston may be installed. The "smoke" you see out the back of the car later in the run is the slipper clutch dust. It may have one or two gears. Think about that - 0-330mph in one gear, it's real hard on the clutch.

On this topic - The NZ Nationals are on at Meremere this coming weekend the 5th and 6th March. A jet car will be doing runs plus there are 5 Aussie bikes here. Were hoping to try a few starts on Friday arvo to see how suspension adjustments have affected the car's starts if anyone runs out of stuff to do or is riding past. We'll be parked next to the jet car on race day under the Hauraki banner with the Hauraki girlies

Dave Green's corvette, I'm Mike.

**speedpro** · 27th February 2005, 22:22

Originally Posted by onearmedbandit

Take this for example, latest PB mag tests a TTS Supercharged GSXR1000 putting out 200bhp, and with extended gearing hits a genuine 192.635 mph, a lot and I mean a farkin lot short of 230mph.

To be honest that sounds a bit slow for 200hp. My bike makes 175hp with bent valves and a (big)bit more when all is good, and the cops got me at 312kmh (196mph) down the back straight. I don't have a fairing and it's only the back straight, no runup. That was 9000rpm, Jim Steadman, recently in Kiwi rider, reckons he's seen 9300rpm down the back straight on it. His street Z1R-turbo would pull the same gearing to red line as well, 20 years ago!

**onearmedbandit** · 27th February 2005, 22:30

Yeah, I too thought it was a bit slow, but you can't argue with the numbers. Regardless of this, my original point remains re 'tuned-up' thou approaching 230mph.

**TwoSeven** · 27th February 2005, 22:32

I had a collegue that hotted up a cibby 900 back in the early 90s - took it to 1080cc and fitted various bits to it. Was clocked at 215mph on bruntingthorpe (a place in the uk where people do speed runs). I'm sure in the nearly fourteen years since they have managed to make bikes go faster with not much more effort.

If you read back maybe 5 years or so worth PB issues you'll see an article where they did a run on fast bikes at bruntingthorpe - from memory quite a few of them did +200 - I believe the record for a tuned up shop bike might be in the nature of the 230 mark, and I know quite a few did 220 odd.

Recently I'm told that the best production bike for tuning is the old suzi buss, and not much needs to be done to get them over the 200 mark. I know turbo kits are easy to install on them and they have plentry of room for extra tuning.

Sounds like you are still living in the 80s if you believe production bikes cant be made to go fast or have to be specially tuned 'dragsters' that people use to make videos. You'll find in other countries, there are quit a few enthusiasts that build specials in their spare time so its not uncommon to see a bunch of nutters down the local d-strip on a saturday afternoon.

**gav** · 27th February 2005, 22:55

Hard to believe a CB900 no matter how modded could do 215mph, it would need at least 250 bhp to acheive that, from an engine that would have had what 70-80 hp standard? It takes an awful lot of power to get close to 200mph and then huge amounts of power are need ed to get the speed up ,in small amounts. Didnt PB have an article from a Lucky Strike mech who had a ZZR1100 he had modded that hit a genuine 200mph? They also had the V&M Blackbird that topped that speed. That TTS GSXR1000 doesnt sound right to me if they were going for top speed. Arent MotoGP bikes topping 200mph with what 240-250 hp?
Aerodynamics plays a huge part in getting top speeds, thats why the huyabusa is so impressive.

**Blakamin** · 27th February 2005, 23:35

stick a V8 in ya pipe and smoke it....

that was just for the 4cyl turdo boys of course

... anything that can go from zero to 300MPH in under 4.5 seconds has my respect!!!!!

(sky showed the rails shutting down before the 60 foot mark and still getting under 10 secs...)

**onearmedbandit** · 27th February 2005, 23:38

Sounds like you are still living in the 80s if you believe production bikes cant be made to go fast or have to be specially tuned 'dragsters' that people use to make videos. You'll find in other countries, there are quit a few enthusiasts that build specials in their spare time so its not uncommon to see a bunch of nutters down the local d-strip on a saturday afternoon

And just where did you jump to that conclusion from?? Just how much horsepower do you think it requires to push 220+mph. And I do recall PB mags from 5 yrs ago testing 'busa's etc at Bruntingthorpe where most ran under 200mph, with only a couple (incl MR Turbos I think) running over 200mph. In fact if I look through my collection I've probably still got one or two with those tests in them.

I also remember SR (US mag) running the UFO class. ZZR1100's etc running turbos and NOs putting out 440bhp running 220+mph, magazines from the early 90's. Time doesn't change anything relating to maximum speed, the basic formula boils down to gearing, drag co-efficient and hp (and hand-in-hand torque), with weight also playing a small part although effecting acceleration dramatically (and therefore over a given distance max speed.)

So, if aerodynamics haven't changed greatly (and they haven't, bikes still have terrible COD numbers), gearing remains similar (no advances really in that field - for this particular instance) and hp levels haven't vastly increased (remember 440hp from a ZZR11) than overall top speed won't change dramatically.

Like gav said, your mates CB must have been putting out over 250hp (I'd say over 350hp going by its aerodynamics) to have hit 215mph.

**marty** · 28th February 2005, 07:34

Originally Posted by dangerous

Marty, have you got the link there I did have it but was lost when I went to the new puter.
Now you forgot to say the the spark puugs have burnt out half way down the strip and the engine then deisels its way to the finish line.

i plagarised it out of one of our work magazines. left a couple of the boring stats out, but they've been picked up by others......