15 year on Report on California's 3 strike law, it's impact on crime

**Genestho** · 19th April 2009, 09:15

"Virtually all predictions in 1994 prior to the passage of three stikes warned California's prison population would explode, forcing the construction of 20 new prisons, in just five years....

FACT: California funded and built 19 new prisons prior to "three strikes" laws
In the last 15 years since implementation of "three strikes" California has built and funded ONE prison

FACT:California had the 4th highest crime rates in United States, it dropped back to 29th, California crime rates dropped twice as fast as any other state, with the exception of New York

FACT: California saved $54 billion with the reduction of crime.

Criminologists have historically equated crime to population - More people equals more crime.
FACT: California has cut crime by half while its state population increased 14 million (50% increase in state population since implementation of "three strikes")"

Attached is the report 15 years on looking at the impact of the "three strikes" law....

**Skyryder** · 19th April 2009, 10:21

I've had the view for some time that the three strikes is the way that we should go. Along with a proper youth prison where juveniles can be removed from the environment where they can further re-offend. I also believe that there needs to be some seriouse rehabilitation programmes built in along side any kind of youth and adult detainment.

Skyryder

**dave_a** · 19th April 2009, 10:26

I think we need old JK to take a read of this

**Tank** · 19th April 2009, 11:09

My idea of shooting the bastards saves us having to build any more prisons, and reoffending rates are zero.

Great report tho - here is hoping that they do something here in NZ

**Murray** · 19th April 2009, 11:47

Perhaps all the crims are scared of "The Terminator" and what he may do to them!!!

**Mully** · 19th April 2009, 12:49

Well, that's interesting. Certainly good ammunition against those who say three strikes wont achieve anything.

**FJRider** · 19th April 2009, 12:58

Originally Posted by Mully

Well, that's interesting. Certainly good ammunition against those who say three strikes wont achieve anything.

Equally the same amount of thought done, when sitting on 90 demerit points... one little one more, and .....

**Skyryder** · 19th April 2009, 13:03

As mentioned my previous post I don't have a problem with the three strike concept although I would go as far to suggest that the sentancing judge not be bound by the legislation. I'd like to see other factors included with sentancing other than just the third conviction.

The link does contain some interesting information but I have no idea of its source.

I got this from Wiki...........that in some respects seems to temper the links conclusions. (4) suggests other factors in the downward trend other than the three strikes law. just food for thought.

According to the California Dept. of Justice and the California Dept. of Corrections, for the ten years prior to the enactment of the “3 strikes law”, homicide, rape, robbery, assault, burglary, and vehicle theft totaled 8,825,353 crimes, but for the ten years after the enactment of the law, these crimes dropped to 6,780,964.[4] However the decline in crime was a general trend throughout the U.S., even in those parts of the country without three strikes laws.[5]

Skyryder

**Genestho** · 19th April 2009, 13:37

Originally Posted by FJRider

Equally the same amount of thought done, when sitting on 90 demerit points... one little one more, and .....

The "Three strikes" Californian Report and law, only applies to Serious Violent Crimes eg, Murder, Rape, Assault, Robbery and property crimes.. Burglary and Car Theft.

There is no place for "Traffic Crime" in these laws.

Skyrider, I agree with what you say with regards to removing youth from the environment where they can further re-offend, and rehabilitation options.

The source of the preparation of the report based on Crimes facts and stats and cost of crime, is an organisation called the Three Strikes Organization (s) run by Mike Reynolds whose Daughter was murdered in 1992, he assisted in the drafting of California's "three strike" laws

"One of the strongest tributes to Mike Reynolds' success is the nationwide proliferation of measures and voter initiatives which have been modeled after his Three Strikes concept."

Perhaps...In answer to general decline stats...

To date, 31 states have enacted laws with the same purpose and the federal government has passed a law which imposes the three strikes punishment standard on anyone committing violent federal offenses."

**munterk6** · 19th April 2009, 14:56

I can't see NZ ever instituting the 3 strikes system...we are far to socialist/humanist and from what I have seen in the youth justice system, the lawmakers WANT the kids in the community they have offended...for "rehabilitation" purposes. What a friggin' JOKE. And the joke is on us.

**Skyryder** · 19th April 2009, 15:37

Originally Posted by munterk6

I can't see NZ ever instituting the 3 strikes system...we are far to socialist/humanist and from what I have seen in the youth justice system, the lawmakers WANT the kids in the community they have offended...for "rehabilitation" purposes. What a friggin' JOKE. And the joke is on us.

Might have more to do with this.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=10559461

Skyyrder

**Molly** · 19th April 2009, 15:58

Are these reported (and, importantly, then recorded crimes) or are they based on victimisation surveys (generally more reliable). Also, crime stats are notoriously difficult to 'trend' as methods of recording change over time and because so many factors influence different types of criminality and policing.

The first thing to consider is displacement (primarily of time, space, and type) and once adjusted for that it'd then be worth revisiting the stats.

If anybody really wants to delve into the murky world of policing, crime, and politics I'm currently selling a shitload of my old criminology books on TradeMe. Be warned though, after three years' study all I realised is that you can never really get to the root cause of offending (a word in itself which covers a huge spread of behaviours). You do at least learn to hold several wholly opposing views at the same time. Some things don't resolve. That's just part of the complexity of life.

**Taz** · 19th April 2009, 16:06

Originally Posted by T.G.W

The "Three strikes" Californian Report and law, only applies to Serious Violent Crimes eg, Murder, Rape, Assault, Robbery and property crimes.. Burglary and Car Theft.
"

What is this 3 strikes thing. Does this mean you can murder/rape/assault 3 times before you get imprisoned??

**balans** · 19th April 2009, 16:30

Originally Posted by Anthrax

What is this 3 strikes thing. Does this mean you can murder/rape/assault 3 times before you get imprisoned??

No you still get imprisoned, slapped on the wrist or whatever for the first 2 offences as normal, but for the third conviction the sentence is a mandatory 25 to life, or similar as it varies from state to state.