This makes me unhappy with the world I live in

[MsKABC]

wot a crock of shit - the dog ain't gonna say if it is uncomfortable or painful is it? a good way to get bitten tho, the only thing that should be going down a dog's throat is food - much better ways to discipline than shoving your fingers down his/her throat.

There is no fuckin difference between treating a dog and a human. Both deserve love, respect, food, shelter, discipline etc etc.

Who gives a fuck what colour/how many pretty ribbons you got/get - seen a few "happy" dogs with "pleasant" owners that aren't so pleasant behind closed gates.

Perhaps when you have in excess of over twenty-five years working with "man's best friend" then it might give you some weight to stand on your little soapbox and declare your self-righteous behaviour.


Abuse is abuse, no matter what you colour it as, whether it be mental or physical.

No need to get angry and use expletives here friend, we're just having a debate is all.

I think it's better to give the dog a little discomfort in order to let them know their behaviour is unacceptable, than to let it continue and develop into a trait that results in a child getting bitten and the dog becoming an unsociable member of society and being rehomed because an owner can't handle it, or perhaps even destroyed.

Don't you think you're being a little OTT objecting to this training methodology, given the subject nature of this thread: some scumbag stealing an old dog and using him for bait with pittys? Like comparing apples and oranges really.

Do tell us more about your 25 years of experience? Did you know that feeding brisket bones constantly to dogs will ruin their teeth and give them constipation, causing scar tissue to form around their anus, which requires surgery to correct? And it won't stop them mouthing or biting either.

You implied I didn't know how to train a dog - I simply responded with evidence that says otherwise. Trophies and ribbons seem like pretty good evidence to me!

I learned this technique from someone with close to 30 years experience working with dogs, who is well-known in the film and tv industry for working with animals.

There is no unpleasantness behind closed gates at my house, but I do know what you mean. I work with a trainer who is reknowned for using only positive (and by that I mean "happy", not positive in the true dog training sense of the word) methods.

[MSTRS:Me]

There is no fuckin difference between treating a dog and a human. Both deserve love, respect, food, shelter, discipline etc etc.

I don't know a lot about dogs, but I can see the failure of this logic....
Dogs and humans may both be pack animals in a lot of ways, but the big difference is in intelligence (well, it is in most cases). A dog operates on instinct vs training, just as we do up until around 3 years of age. Minor physical discipline is very effective at discouraging poor behaviour before it becomes entrenched. Of course, there is also the love, respect, food, shelter etc to go along with it. A pack animal is part of a hierarchy and needs to learn it's place. There is only one alpha, and woe-betide the person who lets their dog think it's him....

[nudemetalz]

That prick that's been arrested has 16 charges against him now:-

-Stealing a 14-year-old ridgeback-cross named Lincoln, valued at $200.

-Transporting his dog Dukes for the purposes of having it participate in animal fighting.

-Failing to ensure Dukes received proper protection and rapid diagnosis of any significant injury.

-Failing to ensure Lincoln received proper protection and rapid diagnosis of any significant injury.

-Was present for the purposes of witnessing the fighting or baiting of an animal, namely Lincoln.

-Encouraging and assisting a dog fight.

-Knowingly training an animal for the purposes of dog fighting.

-Confining or transporting an animal in a manner likely to cause it distress.

-Owning Dukes for the purposes of an animal-fighting venture.

-Failing to ensure Dukes received treatment to alleviate unnecessary pain and distress.

-Deserting Lincoln with no provision made to meet the dog's physical needs.

-Ill-treating Lincoln.

-Ill-treating Dukes.

-Using a place, namely Whitireia Park, for dog fighting.

-Possessing Lincoln for the purposes of an animal-fighting venture.

-Failing to comply with the Animal Welfare Act by ensuring a rapid diagnosis of any significant injury and disease.

Rot in hell, you little bastard !!!

[MsKABC]

Rot in hell, you little bastard !!!

Unfortunately he will likely get a slap on the wrist with a wet bus ticket

[JimO]

That prick that's been arrested has 16 charges against him now:-

-Stealing a 14-year-old ridgeback-cross named Lincoln, valued at $200.

-Transporting his dog Dukes for the purposes of having it participate in animal fighting.

-Failing to ensure Dukes received proper protection and rapid diagnosis of any significant injury.

-Failing to ensure Lincoln received proper protection and rapid diagnosis of any significant injury.

-Was present for the purposes of witnessing the fighting or baiting of an animal, namely Lincoln.

-Encouraging and assisting a dog fight.

-Knowingly training an animal for the purposes of dog fighting.

-Confining or transporting an animal in a manner likely to cause it distress.

-Owning Dukes for the purposes of an animal-fighting venture.

-Failing to ensure Dukes received treatment to alleviate unnecessary pain and distress.

-Deserting Lincoln with no provision made to meet the dog's physical needs.

-Ill-treating Lincoln.

-Ill-treating Dukes.

-Using a place, namely Whitireia Park, for dog fighting.

-Possessing Lincoln for the purposes of an animal-fighting venture.

-Failing to comply with the Animal Welfare Act by ensuring a rapid diagnosis of any significant injury and disease.

Rot in hell, you little bastard !!!

thats got to be worth 1 months home detention and a right royal telling off from the judge

[Morcs]

Arent pitbulls illegal in NZ?

They should be. They are illegal in many other countries for good reason.

[nudemetalz]

thats got to be worth 1 months home detention and a right royal telling off from the judge

Might go for a ride around Titahi Bay with my sniper rifle across my back now that I know what he looks like....
ooops,...did I say that out loud...?

[MSTRS:Me]

I don't know a lot about dogs, but I can see the failure of this logic....
Dogs and humans may both be pack animals in a lot of ways, but the big difference is in intelligence (well, it is in most cases). A dog operates on instinct vs training, just as we do up until around 3 years of age. Minor physical discipline is very effective at discouraging poor behaviour before it becomes entrenched. Of course, there is also the love, respect, food, shelter etc to go along with it. A pack animal is part of a hierarchy and needs to learn it's place. There is only one alpha, and woe-betide the person who lets their dog think it's him....

In fact, when I think about the above, I can't help but draw parallels with today's society...

Too many kids grow up without having been properly taught boundaries, or lack the intelligence to work it out for themselves (or the motivation, for that matter). Or some are in fact taught to lie, cheat, steal and generally covet/take what isn't theirs. Respect for others is sadly lacking in this PC world (oh...all the words are there, but the reality is that what is taken on board is the 'ME first' lesson, which does not teach self-respect, only indulgence. A valuable tool (as part of a whole range) for disciplining kids was effectively removed, and the alternatives are not necessarily as effective as a form of control/censure. The bullshit that tries to say that 'everyone is a winner' (in kid's sports, for instance) that simply fails to result in kids learning about life (winners and losers).The misguided attempt to treat 18 year olds as adults by lowering the legal drinking age (many 18yo are more than responsible, but many more lack the maturity and are no better than kids let loose in the sweetie shop.

I could go on, but you get the picture...I guess what I am trying to say is that consequences should be taught AND learned to a much higher standard than is the case today. And dogs are no different to us in this regard.

[chanceyy]

there is a clear difference between abuse & teaching an animal its place

when I got my rottie we had 2 other dogs (all 3 bitches and yes I was the 4th) she had been quite badly abused and neglected before I got her

being a strong minded dog I had to become the pack leader on our property to ensure there was no fights .. we had the odd niggle which i promptly interferred and after the second time it never happened again. What did I do .. what any other top dog would do

The interesting part was dad telling me that he could clearly see the pecking order .. me, my rott, parents lab and the old spaniel (who really did not give a shit) when I left the property my rott used to like to think she was in charge however with the training she respected other ppl and always obeyed my parents

my horses are no different .. body language is how animals communicate and its how I communicate with them .. I am the leader of my animals and as spoilt & well cared for as they are they also know their place

making situations uncomfortable to an animal to teach it not to do something and it should only take 2-3 times to get the message is far different to continual and constant beatings, kickings, neglect ..

there are far to many animals in the world who suffer the second kind

[wbks]

depends what kind of childhood they had - one can never tell until it is too late

My point was that it doesn't matter how it's raised. Of course a fight trained pit bull will be a lot less docile and trustworthy than a well trained one thats had a nice life, but they were bred very specifically to be fighters physically and mentally. So no matter how much people like to tout the argument that its all in the upbringing, it doesn't get past the science behind the breed and the countless times pitty's "snap" on a toddler or another dog for no reason which seems to surprise everyone because it was raised well and never showed aggression

[Brett]

No need to get angry and use expletives here friend, we're just having a debate is all.

I think it's better to give the dog a little discomfort in order to let them know their behaviour is unacceptable, than to let it continue and develop into a trait that results in a child getting bitten and the dog becoming an unsociable member of society and being rehomed because an owner can't handle it, or perhaps even destroyed.

Don't you think you're being a little OTT objecting to this training methodology, given the subject nature of this thread: some scumbag stealing an old dog and using him for bait with pittys? Like comparing apples and oranges really.

Do tell us more about your 25 years of experience? Did you know that feeding brisket bones constantly to dogs will ruin their teeth and give them constipation, causing scar tissue to form around their anus, which requires surgery to correct? And it won't stop them mouthing or biting either.

You implied I didn't know how to train a dog - I simply responded with evidence that says otherwise. Trophies and ribbons seem like pretty good evidence to me!

I learned this technique from someone with close to 30 years experience working with dogs, who is well-known in the film and tv industry for working with animals.

There is no unpleasantness behind closed gates at my house, but I do know what you mean. I work with a trainer who is reknowned for using only positive (and by that I mean "happy", not positive in the true dog training sense of the word) methods.

In my humble opinion, you are right!

[Finn]

I just thought I'd clarify my post about hating animal abuses and maori scum as one of our resident "save the world" Marxists, short circunt has wet his panties over it.

While I strongly believe that the general maori population could try a little harder in life, my comment above was not racist at all. I was of course referring to the maori scum that this thread is about.

The press released the article saying they were maori. I simply added scum to the end.

[Finn]

That prick that's been arrested has 16 charges against him now:-

-Stealing a 14-year-old ridgeback-cross named Lincoln, valued at $200.

-Transporting his dog Dukes for the purposes of having it participate in animal fighting.

-Failing to ensure Dukes received proper protection and rapid diagnosis of any significant injury.

-Failing to ensure Lincoln received proper protection and rapid diagnosis of any significant injury.

-Was present for the purposes of witnessing the fighting or baiting of an animal, namely Lincoln.

-Encouraging and assisting a dog fight.

-Knowingly training an animal for the purposes of dog fighting.

-Confining or transporting an animal in a manner likely to cause it distress.

-Owning Dukes for the purposes of an animal-fighting venture.

-Failing to ensure Dukes received treatment to alleviate unnecessary pain and distress.

-Deserting Lincoln with no provision made to meet the dog's physical needs.

-Ill-treating Lincoln.

-Ill-treating Dukes.

-Using a place, namely Whitireia Park, for dog fighting.

-Possessing Lincoln for the purposes of an animal-fighting venture.

-Failing to comply with the Animal Welfare Act by ensuring a rapid diagnosis of any significant injury and disease.

Rot in hell, you little bastard !!!

And that was just in one day. What about the monkeys other convictions?

[avgas]

Death? Really? How does the perpetrator of this crime differ from your friendly neighbourhood drug dealer, or the owner of Bluechip?

It doesn't but you have to start with baby steps before you can run - i mean imagine the press report when the courts kill losers off our society. Its not humane, its human.

[Finn]

Here's the monkey. No surprises.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crim...ries-disguise/