Traction feedback device?

[CookMySock]

Say I have one of your devices and are cornering 9% from the egde, but within the +_10%. I notice your gadget is telling me I can corner harder so I push it that extra 10% and have an off, are you prepared for the legalities that would follow?

Naw. If that was true, then motorcycles would come with warning labels "do not lean over - might fall!"

to explain it to you, and those without a good grasp of physics probly wouldnt get it anyway."

Lets hear your maths and physics.

Yeh i realise this, but sometimes it would be nice to know how much more force can be applied, my first off was an oil slick evasion at a yellow light, locked the front up before the slick as i didnt know how quickly i could actually stop, i think if id had one if these i would not have had a lock up

If you were into the oil slick, nothing will save you there. ABS will help, but you are in the hands of the gods now.

But generally...its around fear...and instinct. and how you use it...and it can be taught...with out huge amounts of drama and hassle!

For the trainer, yes. I had one idiot try to teach me paragliding, and it was abundantly clear he knew everything about paragliding, and fuck all about how to teach. According to him, it was all about how you hold your tongue, and he was completely incapable of making a concise description of anything, and he used 100% of his ability to do any demonstration, which of course only proved that us newbies might as well give up right now.

I think such a device has merit. I think it would need to be smart though - it would have to reevaluate itself constantly. The maths in the DSP would have to smart enough to detect the bikes' wriggle from wet road conditions, cold tyres, etc etc. But yeah I can't tell the difference between a harmless tyre squirm and what could develop into a dangerous slide, so bring it on.



Steve

[Starky307]

Ride by feel, not by instruments.

[bogan]

No...thats not just what suspension does...and add to that chassis geometry.
I does alot lot more...there are 500 page books avalible which will outline a fair bit of the info...but not all.

Im going to have to disagree with you there, suspension IS about providing a uniform force and grip to the road surface, that is the summary, the 500+ page books just go into detail about how this is done

[cowpoos]

Im going to have to disagree with you there, suspension IS about providing a uniform force and grip to the road surface, that is the summary, the 500+ page books just go into detail about how this is done

well...you are very very wrong.

[bogan]

well...you are very very wrong.

care to elaborate what the purpose of suspension is then?

[CookMySock]

care to elaborate what the purpose of suspension is then?

You will get nowhere with that.

Build the doo-dad and lets see it. If it's going to have elaborate DSP software, consider making it GPL - you will get some high-end maths and science people get on board with it I am sure. I'm always keen to see another little black box that can think.

Steve

[bogan]

yeh still plan on building it, but dont think theres enuf intrest atm to put it on high priority, gotta finish my electric bike and other projects first

[Shaun P]

Probably a better application would be to have a lean angle data logger paired with a gps data logger so you can review the data afterwards, you wouldnt be able to look at it at max lean angle etc

[Shaun P]

unless you had a HUD haha

[LBD]

Naw. If that was true, then motorcycles would come with warning labels "do not lean over - might fall!"

Lets hear your maths and physics.

Bikes dont tell you that you are X % from the traction limit, you can corner X % harder before you have an accident....

"to explain it to you, and those without a good grasp of physics probly wouldnt get it anyway." is Bogans statement...

[cowpoos]

care to elaborate what the purpose of suspension is then?

Have a wee ponder about...what happens with the rear end of a bike...its job is not just to absorb bumbs but also to deliver traction...so

take a wheel...stick it on a lever [a flexible one]...add a hinge...110nm or torque...gearing to manipulate the torque...breaks in that torques loading [gear changes]...weight changes...differeing amounts of torque provided...and then ad bumps....oh...then forward to rear pitching via braking...momentuim...centrifical forces...changing weight distribution...friction...etc etc

and use your vast physics knowledge...and think about it. we could ad more forces too...

If you come back to me and tell me I'm wrong again. You are obviously in the wrong field of expertise.

[bogan]

Have a wee ponder about...what happens with the rear end of a bike...its job is not just to absorb bumbs but also to deliver traction...so

take a wheel...stick it on a lever [a flexible one]...add a hinge...110nm or torque...gearing to manipulate the torque...breaks in that torques loading [gear changes]...weight changes...differeing amounts of torque provided...and then ad bumps....oh...then forward to rear pitching via braking...momentuim...centrifical forces...changing weight distribution...friction...etc etc

and use your vast physics knowledge...and think about it. we could ad more forces too...

If you come back to me and tell me I'm wrong again. You are obviously in the wrong field of expertise.

youre not wrong again, just continuing to be wrong!!

yeh all that shit happens with torques and forces and whatnot, thats blindingly obvious, but you gotta understand that all that is designed to do one thing. It all contributes to a system that aims to provide a uniform amount of force to the raods surface, which generates a uniform amount of grip

[cowpoos]

youre not wrong again, just continuing to be wrong!!

yeh all that shit happens with torques and forces and whatnot, thats blindingly obvious, but you gotta understand that all that is designed to do one thing. It all contributes to a system that aims to provide a uniform amount of force to the raods surface, which generates a uniform amount of grip

jesus.....but it doesn't provide a uniform force...it can't...and it doesn't.

[bogan]

jesus.....but it doesn't provide a uniform force...it can't...and it doesn't.

look mate, unless you have even a skerrick of evidence to back up your statements, please refrain from offering technical advice to those who do know about this sort of thing

[T bone]

I'm going with starky on this, ride by feel, isn't that what riding is all about??? being pure unassited riding, no gadgets no traction control, no abs & the other BS. Your own brain can process these things better than any electronic aid. I'm not bagging your idea, but I'm still a learner rider, & if I'm mid-corner leant over there is no way I'm looking down to check if there is a light on!!! I'm too busy looking down the road for the next corner.
Personally I think you'd be better off developing a decent datalogging system with a gps. that you can download after your ride/race & look at all your inputs eg suspenion travel,steering angle, throttle input, brake pressure front/back, wheel speed, engine speed, lean angle, acceleration. even look at rider heart rate to see where you get stressed out the most.
Just my opinion though