Non-stick coating problem

[Beemer]

I've got a Panasonic breadmaker (model SD-253) that has a problem with the non-stick coating on the bread pan, which bubbled and flaked off after a short time. We've had two replaced under warranty but now it's out of warranty and when I contacted them today to see if I could get a replacement, I was told the bread pan came complete with a new kneading blade and it could be provided to me for just $150.48! Hells bells, the whole unit only cost me $199 in the first place!

At that price I would be better off buying a new breadmaker, but what I'd like to know is whether anything can be done with the old pan? The coating has bubbled badly on the base and in some places there are holes and it's starting to rust. I use it every day so binning it without a replacement isn't an option - but neither is spending $150!

I had a look on Trade Me but second-hand ones are going for about $200 so that's not really an option either.

[icekiwi]

HPC in Auckland do those types of coating give them a call
0800 HPC TECH

[Blackshear]

Remind me to never buy a breadmaker

Home-made pizza, toasted sammies with bacon is all I can cook.

Crikey, looking at all the breadmakers around, they're pretty costly!

[steve_t]

I'm assuming that the unit is a little over 12 months old... but you could have a case for getting a new one again for free or a refund or something. The fact that you've had 2 units replaced previously due to defective non-stick coatings shows that they've used an inferior product/process in making this unit.
Even though the warranty is only for 12 months, it can be argued the a breadmaker is not something you would use every day, and that with 'reasonable use' the non-stick coating should last more than 12 months or it's 'not fit for the purpose'. This is of course making sure there aren't scratches or scouring marks from metal scourers, knives etc. Best to talk again to your retailer.
Or is the unit significantly older?

[Beemer]

I bought the breadmaker in December 2005 when Farmers had a sale (found the receipt before and actually paid $279.99) as the Sanyo breadmaker I was using was nearing the end of its life. It kept going for more than a year and even when the electrical part died (some sort of acid was leaking out of the base and corroding the spindle), the pan was fine. It wasn't coated with the silver coloured stuff on the Panasonic one that flakes off, rather it appeared to be made of some form of dark grey non-stick material. Shame the pans aren't interchangeable!

So the Panasonic one didn't get used for more than 12 months after purchase (apart from a test run when I got it to make sure it did actually work!) and the pan started deteriorating within three months. They replaced that one no problem after I explained how little use it had, despite being purchased in 2005. Unfortunately that pan only lasted about six months before it bubbled too. They replaced that one too, but said they had not had a single one returned with this problem, which I found really hard to believe. The new pan took a little longer to start bubbling, which happened about six months ago. At first it was okay, but now it's really bad and I doubt I'll be able to use it for much longer.

I do use the breadmaker almost every day (at least three to four times a week) but considering they advertise them along the lines of "wake up to fresh bread every morning" then this should not be unreasonable. Considering many non-stick frying pans come with a 25 year or longer guarantee, you'd expect a breadmaker pan to last longer than a couple of years. The Sanyo one had been used as often as the Panasonic one for more than 10 years and apart from a few minor scratches and some discolouration, the pan was fine.

When I got the replacement pan I was told they no longer made that model and a new one would be out soon, but I haven't seen one so far. I don't realistically expect them to replace this one for free, but paying half the cost of the original unit for a pan and blade seems excessive. When I got the new pan it came with an invoice which they told me to ignore, but from memory it was for about $50 - a bit more acceptable than $150, that's for sure!

I'll contact HPC as I see they do non-stick coating on food processing equipment and they may be able to help.

[LBD]

So they have not fathomed the mistery of getting the nonstick surface to stick to the surface of the bread maker....?

[Sparrowhawk]

So they have not fathomed the mistery of getting the nonstick surface to stick to the surface of the bread maker....?

Rant time. To get the nonstick to stick is pretty simple.

They heat up the aluminium base (which is toxic when it gets hot by the way). Because it's porous(sp?) it expands, they put the teflon coating on (which also emits toxic gasses when it gets hot), which drips into the pores, which then close as it gets cold, meaning the teflon is stuck there. The problem is, as the unit gets hot and cold repeatedly the teflon comes back out of the pores.

Which is why (to my basic understanding, I'm no professional) teflon doesn't stick for long. Add that to the fact that aluminium & teflon are both proven to give off toxic gasses when they get hot, and you start to wonder why they're allowed to sell it, and why we keep buying it!

/rant

If anyone would like to know the solution to this little problem, PM me

[Beemer]

Sounds good, but why does some work and some doesn't? The non-stick surface (rather than a coating) on the Sanyo breadmaker never bubbled or altered apart from becoming discoloured yet the Panasonic one did within a few months. Need to go back to the drawing board methinks!

Looks like that coating place does saucepans and frying pans so they may be able to help.

[grusomhat]

There's a breadmaker sitting outside an asian shop near my school. It's been there for over a week so I'm guessing it's rubbish. I can check it tomorrow maybe and see if the pans still in it and if it's ok still if you want. Not sure if would fit yours though. Don't think there is much variation is sizing though?

[LBD]

Rant time. To get the nonstick to stick is pretty simple.

They heat up the aluminium base (which is toxic when it gets hot by the way). Because it's porous(sp?) it expands, they put the teflon coating on (which also emits toxic gasses when it gets hot), which drips into the pores, which then close as it gets cold, meaning the teflon is stuck there. The problem is, as the unit gets hot and cold repeatedly the teflon comes back out of the pores.

Which is why (to my basic understanding, I'm no professional) teflon doesn't stick for long. Add that to the fact that aluminium & teflon are both proven to give off toxic gasses when they get hot, and you start to wonder why they're allowed to sell it, and why we keep buying it!

/rant

If anyone would like to know the solution to this little problem, PM me

So it is not stuck to the surface so much as held to the surface mechanically with microscopic sized keys....

[CookMySock]

I'd take it back. The CGA states it must be fit for its purpose, and last about the amount of time a reasonable person would expect - warranty or otherwise, and quite plain and simple - it isn't.

On the other hand, you are giving it quite a workout.

Steve

[Beemer]

What can I say? My other half loves fresh bread for lunch! I'll have a look and see what Consumer say about the lifespan of a breadmaker as someone has just taken Dell to the Disputes Tribunal over a computer motherboard that died out of warranty and they argued that the life of a computer should be longer than two years or something. May still be out of luck, but worth a try.

I'm certainly not prepared to pay half the cost of a new one just for the pan when I know they only last three to six months anyway.

Thanks for the offer of checking out the dumped one - the pans aren't interchangeable as they have a spindle mechanism on the bottom that drives the blade when making the bread, so it would have to be a Panasonic SD-253 to be of any use.

I just had a look at Consumer's website and they say a breadmaker's life expectancy is 3-7 years, but they should last 5+. They say it can be worth replacing the bowl if there are problems with the coating but they don't say how long the coating should last.

I emailed HPC yesterday but apart from an automated reply saying thank you for your email, I haven't heard back from them as yet.

[vifferman]

We've had our Panasonic for around 10 years - the non-stick coating on the paddle has flaked off around the edges (probably because I very rarely clean the thing), but the pan is mostly still OK.
The only problem I've had is with drive belts - I've wrecked a couple from putting too much oatmeal in the bread mix (makes it too sticky for the feeble motor/paddle to turn).

I've also wrecked a few electric breadkives. I now have a much better (manual) Danish breadknife, from a set of very sharp kitchen knives that have inflicted quite a few injuries on hapless fingers that strayed too close...

I considered not replacing the breadmaker if it died, as the boys have decided they don't like bread, and won't eat home made bread unless I cook it in the oven. Focaccia is OK apparently, but they didn't eat the home-made hot cross buns I made (which were baked in the oven).

Fussy bastages.

[The Pastor]

whats wrong with just making it the oven?

[Beemer]

whats wrong with just making it the oven?

While I am perfectly capable of making a loaf of bread from scratch and cooking it in the oven, the convenience factor of breadmaking is what makes a breadmaker so good. You put the ingredients in the night before and it beeps to let you know when it's ready! Whereas with breadmaking by hand, you have to mix the ingredients, knead it, leave it to rise, knead it again, then shape it and leave it to rise before cooking it. I don't know whether I'd bother doing that every day.