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Thread: Oddball engines and prototypes

  1. #2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by tjbw View Post
    I'm a big fan of opposed piston engines, from the Jumo to Achates, but none have been used in F1 as far as I'm aware.
    Not F1 but
    "Probably the fastest car of the pre-Grand Prix period was the opposed piston Gobron Brille which in 1904 was the first I.C. engined car officially to exceed 100mph " Quote from The Grand Prix Car 1906 - 1939 by Laurence Pomeroy.

    Seems to have been a dead end with conventional engine types taking over.

    Frits - you maintained a tactful silence when I posted the Bradshaw Ryger progenitor. When does your non - disclosure agreement expire ?

  2. #2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumph View Post
    ........"Probably the fastest car of the pre-Grand Prix period was the opposed piston Gobron Brille which in 1904 was the first I.C. engined car officially to exceed 100mph " Quote from The Grand Prix Car 1906 - 1939 by Laurence Pomeroy.
    Seems to have been a dead end with conventional engine types taking over.............
    I would think that the good old inline four was a much more convenient "compromise", relatively compact and easy to work on, easy to balance! - above all, cheaper to produce! - what more can I say?
    Having said all that, the opposed piston engine appeals to me and is never out of my mind, biggest problem is it's awkward shape and difficulty of getting the reciprocating motion turned tidily into rotary motion (1 output shaft) stops it from competing with conventional engines
    .
    Gowbron Brillie, Commer/Sultzer etc, were brave attempts to simplify things by complicating them! The Commer was actually quite successful though.

    The only other successful engine using the KIC (keep it complicated) principle was a complicated development of the Junkers Jumo (which it seems Napier had been building under licence) called the "Napier Deltic" which was used successfully for many years on British trains and possibly torpedo boats.
    ...... or something like that!
    Strokers Galore!

  3. #2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    The only other successful engine using the KIC (keep it complicated) principle was a complicated development of the Junkers Jumo (which it seems Napier had been building under licence) called the "Napier Deltic" which was used successfully for many years on British trains and possibly torpedo boats.
    ...... or something like that!

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...ss_patrol_boat
    it's not a bad thing till you throw a KLR into the mix.
    those cheap ass bitches can do anything with ductape.
    (PostalDave on ADVrider)

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    Strokers Galore!

  5. #2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frits Overmars
    My thoughts exactly, but I refrained from expressing them; I'm afraid I criticize enough as it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by guyhockley View Post
    Oh, I don't know, you let me get away with my wildly innacurate "Nazi tech" remark!
    I let you get away with it for the simple reason that you were right. Most German bombers had Mercedes or BMW engines, but Junkers powerplants visited London too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grumph View Post
    Frits - you maintained a tactful silence when I posted the Bradshaw Ryger progenitor. When does your non-disclosure agreement expire ?
    In about a decade or when one of the legal parties involved ceases to exist -whatever comes first

  6. #2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frits Overmars View Post

    In about a decade or when one of the legal parties involved ceases to exist -whatever comes first
    So I'd better hope I get the cardiac bypass surgery they're talking about if I want to hear the real story....

  7. #2017
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    Quote Originally Posted by guyhockley View Post
    Oh, I don't know, you let me get away with my wildly innacurate "Nazi tech" remark!
    Guy, we have all been a bit worried about the accuracy of our statements sometimes! - it is also easy to misinterperet peoples' posts here (not having a facial expression to judge it by)! - so I guess it is up to the skill of the person writing the reply to get the message across properly!

    Me? a total disaster! but I have learnt to say things as I understand them (ie to the best of my ability) and rely on others to correct me (so long as they know) - guess that's what forums are all about!
    I am open to and can handle 'sensible' criticisim from those who know, so long as they don't get it wrong or do it in a persistent cynical manner - other than that I am an easy going guy!

    My wife tells me that the frontal lobe of my brain has deteriorated somewhat! ......... but I don't care, (that in fact is a symptom of this condition) - it does have an upside though, it allows us old guys to say what we think! and we are (nearly) always right
    Strokers Galore!

  8. #2018
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frits Overmars View Post
    I let you get away with it for the simple reason that you were right. Most German bombers had Mercedes or BMW engines, but Junkers powerplants visited London too.

    In about a decade or when one of the legal parties involved ceases to exist -whatever comes first
    I was basing my remark on the fact that the Jumo was already a successful design before Germany's best Charlie Chaplin impersonator took over, I think?

    Does legal parties mean individuals or if the Ryger company stops trading would that remove the shackles?

  9. #2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    Guy, we have all been a bit worried about the accuracy of our statements sometimes! - it is also easy to misinterperet peoples' posts here (not having a facial expression to judge it by)! - so I guess it is up to the skill of the person writing the reply to get the message across properly!

    Me? a total disaster! but I have learnt to say things as I understand them (ie to the best of my ability) and rely on others to correct me (so long as they know) - guess that's what forums are all about!
    I am open to and can handle 'sensible' criticisim from those who know, so long as they don't get it wrong or do it in a persistent cynical manner - other than that I am an easy going guy!

    My wife tells me that the frontal lobe of my brain has deteriorated somewhat! ......... but I don't care, (that in fact is a symptom of this condition) - it does have an upside though, it allows us old guys to say what we think! and we are (nearly) always right
    I always enjoy reading your stuff, way off topic, but, I'm married to the eldest of 5 children, their dad is 83 and lives 5 miles from us (oops! 8k). Mother-in-law died a couple of years back (Alzheimer's) and the brother and sisters live 2-3 hours away. They are constantly telling him what he shouldn't be doing, including driving, when he lives in the most northerly village in Dorset with almost no facilities. Apparently, we shouldn't let him drive to visit us or to go to football or do just about anything. Thing is, they're wearing him down into the image they (want to?) have of him. He's absolutely fine, people who meet him never believe how old he is...
    He has a plan for us to enter some summer trials, that should cause some, err, "interest".
    Keep kicking, Will, and sorry to hear some other gents on here have ticker trouble.

  10. #2020
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    Quote Originally Posted by guyhockley View Post
    ...... Apparently, we shouldn't let him drive to visit us or to go to football or do just about anything. Thing is, they're wearing him down into the image they (want to?) have of him. He's absolutely fine, people who meet him never believe how old he is...
    He has a plan for us to enter some summer trials, that should cause some, err, "interest".
    Keep kicking, Will, and sorry to hear some other gents on here have ticker trouble.
    First of all, good luck to our old mate from Aus hope we see him on here soon again with his contributions!

    Your father in law sounds like my old man used to be!
    I'm not nearly as old as he is of course, but I'm a little worse for wear medically, which effectively puts me in his bracket! So I'm starting to get the same problems with the family and I do understand his position (and theirs too of course!) they do care, but my mechanical aspirations are on a totally different wavelength to them!

    Think I'm supposed to be a gardener and bowls player now, like any other sensible person instead of a grumpy 'would-be' engineer/foundryman/mechanic!

    I was advised by the doctor to stop driving a few years ago because of my ticker, also my immobile neck which makes it difficult to turn right on to a busy road, but I've fixed all that with "smoke and mirrors", lots of swivelable mirrors and smoke from the tyres when I "plant" it when pulling out!
    I have about one and a half years to build an engine, prob with the odd tip maybe from Flettner, TZ and Grumph etc. My life will then become very restricted because I most probably won't get another drivers licence and I won't be able to nip out to the scrapyard and other nice places anymore!
    I can't even contemplate riding a bike because if I drop it, it'll be curtains for me! - my mind is willing but the body can't keep up!

    I was a little disappointed though, when a while back someone on the forum (ESE thread - and I won't say who) suggested that anyone who wasn't involved with Bucket Racing or building and racing a Bucket shouldn't be here! and suggested that I might be an alcoholic who sat in front of the computer drinking all night. (fact is, I'm virtually a tee totaller!). - but hopefully that suggestion wasn't aimed at me and I've got it wrong!
    Strokers Galore!

  11. #2021
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    First of all, good luck to our old mate from Aus hope we see him on here soon again with his contributions!

    I was a little disappointed though, when a while back someone on the forum (ESE thread - and I won't say who) suggested that anyone who wasn't involved with Bucket Racing or building and racing a Bucket shouldn't be here! and suggested that I might be an alcoholic who sat in front of the computer drinking all night. (fact is, I'm virtually a tee totaller!). - but hopefully that suggestion wasn't aimed at me and I've got it wrong!
    Relax a little, Will. While I have a bucket project under way (slowly...) I've only been involved on the fringes of it here in the last few years. Prior to that I was public enemy #1 to a lot of them as I ran race meetings that they ran at as guests - and I was very hard on oil leaks and poor preparation...

    But since they've got to know me a bit better, you'd be surprised at the calls for advice...I seem to be an on call RAM device - sometimes very random access to memory too, LOL.

  12. #2022
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frits Overmars View Post
    I let you get away with it for the simple reason that you were right. Most German bombers had Mercedes or BMW engines, but Junkers powerplants visited London too.
    BMW and Mercedes are probably the most sought after mode of transport in London these days
    it's not a bad thing till you throw a KLR into the mix.
    those cheap ass bitches can do anything with ductape.
    (PostalDave on ADVrider)

  13. #2023
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumph View Post
    Not F1 but
    "Probably the fastest car of the pre-Grand Prix period was the opposed piston Gobron Brille which in 1904 was the first I.C. engined car officially to exceed 100mph " Quote from The Grand Prix Car 1906 - 1939 by Laurence Pomeroy.

    Seems to have been a dead end with conventional engine types taking over.
    Another F1 proposal for an opposed piston two stroke. Apologies if everyone has already read this - it is from an article that was attached to a forum post I linked to when we were discussing Lynton Imps.

    Random thought: The K series Rover engines would lend themselves to this sort of experimenting...
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  14. #2024
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumph View Post
    Relax a little, Will. While I have a bucket project under way (slowly...) I've only been involved on the fringes of it here in the last few years. Prior to that I was public enemy #1 to a lot of them as I ran race meetings that they ran at as guests - and I was very hard on oil leaks and poor preparation...

    But since they've got to know me a bit better, you'd be surprised at the calls for advice...I seem to be an on call RAM device - sometimes very random access to memory too, LOL.
    Yes, relax Will, you shouldn't even get a wee bit pee'd off by those comments

  15. #2025
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    Quote Originally Posted by guyhockley View Post
    Does legal parties mean individuals or if the Ryger company stops trading would that remove the shackles?
    I don't know anything about legal matters; I'd have to check with my jurist daughter, but as I understand it, individuals as well as companies can be legal parties.
    As for the Ryger company stopping trading, I never noticed they even started.

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