ESE's works engine tuner

[TZ350]

Ok, making progress, that's if you can call getting it wrong progress.



Ecotrons has a very clever self tuning feature where you tell the map what Lambda you want at what RPM and the ECU will read the ALM O2 sensor and adjust the mixture for you.



The green squares on the map are where the ECU has completed the tuning process and delivered the Lambda asked for.

But you do have to ask for the right Lambda value for the engine. And this is where I went wrong tonight, I made the lower end to rich and eventually after a lot of auto tuning work the motor could not pull the skin of a rice pudding and drag itself into the power band.

On a rolling road dyno you can only do this auto tuning at low RPM and light loads because the Auto Tuning function needs the throttle and rpm to be held steady for 10 seconds or so to work.

The auto tuning feature works better and you can cover more of the map if you can ride on the road and use the head wind as a load or better yet, use a dyno with a brake to hold the engine steady.



My mistake was asking for to rich a Lambda at low throttle settings, and having the bike struggling to pickup on the dyno. I had made the map 0.85 Lambda everywhere, I should have stuck with the default map that had Lambda 1 at low RPM and dropping to Lambda 0.85 - 0.82 at max power.

But being able to make planned mistakes is a step better than just making ignorant mistakes and not knowing why.

So .... its progress ...

[Haufen]

My mistake was asking for to rich a Lambda at low throttle settings, and having the bike struggling to pickup on the dyno. I had made the map 0.85 Lambda everywhere, I should have stuck with the default map that had Lambda 1 at low RPM and dropping to Lambda 0.85 - 0.82 at max power.

But being able to make planned mistakes is a step better than just making ignorant mistakes and not knowing why.

So .... its progress ...

Do you mean low throttle settings or full throttle low rpm? Regarding the latter, you should be able to run Lambda 0,85 (and richer) without 4-stroking from about 3000 rpm to top rpm if ignition timing is in the right ballpark. Also, a properly designed combustion chamber (high msv type) should make tuning the EFI easier for you as it's less sensitive to 4-stroking.

[Frits Overmars]

Ok, making progress, that's if you can call getting it wrong progress.

Getting it wrong and realizing it will teach you more than just getting it right the first time. So yes, you can definitely call it progress.

My mistake was asking for to rich a Lambda at low throttle settings, and having the bike struggling to pickup on the dyno. I had made the map 0.85 Lambda everywhere, I should have stuck with the default map that had Lambda 1 at low RPM and dropping to Lambda 0.85 - 0.82 at max power.

I know it and you know it, but I can't repeat it often enough: lambda does not tell you rich or lean; it only tells you how much oxygen it sees in the exhaust gases.
At low throttle settings the engine will occasionally miss a combustion cycle, which sends all inhaled oxygen straight into the exhaust.
If you try to adjust the resulting lambda readout by jetting richer, you will smother the engine wit a very rich mixture (and cause even more misfiring).

[TZ350]

Thanks Haufen and Frits, good points. Thanks for the Heads-Up, I am looking forward to having another go, hopefully tonight.

[cotswold]

old school adjustable chamber

[TZ350]

4t - 2t .......

OK so you were just curious and wanted to try the 4T thing.

Attachment 292131

But if getting around town with a 4T is really just not your thing.

Attachment 292132

Then get real and make that 4T into a H2O 100cc 2T

Not sure I would go this way

Interestingly Chambers is actively building a CVT hybrid.

He is grafting his old GP100 engine onto a set of 4 stroke GY6 CVT cases to power his side car.

The last time the 100 ran it was 22hp hopefully we can increase that a bit.

[TZ350]

I know it and you know it, but I can't repeat it often enough: lambda does not tell you rich or lean; it only tells you how much oxygen it sees in the exhaust gases.

At low throttle settings the engine will occasionally miss a combustion cycle, which sends all inhaled oxygen straight into the exhaust.
If you try to adjust the resulting lambda readout by jetting richer, you will smother the engine wit a very rich mixture (and cause even more misfiring).

Getting some where now. Just before the courser is a spike in the Lambda line, this could be an example of what Frits has talked about where a miss fire dumps a whole lot of oxygen into the chamber.



Anyway the good old lead free 96 detonates real bad as the engine rpm approaches the torque peak so its an ideal time to try some Octane improver.

[koba]

I used to like the Idea of Fuel Injection.
I'm over that now.

[TZ350]

I used to like the Idea of Fuel Injection.
I'm over that now.

Me too just about.

[koba]

Me too just about.

Your in balls deep though.
Glad I'm not.

It's still prob worth persevering with given the investment in time an energy so far.
If you do get it going good it might well be the shiz.

I'll still stick with shuffling brass though!

[TZ350]

Did a bunch of runs from 20% to 100% TPS tonight.



80% TPS

Interestingly the runs improved up to 80% TPS then got worse out to WOT.

Also the Octane booster at 10cc per liter of 96 did noticeably improve things but not 100% as there was still some deto but no where near as bad as before.

Tomorrow night, I will try 98 + octane boost.

[Flettner]

Getting some where now. Just before the courser is a spike in the Lambda line, this could be an example of what Frits is talked about where a miss fire dumps a whole lot of oxygen into the chamber.



Anyway the good old lead free 96 detonates real bad as the engine rpm approaches the torque peak so its an ideal time to try some Octane improver.

Remember what I said, with injection ( injection timing control up the transfer ) the spill out the exhaust may well be just air this will tell the oxygen sensor it's too lean. BUT the combustion mixture is just right.
You need to measure the mixture trapped in the combustion chamber. A bit tricky.
I wouldn't bother with an oxygen sensor, it might be a bit like my cat and tell you lies.

[F5 Dave]

. .
I wouldn't bother with an oxygen sensor, it might be a bit like my cat and tell you lies.

What like she hasn't been fed? Mine does that too.

[chrisc]

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/moto...-686119218.htm

[Flettner]

What like she hasn't been fed? Mine does that too.

It seems to be magnetized to the fridge!