ESE's works engine tuner

[twotempi]

Rob - You can post that Excel gearbox sheet as an Excel file for people to download if you want

[husaberg]

I've had a play with my ignition.
I need a better measuring stick and a rev counter to get a proper measurement but the timing light seems OK until at least really high revs, the rate of change that I see by the strobe seems smooth and consistent.

Has anyone purchased a timing dial guage? recommendations? I was considering making a fixture for a dial guage that I can borrow and using that.
I'm gutted to find that the local tool shop have just stopped running a special (huge discount) on some precision measuring equipment.

From my rough measurement it looks like the advance curve spans around 29.5 degrees. That seems like a lot?

I'll post some more once I make it presentable.

Oh also, once I get a better idea of the ignition curve nature I'm going to have a go at simulating an engine based around that. It may be an option for a interim build plan as My engine is very mild at the moment.

I used to borrow one but after a while i thought well whats the point i want the timing in degrees not mm...
Here is my slant probably not technically correct either........
Go to the Chainsaw shop get a piston stopper (they are made to do up flywheel nuts i think.)
they look like a bolt with a thread to suit the plug hole and have a rounded end. maybe $10
get a timing disk, a nice proper one and make a sturdy marker that for the timing disk numbers.
insert the stopper in the plug hole move around to towards TDC take note of the degrees mark.
Rotate the engine in the opposite direction half way between the two points where it stops (assuming you have a central plug hole and your cylinder is not offsett) will be TDC.
Now put the pointer at true tdc and mark your flywheel in degrees. according for you tests scribe and use different colour nail polish as it stands out nicely and gives a nice visual indication

People used to make stopper and tdc gauges out of hollowed out plugs and steel rods when they wanted to set up the timming in MM

now i can see there will be alternate views on this.

BTW i have used one of these stoppers to tighten a flywheel before in an emergency i am not proud but it worked.
i used to use an old broken gear to lock the primary normally.(stole that idea from Kevin Cameron i think?)

[Bert]

I used to borrow one but after a while i thought well whats the point i want the timing in degrees not mm...
Here is my slant probably not technically correct either........
Go to the Chainsaw shop get a piston stopper (they are made to do up flywheel nuts i think.)
they look like a bolt with a thread to suit the plug hole and have a rounded end. maybe $10
get a timing disk, a nice proper one and make a sturdy marker that for the timing disk numbers.
insert the stopper in the plug hole move around to towards TDC take note of the degrees mark.
Rotate the engine in the opposite direction half way between the two points where it stops (assuming you have a central plug hole and your cylinder is not offsett) will be TDC.
Now put the pointer at true tdc and mark your flywheel in degrees. according for you tests scribe and use different colour nail polish as it stands out nicely and gives a nice visual indication

People used to make stopper and tdc gauges out of hollowed out plugs and steel rods when they wanted to set up the timming in MM

now i can see there will be alternate views on this.

BTW i have used one of these stoppers to tighten a flywheel before in an emergency i am not proud but it worked.
i used to use an old broken gear to lock the primary normally.(stole that idea from Kevin Cameron i think?)

I've got a tdc tool buzziti (spelling?). Then just made up a conversion chart (mm to degrees).
But the spark plug solution works well.

http://www.scooterhelp.com/tips/timi...ing.tools.html

[dinamik2t]

http://forum.rcdesign.ru/f5/thread241866.html rar-file.wondering if I can help with translation

The diagrams and pics in that document look very interesting, but I can't read Russian.. (I have an aunt who can, but I doubt she can help). Perhaps you could say a few works on that research.
Thanks for posting anyhow..

[ief]

Try google translator, I won't say it gets clear as crystal but better then russian.

[cookie1965]

(assuming you have a central plug hole and your cylinder is not offsett) )

I've seen people post that before, and the truth is that as long as the piston stop touches the same point on the piston crown going forward and backward, the middle point between the 2 degree wheel readings is TDC regardless of if the stop touches the highest point of the piston or not.

[F5 Dave]

Rogan's bike is currently a bit heavier (250 frame, albeit a very small one).

I had the chance to borow that bike before they got it. Getting it in the van was enough to convince me to look elsewhere. The 3XV frame is exceddingly stout for a 250. Surprised.
None of which helps the ego as I struggled to chase down that combo a couple of weeks ago.

[TZ350]

How dose that graph look with my FXR overlaid Rob. Coz that looks rather good. Put that engine in a sorted chassis and watch out. I think they are the same a 8500 then yours just takes off nice.

Hi Rich these are the graphs from the back to back test. (Rich Blue Line) in this graph I dont think my extra top end makes up for your better low end drive.



This is my current (old) engine. (Rich Blue Line) this looks quite good from 9 onwards, below that it drops dead. But I am sure with a bit of work it could be extended at the top and bottom.

If my engine could be made to pull from 7,500-8000 rpm I would be a happy chap. Now all I need is to lose 25kg 35 years and build a lighter bike.



The only real difference between the new and old (Blue line) engine is the extra blow down time area of the side ports (Red line). I think that with some sort of valve in the side ports I could join the graphs and then an ATAC valve like FarmerKens for plumping up the bottom end would do the trick.

[TZ350]

Anyway at the moment my interest is the CVT system. The front pulley is upside down because it sits on the table better that way.

At first sight it might seem that the distance between the pulleys has to be very accurate but what does very accurate mean? 10mm 5mm 1mm 0.1mm 0.5mm 0.05mm.

There are some simple ways of getting some sort of idea, like measuring the distance between the shaft centers of a real CVT Scooter and its easy to get a good measurement of the distance between shaft centers with some simple engineering tricks.

After taking a logical look at the way the sheaves clamp the belt I don't think a mm or two here or there between shaft centers will make much difference.

And I think that if one gets it really wrong, the range of effective CVT ratios might be affected but as long as the friction on the belt is high enough when clamped by the moving sheaves the thing will run anyway.



But if one was truly concerned about the relative length between the logical centers of the belt as well as the pulley pre load frictional force on the belt itself, here is a simple solution to adjust the belt tension.

[cotswold]

[QUOTE=TZ350;1130462968]







After trying both versions of your engine I would be hard pushed to choose which I would prefer. Before it nipped at Toke the beast was not horrible to ride and with a bit more time on it I think would be the faster of the two, Saying that the Taumarunui version was easy to ride but I was not able to ride it to its potential due to the Det problems and if I had been able to rev it out I may lean towards that one.

[TZ350]

With a bit of fiddling I think we may be able to get the best of both.

I am going to take the head off tomorrow to see what damage the det has done, water injection or a pressure dump valve in the chamber for when its in over rev may be the answer.

[wobbly]

Thousands of 2Ts have done thousands of Kms happy running in overev with no issues.
Both of the dyno graphs would indicate that either of the engines as run, are a complete waste of time reving past 12500 anyway.
If the thing is detoing up there, well over the torque peak, then only 2 things can be happening.
There is way too much advance past 12,000, or the air corrector is forcing the A/F ratio way too lean.
This would be the sort of effect you would see if a too big solenoid power jet was being switched off over the top.
Look into and correct these simple issues before even thinking of dicking around with water and and or dump valves that are completely unnecessary.

[bucketracer]

Attachment 275922 Attachment 275923

B9 plug after Tokoroa.



B10 plug after Taumarunui

Attachment 275921 Attachment 275920

The B10 plug from Taumarunui after some hot laps and a proper plug chop before over rev deto set in. I would be interested in what Wob has to say about it.

Hi Wobbly could you please have a look at TeeZees B10 plug for us.

[TZ350]

Yes, Wob I would be very keen to know if the colour of the B10's fuel ring is more like you would expect.

[husaberg]

Seeing as F4 is way too fast , F5 is dominated by the 50cc zealots from Wellington, if i have any chance of ever winning a title I will need to create my own class F6

49cc single speed pre 1960 that should narrow the field a bit

Heres my entry, after reading in depth about small frontal area , light weight skinny tyres I have arrived at this formula

Attachment 275248 Attachment 275249 Attachment 275250 Attachment 275251

maybe some of the senior bucket guys like speedpro can shed some of their wisdom as he can probably remember them when they were new

I'm afraid your mass distribution is less than optimal; you might want to have more load on the front wheel.
Ever considered Solex racing ? (yes, it's another crazy Dutch thing. But the French picked up on it as well ).

I found this while looking for something else .Of course I didn't find what i was looking for but what's new.
I have posted Vincenti Paitti stuff before but never put 2 and 2 together.

The other bit is for Grumph we mentioned a while back this guy i certainly never knew he would go to the evil side i guess he is in a way responsible for the Evil FXR150 as Well.
He knew Bugathi as well as co designing the TSCC.
http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache5LvEZT9e7YJ:twinspin-ec.com/The Piatti Story_MASTER_Word_02.pdf+patents+for+vincent+piatt i&hl=en&gl=nz&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESgVOzV8mu0AmIn5ZXdBdPiHpb16eWG0jNGU8qa2 Gb1Kd86ZYlojR3yeSMvOSMMk_CyB1s1lKgOWBi1yZeznOyq2My BOvc5S7XO9hIKF0M7HwNi_FfNUBJBbBaAHfAy2k_3Lk_sg&sig=AHIEtbTx5y12z-YhH3gOMYEJKo7N4HUBhA

http://twinspin-ec.com/Analysis Software.htm