race bikes...

[dss3]

I am trying to find a reasonable F3 race bike to buy at the moment. There doesn't seem to be a great deal of them around. Considering spending up to or around $3,000.00

Would those of you with race bikes recommend buying a bike that is "ready to race" or to buy a road bike and modifying it for racing? Obviously this would be somewhat dependent on how good a deal you got on the particular bike, however in general what do you think would be best/easiest/cheepest?

If going down the "modify" road what would you be looking to change on the bike? Different gearing, better brakes/lines, better tyres, removal of lights/speedo,fitting fancy race numbers and plastering of bike in bullshit stickers... anything obvious i'm missing?

Any helpful infomation appreciated, hope to be racing sooner rather than later.

_daryl

MODERN TRANSPORT ENGINEERS (2002) LTD
HEAVY TRANSPORT AND TRAILER MANUFACTURERS
Cnr Foreman and Tasman Roads,
Box 10055 Te Rapa,
Hamilton
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Fax 64-7-8491633

[Quasievil]

Oh No not another one.

I reckon mate look for a race bike first then a road bike second, go for a 400 so I can kick your arse on it, maybe a GSXR400 or ZXR400 or NC30
Ask SLim about her guys GSXR400 race bike you should get that for $3000
otherwise TM is the way to look.

Look at Frosties Race comments here
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=3032

im keen to help with my limited skill and I will keep a look out for you as well

[FROSTY]

To be honest mate if ya need to ask the question then its self answering.
Buy something thats already built up ready to race.
From personal experience The money you spend developing a race bike you just don't recoup.
I'd start out with a reliable bike with as stock as possible a motor.
I think slims partner was selling his gixxer400
If ya go the other way Atomic wreckers were selling a zxr400 -perfect as a beginner bike
Feel free to call me with anything ya find and ill be happy to help ya out.

[dss3]

To be honest mate if ya need to ask the question then its self answering.

Shit, that sounds deep! Will go think about that haha.

Doesn't look like Slims man wants to sell his anymore, otherwise would be looking at it this weekend. And yeah Quasi I have read through that post cheers. Will definitely be getting a 400 of some description, watch out! All ready got my applications for race licenses sent away, so now its just a matter of finding a bike and practising.

Surely buying a race bike would be cheeper than buying a road legal bike in same condition all other things being equal though?

[Hoon]

Yeah race bikes are cheaper but you also have to remember you are buying all the little problems that the previous owner couldn't fix. Also it gets real hard trying to troubleshoot when you don't know whether its the after market exhaust or the non standard carbs or the hacked airbox or the total loss etc causing the problem. You end up just stabbing in the dark.

I myself prefer an untouched street bike, at least I know exactly what I'm getting and what it should be putting out after a freshen up. Having a known starting point provides a good solid base for measuring improvements too.

However yes you can get a good deal from buying a used race bike but you have to ask why the person is selling it, what lap times it did and how reliable it was (look up old race results and ask others that raced against it).

$3000 will buy you a competitive bike but you will also need to factor in another $1000-2000 to sort it/yourself properly.

[FROSTY]

actually thinking about it i tend to agree with hoon My reason is different than his. A road bike is a lot easier to sell than a race bike -so If ya just plain cant get ya head into this racing lark you can always sell it again,.

[dss3]

Cheers for the help guys.

So it looks like at the moment unless I can find a good race bike that I know has been looked after relatively well with a decent history, I will be going for a road bike and modifying it.

When it comes to modifying a road bike I know Frosty has listed all the changes you need to meet regulations in the above mentioned post, like removing lights, wiring sump, no antifreeze, etc etc.

However what would you change to make the bike more competitive? I guess there could be no limit to what you could do if you have the money, but excluding major engine mod's etc what other expenses would be likely?

Im thinking you might change the gearing, fit better brake pads, possibly braided lines, maybe new air filter, better sticky tires. None of these things are particularly major or expensive. Anything obvious missing here???

_daryl

[That Guy]

I'm stuck on the road vs race bike one. Frosty and Hoon are both right. I bought a $3k or so race RGV, and then used up 4 track days getting it going properly; sometimes paying $80 at Puke for only 3 laps and the rest of the time with the bike in bits track side. However if you buy a road bike you'll get the chance to road test properly you'll also have to spend time & money on getting it converted.

Either way keep some budget spare, and if you buy a race bike - go to a track day first to help avoid a race day dnf dissapointment.

[Quasievil]

Mate I got a raod bike and trimmed it up, if I can do it , believe me anyone can do it !!
as far as Im concerned just make sure the suspension is mint and get good rubber, ie for 400cc get dunlop GPR70 you cant go wrong with these, you can pass tl1000 wanna be racers around the outside of hairpins on them easy!!!

Go get a ZXR400 or a cheaper option will be a gsxr400.

I think the Hondas NC30 will give you a rubber restriction as they are on 18 inch tyres (correct me if Im wrong ) and 17 inch wheels are very expensive and you will have more luck searching for a blonde Nymphomaniac that looks like pamela anderson walking in frankton.

Keen to help out (of course) and will look out for suitable bikes

[Quasievil]

Here are some I would be looking at, there are some Hondas which comprimises my above comments but not sure Im right.
There are some good' ns though for reasonable coin

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=26715818&key=12104043

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=26898554&key=12104257

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=26737439&key=12104257

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=26581431&key=12104257

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=27189239&key=12104257

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=26692118&key=12104257

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=27070727&key=12104257

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=27186052&key=12104257

http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=27290536&key=12104257

[GixerBoy]

Hi daryl you got the bug as well we could start a ham's racing crew. Here is one quasi missed.

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Sports-tourer/auction-27211368.htm

[FROSTY]

Ok dude heres the truth--forget all the racer bullshit.
Unless ya names Foggarty or similar You are totally wasting your time spending money on the bike to start with.
There is no limit to the money you can spend on a race bike . Ie If ya have a million bucks you could spend that much.
In ascending order heres what I suggest.
1)Full engine service -Use quality lubricants. Best insurance you can invest in.Get the motor compression and leakdown tested to ensure its all kosher.
Get the rev/speed limiter removed or suckered into not working. ($300-$600)
2)get the suspension front and rear serviced and set for your weight
I used mr Bruin for the rear and Colmans suzuki tio do the setup. (150-600)
This is the second biggest go fast job you can do -no amount of HP is gonna help ya if your wobbling topwards the fence at 150km/h
3) a set of quality road tyres -GPR70's or similar. (500)
Trust me here the whole slicks/wets thing is more head damage than you need at this stage--You see how hard me and KK ride our F3 bikes on stock tyres
4) THE BIGGEST IMPROVEMENT TO LAP TIMES /RACE FINISHES YOU CAN MAE IS ---TUNE UP THE LOOSE NUT ON TOP
Im really serious here -My lap times have improved 10 seconds in a year at pukie and about 7 seconds in a year at taupo and that was on a stock motor.There is nothing gonna carve ya lap times down more than just plain doing laps.
Proof--ok I was at Taupo last weekend on a gutless TZR250 beating guys on gsxr600s and SV650's --quite simply by outriding em - Im not as good as a lot of other KB racers so ya see my point.
From there the skys the limit.
Hot Cams,porting,ohlins suspension.steerring dampers,crash bunggs,race wiring loom,big bore kit, race fairings,slicks,tyre warmers,spare wheels -ligtweight wheels. -The list goes on and on.
Just get ya ass out there first off
If ya need a hand with basic setup come seee me and Ill do it for ya.

[That Guy]

Frosty's right - get a reliable bike and just ride. 99% of fast will come from you in the first season or so - not the bike.

Have you seen that crashed NC30 for sale on here? http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=12014
Could be a cheap start? Might need de-restricting though - KK knows all about NC30s....

[Brian d marge]

Ok dude heres the truth--forget all the racer bullshit.
Unless ya names Foggarty or similar You are totally wasting your time spending money on the bike to start with.
There is no limit to the money you can spend on a race bike . Ie If ya have a million bucks you could spend that much.
In ascending order heres what I suggest.
1)Full engine service -Use quality lubricants. Best insurance you can invest in. ya.

Snip

Thae above is about the best advise you will hear ...Me I would buy an race bike straight off ....

OR ,,go motocross ..( big una bashed plug ) cos its cheaper and Waaaay more fun than road racing

Stephen
A definate air time Junky ....,,,,( I would LOVE to do a 30ft table like aleisi ... or slide it of the face like bubba ...man those guys are impressive,,,,)

[dss3]

Thanks again for all the great info, especially Frosty... you da man! Hope to see you guys out on the track shortly... :D

_daryl

[Quasievil]

Thanks again for all the great info, especially Frosty... you da man! Hope to see you guys out on the track shortly... :D

_daryl

Yeah you will see us, we wont see you though because we are not allowed mirrors on the race bikes:wait:

[dss3]

Yeah you will see us, we wont see you though because we are not allowed mirrors on the race bikes:wait:

Don't worry about it mate, the marshalls will be waving blue flags at you so you will have plenty of time to move out of the way for me!

Hahaha, at least you have a good sense of humour... you'll be needing it! And whats up with you always being the next person to post anfter anything I post? You're like my god damn shadow!!!

[Quasievil]

Don't worry about it mate, the marshalls will be waving blue flags at you so you will have plenty of time to move out of the way for me!

Hahaha, at least you have a good sense of humour... you'll be needing it! And whats up with you always being the next person to post anfter anything I post? You're like my god damn shadow!!!

yeah Yeah Yeah , your shadow, no. Worst nightmare yes :devil2:

[dss3]

yeah Yeah Yeah , your shadow, no. Worst nightmare yes :devil2:

Arrrgh! Not the one where I wake up one morning to find that someone has been and stolen my dear TL?... and replaced it with... a Kawasaki....arrrgh... wake up Daryl, it's ok, it's just a bad dream....

Fuck it, that's enough pissing around... it's home time now, off to da pub!

Call me if your keen to ride tommorrow morning.

_daryl

[Fluffy Cat]

You need a 250 2 stroke no need for hot cams etc....just lots and lots of small moving cheap parts like say.....a crank or pistons..yes pistons you will need lots of those and the things the pistons go in er what are they...cylinders yes cheap cylinders.
No wait a sec all the 250 2 strokes are mine or will be mine better get a 4 stroke!.

[dss3]

You need a 250 2 stroke no need for hot cams etc....just lots and lots of small moving cheap parts like say.....a crank or pistons..yes pistons you will need lots of those and the things the pistons go in er what are they...cylinders yes cheap cylinders.
No wait a sec all the 250 2 strokes are mine or will be mine better get a 4 stroke!.

Haha, thanks for that informative if somewhat mad reply mate!

Looking at this at the moment, so no one else try and buy it first OK!!!

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Sports-tourer/auction-27223373.htm

[Ghost Lemur]

Go for the '88 VFR 400. Besides being hell cheap to buy (which leaves more money for spares/go fast bits), it'll also mean you can go in the pre89 class therefore get more racing in than if you stuck to F3 alone.

It's already reached it's reserve and "shouldn't" go over the $1k mark before it ends on Sunday.

[Ghost Lemur]

Haha, thanks for that informative if somewhat mad reply mate!

Looking at this at the moment, so no one else try and buy it first OK!!!

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Sports-tourer/auction-27223373.htm

Don't waste that nice bike on the track. Always saddens me to see one less nice streetbike removed from circulation. If you're not going to use it on the road why pay for it already being registered? You can get un unregistered (through lack of use) bike for a hell of a lot less. Still recon the '88 NC24 I just mentioned (that Quasi posted) would be the best option. Complete bike under a grand, and by the time you need the extra performance of a latter bike you will have got your fill of it and be able to recoup more of you costs. As opposed to buy a $3k-$3500 wof/reg'd bike and loosing hand over fist right off the bat.

[Two Smoker]

Yeah you will see us, we wont see you though because we are not allowed mirrors on the race bikes:wait:

But i get to see you qausi TWICE!!! You know... as i lap you.....

Daryl get a ZXR400, NC30 or gixxer400... Craig isnt selling his bike yet,due to needing to fix his new bike...

I wouldnt go for the NC24, as its performance is inadequate...

[FROSTY]

there was a really cool viffer400 kicking around taupo way pretty cheap--red with a green tail unit