Open letter to Helen Clark

[Pixie]

C.C.George Hawkins,David Benson-Pope,Paul Swain,John Tamahere,Dover Samuels

Hey,Helen. Notice how the French Prime Minister resigns at the slightest indication that The People don't rate him?

The question was:What is accountability?

[Ms Piggy]

Wots the alternative though?

[NC]

Add something about 'extreme makeovers'

[Gremlin]

Wots the alternative though?
Precisely. I don't like Labour one bit. But is there anyone else that can actually hold it together???

I tend to gravitate to National, but they couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery... :oi-grr:

[Pixie]

I suppose we should put up with shit and let the bludgers continue to suck at the public teat AND continue to find new ways to screw us.

I just want to see them out of a job.

The French know what to do and we will see what the Dutch do soon.

Getting our bastards to be responsible for the jobs they are supdosed to perform is like doing an impossible thing

[Phurrball]

C.C.George Hawkins,David Benson-Pope,Paul Swain,John Tamahere,Dover Samuels

Hey,Helen. Notice how the French Prime Minister resigns at the slightest indication that The People don't rate him?

The question was:What is accountability?

I believe, dear pixie, that you, and everyone else, gets to rate the politicos later this year.

Don't believe everything that the media beats up either. David Benson-Pope was one of my teachers, and a damned good one at that. But don't take my word for it, here is the <a href="http://www.oldfriends.co.nz/MessageBoardViewThread.aspx?thread=757603&institution=389">thread</a> started by a Prime journo fishing for dirt. Guess it kinda backfired eh?

My $0.02. I'm with CSL here - What IS the alternative? National/Act? :rofl: [Although Labour is far from perfect...]

[Pixie]

Repeat ,not looking for an alternative,Sack em

[Lou Girardin]

Let's have ANARCHY!

[Oscar]

C.C.George Hawkins,David Benson-Pope,Paul Swain,John Tamahere,Dover Samuels

Hey,Helen. Notice how the French Prime Minister resigns at the slightest indication that The People don't rate him?

The question was:What is accountability?

The French Prime Minister was sacked by Jacques Chirac.
Different system.

[Lou Girardin]

Good old Froggies, cheese eating surrender monkeys or not, they know how to get rid of political embarrasments. (take note US, UK, NZ)

[Ms Piggy]

Repeat ,not looking for an alternative,Sack em
Ummm....eerrrrrrrrr, if we "Sack em" then there kinda has to be something to replace them. What do you suggest?

[Coldkiwi]

I tend to gravitate to National, but they couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery... :oi-grr:

which is EXACTLY why you should vote for them!! The last thing you want is politicians that can organise themselves because then they'll muck the entire country up (as has been ably demonstrated by Helen and labour).
Follow Italy's lead... have a new govt every year so they never get their grubby hands deep enough into anyones pockets to cause any damage and everyone will just get on with it with no gubmint interference! :yes:

[Biff]

I'm lost. What has a referendum on whether or not a nation signs up to the European constitution and the sacking of a French prime minister got to do with the prime minister of NZ?

The Dutch have also voted no by the way.

[Ms Piggy]

The last thing you want is politicians that can organise themselves because then they'll muck the entire country up (as has been ably demonstrated by Helen and labour).
How exactly have Labour mucked up the country entirely? And what have National presented thats any better as an alternative? Oh apart from policies that will continue to ensure the poor get poorer.

[Motu]

Each successive government revamps a well running system into a total fuckup,the next government spends it's term trying to put it back together again and takes the rap for the mess - the names mean nothing,they all do it.

Helen's the only member of parliment with a backbone,for all her faults I don't want any other gutter crawling slugs in power,Brash and Winstone make me sick.

[MrMelon]

Add something about 'extreme makeovers'
Hey c'mon, even extreme makeover's gotta draw the line somewhere.

[Biff]

Hey c'mon, even extreme makeover's gotta draw the line somewhere.

Extreme flame thrower?

[El Dopa]

Follow Italy's lead... have a new govt every year so they never get their grubby hands deep enough into anyones pockets to cause any damage and everyone will just get on with it with no gubmint interference! :yes:

Oh yeah, Italy's doing reeeeal well with Il Bertolusci in charge.

Just a thought, but if you have a change of government every year, every party will spend 99% of their time either preparing for an election, or sorting their shit out post-election (choosing a cabinet, getting used to their portfolios etc).

In what way is this a good thing?

[Dafe]

GO NATIONAL!!!

TO HELL WITH THE LABOUR PARTY!
I work for my money!!!

[Timber020]

Don Brash, a clueless accountant/civil servant. A great politician until he either has to
1) say something
2) Do something.

After his speel at Dawn parade, Id rather move to aussie than have him in any situation where he may represent Me or my nation.

[Pixie]

I'm lost. What has a referendum on whether or not a nation signs up to the European constitution and the sacking of a French prime minister got to do with the prime minister of NZ?

The Dutch have also voted no by the way.
Let me explain...Froggy leader did something Froggy population largely didn't like...and he quit (or got sacked)

This appears not to happen in this fair land.
Even pom politicians are more likely to resign than ours are.

[Pixie]

Each successive government revamps a well running system into a total fuckup,the next government spends it's term trying to put it back together again and takes the rap for the mess - the names mean nothing,they all do it.

Helen's the only member of parliment with a backbone,for all her faults I don't want any other gutter crawling slugs in power,Brash and Winstone make me sick.
Bob Jones in a recent interview,
"Clark is a consumate politician:she would bring in the 'Hanging Maoris act' if she thought it would advance her political aspirations"

You've been snowed.

[Rainbow Wizard]

Precisely. I don't like Labour one bit. But is there anyone else that can actually hold it together??? And top marks, he's pushing the "lower taxes barrow" that might steal a few voters from Act!

[Gremlin]

And top marks, he's pushing the "lower taxes barrow" that might steal a few voters from Act!
I think just about everyone is catching that bus except labour. And he still sorta slept with clarke who loves to tax and err.... tax.

The one valuable thing I have learnt from uni is that they are all just about the same, will sell their grandmothers for votes, and are probably good mates away from public scrutiny. Uni has made me apathetic.

[Lou Girardin]

Oh yeah, Italy's doing reeeeal well with Il Bertolusci in charge.

Just a thought, but if you have a change of government every year, every party will spend 99% of their time either preparing for an election, or sorting their shit out post-election (choosing a cabinet, getting used to their portfolios etc).

In what way is this a good thing?

It's a good thing if you're Italian. They don't allow Govt's to interfere in their lives. if it's against the law they do it anyway.

[Coldkiwi]

How exactly have Labour mucked up the country entirely? And what have National presented thats any better as an alternative? Oh apart from policies that will continue to ensure the poor get poorer.


from my point of view, the state of society in the country has taken some serious turns away from common sense since they've been in. Drinking ages being lowered, prostitution legalised, civil unions legislation with massive holes, defence spending still falling like a stone (read the RSA's review of defence if you think the latest "$1Billion" increase is anything to crow about) and a finance minister that thinks a 67C tax cut is grounds for calling everyone miserable sods that will always be ungrateful for any tax cut.

National may not have promoted anything particularly rosier (and I've never voted for them for that reason)- but at least they've proved that they're totally disorganised!
I think its much better to have a bunch of disorganised morons in power and red hot opposition (whatever their bent) keeping govt stupidity in check than a well organised govt with a social agenda longer than the country and little to no opposition in power to make sure they don't go too far with it.

Like the Pirelli slogan goes "power is nothing without control" :niceone:

[Gremlin]

Ok, before reading this, bear in mind I tend to support the right wing, and I'm probably making generalisations, but its a different view point.

Labour is for the people. National is for businesses. Labour screws businesses and tries to help the people. National helps businesses and screws the people (in a very basic view). But if Labour is in power and making the company spend huge on tax and compliance, then profits fall and people have to be laid off, or halt pay increases. v.v if the business is doing really well, then they want to expand and employ more people, or pay more.

So, to my way of thinking, if businesses are suffering then people suffer. If businesses do well, then people do well, so why not allow the businesses to do well?? Ok, obviously not everyone will follow that line (some will just take the profits) but in the end, they will probably end up spending it, probably to another business, hence the money go round and velocity of money...

That said, I'm a student and I want universal allowances even though they probably aren't financially viable. But I want them.

I also liked National's every year of work = one year wipe off of student loan (Labour called it slave labour) :oi-grr:

[Ixion]

National, Labour, Labour, National, don't make any difference, it is just the difference between government by plutocrats or government by bureaucrats

Whatever government you have it will always be inimical to the working class.

All the people can hope for is a government that's so crippled that it can't actually do much at all.

[riffer]

I also liked National's every year of work = one year wipe off of student loan (Labour called it slave labour) :oi-grr:

Ah actually Gremlin - that was the Greens. :whistle:

[SPORK]

Greens. They rule. Wouldn't work as a majority party, but as a "flavour on the side" they're awesome. In a couple of years I'll vote for 'em.


...Or the Communist party...

[Oscar]

The Resource Management Act is strangling this country and is typical of the fucking "we just know better" namby pamby fucking PC wankers in power at the moment.

Want to see Aussie V8's? Vote National.
Want see bike racing survive? Vote National.
When Labour has finished saving us from cigarettes, speeding and booze, they're gonna come after other anti-social elements like people who ride motorbikes.

[Oscar]

Ok, before reading this, bear in mind I tend to support the right wing, and I'm probably making generalisations, but its a different view point.

Labour is for the people. National is for businesses. Labour screws businesses and tries to help the people. National helps businesses and screws the people (in a very basic view). But if Labour is in power and making the company spend huge on tax and compliance, then profits fall and people have to be laid off, or halt pay increases. v.v if the business is doing really well, then they want to expand and employ more people, or pay more.

So, to my way of thinking, if businesses are suffering then people suffer. If businesses do well, then people do well, so why not allow the businesses to do well?? Ok, obviously not everyone will follow that line (some will just take the profits) but in the end, they will probably end up spending it, probably to another business, hence the money go round and velocity of money...

That said, I'm a student and I want universal allowances even though they probably aren't financially viable. But I want them.

I also liked National's every year of work = one year wipe off of student loan (Labour called it slave labour) :oi-grr:

It was the Greens.
In fact Rob Donald called University Fees "inter-generational theft". This is bullshit - if you want to buy a business you pay. If you wanna train as a Doctor and earn huge money why should the tax payers help you?

In fact free educational isn't free at all - someone pays: the long suffering taxpayer. Actually free education is inter-generational theft: your children pay.

[Pixie]

Ok, before reading this, bear in mind I tend to support the right wing, and I'm probably making generalisations, but its a different view point.

Labour is for the people. National is for businesses. Labour screws businesses and tries to help the people. National helps businesses and screws the people (in a very basic view). But if Labour is in power and making the company spend huge on tax and compliance, then profits fall and people have to be laid off, or halt pay increases. v.v if the business is doing really well, then they want to expand and employ more people, or pay more.

So, to my way of thinking, if businesses are suffering then people suffer. If businesses do well, then people do well, so why not allow the businesses to do well?? Ok, obviously not everyone will follow that line (some will just take the profits) but in the end, they will probably end up spending it, probably to another business, hence the money go round and velocity of money...

That said, I'm a student and I want universal allowances even though they probably aren't financially viable. But I want them.

I also liked National's every year of work = one year wipe off of student loan (Labour called it slave labour) :oi-grr:
I always thought it was:
Labour is for the labour MP's
National is for the national MP's
NZ First is for NZ First MP's
Greens are for Greens MP's
etc.

I will never vote for ideological zealots

[El Dopa]

It's a good thing if you're Italian. They don't allow Govt's to interfere in their lives. if it's against the law they do it anyway.

True. At my old work, a Pom delegation, a German delegation and an Italian delegation all got together to nut out some mutually beneficial thing, can't remember exactly what.

At the end of the negotiations, one of the German delgates was complaining about how hard it would be for them to comply with all the requirements (which applied equally to all the parties/nationalities). One of the Italians looked at him and said 'it is but a beautiful dream, something for us to aspire to'. Which about sums up their attitude.

[Lou Girardin]

The Resource Management Act is strangling this country and is typical of the fucking "we just know better" namby pamby fucking PC wankers in power at the moment.

Want to see Aussie V8's? Vote National.
Want see bike racing survive? Vote National.
When Labour has finished saving us from cigarettes, speeding and booze, they're gonna come after other anti-social elements like people who ride motorbikes.

National introduced the RMA.
The Wellington street race died under National.

[cruzer]

What about;
- Giving people who are on the bebnefit a "benefit card" that can only be used for spending for fundamentals of life?
- Why not stop treating people in prison as though they are the ones that have been wronged. Once convicted and sentenced, offer 4 rights.....1) the right to shelter - 2) the right to food - 3) the right to clothing - 4) the right to medical attention, everything else....work for it.
- Making people responsible for their actions and allowing people to take responsibility
These few things and others are only ideas and opinions and are not designed to anger or draw an irrate response but to illustrate that we can all complain bitterly and until blue in the face but, changes are most often effected from within, join a party that best suits your needs and be heard. :niceone:

[cruzer]

What about;
- Giving people who are on the benefit a "benefit card" that can only be used for spending for fundamentals of life?
- Why not stop treating people in prison as though they are the ones that have been wronged. Once convicted and sentenced, offer 4 rights.....1) the right to shelter - 2) the right to food - 3) the right to clothing - 4) the right to medical attention, everything else....work for it.
- Making people responsible for their actions and allowing people to take responsibility
These few things and others are only ideas and opinions and are not designed to anger or draw an irrate response but to illustrate that we can all complain bitterly and until blue in the face but, changes are most often effected from within, join a party that best suits your needs and be heard. :niceone:

[Oscar]

National introduced the RMA.
The Wellington street race died under National.

I'll think you'll find it was ammended under Labour.
It is strangling progress.

[marty]

although, people are quick to use the RMA to their advantage if there is a NIMBY situation happening. the pylons and wind farms are classic examples. it works both ways, if there was no RMA, the 400kva footings would be down already, there would be a gondola across the south island, whenuapai would be auckland's second airport, ferrys would be doing 30kts down the malborough sounds, international companies would be mining black sand off 300 miles of west coast beaches etc etc

[Oscar]

although, people are quick to use the RMA to their advantage if there is a NIMBY situation happening. the pylons and wind farms are classic examples. it works both ways, if there was no RMA, the 400kva footings would be down already, there would be a gondola across the south island, whenuapai would be auckland's second airport, ferrys would be doing 30kts down the malborough sounds, international companies would be mining black sand off 300 miles of west coast beaches etc etc

Maybe they would.
But I can tell you that the taxpayer wouldn't have to be forking out 50k for Taniwha next to the expressway, neither.

[marty]

i don't think that had anything to do with the rma - more likely everything to do with greed

[Lou Girardin]

I'll think you'll find it was ammended under Labour.
It is strangling progress.

Whatever.
You'll find that National and Labour are the political equivalent of Dame Edna Everidge and Sir Barry Humphries.