Police target motorcyclists in another safety campaign

[White trash]

Just had a visit from a local Constable informing me of a local/nation wide campaign targeting motorcyclist safety compliance. Licence, rego, WOF, correct gear etc etc.

Aiming at the commuter riders is the impression I got, he and other officers will be targeting high traffic areas around Wellington, Hutt Valley for the next month.

You might get a free muslie bar and a pen that doesn't work and a photo of StoneY on his KTM if you're good.

Seemed like a nice enough chap and bloody good of him to let us know what was happening so we could pass the message on I thought.

[Str8 Jacket]

Seemed like a nice enough chap and bloody good of him to let us know what was happening so we could pass the message on I thought.

Yeah, it is good of them! I am just glad tha they didn't stop me this morning on my way to work - I think that my bike may have blown over.

[jim.cox]

What business is it of theirs that we wear the "correct gear"

Ok, helmets are compulsary

But if I decide to ride in shorts and jandals its my choice

We must resist these Saftey Nazis....

[Badjelly]

What business is it of theirs that we wear the "correct gear"

Ok, helmets are compulsary

But if I decide to ride in shorts and jandals its my choice

We must resist these Saftey Nazis....

How is your campaign of resistance against the Spelling Nazis coming along?

[baffa]

Good idea imo.
Probably going to ping half the bikes they pull over for no rego.

[The Pastor]

terrible idea, good time to sell the bike i think!

[oneofsix]

Oh great. I leave early enough to just beat the traffic and now I risk having a friendly chat with the :police: whilst they poke their beaks around my bike etc and then be left to compete with the cages I was trying to avoid. Shouldn't be so negative, they are only trying to help - yeah :drinknsin

[5150]

What business is it of theirs that we wear the "correct gear"

Ok, helmets are compulsary

But if I decide to ride in shorts and jandals its my choice

We must resist these Saftey Nazis....

The business that if you are riding yer moped in shorts, teeshirt and jandals, pie in one hand while texting with the other and have an accident, we don't have to pay through ACC to fix yer mother fucking arse :doh:

[Bassmatt]

The business that if you are riding yer moped in shorts, teeshirt and jandals, pie in one hand while texting with the other and have an accident, we don't have to pay through ACC to fix yer mother fucking arse :doh:

The logical conclusion to that line of argument is NO MOTORCYCLES. Be careful what you wish for.

[oneofsix]

The business that if you are riding yer moped in shorts, teeshirt and jandals, pie in one hand while texting with the other and have an accident, we don't have to pay through ACC to fix yer mother fucking arse :doh:

if they have a pie in one hand and texting with the other then they have them by the short and curlies but ACC still pays just as it does for horse riders and prison escapers.

[5150]

The logical conclusion to that line of argument is NO MOTORCYCLES. Be careful what you wish for.

I wasn't wishing for anything actually. Just sick in constantly seeing idiots in shorts and jandals or lycra riding their skooters / push bikes like morons while rest of us actually cares about our own and everyones safety. Over and Out

[dogsnbikes]

Just sick in constantly seeing idiots in shorts and jandals or lycra riding their skooters / push bikes like morons while rest of us actually cares about our own and everyones safety.

I think we have the biggest Moron down here

He rides around in shorts and barefeet and has Ford stickers on his Honda Blackbird:brick:

[5150]

I think we have the biggest Moron down here

He rides around in shorts and barefeet and has Ford stickers on his Honda Blackbird:brick:

:pinch::crazy:

[Maha]

If you are riding legally you have nothing to worry about.

[jim.cox]

If you are riding legally you have nothing to worry about.

I disagree

If I am riding legally why should I be pulled over at all ?

Being targeted as part of a "campaign targeting motorcyclist safety compliance" is just bullshit plain and simple...

[riffer]

If you are riding legally you have nothing to worry about.

Yup. That one worked perfectly in Warsaw Ghetto too (skirting carefully around Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law)).

[Maha]

I disagree

If I am riding legally why should I be pulled over at all ?

Being targeted as part of a "campaign targeting motorcyclist safety compliance" is just bullshit plain and simple...

A cop will not know you are riding legally until he asks you to stop...:brick:

[Bassmatt]

A cop will not know you are riding legally until he asks you to stop...:brick:

Nor does he know if I am acting legally in my own home until he enters it..........random home inspections are all good too then?

[jim.cox]

A cop will not know you are riding legally until he asks you to stop...:brick:

So why not be honest and call it a "Campaign Targeting Legal Compliance" ?

[oneofsix]

I disagree

If I am riding legally why should I be pulled over at all ?

Being targeted as part of a "campaign targeting motorcyclist safety compliance" is just bullshit plain and simple...

Because they can as a condition of being on the road, they can stop you any time for any or no reason. They have the power, but isn't that why it is called an 'abuse of power'? :angry2:

It is similar to the good old USSR system. No one is perfect so everyone will do something wrong sometime, it is just a matter of using it to suppress them and you can rely on some of their number being helpful with little homilies like the infamous "if you are doing nothign wrong ..." :bs:

[Maha]

So why not be honest and call it a "Campaign Targeting Legal Compliance" ?

Because bikers are (in general) fuckin easy to wind up. ? :corn:

[Big Dave]

Why *should* you - is a different answer to why *are* you.

You 'should' be allowed to continue unhindered.

The 'are' is partly because:

- Said cops are sick of having to scrape what's left off the tarmac and inform next of kin. (Ask them - they'll tell you). They believe it's a proactive approach.

- Further up the chain, there have been too many 'It's cheaper to ride unregistered than pay my ACC' rants.

- So many complain online about what other people wear.

[SMOKEU]

Time to do a runner then.

[jim.cox]

Time to do a runner then.

Nah - Just dont swallow the bullshit they spout - and dont let them push you around

[Zedder]

I presume this is what the cops are talking about:http://www.transport.govt.nz/saferjourneys/saferjourneysactionplan2011-2012/

[jim.cox]

I presume this is what the cops are talking about:http://www.transport.govt.nz/saferjourneys/saferjourneysactionplan2011-2012/

Oh No - Yet more bureaucrap pc speak

Dont they understand we're drowning in it all ready

Bubble

bubble

bub...

[Str8 Jacket]

Watch out if you don't stop.....

260108

[Gremlin]

meh... it's not the first campaign, won't be the last. I've clocked up 50+k in the last year odd, not been stopped or spoken to once during that time about some campaign.

I'm starting to wonder if they really exist...

[willytheekid]

I love getting waved down:eek:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LRtticU6ZU
:laugh:

No problems getting stopped for a "safety check"...as long as the cop in question knows something! about bikes & gear etc (other wise its bloody pointless int it)

...I also hope they are giving away shiny vests instead of stupid pens etc with winter coming :yes:

[Bald Eagle]

More revenue gathering thinly disguised as a 'safety campaign' :facepalm:

[Maha]

More revenue gathering thinly disguised as a 'safety campaign' :facepalm:

How is it ''revenue gathering''?

[MSTRS]

Watch out if you don't stop.....



Typical bloody motorcyclist...pulling random U-turns without looking. Will they never learn?

[Crasherfromwayback]

I disagree

If I am riding legally why should I be pulled over at all ?

.

As good as our police are...they're not mind readers. So they don't actually know you're riding 'legally'.

[awa355]

It's the thought of some condesending, snotty nosed police cadet (almost) telling me that motorcycling is "Dangerous". After 44 years riding, I know what the "RISKS" are.

I'm as law abiding as anyone, but I get my back up at being pulled over for no reason, I'm afraid, my respect for the police has gone downhill in the last 20 years or so.

I'll be asking whoever pulls me up if they have a full motorbike licence, If not, I'll be tempted to say 'What the fuck would you know about the risks then?'

[mossy1200]

Good on them if they target riders in shorts and skirts with little or no footwear and give them a talking to about safety gear.Sure check their rego at same time.
I really dont mind stoping for 5mins to be honest.Maybe a stolen bike might get found or people not paying regos will get harmed in the process.SO WHAT..

[Berries]

What is wrong with no footwear if you don't crash?

I'd be tempted to put my flip flops and hot pants on just to see what they said. Bit cold in the mornings at the moment though. Anyone know if it just a Wellington thing?

[Nzpure]

21 Unreasonable search and seizure
Everyone has the right to be secure against unreasonable search or seizure, whether of the person, property, or correspondence or otherwise.
22 Liberty of the person
Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily arrested or detained

Does these 2 acts from the bill of rights not apply to said initiatives? or am i barking up the wrong tree?

Heres the link if you need it, its right there in the bill of rights...http://legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1990/0109/latest/whole.html#DLM225522

[Crasherfromwayback]

21 Unreasonable search and seizure
Everyone has the right to be secure against unreasonable search or seizure, whether of the person, property, or correspondence or otherwise.
22 Liberty of the person
Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily arrested or detained

Does these 2 acts from the bill of rights not apply to said initiatives? or am i barking up the wrong tree?

Heres the link if you need it, its right there in the bill of rights...

If some low life miserable cunt had stolen my bike today while I was at work (so I hadn't reported it yet), and the police pulled him over for a spot check...and he was an unlicenced cocksucker...and they took the bike off him...I'd be stoked. You on the other hand...would much rather the cunt rode off into the sunset on your pride and joy.

[mossy1200]

What is wrong with no footwear if you don't crash?

I'd be tempted to put my flip flops and hot pants on just to see what they said. Bit cold in the mornings at the moment though. Anyone know if it just a Wellington thing?

Nothing wrong with it but are you prepaired to pay for your own skin grafts if you do rather than everyone else chip in with a increased rego next year.The only way to battle a penpusher is to give them less to calculate.
In my ideal world riding gear would be manditory out of town limits,footwear would need to be of good standard suitable for riding and owning a bike would involve having to have suitable gear provided for inspection during warrent of fitness time.Add rego at $250 instead of $500+.

I guess i can live with what we have though which is idiots that dont have common sence and havent been forced to reduce risks.

[Nzpure]

If some low life miserable cunt had stolen my bike today while I was at work (so I hadn't reported it yet), and the police pulled him over for a spot check...and he was an unlicenced cocksucker...and they took the bike off him...I'd be stoked. You on the other hand...would much rather the cunt rode off into the sunset on your pride and joy.

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety

[Scuba_Steve]

If some low life miserable cunt had stolen my bike today while I was at work (so I hadn't reported it yet), and the police pulled him over for a spot check...and he was an unlicenced cocksucker...and they took the bike off him...I'd be stoked. You on the other hand...would much rather the cunt rode off into the sunset on your pride and joy.

yet if he was licenced "cocksucker" & the bike was too, he would have rode off into the "sunset on your pride and joy" even going through the cops (bet you'd be happy about that). Your using abit of scarecrow there mate

[pritch]

Years ago the only time anyone got stopped without giving cause was because there had been a prison escape. Now road blocks for breath testing are common and more recently spot checks of motorcycles seem to be in vogue.

It is only a matter of time until some underemployed drone in Wellington (or Nelson?) comes up with another brilliant idea.

[mossy1200]

21 Unreasonable search and seizure
Everyone has the right to be secure against unreasonable search or seizure, whether of the person, property, or correspondence or otherwise.
22 Liberty of the person
Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily arrested or detained

Does these 2 acts from the bill of rights not apply to said initiatives? or am i barking up the wrong tree?

Heres the link if you need it, its right there in the bill of rights...http://legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1990/0109/latest/whole.html#DLM225522


You think that its unreasonable to check if someone has a licence,is riding a bike thats not been stolen and the vehicle is fit to share the road with your friends and family.

You consider having these checks being detained.

I consider it a 5min inconvience every so often.
Perhaps stopping for red lights can be classed being arbitrarily detained also.

[SMOKEU]

How is it ''revenue gathering''?

How is it not revenue gathering?

[Str8 Jacket]

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety

How eloquent. The fact remains that the coppers are usually there to assist us and to enforce the law. I'm happy with that.

[Bassmatt]

How eloquent. The fact remains that the coppers are usually there to assist us and to enforce the law. I'm happy with that.

Good law shouldnt need to be "enforced"

en·force (n-fôrs, -frs)
tr.v. en·forced, en·forc·ing, en·forc·es
1. To compel observance of or obedience to
2. To impose (a kind of behavior, for example)
3. To give force to; reinforce

[mossy1200]

How is it not revenue gathering?


If you have a registered bike with current warrent of fitness and are wearing a approved helmet no revenue has been gathered.

If thats not acceptable FORKIN walk from A to B.

[mossy1200]

Good law shouldnt need to be "enforced"

Dont kill people is a good law.I dont think we should stop enforcing that one.

[Nzpure]

You think that its unreasonable to check if someone has a licence,is riding a bike thats not been stolen and the vehicle is fit to share the road with your friends and family.

You consider having these checks being detained.

I consider it a 5min inconvience every so often.
Perhaps stopping for red lights can be classed being arbitrarily detained also.

Stopping at lights is not arbitrary to ensure and even flow of traffic.
If no obvious cause is given for being pulled over then yes. Check points and the like is a bit of a grey area, But technically most people stopped at check points are having the rights breached.
Wof's are there for the purpose of ensuring that vehicles are fit for the road. If its too hard for police (which i imagine it is) to check whether a car is road legal via there sticker, Maybe cop cars should be fitted with a camera the cross references every number plate in view with the LTNZ database then throws a red flag up for said vehicle. The tech would be there already. Surely it would mean less work for everyone. Im sure cops just love standing in the rain at check points.
Breath alcohol monitors can be fitted to cars to ensure the vehicle cannot be started if the driver is intoxicated. There are thousands of methods to avoid and breach of rights.

For the record, i have no issue with spot checks or check points. I just like to argue :corn:

[Bassmatt]

Dont kill people is a good law.I dont think we should stop enforcing that one.

How can you enforce someone to not do something? 99.9% of people comply by choice. Dont confuse punishment of law breaking with enforcement of laws they are not the same thing.

[Nzpure]

How can you enforce someone to not do something?

Kill em all a let {Insert preferred deity here} sort them out

[Maha]

How is it not revenue gathering?

I refer you to post #14 and mossy's post below?


If you have a registered bike with current warrent of fitness and are wearing a approved helmet no revenue has been gathered.

If thats not acceptable FORKIN walk from A to B.

Fickle lot at times...where is that wall....:brick:

[Crasherfromwayback]

yet if he was licenced "cocksucker" & the bike was too, he would have rode off into the "sunset on your pride and joy" even going through the cops (bet you'd be happy about that). Your using abit of scarecrow there mate

Nah. I just have no problem at all being pulled over for a few minutes and are quite happy for them to do so.

[mossy1200]

Stopping at lights is not arbitrary to ensure and even flow of traffic.
If no obvious cause is given for being pulled over then yes. Check points and the like is a bit of a grey area, But technically most people stopped at check points are having the rights breached.
Wof's are there for the purpose of ensuring that vehicles are fit for the road. If its too hard for police (which i imagine it is) to check whether a car is road legal via there sticker, Maybe cop cars should be fitted with a camera the cross references every number plate in view with the LTNZ database then throws a red flag up for said vehicle. The tech would be there already. Surely it would mean less work for everyone. Im sure cops just love standing in the rain at check points.
Breath alcohol monitors can be fitted to cars to ensure the vehicle cannot be started if the driver is intoxicated. There are thousands of methods to avoid and breach of rights.

For the record, i have no issue with spot checks or check points. I just like to argue :corn:

Fair call ill get my warrent and registration enlarged to A4 size and provide lights so they can be seen while im riding plus get a breath testing ignition and tattoo my name and address on my neck so it can be seen while im riding instead of pull over for 5mins once a year or less.


That will teach them that im not prepaired to do my share to keep the people around me as safe as possible unless it can be done without any inconvience to my self serving ultra ego.

[Nzpure]

Fair call ill get my warrent and registration enlarged to A4 size and provide lights so they can be seen while im riding plus get a breath testing ignition and tattoo my name and address on my neck so it can be seen while im riding instead of pull over for 5mins once a year or less.


That will teach them that im not prepaired to do my share to keep the people around me as safe as possible unless it can be done without any inconvience to my self serving ultra ego.

All i can say to your comment is better displayed in the emote.....:facepalm:

Digital number recognition software is widely available. Wouldn't be that hard to get fitted.

[kevie]

hhhmmmmm is soley targeting motorcyclists bordering on discrimination by singling out a single group???........ read an article recently that Aussy had set up testing stations for motorcycles and the human rights gurus deemed them illegal as they targeted one people group and left all the rest alone ...... yay lets all complain were discriminated against ...... yeh right LMAO

They would be better stopping all the cages and lecturing them on not running us bikers off the road (or into the road as the case might be)

I think its a discrete way of finding how many are not registering their bikes in protest, guess they have to get revenue somehow to pay for these flash new prisons with the mod cons in them.

[Ender EnZed]

I'd be tempted to put my flip flops and hot pants on just to see what they said.

+1

And a pie inside the visor.

[Str8 Jacket]

Dont kill people is a good law.I dont think we should stop enforcing that one.

hmmm, you still sure about that?

Dear god people, next time someone breaks into or steals your shit cause they're the .01% that don't 'abide by the law'.....

Or we could all just wear tinfoil hats.

[Nzpure]

Or we could all just wear tinfoil hats.
+1
Oh hells yea!!!!!:yes::yes::yes::yes::yes::yes:

[mossy1200]

All i can say to your comment is better displayed in the emote.....:facepalm:

Digital number recognition software is widely available. Wouldn't be that hard to get fitted.

And the issue of licenced rider and ownership could be solved by putting chips in our bodies so we can be digitally recognised also in order to protect our civil rights.Are you so against pulling over for 5mins every so often?If its that bad buy a trail bike.Seems to me alot here are fast to single out boy racers or bad habits of cage drivers or old people or people that drive to slow or make a mistake but its ok to ride anyway you please by your own set of rules.
Riding a bike doesnt make you any better than everyone else on the planet.Looking out for people around you by being safe could make you better than most.

[nzspokes]

Maybe cop cars should be fitted with a camera the cross references every number plate in view with the LTNZ database then throws a red flag up for said vehicle. The tech would be there already. Surely it would mean less work for everyone. Im sure cops just love standing in the rain at check points.


We already have that in SA. Vans that pick you up as you go past.

And they drive behind you and check you out before you get stopped if its a rolling stop. So rolling stops if you are showing legal reg and wof is on the nose.

[gatch]

It's a bit lame that they are targeting bikes only.

If it was really in the interest of public safety they would stop and check everyone. Plenty of dodgy cars and trucks out there..

[Katman]

They would be better stopping all the cages and lecturing them on not running us bikers off the road (or into the road as the case might be)


Multi vehicle accidents where the car driver is at fault make up the minority of motorcycle accidents.

Most of the time we manage it all by ourselves.

[Nzpure]

And the issue of licenced rider and ownership could be solved by putting chips in our bodies so we can be digitally recognised also in order to protect our civil rights.Are you so against pulling over for 5mins every so often?If its that bad buy a trail bike.Seems to me alot here are fast to single out boy racers or bad habits of cage drivers or old people or people that drive to slow or make a mistake but its ok to ride anyway you please by your own set of rules.
Riding a bike doesnt make you any better than everyone else on the planet.Looking out for people around you by being safe could make you better than most.

Chips in our bodies god almighty going a little far arn't you?.....The information about said vehicles status is freely available via your rego plate. All i said is to use a camera the reads the rego plate and cross references a data base (Use car jam) and brings up a reg flag if said vehicle isn't reg'd or wofed...... which (not 100% certain) the cops can already do by manually inputting the reg plate into there computer system (which they have in there car?? dunno never actually been pulled over or given a ticket)

[Bassmatt]

And the issue of licenced rider and ownership could be solved by putting chips in our bodies so we can be digitally recognised also in order to protect our civil rights.Are you so against pulling over for 5mins every so often?If its that bad buy a trail bike.Seems to me alot here are fast to single out boy racers or bad habits of cage drivers or old people or people that drive to slow or make a mistake but its ok to ride anyway you please by your own set of rules.
Riding a bike doesnt make you any better than everyone else on the planet.Looking out for people around you by being safe could make you better than most.

I dont think anyone is suggesting being able to "ride anyway you please" with impunity. Any criticism of boy racers or cagers is when they drive poorly or illegally or inconsiderately. I would expect to be pulled over if I was to ride in that manner I dont expect to be pulled over when Im not riding like that.

[caseye]

I disagree

If I am riding legally why should I be pulled over at all ?

Being targeted as part of a "campaign targeting motorcyclist safety compliance" is just bullshit plain and simple...

Now then Maha, this is something that I entirely agree with. If I am riding along minding my own business then Mr Plod HAS NO RIGHT TO STOP ME, other than of course, the right given him/her by the gubbermint when they decided it was time to give our beloved Police Force the right to stop and interrogate at will.
never used to be this way and they managed just fine.
Sorry Mate, but the old "if you have nothing to hide then you've nothing to fear" attitude is just plain bloody wrong.
Where do we draw the line at intervention Policing??
Before anyone else jumps in and says, A ha, no rego or WOF, Nope wrong, just tired of being harassed by Policemen and woman who actually do, do such damned dangerous things as U Turns in front of groups of riders .
See the LOR thread.
I was there, the dickhead( sorry guys, you know who , I mean) cop did a U Turn in front of a group of bikes in order to tell them that they had not stopped at a compulsory stop sign. Um he could see that they hadn't stopped and or put their right foot down while approaching them from their left???? Nevertheless with 12 bikes in convoy he said he was posting out tickets for failing to stop to the lead three bikes.
Yes, whats more, they had to brake to avoid hitting his car as he completed his U TURN! in front of them.
The pity is that we were all going to the Hamilton Toy Run, starts in Cambridge , using back roads and avoiding high density traffic roads so we would not get caught up in any incidents.
But No, a Police constable OUT for his quota and doing his assigned job, ( stopping motorcyclists and berating them for riding motorbikes ) nearly kills three bikers in the 'EXECUTION " of his job.
I for one have had enough and will reply in kind to any Police person who stops me, for No Good reason ( If it's because I'm doing something wrong, then fair cop)and attempts to lecture me.Because they've been told to.
Been back on the big bike for a little over two months now and already been stopped harassed and berated by more Police than in my entire 30 plus years of motor biking.No tickets, was not doing anything wrong, just stopped because they can!
Not acceptable for this kid anymore.
rant over.

[SMOKEU]

If you have a registered bike with current warrent of fitness and are wearing a approved helmet no revenue has been gathered.

If thats not acceptable FORKIN walk from A to B.


I refer you to post #14 and mossy's post below?



Fickle lot at times...where is that wall....:brick:

My bike is registered. The vehicle license is expired so they could still gather revenue from me.

[James Deuce]

The business that if you are riding yer moped in shorts, teeshirt and jandals, pie in one hand while texting with the other and have an accident, we don't have to pay through ACC to fix yer mother fucking arse :doh:

What a load of shit.

[Bassmatt]

My bike is registered. The vehicle license is expired so they could still gather revenue from me.

registration is the colloquial term used in this country for a vehicle license.
You know this.
And I have never been asked by a police officer if my vehicle has a current license.

[Nzpure]

:facepalm:
My bike is registered. The vehicle license is expired so they could still gather revenue from me.:facepalm:

:gob:My bikes registered and wofed ( Its always got a wof) :gob:
:yes:Only so i can do my 6F test:yes:

[SMOKEU]

registration is the colloquial term used in this country for a vehicle license.
You know this.

Registration and licensing are 2 very different things. Refer to NZTA for further information.

[SMOKEU]

:facepalm::facepalm:

:gob:My bikes registered and wofed :shit:gob:
:yes:Only so i can do my 6F test:yes:

It pays to keep the WOF current.

[Bassmatt]

Registration and licensing are 2 very different things. Refer to NZTA for further information.

:facepalm: Say that to the cop when he asks to see your registration and see if you pass the attitude test.
Refer to a dictionary for the meaning of colloquial.

[Nzpure]

It pays to keep the WOF current.

Yes it certainly does :bleh::tugger:

[dogsnbikes]

Wof's are there for the purpose of ensuring that vehicles are fit for the road. :

To a point,all a Wof say's is that the vehicle was fit for the road at the time of inspection,But there is a small minority that will alter their Vehicles as soon as they have a Wof issued.

Others rely on a Wof as their time to get a service reminder,yet some insist on flogging other peoples wofs or printing there own

I don't mind if I get stopped,but who ever it is better know what they are talking about in terms of motorcycle saftey,

I don't even mind if some don't pay their vechicle licencing fee as a form of protest,as no Rego doesn't make a Vechicle unsafe

But I do get annoyed by others that have an unsafe vechicle's on the road...

[Nzpure]

To a point,all a Wof say's is that the vehicle was fit for the road at the time of inspection,But there is a small minority that will alter their Vehicles as soon as they have a Wof issued.

Others rely on a Wof as their time to get a service reminder,yet some insist on flogging other peoples wofs or printing there own

I don't mind if I get stopped,but who ever it is better know what they are talking about in terms of motorcycle saftey,

I don't even mind if some don't pay their vechicle licencing fee as a form of protest,as no Rego doesn't make a Vechicle unsafe

But I do get annoyed by others that have an unsafe vechicle's on the road...

Those who flog others or print there own would get picked up via the camera idea, Seeing a car sacked on its arse is a reason to pull it over as the vehicle looks a little suspect or a bike going down the road that sounds like a 747 or the like. Generally people who do things to there car or bike immediately after the inspection do so because the modifications are blaringly obvious. Hence being pulled over isn't unjustified.

[scumdog]

meh... it's not the first campaign, won't be the last. I've clocked up 50+k in the last year odd, not been stopped or spoken to once during that time about some campaign.

I'm starting to wonder if they really exist...

Likewise, last got stopped (by the booze-bus guys, for a random breath test) in...oh...about 2008-2009.

Maybe a tassle-bedecked, fingerless-glove wearing Harley-rider is not the target species???;)

[scumdog]

Now then Maha, this is something that I entirely agree with. If I am riding along minding my own business then Mr Plod HAS NO RIGHT TO STOP ME,

True - they should wait until you get home and then phone you to find out if you:
(a) Stole the bike
(b) Are suspended or disqualified
(c) Have drunk too much booze to be riding.
;)

[mossy1200]

Maybe ill post a race thread saying i intend to return to the track.

I wont be handing in my licence at each meeting.You can trust I have one.
Im not letting anyone check I have my back brace on.You should trust I have one on.It wouldnt mater anyway if i dont fall off.
I dont accept that my bike needs scrutinized because i can be trusted to keep it up to scratch.Besides if you cant see anything wrong with it while I ride past then its gotta be ok.It shouldnt need checked once its been checked before.
im not even happy to pay race fees as I think thats just revenue earning.

[scumdog]

More revenue gathering thinly disguised as a 'safety campaign' :facepalm:

Never!?

Wow, I had better start carrying money then - I wonder why they would want to take any off me??

On second thoughts, maybe I'd just better leave it to the usual whinging losers to pay the 'revenue', they seem to be better at it than me so far...:pinch:

[Nzpure]

Maybe ill post a race thread saying i intend to return to the track.

I wont be handing in my licence at each meeting.You can trust I have one.
Im not letting anyone check I have my back brace on.You should trust I have one on.It wouldnt mater anyway if i dont fall off.
I dont accept that my bike needs scrutinized because i can be trusted to keep it up to scratch.Besides if you cant see anything wrong with it while I ride past then its gotta be ok.It shouldnt need checked once its been checked before.
im not even happy to pay race fees as I think thats just revenue earning.

Again jumping off the deep end dude. Going a little bit far to the point where everything you just said was a tad silly. All im saying, No in fact asking. Aren't the cops required to have justifiable cause before stopping you ?
No need to get upset. I imagine the whole if the coppa's put up a check point theres no breach there eg you didn't have to be driving down that road.

Again Mossy as i mentioned before i have no quarrel with the cops,checkpoints or spot checks. I my self have never had a ticket or fine of any kind nor do i intend to change that. All i am saying is that a spot check is a breach of our rights as stated in the bill of rights and methods to avoid it.

[scumdog]

Aren't the cops required to have justifiable cause before stopping you ?
.

No:oi-grr:

[Nzpure]

So this part "Liberty of the person
Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily arrested or detained." has been omitted from the bill of rights?

[Crasherfromwayback]

So this part "Liberty of the person
Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily arrested or detained." has been omitted from the bill of rights?

I wouldn't consider being held up for a couple of minutes being 'detained'. If so...then red traffic lights are breaking the law.

[Nzpure]

I wouldn't consider being held up for a couple of minutes being 'detained'. If so...then red traffic lights are breaking the law.

No because traffic lights arn't arbitrary.

[Nzpure]

I wouldn't consider being held up for a couple of minutes being 'detained'. If so...then red traffic lights are breaking the law.

detainedpast participle, past tense of de·tain (Verb)
Verb:
Keep (someone) in official custody, typically for questioning about a crime or in politically sensitive situations.
Keep (someone) from proceeding; hold back.

[Zedder]

So this part "Liberty of the person
Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily arrested or detained." has been omitted from the bill of rights?

At a check point, you're not arrrested or detained (for more time than it takes to check things out) unless you are in breach of a law.

[Crasherfromwayback]

No because traffic lights arn't arbitrary.


.
Keep (someone) from proceeding; hold back.

Traffic lights that are red always keep me from proceeding.

[Nzpure]

Traffic lights that are red always keep me from proceeding.

Again lights still arn't arbitrary.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Again lights still arn't arbitrary.

The results the same though ain't it.

[Zedder]

I had a read over the Safer Journeys info and I'm happy that at least the authorities/cops are doing something to address the issues.

It's like the trial of written warnings and Rastuscat's options campaigns: They could have done nothing and carried on doing nothing but they didn't. Right or wrong, unlawfull (in some eyes) or whatever, it's something.

[mossy1200]

So this part "Liberty of the person
Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily arrested or detained." has been omitted from the bill of rights?

My comments wernt dirrected towards you but aimed to point out that people here seem to have 2 standards.We ride on a road we didnt personally build.Its was created by the collect revenue gained and is therefore shared by all so we have a responsibility to make every effort to keep others and ourselves as safe as possible.Due to the fact some people have less common sence than they should have we have rules that try to keep a standard.People who dont pay rego etc are stating the rules dont apply to them.If the rules dont apply i dont understand how these people expect to get insurance via ACC.
I dont have a issue with popo targeting bikes.Its not because I think a minority group should be singled out.Its because the few that boast its cheeper to put your rego on hold than pay registration are the first to make noise when they think it could cost them.People make comments about jandals and shorts as a popo wind up rather than say we should make an effort to lead by example and ride safe,be safe and act safe.

I watch idiots in bad gear cutting through traffic,speeding and disregarding other people.Almost every day a bike or scooter passes cars waiting to cross from Hataitai into the Mt Vic tunnel merging lane making cages fail to cross.These few that ride like they are the only road user that matters leave other road users resenting us.Popo do own their own vehicles.They share our road while not on duty and they notice what happens.If 5 % of motorcycles act up they are the 5% that get noticed and remembered.If we are singled out its because we stand out due to the behaviour of a few.Popo isnt after the rider that doesnt stand out.They are targeting the ones that dont and wont ride responsibly and wont or dont pay their share.

Drunk drivers are a minority but they are targets
Boys racers are a minority but they are targets
Truck drivers are a minority they get checked for loads and distance.
Motorcycles are a minority ...
Speeding drivers are a minority(we would hope).They are targets.
Cages are a majority but they still get random checks.

Just because we stood out as being unsafe due to a few or bad arse cause we didnt all want to pay rego doesnt meen we are all targets but doesnt it meen we should up our standards so we dont stand out.

[Nzpure]

The results the same though ain't it.

Your argument is invalid sir....
Its the difference between right and wrong.....
If a coppa came and turned your house over for no good reason you would be little pissed would you not? Mind you if your house was full of drugs you would be a little pissed also...but you get my point.
Its your right, Not to be detained at the whim of anyone. Being ok with having your rights abused for a little extra safety, removes your right to either. If you will roll over for the small stuff you will roll over for the big stuff.
Thats my point. Its because our (kiwi's) mindset that our government does what the hell it likes. There is no consequence for them, Without it they will continue on the path they are on. Which IMHO is a elected dictatorship, a little harsh i know but you get my drift.
Also like to point out if a coppa pulled me over for a random check i would do nothing but be the most courteous i could be. I do not envy the job they have to do some times, However i would be one if they didn't descriminate me for being colour blind =P

[Nzpure]

My comments wernt dirrected towards you but aimed to point out that people here seem to have 2 standards.We ride on a road we didnt personally build.Its was created by the collect revenue gained and is therefore shared by all so we have a responsibility to make every effort to keep others and ourselves as safe as possible.Due to the fact some people have less common sence than they should have we have rules that try to keep a standard.People who dont pay rego etc are stating the rules dont apply to them.If the rules dont apply i dont understand how these people expect to get insurance via ACC.
I dont have a issue with popo targeting bikes.Its not because I think a minority group should be singled out.Its because the few that boast its cheeper to put your rego on hold than pay registration are the first to make noise when they think it could cost them.People make comments about jandals and shorts as a popo wind up rather than say we should make an effort to lead by example and ride safe,be safe and act safe.

I watch idiots in bad gear cutting through traffic,speeding and disregarding other people.Almost every day a bike or scooter passes cars waiting to cross from Hataitai into the Mt Vic tunnel merging lane making cages fail to cross.These few that ride like they are the only road user that matters leave other road users resenting us.Popo do own their own vehicles.They share our road while not on duty and they notice what happens.If 5 % of motorcycles act up they are the 5% that get noticed and remembered.If we are singled out its because we stand out due to the behaviour of a few.Popo isnt after the rider that doesnt stand out.They are targeting the ones that dont and wont ride responsibly and wont or dont pay their share.

Drunk drivers are a minority but they are targets
Boys racers are a minority but they are targets
Truck drivers are a minority they get checked for loads and distance.
Motorcycles are a minority ...
Speeding drivers are a minority(we would hope).They are targets.
Cages are a majority but they still get random checks.

Just because we stood out as being unsafe due to a few or bad arse cause we didnt all want to pay rego doesnt meen we are all targets but doesnt it meen we should up our standards so we dont stand out.

Very true, However i do believe its a breach of our rights...Not going to change anything however and a cop will never find me being a smart arse or disrespectful.

[bsasuper]

Pointless thread, the POPO are ALWAYS targeting us.

[FJRider]

Pointless thread, the POPO are ALWAYS targeting us.

Speed up then ... it will ruin their aim ...

[tigertim20]

Just had a visit from a local Constable informing me of a local/nation wide campaign targeting motorcyclist safety compliance. Licence, rego, WOF, correct gear etc etc.

Aiming at the commuter riders is the impression I got, he and other officers will be targeting high traffic areas around Wellington, Hutt Valley for the next month.

You might get a free muslie bar and a pen that doesn't work and a photo of StoneY on his KTM if you're good.

Seemed like a nice enough chap and bloody good of him to let us know what was happening so we could pass the message on I thought.

It so nice of them that I will kindly throatfuck any cunt who pulls me over for no reason other than im on a bike until his eyes swell.
Blatant fucking bullshit.

how about spending the next fucking month sitting at intersections with the new rule changes and doing something useful to prevent accidents to ALL fucking road users?

[scumdog]

Pointless thread, the POPO are ALWAYS targeting us.

Boy, do I have issues then!

I ride, I'm popo, oh the turmoil...:blink:

[mossy1200]

Very true, However i do believe its a breach of our rights...Not going to change anything however and a cop will never find me being a smart arse or disrespectful.


To me its more about the removal of those that dont respect a standard that we should set for ourselves rather than be told how to act.
If it costs me 5 mins to get licence and rego checked etc and 100 other bikers checked also to have someone change their actions be it wear safer gear,replace worn tire or so on in order to ensure the idiot doesnt kill your wife,son or friend then ill wave my rights for that 5mins.

If you thought it might help would you?
If you dont think it could is it wrong of me to hope it might and accept it?

[tri boy]

Ive saved over $1500 since Nick the Dick hiked the rego/ACC fees.
Comute on the XR/Scram/Bandit, or KLE alot.

Don't give a rats arse about rego anymore, but keep the bikes well maintained and safe.

Don't give a rats arse about riders that think i'm a twat for taking this approach.:motu:
All I know is $1500 of my pingers never reached the pollies slush fund.:woohoo:

PS Gareth Morgan is a weak as piss arse lick,that has done Nothing to advance rider safety, or anything useful since he climbed on Nicks Sweaty back.:buggerd::sick:

[Crasherfromwayback]

Your argument is invalid sir....
Its the difference between right and wrong.....


Whilst I hear ya, and understand your point...mine is I don't sweat things like traffic lights or random pull overs. A couple of mins of my time ain't worth getting my panties in a bunch over.

So that's my argument. And as far as I'm concerned...it's actually 100% factual. 2 mins at a set of lights...or on the side of the road. Don't care.

And as far as I'm concerned...a police officer should be able to pull anyone, anytime, over at their descretion. If they decide on the spot to ram a batton up your arse then I'll have 'issues'!

Specially if they don't kiss me first.

[mossy1200]

Ive saved over $1500 since Nick the Dick hiked the rego/ACC fees.
Comute on the XR/Scram/Bandit, or KLE alot.

Don't give a rats arse about rego anymore, but keep the bikes well maintained and safe.

Don't give a rats arse about riders that think i'm a twat for taking this approach.:motu:
All I know is $1500 of my pingers never reached the pollies slush fund.:woohoo:

PS Gareth Morgan is a weak as piss arse lick,that has done Nothing to advance rider safety, or anything useful since he climbed on Nicks Sweaty back.:buggerd::sick:


hey I feel for multi bikes multi rego and I think registration should be done by licence and warrent should only be obtained by licenced rider.Get challenged prove licenced and registered rider.After all we cant ride more than one at a time but we can clock the same total kms as a multi bike owner on just one bike.
The issue is if you have accident costing 25k in hospital fees others have paid into the kitty and you havent.

If you could pay one acc road user fee would that make you happy?
Idd own more bikes if i could pay one collective registration even if some were just cheaper bikes.
multi rego is preventing me from having more

[Brian d marge]

Tired cant think, but in a nut shell

rego , not a safety item ,pays for health?? and roads? and big AA lunches

WOF , yes need

bad driving , educate , forced education , beat senseless fine, shankes poney ( in that order)

drinking driving and stupidity, wall and bullet in head

Jandals , and other acts of sheer stupidity , see above.


bad taste in motorcycles , see stupidity

I think we all agree , we would like the old bill to Help and worK WITH us , rather than ping us on an open stretch of road , at the insane speed of 104 kmph,,,,, the extra energy in those extra 4 kms must be HUGE .for it to be such a concern


Stephen

[Maha]

My bike is registered. The vehicle license is expired so they could still gather revenue from me.

Bless...you figured it out..;)

[sondela]

A little off the subject here, but I saw one of Chch's bike cops Lights on, pull over a bicyclist and ticket him today. Must say, said cyclist looked very unhappy indeed (heh) Anyone know what cyclists get ticketed for? I thought they were immune....

[Crasherfromwayback]

A little off the subject here, but I saw one of Chch's bike cops Lights on, pull over a bicyclist and ticket him today. Must say, said cyclist looked very unhappy indeed (heh) Anyone know what cyclists get ticketed for? I thought they were immune....

Wearing lycra in public?

[nzspokes]

A little off the subject here, but I saw one of Chch's bike cops Lights on, pull over a bicyclist and ticket him today. Must say, said cyclist looked very unhappy indeed (heh) Anyone know what cyclists get ticketed for? I thought they were immune....

Same as any other road user.

[SMOKEU]

Same as any other road user.

With a few exceptions as cyclists aren't bound by all the laws that people operating a motor vehicle on a public road are.

[Zamiam]

If you are riding legally you have nothing to worry about.

This is the exact bullshit that is used to justify them progressively removing our rights.

A fundamental of our justice system used to be innocent until proven guilty - stopping us when we have done nothing wrong is fundamentally wrong and stop trying to justify this breech of what used to be our rights by a bullshit statement like this.

[sondela]

Wearing lycra in public?

Haha probably, it is a sin..

[Katman]

It so nice of them that I will kindly throatfuck any cunt who pulls me over for no reason other than im on a bike until his eyes swell.


Somehow I doubt it.

[Jdogg]

If they are actually using this as a motive to just check regos and warrants, then doesn't it make the new ANPR set ups seem like a bit of a waste of money??

[FJRider]

This is the exact bullshit that is used to justify them progressively removing our rights.

A fundamental of our justice system used to be innocent until proven guilty - stopping us when we have done nothing wrong is fundamentally wrong and stop trying to justify this breech of what used to be our rights by a bullshit statement like this.

Another "I know my rights" post ... :yawn:

Perhaps ... if those who refuse to pay the legally required fee's and taxes ... to allow their vehicles to be used on the countrys roads. Which also goes towards other benefits (excuse the pun) the average tax payer/citizen can recieves/funds in the form of Goverment assistance .... of one form or another. A few of their rights should be removed.


If they dont pay their share ... they shouldn't be elligible for a share.

[scumdog]

A fundamental of our justice system used to be innocent until proven guilty - stopping us when we have done nothing wrong is fundamentally wrong

Yeah, best to let the drunk-driver crash into somebody and THEN speak to him about his drink driving, after all, up until then he probably had done 'nothing wrong'...:wacko:

[mossy1200]

Another "I know my rights" post ... :yawn:

Perhaps ... if those who refuse to pay the legally required fee's and taxes ... to allow their vehicles to be used on the countrys roads. Which also goes towards other benefits (excuse the pun) the average tax payer/citizen can recieves/funds in the form of Goverment assistance .... of one form or another. A few of their rights should be removed.


If they dont pay their share ... they shouldn't be elligible for a share.

A guy that was collecting smoke butts from a car park walked up to me and told me the Government charged almost 90% tax on smokes and they wernt getting any of his Benefit.

True story.

[Zamiam]

You guys are so funny. My vehicles are always registered/licensed, current wof etc when used on the road therefore I am legal, have paid my dues and also had an "expert" check they are fit to be on the road. So I have done nothing wrong yet someone can decide they have the right to illegally detain me from going about my business. As mentioned elsewhere in this thread the technology exists to do rego recognition. If the government was to spend the money it would be recovered very quickly as it would work 24/7. I'd have no problem with this. It would also allow police resources to be utilized for more important things such as real crime.

[scumdog]

. So I have done nothing wrong yet someone can decide they have the right to ILLEGALLY detain me from going about my business.

Illegally huh? really??

Do tell...

[Scuba_Steve]

A little off the subject here, but I saw one of Chch's bike cops Lights on, pull over a bicyclist and ticket him today. Must say, said cyclist looked very unhappy indeed (heh) Anyone know what cyclists get ticketed for? I thought they were immune....

they have to obey rules just like everyone else, just usually they're ignored unless a sting is going on. Usually deadly pedleys get done for helmet & intersection (cruising through reds) stings tho

[Kickaha]

So I have done nothing wrong yet someone can decide they have the right to illegally detain me from going about my business
So who is detaining you illegally? can't be the police as they can stop you anytime they please quite legally

As mentioned elsewhere in this thread the technology exists to do rego recognition. If the government was to spend the money it would be recovered very quickly as it would work 24/7.
Can you explain how such technology recognises who is riding/ driving the vehicle?

It would also allow police resources to be utilized for more important things such as real crime.
So tell us what the split and how police resources are allocated and how much is utilized on"real crime"

[Crasherfromwayback]

. It would also allow police resources to be utilized for more important things such as real crime.

Is drink driving not a crime?

[mossy1200]

You guys are so funny. My vehicles are always registered/licensed, current wof etc when used on the road therefore I am legal, have paid my dues and also had an "expert" check they are fit to be on the road. So I have done nothing wrong yet someone can decide they have the right to illegally detain me from going about my business. As mentioned elsewhere in this thread the technology exists to do rego recognition. If the government was to spend the money it would be recovered very quickly as it would work 24/7. I'd have no problem with this. It would also allow police resources to be utilized for more important things such as real crime.

Correct but it wont test if you own the bike(borrowed or stolen) or if you have been drinking or on drugs.The fear of getting caught is a deterrent for most who might be tempted to have some drinks or drugs or ride that tyre till the warrents due even though its got wires poking out.You know a tyre can be bald the day after you get a warrent.

I still believe the attention that a few draw towards motorcycles are the cause of the 1month blitz more than anything else.
the average scooter rider in Wellington has a helmet and nothing else in the way of gear.Some wear push bike helmets.

Search trade me and you will see people selling scooter 125s licenced as mopeds so they dont need a warrent and they openly advertise it.

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/scooters/auction-459323737.htm

[pete376403]

got no problem with the cops stopping vehicles for wof and rego checks but is should be ALL vehicle, not just bikes.

(would be priceless to see the mayhem this would cause at peak hour - specially as the bikes could filter through)

[Zamiam]

Shit didn't realize they checked ownership on the side of the road. Given that most vehicles I drive are company owned they must search company files, sometimes multiple levels to know I'm allowed to be driving them.

Guys and girls anyone can justify allowing this kind of thing to go on BUT you will never convince me that the old adage "you've got nothing to fear if you've done nothing wrong" justifies what is slowly becoming a police state.

As for illegally stopping me - yes the bill of rights is meant to prevent me being harassed/stopped from going about my legal business. Once someone can do this without reason the length of time I'm stopped for is irrelevant. They can ticket us for being over the speed limit by 1 km/hr so stopping me for 1 second is illegal.

Thin end of the wedge, one day you'll wake up and find you can't fart without paying carbon tax and say when did we allow them this power ?

[FJRider]

Can you explain how such technology recognises who is riding/ driving the vehicle?



It doesn't matter who was in control of the vehecle. "The letter" gets sent to the registered owner. It is up to them to prove it wasn't them ... and who was. I think up to a $10,000 fine for not supplying that information to police.

[Deano]

You get a free muesli bar you ingrateful cunt lol

[Deano]

Will we see them on trtnr ? We usually see them every week in any case. Oh that's right, I won't be seeing anyone for a while lol

[FJRider]

Shit didn't realize they checked ownership on the side of the road. Given that most vehicles I drive are company owned they must search company files, sometimes multiple levels to know I'm allowed to be driving them.



You can get a ticket for no WOF/rego in a company vehicle. Who owns it/has permission to use it is not important (unless it's been reported stolen) Having your licence is .... because you get the ticket

[Deano]

How dare they - seriously how fucking dare they offer me a free muesli bar and some road safety advice when I fucking know everything lol


But jokes aside, how fucking dare they offer me a pic of stoney on his ktm

[FJRider]

A little off the subject here, but I saw one of Chch's bike cops Lights on, pull over a bicyclist and ticket him today. Must say, said cyclist looked very unhappy indeed (heh) Anyone know what cyclists get ticketed for? I thought they were immune....

They can't get done for no rego/WOF. everything else ... DIC/speeding/failing to give way/running a red ... and they are certainly not immune.

And you can lose your licence on a treadly ...

[FJRider]

But jokes aside, how fucking dare they offer me a pic of stoney on his ktm

Apparently ... it's wallet sized ... (so nobody will know you carry one)

[Nzpure]

I think the point is simple. Its not about the cops revenue gathering, or any other bullshit complaint. My issue is simple, Its illegal according to the bill of rights to be detained without any reason. The bullshit about traffic lights is stupid, Theres a reason traffic lights stop you and its a valid one. To stop a motorist simply because they are on a motorbike is/should be illegal. Its because we ratify this ""initiative"" that it continues. The bill of rights is quite clear on this. But the government will continue this sort of thing until the people (Us) put a stop to it. As kiwi's however we will just roll over and take it, Thats what we will do as we always have. Its not the coppa's that are doing it, They have a job to do just like everyone else. It's the government, People will keep allowing it as they see it is a safety factor but as my mate Benny Franklin put it so well. Those who will give up their liberties for a little safety deserve neither.
The cops dont have a right to stop you for no reason. Its a breach of our rights, but will continue until we hold the government accountable.

[Berries]

People make comments about jandals and shorts as a popo wind up rather than say we should make an effort to lead by example and ride safe,be safe and act safe.
I said it because frankly I do not give a shit what some copper at the side of the road tells me about my riding gear. If I am legal I am legal. I will listen politely if the guy obviously has more riding experience than me but other than that they can talk to the hand. Gloved in ten thousand layers of kevlar enriched kangaroo hide, in hi-viz yellow of course, zipped to my quadruple stitched, reflectively piped one piece suit which has in built air bags, obviously, which must be what all the ATGATT proponents are wearing these days.

Swap the muesli bar for a hot dog and I might change my mind.

Honestly, does anyone think this is anything more than a check on rego due to the loss of income since the ACC increases? In two minutes at the side of the road what exactly are you going to be told that will change the way you ride or what gear you are going to wear? Nowt.

[Deano]

I think the point is simple. Its not about the cops revenue gathering, or any other bullshit complaint. My issue is simple, Its illegal according to the bill of rights to be detained without any reason. The bullshit about traffic lights is stupid, Theres a reason traffic lights stop you and its a valid one. To stop a motorist simply because they are on a motorbike is/should be illegal. Its because we ratify this ""initiative"" that it continues. The bill of rights is quite clear on this. But the government will continue this sort of thing until the people (Us) put a stop to it. As kiwi's however we will just roll over and take it, Thats what we will do as we always have. Its not the coppa's that are doing it, They have a job to do just like everyone else. It's the government, People will keep allowing it as they see it is a safety factor but as my mate Benny Franklin put it so well. Those who will give up their liberties for a little safety deserve neither.
The cops dont have a right to stop you for no reason. Its a breach of our rights, but will continue until we hold the government accountable.the answer is simple then. Don't just roll over and take it. Challenge them through legal channels citing the bill of rights. Seriously, do it if you feel so strongly about it. I'm watching and waiting with baited breath...you'll be a hero to many if you win. Go on, do it.

[Nzpure]

I said it because frankly I do not give a shit what some copper at the side of the road tells me about my riding gear. If I am legal I am legal. I will listen politely if the guy obviously has more riding experience than me but other than that they can talk to the hand. Gloved in ten thousand layers of kevlar enriched kangaroo hide, in hi-viz yellow of course, zipped to my quadruple stitched, reflectively piped one piece suit which has in built air bags, obviously, which must be what all the ATGATT proponents are wearing these days.

Swap the muesli bar for a hot dog and I might change my mind.

Honestly, does anyone think this is anything more than a check on rego due to the loss of income since the ACC increases? In two minutes at the side of the road what exactly are you going to be told that will change the way you ride or what gear you are going to wear? Nowt.

Until they change the law, any clothes that make you decent are appropriate. All you required to wear is helmet and underwear.....speedo's even.:facepalm:

[Nzpure]

the answer is simple then. Don't just roll over and take it. Challenge them through legal channels citing the bill of rights. Seriously, do it if you feel so strongly about it. I'm watching and waiting with baited breath...you'll be a hero to many if you win. Go on, do it.

Hence why im going to Uni next year! Im gunna get all clued up in civil law and rights and i will!
:angry:

[Deano]

Hence why im going to Uni next year! Im gunna get all clued up in civil law and rights and i will!
:angry:I sincerely hope you do and this is not just another keyboard rant. Good luck with the study

[Berries]

Until they change the law, any clothes that make you decent are appropriate.
Oh well, that's the hotpants idea fucked then.

[mossy1200]

Hence why im going to Uni next year! Im gunna get all clued up in civil law and rights and i will!
:angry:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTd471QNwTc&feature=related

[BoristheBiter]

Now then Maha, this is something that I entirely agree with. If I am riding along minding my own business then Mr Plod HAS NO RIGHT TO STOP ME, other than of course, the right given him/her by the gubbermint when they decided it was time to give our beloved Police Force the right to stop and interrogate at will.
never used to be this way and they managed just fine.
Sorry Mate, but the old "if you have nothing to hide then you've nothing to fear" attitude is just plain bloody wrong.
Where do we draw the line at intervention Policing??



Very true, However i do believe its a breach of our rights...Not going to change anything however and a cop will never find me being a smart arse or disrespectful.

When you get your licence you sign it and agree to the conditions, of which there is this

Drivers and other road users to comply with directions of enforcement officers, etc
(1AA) A person driving a motor vehicle that has a warning notice given under section 22AF attached to it must comply with that notice.
(1) A person must comply with sections 68, 69, 70, 71A, 72, and 73 (which relate to the administration of breath screening tests, evidential breath tests, and blood tests).
(2) A person must comply with all lawful requirements, directions, and requests made by an enforcement officer under any of sections 68, 69, 70, 71A, 72, and 73.
(3) A person must comply with all lawful requirements and requests made by a medical practitioner or medical officer under section 72 or section 73 (which relate to the administration of blood tests).
(4) A person may not—
(a) remove, obscure, or render indistinguishable a notice affixed to a vehicle under section 115, unless current evidence of vehicle inspection has been obtained for the vehicle or (if the notice was given under section 96(1B)) the direction requiring the vehicle not to be driven on a road has been cancelled under section 102(3)(b) or section 110(3)(a)(ii); or
(b) drive a vehicle to which a notice given under section 115 applies until current evidence of vehicle inspection has been obtained for, and is displayed on, the vehicle.
(5) Drivers and other persons must comply with all other lawful requirements, directions, notices, and requests given to, and prohibitions imposed on, them under this Act by an enforcement officer or a dangerous goods enforcement officer.

It is not a right to have a licence and if you don't like the rules then don't ride/drive.

[BoristheBiter]

This is the exact bullshit that is used to justify them progressively removing our rights.

A fundamental of our justice system used to be innocent until proven guilty - stopping us when we have done nothing wrong is fundamentally wrong and stop trying to justify this breech of what used to be our rights by a bullshit statement like this.

see above, you have no right to be on the road.

[Parlane]

Well I didn't get a muesli bar :( Cops were out on the beat this morning in riccarton, I saw two seperate groups. Met the second. May have been rastuscat, described himself as a motorcycle enthusiast.

[Zedder]

Well I didn't get a muesli bar :( Cops were out on the beat this morning in riccarton, I saw two seperate groups. Met the second. May have been rastuscat, described himself as a motorcycle enthusiast.

So how was the interaction?

[Paul in NZ]

How dare they - seriously how fucking dare they offer me a free muesli bar and some road safety advice when I fucking know everything lol

They are going to get a shock if they offer me a muesil bar. I'll sue them for assault with a deadly weapon.... Being a type 1 diabetic, coeliac and on an IC diet muesil bars are sticks of sugary bowel shredding death I tells ya - may as well offer me a couple of shots of moonshine and a smoke...

[Parlane]

So how was the interaction?

Basically was just to tell me off for coming around a corner too fast, which was true. And then looked deeply in to my eyes (looking for contacts). Told me he was just being a flea in my ear (so just a warning) and that I chose the vehicle so I have to get the contacts (glasses fog up).

All in all, not too bad. He could have done me for $400 for not wearing my glasses + 35 demerits :\

Before you start keeping your kids at home, I can see fine. Just not street sign letters from far away.

[Maha]

They are going to get a shock if they offer me a muesil bar. I'll sue them for assault with a deadly weapon.... Being a type 1 diabetic, coeliac and on an IC diet muesil bars are sticks of sugary bowel shredding death I tells ya - may as well offer me a couple of shots of moonshine and a smoke...

It could be a tazer disguised as a Muesli bar...;)
Better do as they say Paul.

[davereid]

see above, you have no right to be on the road.

I guess thats the point.

You don't actually "sign up" to anything. You have to do as the crown decides.

The Crown has at various times made it illegal for slaves to escape, for maori to breast feed and for irish to dance. Its been illegal to be in a union, and its been illegal not to be in one.

History has shown us that if we are not breaking the law we have nothing to fear but the law itself.


The protections of mechanisms like the Bill of Rights exist because they are intended to ensure the law need not be feared, as it may not cross certain lines, even for very good reasons.

We have abandoned many of those principles in Transport Law. The right to remain silent, the presumption of innocence, the right to a trial, and the right to go about your business without search and seizure have all been abandoned to make us safer on the road.

And we have already watched police abusing the privilege, bragging for example about how they stopped the Hells Angels 6 times "randomly" on one run in Nelson a year or so back.

I for one don't approve. As soon as given the power to abuse, police took it.

Its my opinion, that the road toll would be little different if police had to have due cause to stop drivers, but we would still have a Bill of Rights thats is not eroded.

[5150]

They are going to get a shock if they offer me a muesil bar. I'll sue them for assault with a deadly weapon.... Being a type 1 diabetic, coeliac and on an IC diet muesil bars are sticks of sugary bowel shredding death I tells ya - may as well offer me a couple of shots of moonshine and a smoke...

How about a shot of Tazer and a pepper spray? :Police:

[willytheekid]

Basically was just to tell me off for coming around a corner too fast, which was true. And then looked deeply in to my eyes (looking for contacts). Told me he was just being a flea in my ear (so just a warning) and that I chose the vehicle so I have to get the contacts (glasses fog up).

All in all, not too bad. He could have done me for $400 for not wearing my glasses + 35 demerits :\

Before you start keeping your kids at home, I can see fine. Just not street sign letters from far away.

I thought I saw you this morning!...nice of that lady to help you afterwards :laugh:
http://9.media.todaysbigthing.cvcdn.com/82/17/40cd6142165f7273708feb460fcc2177.jpg
...I didnt get stopped because I can behave myself :innocent:...well, that and the new bike/truck dosn't go around corners fast...or even slowly!
http://www.best-funny-video.com/small/blind-biker-small.jpg

[Paul in NZ]

It could be a tazer disguised as a Muesli bar...;)
Better do as they say Paul.

Quite honestly it would be healthier for me to take the tazer shot :yes: Besides I'm not going to go all Tame Iti on them... On the few times I've been pulled over its always because I was doing something stupid in a stupid place OR to have a safety chat which has usually been pleasant, worthwhile and friendly..... But then I'm a friendly chap really

[Scuba_Steve]

They can't get done for no rego/WOF. everything else ... DIC/speeding/failing to give way/running a red ... and they are certainly not immune.

And you can lose your licence on a treadly ...

there's no such thing as DIC in NZ for deadly pedley's & the speeding one, in most circumstances can be hard to achieve


Until they change the law, any clothes that make you decent are appropriate. All you required to wear is helmet and underwear.....speedo's even.:facepalm:

Underwear is actually optional, helmet is your only legal requirement & lets keep it that way or less.

[Tigadee]

Maybe cop cars should be fitted with a camera the cross references every number plate in view with the LTNZ database then throws a red flag up for said vehicle. The tech would be there already.

It is...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_number_plate_recognition

Be afraid, citizen, be very very afraid...
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-37zWzhoXZlE/TsUl4DwmQ2I/AAAAAAAAAsc/mrOCuyC0gaI/s1600/Sylvester-Stallone_Judge_l.jpg

[Zedder]

Basically was just to tell me off for coming around a corner too fast, which was true. And then looked deeply in to my eyes (looking for contacts). Told me he was just being a flea in my ear (so just a warning) and that I chose the vehicle so I have to get the contacts (glasses fog up).

All in all, not too bad. He could have done me for $400 for not wearing my glasses + 35 demerits :\

Before you start keeping your kids at home, I can see fine. Just not street sign letters from far away.

Yeah, you should wear contacts lenses. Besides with glasses, you make a spectacle of yourself.

[5150]

Be afraid, citizen, be very very afraid...


I Love Judge Dred :Punk:

[Nzpure]

there's no such thing as DIC in NZ for deadly pedley's & the speeding one, in most circumstances can be hard to achieve



Underwear is actually optional, helmet is your only legal requirement & lets keep it that way or less.

No i think you will find if your are wearing absolutely nothing it would be indecent exposure...:eek5:

[oneofsix]

No i think you will find if your are wearing absolutely nothing it would be indecent exposure...:eek5:

Sorry but there is no such thing as "indecent exposure". Hasn't been since last centenary. Try offensive behaviour but I think that would fail unless he was waggling his bits about. As long as he kept them tucked behind his tank he should be ok.

[Nzpure]

Sorry but there is no such thing as "indecent exposure". Hasn't been since last centenary. Try offensive behaviour but I think that would fail unless he was waggling his bits about. As long as he kept them tucked behind his tank he should be ok.

Really?
Lol you live and learn!

[BoristheBiter]

I guess thats the point.

You don't actually "sign up" to anything. You have to do as the crown decides.

The Crown has at various times made it illegal for slaves to escape, for maori to breast feed and for irish to dance. Its been illegal to be in a union, and its been illegal not to be in one.

History has shown us that if we are not breaking the law we have nothing to fear but the law itself.


The protections of mechanisms like the Bill of Rights exist because they are intended to ensure the law need not be feared, as it may not cross certain lines, even for very good reasons.

We have abandoned many of those principles in Transport Law. The right to remain silent, the presumption of innocence, the right to a trial, and the right to go about your business without search and seizure have all been abandoned to make us safer on the road.

And we have already watched police abusing the privilege, bragging for example about how they stopped the Hells Angels 6 times "randomly" on one run in Nelson a year or so back.

I for one don't approve. As soon as given the power to abuse, police took it.

Its my opinion, that the road toll would be little different if police had to have due cause to stop drivers, but we would still have a Bill of Rights thats is not eroded.

If you don't like it, don't drive.

Show me in the bill of rights where is says it is your right to drive a vehicle.
Until then your rights have not been infringed.

All the points you have raised are rubbish as you can fight it in court and you don't have to say anything so you're wrong with that as well.

[SMOKEU]

DIC

I've never heard of such a thing in NZ.

[Bassmatt]

I've never heard of such a thing in NZ.

Its not a fucken courtroom bro
have you never heard anyone refer to an EBA charge as being "done for DIC"? you need to get out more. Everyone else knows what it means.
You havent looked "colloquialism" up yet have you

[Fast Eddie]

done dic or done dui.. the only 2 terms i've heard lol

[FJRider]

I've never heard of such a thing in NZ.

Drunk In Charge ... old terminology ... Now it's EBA.

[SMOKEU]

Its not a fucken courtroom bro
have you never heard anyone refer to an EBA charge as being "done for DIC"?

Yes I have.


Drunk In Charge ... old terminology ... Now it's EBA.
Point taken.

[Tigadee]

Have a box of donuts handy, no issues then...:woohoo:

[Mystic13]

You think that its unreasonable to check if someone has a licence,is riding a bike thats not been stolen and the vehicle is fit to share the road with your friends and family.

You consider having these checks being detained.

I consider it a 5min inconvience every so often.
Perhaps stopping for red lights can be classed being arbitrarily detained also.

I think you've got the wrong idea. It's not being stopped so much it's the stopping of bikes only. They should stop cars and bikes. Or if it really is about safety stop bikes and let them off with a warning for warrant or ergo giving them 48 hours to remedy and show at station.

The issue is this is not a safety check but a disguised revenue thing. "Motorcycle Safety Checkpoint : Yeah Right : TUI"

[mossy1200]

Assumption is the mother of all fuck ups.

We assume they are targeting us.

Could it be they are trying to instow information to the riders travelling to work each day taking risks and dressing like gravel rash doesnt hurt .

To those people who want to hand out verbal if they get stoped.SHAME on you if you do...

The people that spend time trying to keep us safe dont need you spouting off.
If you havent attended a tragic road accident or notified next of kin why do you think your 20 years riding makes you more informed about whats safe and whats not.

You may think you would be better off making your own decisions in this world but would you be better off if everyone made their own decisions also.Not everyone has morals and law and order is what allows you stay safe in alot of cases.

[caseye]

When you get your licence you sign it and agree to the conditions, of which there is this

Drivers and other road users to comply with directions of enforcement officers, etc
(1AA) A person driving a motor vehicle that has a warning notice given under section 22AF attached to it must comply with that notice.
(1) A person must comply with sections 68, 69, 70, 71A, 72, and 73 (which relate to the administration of breath screening tests, evidential breath tests, and blood tests).
(2) A person must comply with all lawful requirements, directions, and requests made by an enforcement officer under any of sections 68, 69, 70, 71A, 72, and 73.
(3) A person must comply with all lawful requirements and requests made by a medical practitioner or medical officer under section 72 or section 73 (which relate to the administration of blood tests).
(4) A person may not—
(a) remove, obscure, or render indistinguishable a notice affixed to a vehicle under section 115, unless current evidence of vehicle inspection has been obtained for the vehicle or (if the notice was given under section 96(1B)) the direction requiring the vehicle not to be driven on a road has been cancelled under section 102(3)(b) or section 110(3)(a)(ii); or
(b) drive a vehicle to which a notice given under section 115 applies until current evidence of vehicle inspection has been obtained for, and is displayed on, the vehicle.
(5) Drivers and other persons must comply with all other lawful requirements, directions, notices, and requests given to, and prohibitions imposed on, them under this Act by an enforcement officer or a dangerous goods enforcement officer.

It is not a right to have a licence and if you don't like the rules then don't ride/drive.

Quite right, it is not a God or NZTA given right to drive a motor vehicle of any sort. Never said it was.
I said that the Police used to get by just nicely thank you very much, when they had no "lawful " right to simply randomly stop any motorists they choose for no particular reason.
I also said I was sick and tired of having our rights as ordinary citizens impinged particularly when it comes to traffic matters and Police simply in the name of the greater good.Read, allowing for the lowest common denominator.
We earn the privilage of a drivers licence a firearms licence and any other sort of licence that you wish to name and we then pay for it.
Nowadays "repeatedly".
We do have a bloody stupid Bill Of Rights( Something that to this day I've never actually clapped eyes on personally) in which it does say, that ordinary citizens going about their lawful business will not be able to be stopped by, interrogated by or otherwise impeded by Police or anyone else without good cause.
Therein lies my point.
Along with the constant eroding of whatever rights and privilages that we do still have as time goes by and different pollies and interest groups decide that this or that is not good for you. therefore we are going to protect you from yourself and pass laws that make you do it our way.
So if you wish to waste time and effort pointing out the obvious, then be my guest, but please at least make some effort to understand my point.

[mossy1200]

Brittany hit the pavement. "It was as if every breath I had ever taken rushed out of me in an instant," she says. "I could feel every inch of my body hitting the road, tumbling, sliding and grinding into the unforgiving surface. In a matter of seconds I had come to the conclusion that I was going to die, and I was OK with it. I knew this was far worse than anything I had ever gone through, and I was convinced I would not live to see the next day." She closed her eyes as she continued her 522-foot tumble down Highway 550. "I never lost consciousness," she says, "but I remember wishing that I had."

http://www.google.co.nz/imgres?imgurl=http://wiki.sabmagfaq.org/Road%2520Rash%2520Queen%3Faction%3DAttachFile%26do %3Dget%26target%3DRRQ4.jpg&imgrefurl=http://wiki.sabmagfaq.org/Road%2520Rash%2520Queen&usg=__y4UwXpQzWnNMWasKMr31TaI_1IQ=&h=315&w=450&sz=25&hl=en&start=3&zoom=1&tbnid=KzV9dCqd5mabuM:&tbnh=89&tbnw=127&ei=2VhpT-fBGuqRiQeK8_SRCg&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dgravel%2Brash%2Bqueen%26hl%3Den%26saf e%3Doff%26rlz%3D1T4HPAA_enNZ451NZ451%26gbv%3D2%26t bm%3Disch&itbs=1

[onearmedbandit]

Went out for a ride today, saw two cops but neither targeted me.

[MSTRS]

... ordinary citizens going about their lawful business will not be able to be stopped by, interrogated by or otherwise impeded by Police or anyone else without good cause.
...

There's the hook. They decide at any time, what is good cause, and it can and does change as current circumstances dictate.

[caseye]

Jeez John, stop making sense will ya!
This is how it always was, they decided, without the blanket authority that they now have.
It used to make them think about, what if I do this? and it stopped some Police persons making complete asses of themselves.
These days when! they do, they slink behind the "we can and we will Cause banner"
it makes me puke.
Worse, some of us think it's OK for them to have such powers.
I don't, can you tell?

[Bassmatt]

Brittany hit the pavement. "It was as if every breath I had ever taken rushed out of me in an instant," she says. "I could feel every inch of my body hitting the road, tumbling, sliding and grinding into the unforgiving surface. In a matter of seconds I had come to the conclusion that I was going to die, and I was OK with it. I knew this was far worse than anything I had ever gone through, and I was convinced I would not live to see the next day." She closed her eyes as she continued her 522-foot tumble down Highway 550. "I never lost consciousness," she says, "but I remember wishing that I had."

http://www.google.co.nz/imgres?imgurl=http://wiki.sabmagfaq.org/Road%2520Rash%2520Queen%3Faction%3DAttachFile%26do %3Dget%26target%3DRRQ4.jpg&imgrefurl=http://wiki.sabmagfaq.org/Road%2520Rash%2520Queen&usg=__y4UwXpQzWnNMWasKMr31TaI_1IQ=&h=315&w=450&sz=25&hl=en&start=3&zoom=1&tbnid=KzV9dCqd5mabuM:&tbnh=89&tbnw=127&ei=2VhpT-fBGuqRiQeK8_SRCg&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dgravel%2Brash%2Bqueen%26hl%3Den%26saf e%3Doff%26rlz%3D1T4HPAA_enNZ451NZ451%26gbv%3D2%26t bm%3Disch&itbs=1

And being stopped by police so they can see my paid up rego, up to date warrant, and that I wear atgatt will stop this how?

[mossy1200]

And being stopped by police so they can see my paid up rego, up to date warrant, and that I wear atgatt will stop this how?


Refer my previous entry bottom page 11 and read the whole thread at how many people think that riding in poor choice clothing is a good idea.

Police target motorcycles due to a percentage of motorcyclists that get themselves noticed by being eggs and taking risks.If none of us acted like tards maybe we wouldnt all be treated this way.Target vehicles are comuters in Wellington..Reason is some are traveling ill prepared for the event that a accident may happen.Idd say its likely you could ride around Wellington in quality riding gear and not get pulled over.If you hop on a scooter in jandles and shorts its very likely you will get pulled over due to the fact if you dont care about yourself then its likely you dont care about others.To me thats justified reason to be stopped to make sure your vehicle is safe and your not drunk etc.

[Bassmatt]

Refer my previous entry bottom page 11 and read the whole thread at how many people think that riding in poor choice clothing is a good idea.

Police target motorcycles due to a percentage of motorcyclists that get themselves noticed by being eggs and taking risks.If none of us acted like tards maybe we wouldnt all be treated this way.Target vehicles are comuters in Wellington..Reason is some are traveling ill prepared for the event that a accident may happen.Idd say its likely you could ride around Wellington in quality riding gear and not get pulled over.If you hop on a scooter in jandles and shorts its very likely you will get pulled over due to the fact if you dont care about yourself then its likely you dont care about others.To me thats justified reason to be stopped to make sure your vehicle is safe and your not drunk etc.

I have got no problem if they pull over people in jandals etc and chat to them about wearing better gear, but thats not what they are doing is it?
If you think this is what the campaign is for you are either the eternal optimist or very naive

[Katman]

I said that the Police used to get by just nicely thank you very much, when they had no "lawful " right to simply randomly stop any motorists they choose for no particular reason.


Society has changed considerably since then Mark - and not for the better.

[mossy1200]

I have got no problem if they pull over people in jandals etc and chat to them about wearing better gear, but thats not what they are doing is it?
If you think this is what the campaign is for you are either the eternal optimist or very naive

No I believe the campain is about the fact that the action of some have made us stand out enough to get noticed.
The said campain may involve 4 motorcycle cops being asked to deliver a message of safe riding or flocks of popo targeting everyone and making us pay tax for being bikies.Which one it is we dont even know yet.
You have bikers for the last year making statments like its cheaper to put your rego on hold and pay a ticket every 2 years.You have people advertising 125scooters on tard me as registered mopeds that dont need warrents and can be riden on learners car licences.When people make these statments and get caught its their own fault.
I keep my bike legal,I dress to reduce risks as much as possible and I try not stand out like an idiot.
I dont mind losing 5mins to have my bike checked.Try adopting the idea that random checks help to prevent some dangers on the road.

[Bassmatt]

No I believe the campain is about the fact that the action of some have made us stand out enough to get noticed.
The said campain may involve 4 motorcycle cops being asked to deliver a message of safe riding or flocks of popo targeting everyone and making us pay tax for being bikies.Which one it is we dont even know yet.
You have bikers for the last year making statments like its cheaper to put your rego on hold and pay a ticket every 2 years.You have people advertising 125scooters on tard me as registered mopeds that dont need warrents and can be riden on learners car licences.When people make these statments and get caught its their own fault.
I keep my bike legal,I dress to reduce risks as much as possible and I try not stand out like an idiot.
I dont mind losing 5mins to have my bike checked.Try adopting the idea that random checks help to prevent some dangers on the road.

So the answer to people selling scooters registered as mopeds on trademe is to run a checkpoint type campaign targetting motorcycles? :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

[mossy1200]

So the answer to people selling scooters registered as mopeds on trademe is to run a checkpoint type campaign targetting motorcycles? :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

You kinda missed the parts like people openly stating they would rather not pay registration and pay the tickets instead.
You missed the 5% of riders that do stupid shit and stand out in other road users minds.

collectivelly we have put our worst foot forward and been noticed and now we are being targeted.

Example last week I got passed by ducati ss doing 160+ lane splitting on motorway.He didnt just pass me he passed dozens of cages.The message he sent was i dont give a fork about anyone.Average motorist looks at him and gets back up at motorcyclists.this shit is happening every day so we become targets for clamp downs.Its no different than the forktard boy racers in Christchurch.Every young person in flash sporty car gets a rep based on the action of others good or bad.

[Berries]

Brittany hit the pavement. "It was as if every breath I had ever taken rushed out of me in an instant," she says. "I could feel every inch of my body hitting the road, tumbling, sliding and grinding into the unforgiving surface. In a matter of seconds I had come to the conclusion that I was going to die, and I was OK with it. I knew this was far worse than anything I had ever gone through, and I was convinced I would not live to see the next day." She closed her eyes as she continued her 522-foot tumble down Highway 550. "I never lost consciousness," she says, "but I remember wishing that I had."
Ahh, the famous Brittany is posted again.

I wonder if she has learnt how to hold on yet? All the ATGATT in the world won't help her next time she falls off and gets run over by the following truck.

[red mermaid]

Get the chip off your shoulders and get over it.

I can state catergorically that since at least 1983 MoT (when they existed) and Police have had the authority to stop any vehicle on a road that they feel like.

They have always exercised that authority.

As part of Intell led Policing these days Police are always targetting different groups for different reasons, not only in Road Policing.

I spend most of my work day targetting one type of road user, and always have a great time interacting with them as they do with me.

Get over it, it exists, it always has, and most likely always will.

[mossy1200]

Refer post 1

Target area WELLINGTON

So if you live in Dunedin like I used to or a smaller city or town you wont relise how bad the habits are getting HERE,of A-scooter riders B-a small percentage of motorcyclists and C-a percentage of motorcycles in comuter traffic.To add to it people making claims that they would rather break the rules and pay the odd fine.

I drive around in a service vehicle and see the behaviour of a more than a few riders.They are letting us down and they are being noticed and the result is its been decided that we should be targeted for re-education here.

I just dont see why you cant accept that there is a reason why this is happening.

[Berries]

I just dont see why you cant accept that there is a reason why this is happening.
I do accept there is a reason this is happening. Rego, warrant and licence check is one thing and I don't have a problem with that considering the number of unlicenced and disqualified riders out there. I just don't accept that it is then the job of the Police to inform me that my laces are undone or they don't like the colour of my helmet, particularly when it is unlikely that the guy will have as much riding experience as I have. I also don't accept it when people who make their own risk assessment as to what they should wear on any given ride give advice to people who make their own risk assessment which may differ. ATGATT is relative. Unless you are wearing an airbag suit, airbag helmet, neckbrace, back protector etc etc etc you are not ATGATT. So stop preaching.

That's the royal 'you' by the way, not you specifically.

[tri boy]

If you could pay one acc road user fee would that make you happy?



So long as it was a reasonable charge, (and maybe have the ability to set a sliding scale, relative to previous traffic accidents/claims etc).
I would be a happy, (still scroogie) nanna.:yes:

[Tigadee]

Does that mean they perform a 30 point safety check on our bikes? Cool!:innocent:

I can see now why they have the motto: "To serve and protect"

[mossy1200]

I do accept there is a reason this is happening. Rego, warrant and licence check is one thing and I don't have a problem with that considering the number of unlicenced and disqualified riders out there. I just don't accept that it is then the job of the Police to inform me that my laces are undone or they don't like the colour of my helmet, particularly when it is unlikely that the guy will have as much riding experience as I have. I also don't accept it when people who make their own risk assessment as to what they should wear on any given ride give advice to people who make their own risk assessment which may differ. ATGATT is relative. Unless you are wearing an airbag suit, airbag helmet, neckbrace, back protector etc etc etc you are not ATGATT. So stop preaching.

That's the royal 'you' by the way, not you specifically.

And since I live in the target area WELLINGTON where we have a dozen approx bike popo who have experience to burn and the colour of your helmet and your inability to tie your laces isnt the topic.Theres also a big diff between full leathers,boots,approved helmet and a back brace when I leave town than jandles and shorts and sometimes in Wellington a CYCLE helmet even NO helmet(no shit i have seen students without helmets)riding.Are you to cool to get advice or is it that you know all?Have you concidered that others may need advice?

[rastuscat]

What business is it of theirs that we wear the "correct gear"

Ok, helmets are compulsary

But if I decide to ride in shorts and jandals its my choice

We must resist these Saftey Nazis....

I guess your next post will be a whinge about increasing ACC levies.

[Berries]

Are you to cool to get advice or is it that you know all?
I'll take advice from anyone if they know their shit. If they don't then I'll have the thousand yard stare fairly quickly.


Have you concidered that others may need advice?
I am sure new riders do need a bit of advice, scooters and L plates might give a clue there. Not sure that it is a job for the Police though.

[rastuscat]

Went out for a ride today, saw two cops but neither targeted me.

..........didn't notice you in time to harrass you, sorry.............

We stopped a bloke this morning who was overtaking a line of moving vehicles on the left. He's been referred to my training programme.

Stopped another chap on a GSXRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR1000RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR. He was super cool, in his leather jacket, full face helmet, gloves, trainers and shorts.

I personally wanted to give him a slapping, but not allowed these days. Just a word about making better choices, and he was on his way.

We get nailed on here for not caring about road safety, but every day I see riders who don't give a big rats arse about it either.

On the up side, Nick Smith got his cum uppance. Knob. Maybe his poor decision making took a while to catch up with him, but it was always going to. Trouble is, he's gone, and we still pay too much for vehicle reg.

[AD345]

Just on the gear thing

Wearing shorts, or a t-shirt does not make you more likely to have an accident nor does it increase the risk you present to the wider public

Wearing jandals, however, probably does

[rastuscat]

Just on the gear thing

Wearing shorts, or a t-shirt does not make you more likely to have an accident nor does it increase the risk you present to the wider public

Wearing jandals, however, probably does

Nope. But when that crash happens that is caused by someone else, the shorts will do you less good than your motorcycle ashtray.

Can anyone predict when some knob is going to fail to see them and knock them off? Ipso facto, it's always safer to wear motorcycle gear than shorts.

[Parlane]

Nope. But when that crash happens that is caused by someone else, the shorts will do you less good than your motorcycle ashtray.

Can anyone predict when some knob is going to fail to see them and knock them off? Ipso facto, it's always safer to wear motorcycle gear than shorts.

The ashtray is that thing on top of the tank aye?

[mossy1200]

I am sure new riders do need a bit of advice, scooters and L plates might give a clue there. Not sure that it is a job for the Police though.


New rider might be riding trump rocket but you would need to pull them up to find that out I Guess.

Your all loud online but your prob a yes sir when popo pull you up.

you fight your fight and ill ride it my way and give up 5mins if need be to do my share if required for the good of removing tards from the roads or trying to re-educate them.

[AD345]

Nope. But when that crash happens that is caused by someone else, the shorts will do you less good than your motorcycle ashtray.

Can anyone predict when some knob is going to fail to see them and knock them off? Ipso facto, it's always safer to wear motorcycle gear than shorts.

It's only safer in that it may minimise some types of ( incredibly fucking painful) injuries. It's not likely to reduce the risk of fatal injury beyond the short wearing person who also has a helmet on. It's a fine and moving line between personal risk profiles and societal appetite for others perceived level of risk

What I like and what you want me to like may be different. It has always been thus

For me the discussion is about your right to decide what I should like as a risk level (you as an individual, not you as a quite rational policeman)

[mossy1200]

It's only safer in that it may minimise some types of ( incredibly fucking painful) injuries. It's not likely to reduce the risk of fatal injury beyond the short wearing person who also has a helmet on. It's a fine and moving line between personal risk profiles and societal appetite for others perceived level of risk

What I like and what you want me to like may be different. It has always been thus

For me the discussion is about your right to decide what I should like as a risk level (you as an individual, not you as a quite rational policeman)

Thats not true go ask a medic about the risk of infection caused by severe road rash not to mention the costs involved in skin grafts.Ambo driver told me its easy to repair broken bones retained within riders gear but if you add infection to the mix amputation or death becomes a possible outcome.

[AD345]

Thats not true go ask a medic about the risk of infection caused by severe road rash not to mention the costs involved in skin grafts.Ambo driver told me its easy to repair broken bones retained within riders gear but if you add infection to the mix amputation or death becomes a possible outcome.

It fits within MY risk profile

[mossy1200]

It fits within MY risk profile

Thats the attitude that provokes change in the form of increased ACC or higher mandatory safety standards due to peoples acceptable risks exceeding accs budget for client repairs.Dont forget to ACC your a value in worth based on average cost to maintain.

[AD345]

Thats the attitude that provokes change in the form of increased ACC or higher manditory safety standards due to peoples acceptable risks exceeding accs budget for client repairs.Dont forget to ACC your a value in worth based on average cost to maintain.

It might be an excuse for levy increases but that doesn't hold up as a REASON to anyone who actually understand ACC and the changes that have been happening since 1974

The only reason for the increase in ACC levies is a change in the ideology of the incumbent government exacerbated by the GFC necessitating a push out of the time line or an increase in levy's to move to a fully funded model . Said model is not a necessity either and was itself a reflection of a more right wing economic approach of the previous govt.

ACC has 11 billion dollars in cash reserves

We could all crash and permanently paralyse ourselves in the next 2 weeks and it aint going to go broke

[mossy1200]

It might be an excuse for levy increases but that doesn't hold up as a REASON to anyone who actually understand ACC and the changes that have been happening since 1974

The only reason for the increase in ACC levies is a change in the ideology of the incumbent government exacerbated by the GFC necessitating a push out of the time line or an increase in levy's to move to a fully funded model . Said model is not a necessity either and was itself a reflection of a more right wing economic approach of the previous govt.

ACC has 11 billion dollars in cash reserves

We could all crash and permanently paralyse ourselves in the next 2 weeks and it aint going to go broke

You win as long as your happy to gamble with my cost of registration because your prepaired to increase your risks when you ride . ACC only need an excuse to increase it again.I wont be the one that needs look after you when you loose your skin and nerve endings and encourage you to have more skin grafts.Ill leave that job to your family and/or the ones that love you.

[AD345]

You win as long as your happy to gamble with my cost of registration because your prepaired to increase your risks when you ride . ACC only need an excuse to increase it again.I wont be the one that needs look after you when you loose your skin and nerve endings and encourage you to have more skin grafts.Ill leave that job to your family and/or the ones that love you.

I don't gamble with your cost of registration, you gamble with MINE by perpetuating the myth that ACC needs targeted levys based on risk and that it also needs more money than it is currently getting

Neither is true

The rest of your post is just melodramatic piffle.

[Brian d marge]

It might be an excuse for levy increases but that doesn't hold up as a REASON to anyone who actually understand ACC and the changes that have been happening since 1974

The only reason for the increase in ACC levies is a change in the ideology of the incumbent government exacerbated by the GFC necessitating a push out of the time line or an increase in levy's to move to a fully funded model . Said model is not a necessity either and was itself a reflection of a more right wing economic approach of the previous govt.

ACC has 11 billion dollars in cash reserves

We could all crash and permanently paralyse ourselves in the next 2 weeks and it aint going to go broke


in a nut shell thats it

Stephen

[mossy1200]

I don't gamble with your cost of registration, you gamble with MINE by perpetuating the myth that ACC needs targeted levys based on risk and that it also needs more money than it is currently getting

Neither is true

The rest of your post is just melodramatic piffle.

Your attitude is that your not prepaired to look after your own well being you need someone to tell you how to do it.
Idd rather think for myself.Seeing as i have been down at speed 2 times.One of those wearing race leathers in the shoulder down to plastic shoulder guards after destroying 2 1.4mm leather layers idd say idd be minus flesh bone and muscle.In my mind im convinced the human body wasnt designed to go very fast so its best I give it as much protection as possible.

[AD345]

Your attitude is that your not prepaired to look after your own well being you need someone to tell you how to do it.

No... that would be YOUR attitude. I'l worry about myself thanks very much and I don't need you to tell me how to do "it"



Idd rather think for myself.Seeing as i have been down at speed 2 times.One of those wearing race leathers in the shoulder down to plastic shoulder guards after destroying 2 1.4mm leather layers idd say idd be minus flesh bone and muscle.In my mind im convinced the human body wasnt designed to go very fast so its best I give it as much protection as possible.

I prefer to protect myself by NOT FALLING OFF

To each their own




I can feel THAT one coming back to bite me in the arse one day...

[scumdog]

I prefer to protect myself by NOT FALLING OFF

To each their own




I can feel THAT one coming back to bite me in the arse one day...

Yup, guaranteeing that the event in caps above will always be the case cannot be done...:yes:

[mossy1200]

No... that would be YOUR attitude. I'l worry about myself thanks very much and I don't need you to tell me how to do "it"

Taken out of context "look after" = protect against.



I prefer to protect myself by NOT FALLING OFF

To each their own


If your not prepaired to fall off your not ready for winning.

I can feel THAT one coming back to bite me in the arse one day...

I hope it doesnt.idd rather everyone survived the ride.

[AD345]

Yup, guaranteeing that the event in caps above will always be the case cannot be done...:yes:

Hey scummy, you know the drill mate

Drive to survive baby






I can actually FEEL the gods putting my name on the shit list now

[Katman]

I can actually FEEL the gods putting my name on the shit list now

I know the feeling.

[AD345]

No... that would be YOUR attitude. I'l worry about myself thanks very much and I don't need you to tell me how to do "it"

Taken out of context "look after" = protect against.



I prefer to protect myself by NOT FALLING OFF

To each their own


If your not prepaired to fall off your not ready for winning.

I can feel THAT one coming back to bite me in the arse one day...

I hope it doesnt.idd rather everyone survived the ride.

mossy - I'm sure you are a nice bloke and I'm not going to keep pulling apart your posts, much as I may be tempted

The only problem I have is that you keep trying to tell me what to do


Stop doing that

.

[Eyegasm]

We could all crash and permanently paralyse ourselves in the next 2 weeks and it aint going to go broke

I agree with everything you have said except for this part.

Maybe you should come and work for ACC and realise how the funding is allocated?

By the way, I actually do work for ACC and now how the funding is allocated. I am not saying there is enough money to cover the coffers.
But just not enough to cover the above statement.

[mossy1200]

mossy - I'm sure you are a nice bloke and I'm not going to keep pulling apart your posts, much as I may be tempted

The only problem I have is that you keep trying to tell me what to do


Stop doing that

.

Fair call do what you want .

[Katman]

I agree with everything you have said except for this part.

Maybe you should come and work for ACC and realise how the funding is allocated?

By the way, I actually do work for ACC and now how the funding is allocated. I am not saying there is enough money to cover the coffers.
But just not enough to cover the above statement.

You'd have to be a bit stupid to take that comment literally, but.

[AD345]

I agree with everything you have said except for this part.

Maybe you should come and work for ACC and realise how the funding is allocated?

By the way, I actually do work for ACC and now how the funding is allocated. I am not saying there is enough money to cover the coffers.
But just not enough to cover the above statement.

Ah, a bit of hyperbole never killed anyone....(see what I did there?) :woohoo:

I have a reasonable idea of the allocation models but I'm always keen to know more

The point was more about the myth of lack of funds - which you already know

[Eyegasm]

Sorry KM, it was more a statement in people thinking that because ACC hass all this money that they think they have enough to cover everything. Unfortunately due to forecasting this is not entirely true.

[AD345]

Fair call do what you want .

You too my friend

I always like to hear the other point of view - always.

That's the bit that makes life interesting

[SMOKEU]

I prefer to protect myself by NOT FALLING OFF



While that may work well in theory, it doesn't appear to work as well in practice.

It's not just n00bs on sports bikes with more money than sense who end up having serious crashes.

[Berries]

Your all loud online but your prob a yes sir when popo pull you up.
Loud? Just trying to have a discussion but it is hard with people who use the word popo. My three year old does that when he is having a shit.


you fight your fight and ill ride it my way and give up 5mins if need be to do my share if required for the good of removing tards from the roads or trying to re-educate them.
I don't have a fight to fight and never said I had a problem with being stopped. But if me getting pulled over for five minutes re-educates other people I am all for it. Hey, lets make it ten minutes and re-educate twice as many.


Idd rather think for myself.Seeing as i have been down at speed 2 times.One of those wearing race leathers in the shoulder down to plastic shoulder guards after destroying 2 1.4mm leather layers idd say idd be minus flesh bone and muscle.In my mind im convinced the human body wasnt designed to go very fast so its best I give it as much protection as possible.
And you are having a go at people who don't crash? I'd rather think for myself as well thank you, if that is allowed in your world.

[Katman]

While that may work well in theory, it doesn't appear to work as well in practice.



Only for those too lazy to put the theory into practice.

[Scuba_Steve]

Yup, guaranteeing that the event in caps above will always be the case cannot be done...:yes:

Hey KM says it can be done...:whistle:


I agree with everything you have said except for this part.

Maybe you should come and work for ACC and realise how the funding is allocated?

By the way, I actually do work for ACC and now how the funding is allocated. I am not saying there is enough money to cover the coffers.
But just not enough to cover the above statement.

Something like 60% lawyers, 30% CEO/management & 10% actual ACC isn't it??? :innocent:

[Zedder]

Hey KM says it can be done...:whistle:



Something like 60% lawyers, 30% CEO/management & 10% actual ACC isn't it??? :innocent:

Don't forget the financial sector, there's $11 billion to invest.

[oneofsix]

Hey KM says it can be done...:whistle:



Scumdog must just be too lazy. After all it is always all up to the rider, there are no external influences. :shutup::facepalm: Who do you believe, a self appointed expert or someone that has probably attended more than enough events.

[Zedder]

Scumdog must just be too lazy. After all it is always all up to the rider, there are no external influences. :shutup::facepalm: Who do you believe, a self appointed expert or someone that has probably attended more than enough events.

Scumdog for ACC Minister!

[Katman]

Scumdog must just be too lazy. After all it is always all up to the rider, there are no external influences. :shutup::facepalm: Who do you believe, a self appointed expert or someone that has probably attended more than enough events.

Spoken like a true perpetual victim.

[MSTRS]

...the human body wasnt designed to go very fast...
Slight correction. The human body wasn't designed to change speeds rapidly.



I prefer to protect myself by NOT FALLING OFF

Good aim...
There's something about things (not) being written in stone. The tablets on Mt Sinai are working well...


The only problem I have is that you keep trying to tell me what to do

Somebody has to...
Like it or not, with the wonderful new National-model ACC, individual's choices impact financially on the group.

[Tigadee]

There's something about things (not) being written in stone. The tablets on Mt Sinai are working well...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I48hr8HhDv0

[baffa]

Wow. 15 pages of crap. Nzpure, I dont think you have the mental faculties to use public roads.
Police target different groups all the time. I do think however, they need to target motorbikers, because break the law more than most.
Yes, the ACC levies are a bit high, but what gives you the right to not pay when the rest of us do? If a large chunk of bikers dont pay their rego, then the govt will simply increase them, and crack down harder on everyone.

I try to pull over when I see bikers on the side of the road needing help. From now on those of you who rock around with no rego, or in shorts and jandals, will get the fingers as I ride off.
Justify it all you like, you're being bigger douchbags than whiny Nick.

[Maha]

I do accept there is a reason this is happening. Rego, warrant and licence check is one thing and I don't have a problem with that considering the number of unlicenced and disqualified riders out there. I just don't accept that it is then the job of the Police to inform me that my laces are undone or they don't like the colour of my helmet, particularly when it is unlikely that the guy will have as much riding experience as I have. I also don't accept it when people who make their own risk assessment as to what they should wear on any given ride give advice to people who make their own risk assessment which may differ. ATGATT is relative. Unless you are wearing an airbag suit, airbag helmet, neckbrace, back protector etc etc etc you are not ATGATT. So stop preaching.

That's the royal 'you' by the way, not you specifically.


Wow. 15 pages of crap. Nzpure, I dont think you have the mental faculties to use public roads.
Police target different groups all the time. I do think however, they need to target motorbikers, because break the law more than most.
Yes, the ACC levies are a bit high, but what gives you the right to not pay when the rest of us do? If a large chunk of bikers dont pay their rego, then the govt will simply increase them, and crack down harder on everyone.

I try to pull over when I see bikers on the side of the road needing help. From now on those of you who rock around with no rego, or in shorts and jandals, will get the fingers as I ride off.
Justify it all you like, you're being bigger douchbags than whiny Nick.

Not all crap baffa...that post by berries is very reasonable and well worded, in a way, it sums up the question put to everyone extremely well in my opinion.

[baffa]

Not all crap baffa...that post by berries is very reasonable and well worded, in a way, it sums up the question put to everyone extremely well in my opinion.

Perhaps not all crap, but after reading almost the entire thread in one sitting makes you start to think that all bikers do is break the law and whine about being caught :sunny:

[Maha]

Perhaps not all crap, but after reading almost the entire thread in one sitting makes you start to think that all bikers do is break the law and whine about being caught :sunny:

Thats probably a fair assumption.

[Bassmatt]

Perhaps not all crap, but after reading almost the entire thread in one sitting makes you start to think that all bikers do is break the law and whine about being caught :sunny:

Fuckin A :headbang: Keyboard warriors :facepalm:

[Nzpure]

Wow. 15 pages of crap. Nzpure, I dont think you have the mental faculties to use public roads.
Police target different groups all the time. I do think however, they need to target motorbikers, because break the law more than most.
Yes, the ACC levies are a bit high, but what gives you the right to not pay when the rest of us do? If a large chunk of bikers dont pay their rego, then the govt will simply increase them, and crack down harder on everyone.

I try to pull over when I see bikers on the side of the road needing help. From now on those of you who rock around with no rego, or in shorts and jandals, will get the fingers as I ride off.
Justify it all you like, you're being bigger douchbags than whiny Nick.

Baffa is it really that wrong to question legitimacy of any govermental policy or initiative?
I didn't complain about any ACC.
Never been pulled over or got a ticket so didn't complain about that.
All i was asking was that surely targeting a minority and stopping people for the sake of looking were both againsts the bill of rights. Im certain they have a bill or act that overrules it however.
I actually believe it is all our god given right to seek a means of transport on new zealand roads. After all it was ours,our mother and fathers,grand mother and grand father etc etc depending on how long your family been in nz (i'm not maori either FYI) tax money and for some blood, sweat and tears that built those roads. We have road rules and laws to insure a smooth and safe passage on these roads. Laws which may been passed in parliment but are only given power by us.
All i was doing was asking a question, and putting my argument forward in support of it. If you disagree with it great! its your right too, see bill of rights. I just believe its a bit on the dodgy side that our government can take it or leave in regards to the bill of rights. It changes nothing, was just a question.

[baffa]

Baffa is it really that wrong to question legitimacy of any govermental policy or initiative?
I didn't complain about any ACC.
Never been pulled over or got a ticket so didn't complain about that.
All i was asking was that surely targeting a minority and stopping people for the sake of looking were both againsts the bill of rights. Im certain they have a bill or act that overrules it however.
I actually believe it is all our god given right to seek a means of transport on new zealand roads. After all it was ours,our mother and fathers,grand mother and grand father etc etc depending on how long your family been in nz (i'm not maori either FYI) tax money and for some blood, sweat and tears that built those roads. We have road rules and laws to insure a smooth and safe passage on these roads. Laws which may been passed in parliment but are only given power by us.
All i was doing was asking a question, and putting my argument forward in support of it. If you disagree with it great! its your right too, see bill of rights. I just believe its a bit on the dodgy side that our government can take it or leave in regards to the bill of rights. It changes nothing, was just a question.

No mate, the whole point of a democracy is that people have a voice. But we also have to balance the rights of the individuals with what is best for society. My right to bear arms in public inhinges on others safety.

You wax lyrical a bit too much, without looking deeper at the practical side of law.
People wearing hoodies up when driving cars get pulled over more than people who dont, because the car is more likely to be stolen. It sounds discrimitory, but people enforce the stereotypes. (And yes, I have been pulled over for wearing a hoodie, and had this explained to me).

You talk about the importance of road rules, but dont seem to think about the practical side of enforcing them.
Police officers have to catch and penalise those of us who break the law, and try and maintain order and safety. If they are aware that a select group of us are more likely to break the law than others, or are in greater danger to ourselves and others (for instance if we dont ATGATT), then they would not be doing their job if they didnt focus on us.

[Berries]

or are in greater danger to ourselves and others (for instance if we dont ATGATT).
I agreed with most of what you said, but all this ATGATT talk bugs me. Do you really think they are going to tell scooter riders in Wellington that they need to wear one piece leather suits on their daily urban commute? Appropriate gear would be sufficient, for all of us, and that does not equate to ATGATT.

[davereid]

My right to bear arms in public inhinges on others safety.


No it doesn't, not unless you are a nutter.
In which case I would prefer that I had the right to bear arms too.

The road rules were policed entirely satisfactorily for many years without the police having the right to random search and seizure.

You give up rights and privacy irreversibly.

I'm too old for it to really effect me.

But Id like to think my grandkids can grow up in a country where they can go about their business without being stopped and searched for all manner of good reasons. Where they can travel without being tracked, spend money without the government watching, trade food with their friends without needing a permit, and surf the internet uncensored.


Maybe its already to late.