Headlight conversion?

[Matariki]

The current bulb in my headlight sucks. Period. I would like to change my bulb over to LED, since its more efficient and visible. My Suzuki TS 185 takes a twin filament bulb 6 volt, with a 25/25 watt rating. The other thing I want to know too if changing a bulb over to LED is legal in New Zealand. NZTA does state the following;


HID conversion kits (an HID bulb with a high voltage power unit or ‘ballast’ which fits into the original headlamp unit in place of the original bulb with no change to the headlamp lens, reflector or housing) are illegal on any vehicle being used on New Zealand roads.

However, a complete halogen headlamp unit can be replaced with a complete HID headlamp unit provided that the replacement headlamp unit complies with approved standards. If in doubt, get advice from a vehicle lighting retailer you trust.


I did find this video which appeared to explain it a bit better (however this is British and I don't know how different their rode code is to ours)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5n38wDe684

I don't want to break the law (it costs too much money and I could loose my license if caught), but my lights suck. So what are my options?

[FJRider]

Will the TS system cope with the LED setup ... ??? Talk to an auto sparky. And make an informed decision ... (talk is free)

[Akzle]

I don't want to break the law, but my lights suck. So what are my options?

break the law.

[Rhys]

I am shore that the TS from about 1981 were 12v

[BMWST?]

you must fins a compatible headlight housing,not just a new lamp if you want to comply with the law

[Matariki]

Hmm... there appears to be nothing on the internet about 6 volt bulbs, only 12 volt for LED. That would mean I would have to do a conversion, which I would rather not do. I'm fine with a standard bulb, but I would like to get one of good quality. Anything that's better than the piece of dim crap I have now.

[Matariki]

I am shore that the TS from about 1981 were 12v

My haynes manual says 6v.

[Matariki]

I am shore that the TS from about 1981 were 12v

I doubled checked in my manual and you're right, that is the case for older models. Mine is 2003 model, but it appears to be based on the old school design. But it does state with the TS100 and TS125 ERZ models (which came out around the 80's) that they take a 12v. I'll have to open my bike up and have a look.

[Akzle]

I'll have to open my bike up and have a look.

just pull the bulb and put the multimeter across the contacts... ^_-

[FJRider]

I doubled checked in my manual and you're right, that is the case for older models. Mine is 2003 model, but it appears to be based on the old school design. But it does state with the TS100 and TS125 ERZ models (which came out around the 80's) that they take a 12v. I'll have to open my bike up and have a look.

A cheaper (and legal) option would be a fitted relay and a higher wattage bulb.

Not all 12 volt generating systems were created equal. So just fitting any old larger wattage, 12 volt bulb/system just may not work.

[Matariki]

So I opened up the front of bike. The bulb is a 12v35/35w. Then I checked the battery which is a Yuasa YTX4L (12v, capacity - 4Ah, cold cranking amps - 50A)

[Gremlin]

LED is usually no good for throwing light down the right, ie, as a headlight, unless they are high power (HP LED).

My trick for that was installing uprated bulbs, on normal bikes it's 55W. The uprated is a +50/+90/+100 bulb, but still only draws the standard 55W. Obviously a bulb that burns twice as bright burns half as long, so longevity often suffers.

See if there is an equivalent for 35W. Not recommended to increase wattage (from 35W to 55W for example), as you can destroy the headlight or burn out the wiring.

[Paul in NZ]

A 35W incandscent bulb isnt for lighting the way on a dark night, its more a navigation light to stop you being run over by a bus. Mr Suzuki never really thought anyone would actually use a TS185 much at night so back in the day it was made it was 'enough'...

My suggestion is something around 45/55W H4 which will be a missive improvement but hopefully not generate so much heat your headlight will collapse seconds before your electrical system into molten slag.

YOU WILL NEED TO OVERLAY YOUR WIRING AND ADD RELAYS.....

In other words build an auxillary loom to cope with it. The standard wiring switch etc can't cope. Use the battery feed to the current bulb to turn the relay off / on.

If you are unsure about what I mean by that sing out and I can post up a simple diagram

[sootie]

Early incandescent bulbs were argon filled. This tended to give quite a yellowish light. My big bike is like this, and I have been considering an upgrade, although I do not do much night riding on it.

In more recent years manufacturers have been filling simple incandescent headlight bulbs with Krypton and Xenon gases & mixtures of these. These heavier molecules reduce blackening of the inside of the glass envelope, and also give a whiter light. (Essentially you get more light for the same power.) This is quite different (obviously) from HID, quartz halogen or LED technology, but maybe some one can advise about practical detail like what is available.
I guess a simple bulb exchange should be possible without any worries about circuit over heating or overload.
Have all modern headlight bulbs now moved away from argon filling?

This is an interesting thread. :niceone:

[Paul in NZ]

This has been covered on KB a few times but basically...

If your bike does not have relays in the light cct from new then the current is being routed through the feeble light switch on the bars and the thin wiring to suit.

Putting a bigger bulb will increase the losses and is a waste of time.

To test, open up the back of the headlight and identify the hot feed into the bulb. Make up a fused lead from the hot side of the battery long enough to reach the headlight. Turn on the headlight and touch the hot lead onto the hot feed. If the bulb brightens you have significant losses in the feed to the light and there are gains in fitting relays.

[Asher]

I brought a panasonic bulb IIRC that 50% brighter than standard, its not major but it was a noticeable difference. Not sure if they come in 35W (mine is 55W) but they are only ~$40 from repco.

[Matariki]

A 35W incandscent bulb isnt for lighting the way on a dark night, its more a navigation light to stop you being run over by a bus. Mr Suzuki never really thought anyone would actually use a TS185 much at night so back in the day it was made it was 'enough'...

My suggestion is something around 45/55W H4 which will be a missive improvement but hopefully not generate so much heat your headlight will collapse seconds before your electrical system into molten slag.

YOU WILL NEED TO OVERLAY YOUR WIRING AND ADD RELAYS.....

In other words build an auxillary loom to cope with it. The standard wiring switch etc can't cope. Use the battery feed to the current bulb to turn the relay off / on.

If you are unsure about what I mean by that sing out and I can post up a simple diagram

Fortunately my dad is a master when it comes to anything electrical, but he's not familiar with motorcycles (and I'm still learning), so a diagram would be greatly appreciated. I'll show it to him and see what he thinks. He usually gives me a hand with most stuff in the garage.

[BMWST?]

Fortunately my dad is a master when it comes to anything electrical, but he's not familiar with motorcycles (and I'm still learning), so a diagram would be greatly appreciated. I'll show it to him and see what he thinks. He usually gives me a hand with most stuff in the garage.

You can continue down this path if you can actually get an updated bulb for your headlamp but I think your best bet is going to a motorcycle wrecker and buying a whole new headlamp which has a more modern lamp in it,but make sure it's something that your electrical system can cope with.Your dad may be able to suss that out,there is not that much difference between cars and bikes at the output end

[spanner spinner]

sorry to be the bringer of bad news but there is no easy way to get a better headlight on these bikes, and i do this sort of thing for a living.Your bike has a direct AC feed for the headlight which comes direct off the headlight power coil. The relay option off the battery will not work as there is just enought power going to the battery to keep it charged so the indercators and brake light will work. If you connect the headlight to the battery circuit it will flatten it 15 to 20 minutes. The headlight charge coil only has enought power to run the standard wattage bulb a larger bulb will be no brighter as it will not be supplied with enough power, and the larger bulb usally will burn out the coil. There is only one option to get a better headlight on these bikes which is to do a full rewire and rewind to the charging circuit and fit a full 3 wave charging system, very involved and very expensive. I have done this to crf450's ect so that they can run big wattage headlight systems, BUT!!! there are aftermarket kits availabe for these models which keep the cost down nothing i can find would fit straight onto your bike. Google a wiring diagram to see how the lights work on your bike to get a better idear of how the lights work as there are even separate coils for high and low beam. The headlights have allways been shit on these bikes.

[Matariki]

sorry to be the bringer of bad news but there is no easy way to get a better headlight on these bikes, and i do this sort of thing for a living.Your bike has a direct AC feed for the headlight which comes direct off the headlight power coil. The relay option off the battery will not work as there is just enought power going to the battery to keep it charged so the indercators and brake light will work. If you connect the headlight to the battery circuit it will flatten it 15 to 20 minutes. The headlight charge coil only has enought power to run the standard wattage bulb a larger bulb will be no brighter as it will not be supplied with enough power, and the larger bulb usally will burn out the coil. There is only one option to get a better headlight on these bikes which is to do a full rewire and rewind to the charging circuit and fit a full 3 wave charging system, very involved and very expensive. I have done this to crf450's ect so that they can run big wattage headlight systems, BUT!!! there are aftermarket kits availabe for these models which keep the cost down nothing i can find would fit straight onto your bike. Google a wiring diagram to see how the lights work on your bike to get a better idear of how the lights work as there are even separate coils for high and low beam. The headlights have allways been shit on these bikes.

Damn... what about replacing the bulb that my bike takes (12v 35/35w) to something that is same but of higher quality, would that improve the lighting?

[Matariki]

I've been having a look around the internet for some ideas on what is available. I don't know though whether or not they would be legal, yet alone if they would work with my motorcycle. But I show the list of stuff that I've found (so far I've found two);

For those wondering, the fitting on my light (I think) is a Bosch BA20d.

HS1 Phillips MotoVision - http://www.regalautobulbs.co.uk/products/philips-motovision-hs1.php

M5 Bosch Pin 12v 35/35w BA20d - http://www.anzamotorcycles.co.nz/parts/bike_accessories/lights_and_indicators/2990-m5_bosch_pin_12v3535watt_ba20d.aspx

[Akzle]

...

you're in the souf eh?

best bet migt be to find someone who IS clever, put on the coffee and do some ol' fashioned learnin...

[Paul in NZ]

I've been having a look around the internet for some ideas on what is available. I don't know though whether or not they would be legal, yet alone if they would work with my motorcycle. But I show the list of stuff that I've found (so far I've found two);

For those wondering, the fitting on my light (I think) is a Bosch BA20d.

HS1 Phillips MotoVision - http://www.regalautobulbs.co.uk/products/philips-motovision-hs1.php

M5 Bosch Pin 12v 35/35w BA20d - http://www.anzamotorcycles.co.nz/parts/bike_accessories/lights_and_indicators/2990-m5_bosch_pin_12v3535watt_ba20d.aspx

Well the 35W is the amount of power the bulb uses and has nothing to do with the amount of light it outputs... So worth a try..

Good comments from Mr Spanner Spinner there... I was having thoughts about that but hoping the electrical system was more advanced than the ancient TS250 I once owned - apparently not...

[F5 Dave]

ok so here we go. You are pretty much stuck with 35w, but I'm guessing it is a plain incandescent bulb & unlike the H4 bulbs shown. It will fit into a socket with 2 bumps on the bottom similar to a tail bulb, but with a locator. ie no long tangs to plug onto.

Find a Yam shop & buy a Blaster (ATV) headlight bulb. it will have a Halogen & same fitting (unless I am wrong, but FXR150s for example have this setup & benefit). Darbi (wholesale only distributor) will carry them & deliver to any bike shop.

Do be aware that if you did uprate your system with a complete rewind to run a bigger wattage hotter bulb the lamp which will be plastic will melt. They do this std if left to idle for a prolonged period whilst interfering with a sheep I am told:rolleyes:.

[Matariki]

ok so here we go. You are pretty much stuck with 35w, but I'm guessing it is a plain incandescent bulb & unlike the H4 bulbs shown. It will fit into a socket with 2 bumps on the bottom similar to a tail bulb, but with a locator. ie no long tangs to plug onto.

Find a Yam shop & buy a Blaster (ATV) headlight bulb. it will have a Halogen & same fitting (unless I am wrong, but FXR150s for example have this setup & benefit). Darbi (wholesale only distributor) will carry them & deliver to any bike shop.

Do be aware that if you did uprate your system with a complete rewind to run a bigger wattage hotter bulb the lamp which will be plastic will melt. They do this std if left to idle for a prolonged period whilst interfering with a sheep I am told:rolleyes:.

Interesting, I'll look into it.

[Matariki]

I quite like the light bulbs that have been developed by Phillips, but the ones that 12v 35/35w have a different fitting on them (three prongs - P36t 463). Would it be possible to change the fitting on my motorcycle to accommodate those sorts of bulbs?

[F5 Dave]

3 pronged ones are considerably bigger than the type I think you have so won't fit the headlight shell. If you pull back the cover you will quickly see the type you have. & it will be a spring backed bayonet arrangement. Probably a bit corroded as well.

[Matariki]

3 pronged ones are considerably bigger than the type I think you have so won't fit the headlight shell. If you pull back the cover you will quickly see the type you have. & it will be a spring backed bayonet arrangement. Probably a bit corroded as well.

Yes, it is a spring backed bayonet arrangement and you're right, it is a bit corroded. But is there nothing I can do to replace the fitting itself (larger headlight shell and fitting)?
Or would that mean I would have to replace the front of the bike with a new headlight?

[F5 Dave]

I think you clean up the contacts & buy a (YFS200) Blaster bulb (check that it is Halogen). It will be better than what you have for sure. After that it gets quantums harder & you will have to ask yourself what type of investment for the amount of night riding you do.

I did the Halogen upgrade on my RG50 & it was heaps better than std. Std bulb is a plain bulb like a house light bulb. Halogens will be like some black paint on the tip & a funny shape. It is a J base.

something like this, not sure if only 30w or 35, but Halogen is heaps better than plain incadescent .
http://www.hyperparts.com/wc.dll?ctwp~getitemclass~1001~1002~1~part~H280709

[Matariki]

I think you clean up the contacts & buy a Blaster bulb. It will be better than what you have for sure. After that it gets quantums harder & you will have to ask yourself what type of investment for the amount of night riding you do.

Yes, I had another look on the net and I found what you were talking about. I'll go down to my local Yamaha dealer and see what they have.

[Matariki]

I think you clean up the contacts & buy a (YFS200) Blaster bulb (check that it is Halogen). It will be better than what you have for sure. After that it gets quantums harder & you will have to ask yourself what type of investment for the amount of night riding you do.

I did the Halogen upgrade on my RG50 & it was heaps better than std. Std bulb is a plain bulb like a house light bulb. Halogens will be like some black paint on the tip & a funny shape. It is a J base.

something like this, not sure if only 30w or 35, but Halogen is heaps better than plain incadescent .
http://www.hyperparts.com/wc.dll?ctwp~getitemclass~1001~1002~1~part~H280709

+1


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to F5 Dave again.

:oi-grr:

[sootie]

The tungsten filament in a quartz halogen bulb is able to run quite a bit hotter than a similar filament in a simple argon, xenon or kryton filled bulb. This increases the efficiency of the electrical to light output energy conversion & hence gives more light out for the same power consumption.

This arrangement is possible by using a high temperature quartz glass enclosure, and filling it with halogen gas (ie chlorine, bromine, iodine etc mixtures). Using heat convection, these gases are able to much more closely control the maximum temperature of the tungsten filament to maintain it close to but reliably below its melting temperature. This bit of technology really does give something for nothing. Modern HID illumination is of course even more efficient, and LEDs are getting there. FYI

[Matariki]

I went down to my local Yamaha store and they said they didn't have any blaster bulbs in stock (they said there aren't any in the country <_<). They showed me a Trifa halogen Bosch Pin bulb, but I told them I would think it about first. They said If I wanted a brighter bulb, I would need to consider getting a bulb with a higher wattage consumption. But I'm not sure whether or not that would be a good idea based on what you guys have posted.

[F5 Dave]

A higher wattage bulb will definitely give brighter light; but only if your system has enough excess power to drive it. Clearly parts guy hasn't grown up riding trail bikes.

Internet might have to find an on-line shop.. . . Ah heck I'll check my spares, I think I used them up but I might have put one aside. . .

[Matariki]

A higher wattage bulb will definitely give brighter light; but only if your system has enough excess power to drive it. Clearly parts guy hasn't grown up riding trail bikes.

Internet might have to find an on-line shop.. . . Ah heck I'll check my spares, I think I used them up but I might have put one aside. . .

Any help would be appreciated. :niceone:

[Coldrider]

Of course the original reflector shell is providing its own limitations.

[Matariki]

So for the Blaster Bulb, is this what you had in mind F5 Dave? Would these be legal for use on New Zealand roads?

http://www.powersportsplace.com/parts/pum-230h6msw-p/overview/vehicle-type/sport-atv/make/yamaha/model/yfs200-blaster

http://www.powersportsplace.com/parts/pum-230h6msw-s/overview/vehicle-type/sport-atv/make/yamaha/model/yfs200-blaster

[Gremlin]

They said If I wanted a brighter bulb, I would need to consider getting a bulb with a higher wattage consumption. But I'm not sure whether or not that would be a good idea based on what you guys have posted.
People can't be experts in everything... I learnt about lighting and what options were available because I do a lot of night riding. I'm generally the one teaching shops about what's available and pros and cons of each choice. The parts guy for example, knows a break down of multiple bikes, what parts are compatible between bikes etc. Hell, I can't do that.

[F5 Dave]

Well I forgot to look to see what I had. I'll reset my reminder.

A white light one should be legal, but the coloured ones *apart from being naff) would not.

Think one link was for white, the other purple.

[Matariki]

They're both Ion Spark white and DOT-compliant.

[Matariki]

I found out that they do stock the Blaster bulbs in New Zealand, but I think have to buy a pack of 10 according to the website. :mellow:

http://www.bits4bikes.co.nz/parts/Yamaha/951.aspx.
Would the 12v 30/30w be better or should I get the 12v 35/35w?

[F5 Dave]

Either would be an improvement, but same wattage as std would be best option if you can get it.

[Ocean1]

Either would be an improvement, but same wattage as std would be best option if you can get it.

:yes:


Halogens will be like some black paint on the tip & a funny shape.

And you should avoid getting your greasy fingers all over them when you fit them.

[Matariki]

And you should avoid getting your greasy fingers all over them when you fit them.

Would wearing disposable gloves be ok?

[Matariki]

Either would be an improvement, but same wattage as std would be best option if you can get it.

std? :blink:

I'll probably go for the halogen one 12v30/30.

Now I need to find out where I can get some replacement springs from, I kind of bent them when I was disconnecting the light, I took them into my local motorcycle store and they said they didn't have springs in the size I was looking for. I'll post some photos to show what I mean.

[Ocean1]

Would wearing disposable gloves be ok?

A few tissues would be OK, as long as you don't get oil or dirt from your fingers on it.


std? :blink:

I'll probably go for the halogen one 12v30/30.

You might have missed the point of changing to the new type of bulb, it may draw the same current, (or in this case s a bit less) but it turns probably almost twice as much into visible light. So you get more light from the same system. :wings:

[Matariki]

You might have missed the point of changing to the new type of bulb, it may draw the same current, (or in this case s a bit less) but it turns probably almost twice as much into visible light. So you get more light from the same system. :wings:

I don't think I fully understand, what does std stand for (other than what the general public knows it as)?
And what will draw the same amount current but give me more light?

[Ocean1]

I don't think I fully understand, what does std stand for (other than what the general public knows it as)?
And what will draw the same amount current but give me more light?

Sorry, had to look back, F5 Dave means standard, as in the same wattage, (energy use) as the original bulb.

The standard incandescant bulb turns only a small quantity of it's 35W of energy into light, replacing it with a much more efficient halogen bulb which uses the same 35W will result in more light for the same energy use. OK?

[Matariki]

Sorry, had to look back, F5 Dave means standard, as in the same wattage, (energy use) as the original bulb.

The standard incandescant bulb turns only a small quantity of it's 35W of energy into light, replacing it with a much more efficient halogen bulb which uses the same 35W will result in more light for the same energy use. OK?

Yes, thank you for clarifying.

[Matariki]

I don't know if the bulb would fit though, the Yamaha YFS200 bulbs are a P15D25-1 fit. My current bulb is a BA20D.

270835

[Matariki]

Hmm... after thinking about it, I've decided that I going with the M5 BOSCH PIN 12v35/35watt BA20d BULB TODO. It is a halogen bulb, and it is sold in New Zealand (and I just realized they sell them at my local motorcycle store :facepalm:)

[Disco Dan]

Hmm... there appears to be nothing on the internet about 6 volt bulbs, only 12 volt for LED. That would mean I would have to do a conversion, which I would rather not do. I'm fine with a standard bulb, but I would like to get one of good quality. Anything that's better than the piece of dim crap I have now.

Dude... don't worry about the voltage differences (at least in terms of fitting) - nothing a resistor or two can't fix.

I've just fitted daytime running lights and a new park light. All LED. I just cut off the factory plugs, soldered in the correct resistor and then soldered LED's to the wires.

LED's for the win. Brighter, last longer and use less power.

[F5 Dave]

Thread dredge from a few months back, but 'a few resistors here & there is beyond most people to calculate & implement reliably. Further the regulation on 6V systems is not as clean cut as typical 12V bike which has a proper regulator, so if you change the system loading you'll run into trouble. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing as they say.