Ranting about NZ retailers

[bogan]

Hey guys something to think about.
Yep we live in a global economy.Yep you can save money by going on e bay etc and buying stuff from wholesalers in the states etc.
I see your logic.
But what happens when the last accessory shop has closed. The last bike shop has gone under?
Ohh they won't I hear you say. Hmmm ok take a look around -how many west auckland bike shops,south auckland?
How many places have closed their doors in the last few years?
Im not Naive enough to say the only reason the companies folded is people buying offshore.But it hasn't helped.

Somebody raised this point before I think, but the ratio of bike shops to bikers is pretty high. Half could close up and we would still have plenty (assuming the others took on the brands).

Lets exaggerate and say 50% of parts sales go overseas, just close 50% of the shops. Hell, take em both to 75%, that's still going to leave at least a couple in all the cities. There will always be a few bikes shops left providing the local service that are not available online, and catering to those who would rather buy local.

Bike shops have been closing and opening, expanding and downsizing, over here for ages. I think those that close are more to do with the shop's poor evaluation of market size than it is to do with some overseas purchases.

[PeeJay]

Hey guys something to think about.
Yep we live in a global economy.Yep you can save money by going on e bay etc and buying stuff from wholesalers in the states etc.
I see your logic.
But what happens when the last accessory shop has closed. The last bike shop has gone under?
Ohh they won't I hear you say. Hmmm ok take a look around -how many west auckland bike shops,south auckland?
How many places have closed their doors in the last few years?
Im not Naive enough to say the only reason the companies folded is people buying offshore.But it hasn't helped.

Things change. Wasnt that long ago we had a thriving vehicle assy industry, 1000"s employed, directly and indirectly. There was none of this importing s/h or even new cars. Once importing was adjusted people started bringing their own cars in and then it snowballed till we have hundreds like yourself bringing in 1ooo's of s/h cars. Killed the assy industry and all the attendant jobs that went with it. I used to make wiring looms for all sorts of cars. 40 of us down the road. History.
Cheap car imports pretty much killed of motorcycles as transport as well. There were bikeshops everywhere back in the 60's 70's. More mechanics than you could shake a stick at. Now try and find someone who can build a crank. Good Luck with that.
We used to have a thriving electronics industry, made our own TV's and radios, cheap Jap imports killed that of as well.
If the retail industry has to adjust to a new way of doing business, and some of them dont want to/cant be bothered/or plain old had enough, so be it.

[Woodman]

Things change. Wasnt that long ago we had a thriving vehicle assy industry, 1000"s employed, directly and indirectly. There was none of this importing s/h or even new cars. Once importing was adjusted people started bringing their own cars in and then it snowballed till we have hundreds like yourself bringing in 1ooo's of s/h cars. Killed the assy industry and all the attendant jobs that went with it. I used to make wiring looms for all sorts of cars. 40 of us down the road. History.
Cheap car imports pretty much killed of motorcycles as transport as well. There were bikeshops everywhere back in the 60's 70's. More mechanics than you could shake a stick at. Now try and find someone who can build a crank. Good Luck with that.
We used to have a thriving electronics industry, made our own TV's and radios, cheap Jap imports killed that of as well.
If the retail industry has to adjust to a new way of doing business, and some of them dont want to/cant be bothered/or plain old had enough, so be it.

I think a lot of businesses in various retail categories are adjusting ok, but there are those who want to change the law so it was like it was in the olden days like you describe with everything protected. Ain't gonna happen though.

[gammaguy]

Hey guys something to think about.
Yep we live in a global economy.Yep you can save money by going on e bay etc and buying stuff from wholesalers in the states etc.
I see your logic.
But what happens when the last accessory shop has closed. The last bike shop has gone under?
Ohh they won't I hear you say. Hmmm ok take a look around -how many west auckland bike shops,south auckland?
How many places have closed their doors in the last few years?
Im not Naive enough to say the only reason the companies folded is people buying offshore.But it hasn't helped.

last time i went into a bike shop in AKL the guy behind the counter was too busy texting someone to even lift his head to greet me.

Clearly if they are an endangered species they dont fall over themselves to be saved

maybe they all deserve to die off like the dinosaurs that many of them are

[Robert Taylor]

Well heres another side. A lot of us buy product in NZ, and use it to make things to sell internationally. But paying massively inflated prices locally makes it difficult to stay competitive on an international market.

These are the people who are bringing money into NZ and creating jobs here. They should not also be expected to provide charity for those businesses who refuse to get with the times and still expect to operate within a national monopoly.

It is worth noting I have managed to find some very good suppliers who are competitive on price, and offer excellent service as well. But it took some doing to find them.

No argument about that. No one is asking for monopolies, just a level playing field

[Robert Taylor]

Amazing how your bubble is burst over and over and over and yet you never notice it as it just doesn't fit what suits you.

As has been pointed out, the effect of crippling the man on the street in order to funnel their money to you is the greater cost, But hey, don't let the numbers get in the way of your delusion.

The world wasn't put here to suit you, and you alone.

Oh for gods sake, your line of thinking and intent to argue is getting ( frankly ) pathetic. Who suggested it was about me? Read my posts, Im all for NZ first and foremost being an export economy. The man on the street is also unwittingly exacerbating the situation, you cannot blame anyone for seeking a good deal but when gst is constantly bypassed the Government coffers suffer, also their ability to provide services and ( if you like ) social justice.

[Headbanger]

Oh for gods sake, your line of thinking and intent to argue is getting ( frankly ) pathetic. Who suggested it was about me? Read my posts, Im all for NZ first and foremost being an export economy. The man on the street is also unwittingly exacerbating the situation, you cannot blame anyone for seeking a good deal but when gst is constantly bypassed the Government coffers suffer, also their ability to provide services and ( if you like ) social justice.

Rob, I don't consider you even understand your own argument, Never mind being capable of evaluating it in the context of social change.

If you are getting addressed personally, its no doubt because your personally engaged in the debate and used yourself as an example. I didn't see anyone call you out before you made your appearance?

[Flip]

The gear change linkage rod on my Harley just busted.

Its a 12" 1/4" dia rod with two ball ends on it. From the local dealer delivered to my door $45.

Not all dealers are stealers. If it was a part for a triumph or honda it would have been 5-10 times that, not that they have anything as cool as a external gear change linkage rod...

[Robert Taylor]

You're not wrong there. Obviously include yourself in that group.

Care to comment on what the Australian Productivity Commission concluded re lowering the GST free threshold?

Why would it be any different here?

When Customs came back to Maurice Williamson regarding NZ gst threshold they included an estimation of how much money the country would SAVE if the gst free threshold was raised to the same level as Aust.
Hence not only is the govt not lowering it, they are not ruling out lifting it.

Just to get a few more sales you would want to lumber the country with more expenses and costs
As for your suggestion that the govt could force banks to collect gst.
Have you actually thought it through?
To make it work would cost a fortune.
And of course the extra compliance costs for a system that doesn't work will be passed on to who ? me and you and every other person in the country.
All because you think people shouldn't have a choice as to where they buy there stuff.

Not to put too fine a point on it, its business's like yours which contribute to our woeful balance of payments situation.
Rather than export goods and services and import money, you export money and import goods.
So instead of whinging about private importers causing the downfall of kiwi society, how about looking in the mirror ?
And if you wish to drag someones social conscience into the discussion, check your own out first

The Government should find a way of accruing gst on every import. Time for them to get ballsy about it and find a workable and cost effective solution, maybe its not impossible?

People have a choice where they buy their stuff from, that is a reality of retail. We add vlaue and that means we get a reasonable slice of the market. That is how we compete ( aside from thin margins )

We employ New Zealanders, subcontract machining and construction to NZ companies and unlike overseas reselling companies in our industry we put money back into the NZ economy . And we use a reasonable quantity of NZ made and sourced materials, like anyone in the motor and related industries

Retailers in NZ of all products are united in wanting Government to significantly lower the gst threshold so that at least they have a slightly better chance of competing. So, is it just me asking for this? Of course its not.

Im not even getting into an argument about social conscience with you as you are not ballsy enough to come clean who you are.

[Robert Taylor]

Rob, I don't consider you even understand your own argument, Never mind being capable of evaluating it in the context of social change.

If you are getting addressed personally, its no doubt because your personally engaged in the debate and used yourself as an example. I didn't see anyone call you out before you made your appearance?

We can agree then to disagree

[Headbanger]

No argument about that. No one is asking for monopolies, just a level playing field

The level playing feild is that all for profit orginisations are charged the exact same fees and taxes.

If you think our tax money should be spent raising more taxes from us, at a cost to us far more then what is raised so people are forced to shop through you and you alone........

Wait, thats exactly your view.

Lmfao, cocksucker.

[Headbanger]

Though in reality I'm just spiteful because I cant afford any mint suspension....:shifty:

[FROSTY]

The level playing feild is that all for profit orginisations are charged the exact same fees and taxes.

If you think our tax money should be spent raising more taxes from us, at a cost to us far more then what is raised so people are forced to shop through you and you alone........

Wait, thats exactly your view.

Lmfao, cocksucker.
MY view. Everybody importing anything pays customs gst of 15% -Thats what I see as a level playing feild and means the gubbiment is able to spend money they do have

[Robert Taylor]

The level playing feild is that all for profit orginisations are charged the exact same fees and taxes.

If you think our tax money should be spent raising more taxes from us, at a cost to us far more then what is raised so people are forced to shop through you and you alone........

Wait, thats exactly your view.

Lmfao, cocksucker.

Again, you just dont get it and Im not going to lower the tone to the level you have decided upon. If you pay gst when buying off a NZ retailer then why should you also not pay gst for anything you privately import?. The Government misses out on gst that it would otherwise have accrued. And in reality its likely now missing out on a lot of gst.

This is an argument about a level playing field for everybody, get it EVERYBODY.

[Katman]

Lets exaggerate and say 50% of parts sales go overseas, just close 50% of the shops. Hell, take em both to 75%, that's still going to leave at least a couple in all the cities. There will always be a few bikes shops left providing the local service that are not available online, and catering to those who would rather buy local.


You've come out with some stupid shit in the past but that one takes the cake.

New thread - 'I had to travel 50 fucking kms to get to the nearest fucking bikeshop!!!'

'And it wasn't open on fucking Sunday!!!'

[Crasherfromwayback]

You've come out with some stupid shit in the past but that one takes the cake.

New thread - 'I had to travel 50 fucking kms to get to the nearest fucking bikeshop!!!'

Yeah quite why any real motorcyclist would want that to happen has me fucked too.

[bogan]

You've come out with some stupid shit in the past but that one takes the cake.

New thread - 'I had to travel 50 fucking kms to get to the nearest fucking bikeshop!!!'

'And it wasn't open on fucking Sunday!!!'

Must be different up your way, my favored shop is about 10 minutes (6k) away, and there's at least three others closer. I'm not saying they should close, just illustrating the fact that the 'oh no we're going to run out if many more close' opinion is pretty fucking far off the mark.

If the complaint is bikers aren't spending enough at a bike shop to keep them afloat, one solution is to have fewer bike shops.


Yeah quite why any real motorcyclist would want that to happen has me fucked too.

Well, if its a choice between inflated prices, or an extra 3 minutes ride to the bike shop, I'll take the later.

[Headbanger]

This is an argument about a level playing field for everybody, get it EVERYBODY.

Jesus fuck Rob, Look at the bigger picture, Pull the stick out of your arse and get over yourself.

People are not businesses and shouldn't be treated as such, The only way you could have a level playing field is if the circumstances were identical, and that would have to be dictated and regulated by the government, and fuck me, You might compete with other bussinesses, Lets Lock that down as well, Welcome to Russia.

The market forces are the consumers, If you can't meet their needs and expectations then they will shop with someone who will. You want to fuck some fuckers over?, Aim your shit at the fucks coming up with different price points for different regions of the globe. Its a rort, and they and their agents deserved to be fucked over.

[Katman]

last time i went into a bike shop in AKL the guy behind the counter was too busy texting someone to even lift his head to greet me.


This is the one area that I agree has good reason for grievance.

In the 30 years that I've been involved in motorcycling I've lost count of the number of bike salesmen that exude the attitude that their shit doesn't stink 'cos they work in a bikeshop - "I'll get to you if and when I can be fucked" sort of thing.

(On the other hand, there's a great number of bike salesmen that actually do understand that the customer is the cornerstone of their business).

If you want to put NZ motorcycle shops on the rack, just be certain of what your reasoning is.

The price that the poor prick at the end of the chain charges you for the part you so desperately want is not a valid reason.

[Headbanger]

You've come out with some stupid shit in the past but that one takes the cake.

New thread - 'I had to travel 50 fucking kms to get to the nearest fucking bikeshop!!!'

'And it wasn't open on fucking Sunday!!!'


20.2 km to my nearest bike shop.

And fuck me, they aren't open on a Sunday, any of them, And I even turned up on a Sunday expecting them to be open.

Shits cheap though, the range is huge, and the salespersons weren't total fucks.

[Robert Taylor]

Jesus fuck Rob, Look at the bigger picture, Pull the stick out of your arse and get over yourself.

People are not businesses and shouldn't be treated as such, The only way you could have a level playing field is if the circumstances were identical, and that would have to be dictated and regulated by the government, and fuck me, You might compete with other bussinesses, Lets Lock that down as well, Welcome to Russia.

The market forces are the consumers, If you can't meet their needs and expectations then they will shop with someone who will. You want to fuck some fuckers over?, Aim your shit at the fucks coming up with different price points for different regions of the globe. Its a rort, and they and their agents deserved to be fucked over.

Heck something we can agree on, different price points at different points of the globe. Yes that is a rort. Pricing should ideally be global

[Ocean1]

Heck something we can agree on, different price points at different points of the globe. Yes that is a rort. Pricing should ideally be global

Wonder if that's ever been the case. Probaby before the industrial revolution...

Might not be a rort, but it's certainly not fair that the godamn yankees pay half the real price we do. Seems likely you'd find a direct correlation between market size and wholesale prices, for obvious reasons.

I think this effect is probably the single biggest cause of the difference in living standard between the big western countries and the minnows. Trade agreements don't work, at least in this regard they're more likely to be a trade protection mechanism than any means to level market access. Don't know how yo fix it, either. Unless some of the smaller trading partners gang up on the big ones.

[avgas]

Though in reality I'm just spiteful because I cant afford any mint suspension....:shifty:
Consider yourself lucky, I can't even afford OK suspension - right now I am over-tightening the chain to keep my ass off the ground.

[Headbanger]

Consider yourself lucky, I can't even afford OK suspension - right now I am over-tightening the chain to keep my ass off the ground.

Yeah, I sold my bike to pay my bills and keep food in the cupboard.

Now Im telling someone whose succesful that he's doing it all wrong.

Lmfao.

I love these little chats with Rob.


Im such a cunt.

[bogan]

So back to the GST topic, I bought a screen from korea last week worth 460NZD, fedex just rang me up and said I needed to pay GST and import fees, but its still in korea. So there is obviously the infrastructure in place already to collect GST using very little man-hours (and I don't just mean the size of the koreans :shifty:). I guess they got the value from the insured sum of the parcel or something?

Now I'm assuming since my parcel has had the duties paid for, it will not go through any more processing than the items not subject to duty or GST. So I'm at a loss as to why the cost of collection is preventing it being collected on items under $400.

[imdying]

Yes, new system in place, cost a few quid (about a quarter billion), but they're far more on to it on collecting now as regular private importers will have noticed. Yes the value comes from the parcels documentation, and yes it can be preregistered for clearance by some carriers (including FedEx). The sort of infrastructure required to vet every parcel coming in, and then store it till it's paid for, is however not in place. In theory it could be put in place, but it would cost more than it earnt. Google for the JBMS.

[mashman]

Heck something we can agree on, different price points at different points of the globe. Yes that is a rort. Pricing should ideally be global

Communist :shifty:

[Robert Taylor]

Communist :shifty:

No, REALIST. Theres a huge chasm between the two

[Edbear]

Yeah, I sold my bike to pay my bills and keep food in the cupboard.

Now Im telling someone whose succesful that he's doing it all wrong.

Lmfao.

I love these little chats with Rob.


Im such a cunt.

Well, this is KB... :rolleyes:

[avgas]

Yeah, I sold my bike to keep food in the cupboard.
Did you try running it on petrol?

[boman]

As the title says, wake up NZ retailers, there is competition out there. How many times is a person expected to get fobbed off, whilst looking for a product?

I am in the market for a new bike jacket. I know what I want, but it is no longer available.

So, what has replaced it?

Is this a too hard question to answer. It seems so. Come on. I can get an answer from a dealer in the USA, overnight, so why cannot NZ retailers be bothered to find out?

With the dollar being so strong, do they want me to go off shore?

I don't want too, but it is becoming obvious that the Auckland dealers want me too.


Am I being too harsh? All I want is someone to ask the question of the importer, and come back to me with an answer.

Look on the internet, and see if there is one you like, is NOT an answer in my book.

IF I want to look on the net, then I will buy off the net. The exhaust I bought, off shore, came within a week. To my door. And they do bike jackets, with FREE freight over $400.00.

Beat that.

But the Kiwi in me, wants to support his local economy. So I guess, watch this space.


On a side note, I was very impressed with the service at Cyclespot. Very helpful, pity I cannot say much about the rest.

[Brian d marge]

See thread #64746472846463
One wonders how they stay in business

Stephen

[Tink]

I can vouch for this.... "where ya been today"... "looking for a jacket" ... "any luck" ... "nope, no one is interested in taking my money".

Winter is coming on .... we still ride rain or shine... !

[boman]

See thread #64746472846463
One wonders how they stay in business

Stephen

I cannot find that thread, but with so many businesses struggling, especially in the motorcycle sector, you think they would crawl over broken glass for a sale.

[blackdog]

I cannot find that thread, but with so many businesses struggling, especially in the motorcycle sector, you think they would crawl over broken glass for a sale.

Absolutely. $1.15 will buy a $US by the end of the week.

[Katman]

I cannot find that thread, but with so many businesses struggling, especially in the motorcycle sector, you think they would crawl over broken glass for a sale.

You should start looking for places where the person you deal with is the business owner - instead of just an employee who really doesn't give a fuck as long as they get their wage each week.

[boman]

Absolutely. $1.15 will buy a $US by the end of the week.

Shit right now, the same jacket, in NZ is $400. Give or take a few dollars.

That jacket is $250. NZ out of USA.


But I do want to but out of NZ, for warranty reasons alone, and the ability to go back to the shop later and buy more stuff.

But it is becoming harder

[boman]

You should start looking for places where the person you deal with is the business owner - instead of just an employee who really doesn't give a fuck as long as they get their wage each week.

I used too. But unfortunately Scott sold, and the guys there now only care about Dirt...

[Genestho]

As the title says, wake up NZ retailers, there is competition out there. How many times is a person expected to get fobbed off, whilst looking for a product?

I am in the market for a new bike jacket. I know what I want, but it is no longer available.

So, what has replaced it?

Is this a too hard question to answer. It seems so. Come on. I can get an answer from a dealer in the USA, overnight, so why cannot NZ retailers be bothered to find out?

With the dollar being so strong, do they want me to go off shore?

I don't want too, but it is becoming obvious that the Auckland dealers want me too.


Am I being too harsh? All I want is someone to ask the question of the importer, and come back to me with an answer.

Look on the internet, and see if there is one you like, is NOT an answer in my book.

IF I want to look on the net, then I will buy off the net. The exhaust I bought, off shore, came within a week. To my door. And they do bike jackets, with FREE freight over $400.00.

Beat that.

But the Kiwi in me, wants to support his local economy. So I guess, watch this space.


On a side note, I was very impressed with the service at Cyclespot. Very helpful, pity I cannot say much about the rest.

Pity you're not in TGA, chap! Lindsay from Bayride is The Bomb Diggity with a solid customer base! Sounds like you need to come down for a wee pootle!

[boman]

Pity you're not in TGA, chap! Lindsay from Bayride is The Bomb Diggity with a solid customer base! Sounds like you need to come down for a wee pootle!

I seriously considered it, J. But I ran out of time this week. Too much stuff to do at home.

[Tink]

I seriously considered it, J. But I ran out of time this week. Too much stuff to do at home.

I am free Saturday? :lol::devil2::rolleyes::msn-wink::2thumbsup:spanking:

[Woodman]

groundhog day

[jellywrestler]

Shit right now, the same jacket, in NZ is $400. Give or take a few dollars.

That jacket is $250. NZ out of USA.


But I do want to but out of NZ, for warranty reasons alone, and the ability to go back to the shop later and buy more stuff.

But it is becoming harder
how will you know it fits first?

[boman]

how will you know it fits first?

Well, I already own a jacket same brand, different style. So I can safely assume that it will fit. Smaller no matter to me, if bigger eat more pies.

But that is Not my point. If I wanted to buy off shore, then I sure as hell will not go spouting off to KB land that I did so.


That would get me hung by the keyboard lynch brigade

[ktm84mxc]

Ordered a custom set of Graffix and numbers for my KTM from EBAY UK 85 pounds delivered be here next Friday ordered it Sunday . The power of the net.

[AllanB]

I like a good rant.

Two comments.

1. Just order the fucker from the States - it will be here in 10 days - if ordered local it will be 10 plus weeks ........

2. Are you 'really' looking for one in NZ so you can try it on for size and then order the correct size from the USA? tehehe

[bogan]

Shit right now, the same jacket, in NZ is $400. Give or take a few dollars.

That jacket is $250. NZ out of USA.


But I do want to but out of NZ, for warranty reasons alone, and the ability to go back to the shop later and buy more stuff.

But it is becoming harder

Don't forget the 104 customs duty for 250 bucks worth of clothing....

[t595]

Well, I already own a jacket same brand, different style. So I can safely assume that it will fit. Smaller no matter to me, if bigger eat more pies.

But that is Not my point. If I wanted to buy off shore, then I sure as hell will not go spouting off to KB land that I did so.


That would get me hung by the keyboard lynch brigade

I had something useful to say but after watching your avatar for the last 10 minutes im fucked if i know what it was:2thumbsup

[Blackbird]

Don't forget the 104 customs duty for 250 bucks worth of clothing....

Nope, just bought a jacket from the States. Cost more than that and no additional costs! Oh, and it arrived in 5 days :niceone:

[boman]

Don't forget the 104 customs duty for 250 bucks worth of clothing....

It would still be cheaper. But that is not my point.

It seems that customer service is dying a slow death, and wallowing in its own excrement.

[boman]

I had something useful to say but after watching your avatar for the last 10 minutes im fucked if i know what it was:2thumbsup

Boobies. The answer to a lot of problems, and a creator of a lot more...

[boman]

I like a good rant.

Two comments.

1. Just order the fucker from the States - it will be here in 10 days - if ordered local it will be 10 plus weeks ........

2. Are you 'really' looking for one in NZ so you can try it on for size and then order the correct size from the USA? tehehe

1. I am tempted.
2. I don't have to try on. I own the brand already, and if its an XL on the label, then its an XL. Same jacket, same factory.

[Tink]

:killingme

Fact is.. no matter what industry,... work hard, earn more...

If you happen to be looking for a job... in sales I guess boman can name a few positions that need a better salesperson... !

[BMWST?]

i dont understand,why dont you just TELL them what you want.Dont make them figure it out just tell them!

[HenryDorsetCase]

Well, I already own a jacket same brand, different style. So I can safely assume that it will fit. Smaller no matter to me, if bigger eat more pies.

But that is Not my point. If I wanted to buy off shore, then I sure as hell will not go spouting off to KB land that I did so.


That would get me hung by the keyboard lynch brigadeRevZilla have got the Roland Sands Jacket I like on spesh. Just saying

[boman]

i dont understand,why dont you just TELL them what you want.Dont make them figure it out just tell them!

I did. I want the same jacket I have on. Which they don't make anymore.

The question posed then was, what have they replaced it with. I got very little information on this question. No I will look into it. No I will ring and find out.

This was during the week, in a fairly quiet shop or three. I was given very limited information on what was available.

I worked in retail, for 15 years. If I didn't have the information at hand, I at least made an effort to find out. Whether it got a sale or not, I was at least better informed afterwards.

A gentleman in the USA, over the interweb, gave me more answers in ten minutes, than what I was given all day.

BUT I do not want to buy off shore, unless I am forced to.

[Tink]

RevZilla have got the Roland Sands Jacket I like on spesh. Just saying

Who are RevZilla (kiwi co)???? ... and is it simple... limited zips etc. I have exactly the same jacket as Boman... they are awesome, mine is a few years newer... and I appreciate why he wants another one.

[BMWST?]

I did. I want the same jacket I have on. Which they don't make anymore.

The question posed then was, what have they replaced it with. I got very little information on this question. No I will look into it. No I will ring and find out.

This was during the week, in a fairly quiet shop or three. I was given very limited information on what was available.

I worked in retail, for 15 years. If I didn't have the information at hand, I at least made an effort to find out. Whether it got a sale or not, I was at least better informed afterwards.

A gentleman in the USA, over the interweb, gave me more answers in ten minutes, than what I was given all day.

BUT I do not want to buy off shore, unless I am forced to.

well you know now.Just ask them to get one!

[bogan]

Nope, just bought a jacket from the States. Cost more than that and no additional costs! Oh, and it arrived in 5 days :niceone:

I'm not saying they get you every time, but when doing price comparisons its worth not forgetting about.