FOR SALE - Drew and Alan's sidecar build

[Drew]

Backstory.

Couple years ago, Alan and I borrowed an outfit and went down south to make up a full grid for the nationals. Had more fun than standing in a pool naked, that's teaming with guppies.

Recently we decided we should buy one together, after my wedding in February. Cool.

Sidecarbob calls me three days ago, fizzing like a kid at Christmas. Informing me that if I didn't buy this outfit right now, he'd do the stuff to my bum, that he Scrivy so enjoys having done. I don't like the sound of that much, so before I get the gory details I buy a very cheap outfit that Alan hasn't even agreed to yet.

That was Thursday night. Friday comes, and after a short day at work, I call Alan so we can come up with a workable plan to get the chair. "What are you doing today"?

"Nothing".

"Wanna go on a road trip"?

"Sweet".

I grab the trailer from TSS Red Baron. (Cheers Stu). We jump in the 'coon' uterus and head to Hastings. Dude who owned the chair didn't know we were coming, but he'd sent an email saying any time except Sundays, so I figured it'd be sweet.

We realise when we get to Hastings, that we're not gonna get a decent pub meal here, so we head to Napier in search of a good steak. I might have had us wandering around on a wild goose chase to find the right spot, but when we did, the $38 steak we had...WAS THE BEST WE'D EVER HAD! Good fuckin job too at that price!

Anyhoo, get hold of the owner at last, and head back to Hastings to grab the chair.

So here it is, back in Wellington, without a garage to put it in yet. Hehehehe. Cheers for the carport space Jimmy. Good cunt.

[Madness]

So in order to get to Hastings you aimed for Tauranga? The steering in my old XF was bad but not that bad.

[Drew]

So in order to get to Hastings you aimed for Tauranga? The steering in my old XF was bad but not that bad.Onya. Was last weekend I went there.

Fail:facepalm:

[scrivy]

Sidecarbob calls me three days ago, fizzing like a kid at Christmas.

Cause he'd just gotten a rimjob from Tracey................... probably.....:shutup:

I like the peep hole shots! Like the peep hole I have into our spare room...... :woohoo:

Geezuz H Christ!! Look at all the wiring............ Where to start.....

[Drew]

Cause he'd just gotten a rimjob from Tracey................... probably.....:shutup:

I like the peep hole shots! Like the peep hole I have into our spare room...... :woohoo:

Geezuz H Christ!! Look at all the wiring............ Where to start.....The peep hole is awesome aye! There is the remains of a starter motor in a box, that got punched by a flailing rod also.

Bike came with another motor that Chris, (the previous owner) had gotten ex USA. Came out of what must surely have been a fuckin spectacular crash. The top rear engine mount on the new power plant, has been welded back on, and the rocker cover is caved in a bit!

The wiring is a complete ZX12 loom. We could run lights and indicators if we got high enough to think it was a good idea.

[scrivy]

The wiring is a complete ZX12 loom. We could run lights and indicators if we got high enough to think it was a good idea.

Hand signals are still legal. Just use a helmet mounted led headlight.....
Get ya passenger to shine a red light out the back for brakes.....

[Drew]

Tunnel ram!

[MIXONE]

Will it be ready for Boxing Day?

[Drew]

Will it be ready for Boxing Day?Doesn't matter if it is. Wont be racing it there this year.

[Kickaha]

Tunnel ram!

Are you tall enough to see over that?

edit: So who knows the outfits history? who built it? who has owned it? previous results?

In the long run you should consider ditching the Kwaka lump and finding a GSXR, it'll most likely be lighter and have more power anyway

[nadroj]

Hand signals are still legal. Just use a helmet mounted led headlight.....
Get ya passenger to shine a red light out the back for brakes.....

The sun already shines out his arse so red leathers will suffice!

[Drew]

Are you tall enough to see over that?

edit: So who knows the outfits history? who built it? who has owned it? previous results?

In the long run you should consider ditching the Kwaka lump and finding a GSXR, it'll most likely be lighter and have more power anywaySidecarbob and Chris Lawrance kinow a bit about it. Ask those guys.

I'm told it's won the NZ title before, powered with a GSX(possiblyR)1100. Was hard to glean pertinant facts from the barrage of Steve's ramblings.

[Tony.OK]

Tunnel ram!

Jaysus!!!

Ditch that sucker for a smaller airbox n duct it into the nose somewhere perhaps?

[White trash]

Good looking machine alright. Can't wait until it's the fuck outta my carport though, and all the other bikes in the garage tbh. I just brought five more bikes home today :facepalm:

[scrivy]

I'm told it's won the NZ title before, powered with a GSX(possiblyR)1100.

It did. In 1983.........:rofl:

[Kickaha]

It did. In 1983.........:rofl:

Give us the history on it dickhead

[scrivy]

Give us the history on it dickhead

Seriously I don't know. Is it the ex Simon Vincent/Steve Puketapu sidecar?

[Kickaha]

Seriously I don't know. Is it the ex Simon Vincent/Steve Puketapu sidecar?

Like I'd be asking if I already knew :facepalm:

[scrivy]

Like I'd be asking if I already knew :facepalm:

I made the remark so that others might twig if it was..... ya muppet.... :eek5:

[scracha]

Good looking machine alright. Can't wait until it's the fuck outta my carport though, and all the other bikes in the garage tbh. I just brought five more bikes home today :facepalm:

Don't suppose Drew's mentioned having a CBR 4 and a CBR 6 in your garage soon?

[scrivy]

Your in good company with your airbox bro.....274094

[Drew]

Chair is being moved to it's new home at Alan's pad this week. Work can commence at any time, (read, January).

[White trash]

Don't suppose Drew's mentioned having a CBR 4 and a CBR 6 in your garage soon?

Like fuck they are.

[nodrog]

So is it running yet or what?

[Drew]

So is it running yet or what?NO.

Haven't put a spanner to it.

Will be at Hampton downs this weekend, spannering a couple mates solos. So expect little progress till after Christmas.

[scrivy]

So is it running yet or what?

POT/KETTLE......... :devil2:

[scrivy]

Haven't put a spanner to it.


I know what one of those is......... want my help bro...... I've got small, medium, large and fuck anything ones....

[Grumph]

I know what one of those is......... want my help bro...... I've got small, medium, large and fuck anything ones....

I had an 18 inch Crescent stolen in the pits at Wanganui in 1989.....we were pitted alongside some sidecars too....

[Drew]

I had an 18 inch Crescent stolen in the pits at Wanganui in 1989.....we were pitted alongside some sidecars too....

That'd be just big enough to undo the front axle on Scrivy's outfit too...

[nodrog]

POT/KETTLE......... :devil2:

I could ride mine tomorrow if i wanted to. (apart from the bit where i need to learn about electricity so i can wire it)

[scrivy]

I had an 18 inch Crescent stolen in the pits at Wanganui in 1989.....we were pitted alongside some sidecars too....

I wouldn't trust the fuckers either........ at least I was flying planes in Aussie then....



That'd be just big enough to undo the front axle on Scrivy's outfit too...

Just........

[Drew]

I could ride mine tomorrow if i wanted to. (apart from the bit where i need to learn about electricity so i can wire it)Oh, fuckin sweet!

Al' and I should be able to get a season of racing in, then sell our outfit, and buy the Windle before we need to worry about you getting your grubby paws on it.

[scrivy]

I could ride mine tomorrow if i wanted to. (apart from the bit where i need to learn about electricity so i can wire it)

If you're as bad at electricity as me, your bike wont be going until 2030.....

[nodrog]

Oh, fuckin sweet!

Al' and I should be able to get a season of racing in, then sell our outfit, and buy the Windle before we need to worry about you getting your grubby paws on it.

you may be too late already :shifty:




If you're as bad at electricity as me, your bike wont be going until 2030.....

yeah, but thems the brakes :eek:

[Weaver]

Well it's now moved from Jimmy's carport to my garage. Leaps and bounds.

[Drew]

Well it's now moved from Jimmy's carport to my garage. Leaps and bounds.

Good work team.

[schrodingers cat]

If you're as bad at electricity as me, your bike wont be going until 2030.....

I used to think lectrickery was white mans magic but actually it is easy. You just have to connect the pipes the right way so the smoke doesn't get out.
If you get is wrong the smoke escapes and nothing works.

So remember folks - it isn't smoke and mirrors - its all about the smoke.

[scrivy]

Good work team.

Sooooooo................. you at least put one spanner on it yet??

[Drew]

Sooooooo................. you at least put one spanner on it yet??Haven't seen the outfit, let alone worked on it since the pictures were taken.

Alan might have done some work on it. ALAN...AL...AL...ALAN...ALAN...AL...AL...AL...AL! STEVE...STEVE...STEVE...STEVE...

[Fast Eddie]

Alan might have done some work on it. ALAN...AL...AL...ALAN...ALAN...AL...AL...AL...AL! STEVE...STEVE...STEVE...STEVE...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/y4xzA3Oul1c" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

hahahhaha 10char

[Weaver]

So Drew came around this morning and we knocked this up.

[Fast Eddie]

So Drew came around this morning and we knocked this up.

yea we got one of those for agip bike too. I have remote oil tank and variety of lines and plumbing and pumps n shit too.. not on the bike tho. Got a standard sump on it.. too much effort to lower the engine an inch or two, dunno how much difference it would make.

got an airshifter too.. no idea how to wire it up and make it work!

[Drew]

That's not a dry sump Kai, it's just a shortened one with the tray enlarged to increase oil volume. Essentially, that single part just moved our build forward a month.

All we need to do is make a baffle to stop the oil sloshing away from the pickup, (I know this thanks very much to Pate), make a shorter pickup, and we're ready to remount the motor and fire it up.

Had a very good day getting a clear idea of what is to be done to get it racing, and the list is quite short indeed!

[Drew]

I'll make use of the air shifter if you don't want it.

[scrivy]

I know this thanks very much to Pate



What's duck liver got to do with it????? :crazy:

[scrivy]

I'll make use of the air shifter if you don't want it.

He doesn't mean a friggin hair dryer..........

[Kickaha]

yea we got one of those for agip bike too. I have remote oil tank and variety of lines and plumbing and pumps n shit too.. not on the bike tho. Got a standard sump on it.. too much effort to lower the engine an inch or two, dunno how much difference it would make.
Yamaha sumps are flatter so you dont really need to


I'll make use of the air shifter if you don't want it.
It's rubbish dont waste your time

[Fast Eddie]

That's not a dry sump Kai, it's just a shortened one with the tray enlarged to increase oil volume. Essentially, that single part just moved our build forward a month.
lol do you need to make a new brake pedal or seat? cause that can take years.. Ask pig n goober


Had a very good day getting a clear idea of what is to be done to get it racing, and the list is quite short indeed!
mean! my list is pretty short too!

1. put petrol in..
2. ???
3. ..win.

haven't figured out phase 2 yet.. but getting there.



What's duck liver got to do with it????? :crazy:
it had passed its expiry date so gave him mean hallucinations.


Yamaha sumps are flatter so you dont really need to
yea, I wonder if its even for the fzr motor, cause I have another spare sump in my parts bin that looks a lot like Drews did in the way that its very big/sticks out.[/QUOTE]


(Airshifter) It's rubbish dont waste your time
naw, maybe he wants to buy it off me :D

[Drew]

yea, I wonder if its even for the fzr motor, cause I have another spare sump in my parts bin that looks a lot like Drews did in the way that its very big/sticks out.FZR have a very flat bottom to the sump. The other one you have must be off a Thuderace, or some such.



naw, maybe he wants to buy it off me :DFive bucks and a half packet of crisps?

[nodrog]

.... and the list is quite short indeed!

my list was too

[Drew]

my list was tooYour list items were slightly bigger in scale.

[Fast Eddie]

FZR have a very flat bottom to the sump. The other one you have must be off a Thuderace, or some such.

makes sense, I think the bikes motor in it now is the thunderace.. I've got spare cylinders and heads n shit (from FZR and Thunderace).. all looks the same so there can't be much diff between FZR and the YZF..

I was going to buy an early R1 motor.. but it slightly made less torque (on paper) than the motor I've got in it (according to factory figures) and not really any more HP.. only advantage was 6 speed over 5. So I flagged it.

Grumph might be able to get some more grunt out of my motor if I give him the bike and some cash hehe..

And I have another gear box in the shed.. I should go count the gears on it.. might be a 6 speed box..

[Drew]

makes sense, I think the bikes motor in it now is the thunderace.. I've got spare cylinders and heads n shit (from FZR and Thunderace).. all looks the same so there can't be much diff between FZR and the YZF..

I was going to buy an early R1 motor.. but it slightly made less torque (on paper) than the motor I've got in it (according to factory figures) and not really any more HP.. only advantage was 6 speed over 5. So I flagged it.

Grumph might be able to get some more grunt out of my motor if I give him the bike and some cash hehe..

And I have another gear box in the shed.. I should go count the gears on it.. might be a 6 speed box..FZR should have plenty of grunt without fucking with it. I'm not sure why you think it's gutless unless it's fucked. It went fine when I raced against it.

[Fast Eddie]

FZR should have plenty of grunt without fucking with it. I'm not sure why you think it's gutless unless it's fucked. It went fine when I raced against it.

guess its alright, (altho nev chopped and re did the ignition leads as they were just sitting there.. so it won't have been running 100%, the exhaust has holes in it, the airbox didn't sit on it properly although does now thanks to nev.. its hardly running 100% prob better now that nev tidied it up though) can do 1.55 round puna which is about right with its prev owner. and 1.23 round hampers was our best I think..

its not too bad, but when a 600 can pull away from you in a straight line you kinda want a little more.. maybe thats just me :D

[Drew]

its not too bad, but when a 600 can pull away from you in a straight line you kinda want a little more.. maybe thats just me :DYeah, that aint right. Your outfit is a fatty, but should still monster an F2 outfit I'd have thought.

Go hyperbike powered man. No replacement for displacement!

[Fast Eddie]

Yeah, that aint right. Your outfit is a fatty, but should still monster an F2 outfit I'd have thought.

Go hyperbike powered man. No replacement for displacement!

haha, yea still a toss up on whether the spend $ on old bike.. or just save and go as modern as I can afford.

easiest way to lose weight. I sure as hell ain't going on diet myself!

[Kickaha]

Yeah, that aint right. Your outfit is a fatty, but should still monster an F2 outfit I'd have thought.

Kai, Phil and the AGIP bike probably give away 120kg + to the F2, plus Tracey/Jo have been riding a lot longer

If there is no replacement for displacement can you explain why as sidecars went to the 1000cc motors after the 1200cc limit was dropped at world level they got faster?

[Drew]

Kai, Phil and the AGIP bike probably give away 120kg + to the F2, plus Tracey/Jo have been riding a lot longer

If there is no replacement for displacement can you explain why as sidecars went to the 1000cc motors after the 1200cc limit was dropped at world level they got faster?Because gixxer thou is the only real way to go. But I don't have the wallet for that shit.

[Kickaha]

Because gixxer thou is the only real way to go. But I don't have the wallet for that shit.

Maybe but the Birchalls run an R1 and they run up the front, Tim Reeves ran a Honda and was up there to, Suzuki is just the easiest option as so many dickheads own them there's a readily avaliable supply of crashed bikes

Birchalls run an 08 R1 as apparently the crossplane doesn't work as good and even with the Suzukis most teams wouldn't run any thing later than an 08

[Drew]

Maybe but the Birchalls run an R1 and they run up the front, Tim Reeves ran a Honda and was up there to, Suzuki is just the easiest option as so many dickheads own them there's a readily avaliable supply of crashed bikes

Birchalls run an 08 R1 as apparently the crossplane doesn't work as good and even with the Suzukis most teams wouldn't run any thing later than an 08

Gixxers are strong, fast, cheap, and available. It's the correct formula to dominate a class, on sheer numbers of entrants running them alone.

The reason that teh number of us dickheads on them is higher, is because they outsell every other liter bike. The percentage will be no different.

[Fast Eddie]

Kai, Phil and the AGIP bike probably give away 120kg + to the F2, plus Tracey/Jo have been riding a lot longer

If there is no replacement for displacement can you explain why as sidecars went to the 1000cc motors after the 1200cc limit was dropped at world level they got faster?
yea, they girls recon'd they weighed in at about 100/105kg together. I came off the scale at 92.8 just before and Phil claims 77 but he's lying.. it'll be closer to 80kg ;) hehe..
Don't even wanna think weight difference in bikes. I lifted pinky front end up by myself, I think we needed 3 lads to lift up Agip front.

shes fun to ride tho! can't wait for wangas, 11 days to go..


Maybe but the Birchalls run an R1 and they run up the front, Tim Reeves ran a Honda and was up there to, Suzuki is just the easiest option as so many dickheads own them there's a readily avaliable supply of crashed bikes

Birchalls run an 08 R1 as apparently the crossplane doesn't work as good and even with the Suzukis most teams wouldn't run any thing later than an 08

Yea, Moly won on a Kawasaki motor, The hondas have a strong showing in Europe and the R1's ..

I was reading some other sidecar forum or thread where the dude was looking to go to a big bang R1 motor and most told him not to do it, go the earlier one..

[Weaver]

I came off the scale at 92.8 just before and Phil claims 77 but he's lying.. it'll be closer to 80kg

Fuckin' who ate all the pies? I'm hoping Drew will drop a kilo or ten. I've weighed 71kg for the past six years. I'll bring a set of scales to the races to try get some psycological advantage.

[tail_end_charlie]

Isnt' there a rough equation for calculating weight loss equivalent to hp increase. Like 7 lbs (3kg) lost is worth about 1 hp. Sounds like some of you lot need to sign on a lightweight swinger.......................................and rider...........................................

[Drew]

I should be under 90 before we race Al.

Won't be a problem once the bug catcher performance parts go on.

[Kickaha]

Fuckin' who ate all the pies?
Pig did,looking at the size of him I think he ate the people who baked them as well

[Drew]

EXCELLENT progress today!

Stripped the guts out of the bung motor, and by Christ is it bung! Now we've got a lump that is actually manageable, to make mounts and changes as required.

Chucked our new dummy block in and discovered that the last owner had been using a shallow sump, but just didn't have a baffle in it and still had a doglegged oil pickup. So the height of the motor is as low as it will go already. Hmmm, that'd be an issue since I could barely reach the bars. But turns out I can do something a bit different with the airbox and all becomes honky dory! Pic to come if Alan can be bothered taking some. The ones on my phone are shit.

So, the list gets shorter again!

Good work TEAM!

[scrivy]

EXCELLENT progress today!
So, the list gets shorter again!

Good work TEAM!

Good shit dude!! Why do you need an airbox?? Make do without it. More room for your T-rex arms to reach the bars.....

[nodrog]

Good shit dude!! Why do you need an airbox?? Make do without it. More room for your T-rex arms to reach the bars.....

sounds like his stomach is more of the problem

[Drew]

Good shit dude!! Why do you need an airbox?? Make do without it. More room for your T-rex arms to reach the bars.....An inlet plenum is usually a good idea on most motors, and without an airbox I'm likely to lie on the intake and have it run Gory styles.


sounds like his stomach is more of the problemFat guts or no, I can and have wired up several vehicles in my time.

[jellywrestler]

I've weighed 71kg for the past six years. try shaving your hair, most peoples hair weights fuck all but yours being Ginger weighs in a lot more, kinda like dog years to human years.

[Weaver]

Also just purchased an alloy wheel for the back, to replace the steel rim so heavy I get roid-rage lifting it in and out.

[Kickaha]

sounds like his stomach is more of the problem
Probably cause he's a tubby little fucker

Also just purchased an alloy wheel for the back, to replace the steel rim so heavy I get roid-rage lifting it in and out.
Something off the shelf with the right offset and stud pattern? did you check the weight first sometimes there's fuck all difference

[sidecar bob]

Looking at your pic, the engine seems a long way back. Front axle to crankshaft is a fairly critical mesurement on short outfits.
Pinky's is 670mm ish & the crank is at axle height give or take 10mm. Pinky has long been regarded as one of the best handling short outfits, not just in NZ.

[Kickaha]

Looking at your pic, the engine seems a long way back. Front axle to crankshaft is a fairly critical mesurement on short outfits.
Pinky's is 670mm ish & the crank is at axle height give or take 10mm. Pinky has long been regarded as one of the best handling short outfits, not just in NZ.

You'd need to compare wheelbase as well or weigh it on 3 scales and work out what percentage of weight is on each wheel

[Fast Eddie]

try shaving your hair, most peoples hair weights fuck all but yours being Ginger weighs in a lot more, kinda like dog years to human years.
hahaha

:D

[nodrog]

Looking at your pic, the engine seems a long way back. Front axle to crankshaft is a fairly critical mesurement on short outfits.
Pinky's is 670mm ish & the crank is at axle height give or take 10mm. Pinky has long been regarded as one of the best handling short outfits, not just in NZ.

no wonder tubby cant reach the steering wheel, is a long chair but some retard has put the seat in the wrong place, it was probably built in the south island.

[Kickaha]

it was probably built in the south island. Or Tauranga

[Drew]

Probably cause he's a tubby little fucker

Something off the shelf with the right offset and stud pattern? did you check the weight first sometimes there's fuck all differenceMaking our own hub thanks, the steel one is stupidly fucking heavy.


Looking at your pic, the engine seems a long way back. Front axle to crankshaft is a fairly critical mesurement on short outfits.
Pinky's is 670mm ish & the crank is at axle height give or take 10mm. Pinky has long been regarded as one of the best handling short outfits, not just in NZ.I thought the same when we put it in. Would save some hassles if we moved it forward, make th pipes a cunt though.

[Kickaha]

Making our own hub thanks, the steel one is stupidly fucking heavy.
Hub or wheel centre?

[Drew]

Hub or wheel centre?Hub I think. Drum the axle goes through, and the wheel and sproket and disk bolt to.

Single sided swingarm, front and rear to come later. We just wanna get out on the thing for now.

[scrivy]

Single sided swingarm, front and rear to come later. We just wanna get out on the thing for now.

Wouldn't waste my money on that. Extra weight, and lots of dollars..... rather buy a windle....

[Fast Eddie]

Making our own hub thanks, the steel one is stupidly fucking heavy.

I thought the same when we put it in. Would save some hassles if we moved it forward, make th pipes a cunt though.

haha, the diff between my single alloy and my steel wheels is ridiculous..

as for engine position, have a geez at the agip bike.. not sure if the engine could go any further forward its kissing the front tyre at times! we almost had to take the whole front end off to get the exhaust off to weld it.. suuuch a cunt.

the sister bike to agip had its motor moved forward I believe..

[Fast Eddie]

Wouldn't waste my money on that. Extra weight, and lots of dollars..... rather buy a windle....

yea.. its not like we do endurance races where we have to pit in and change tyres in 5 seconds flat..

[sidecar bob]

Hub I think. Drum the axle goes through, and the wheel and sproket and disk bolt to.

Single sided swingarm, front and rear to come later.

Take one good thing that shortys have & change it? Im rather fond of the front axle being supported at both ends.
Goob & pig were always bending their single sided front swingarm from memory.

[White trash]

Take one good thing that shortys have & change it? Im rather fond of the front axle being supported at both ends.
Goob & pig were always bending their single sided front swingarm from memory.

Yeah but look at the size of the cunt rolling around it!

[Drew]

More progress today.

Motor is staying where it is, measures 690mm from crank to axle at the moment, and my knowledge of geometry suggests that aside from weight distribution, there's no point moving it.

Chopped the spastic bars off, and mounted some at an angle that wont break my wrists if it gets a bit rough. And they're shiny, actual 5/8 so the controls mount proper!

Began mounting a second brake master, for a decent adjustable bias system. We'll make that shit ourselves, $128+gst is an entry fee for fuck sakes!

Started reshaping the seat body work, so it stops trying to remove my knee caps, and digging groves into my thighs. (Fat or not, I still have skinny as fuck legs for some reason. So, NO, it has nothing to do with pies)!

Tomorrow arvo will be time to start working on the motor. I'll be fashioning an oil pickup minus the 'dogleg'. I'll also have a hoon at making a baffle, with the aid of what Pate told me was required.



Question time, are any of you guys already running an outfit aware or concerned about lateral movement between headstock and swingarm, and the effects that has on the crank bearings? I mean, if the motor is a bracing element, wont any twist be having a rather nasty effect on the crank and it's bearings.

[Kickaha]

Take one good thing that shortys have & change it?
I didn't think shortys had anything good about them :whistle:


Question time, are any of you guys already running an outfit aware or concerned about lateral movement between headstock and swingarm, and the effects that has on the crank bearings? I mean, if the motor is a bracing element, wont any twist be having a rather nasty effect on the crank and it's bearings.
I'm semi convinced that's why Burt fucked so many motors

[sidecar bob]

I'm semi convinced that's why Burt fucked so many motors

Im not. In my chum Dave Moly's book, he basically said those motors seize the moment you pull them out of a solo.

[Kickaha]

Im not. In my chum Dave Moly's book, he basically said those motors seize the moment you pull them out of a solo.

What motors? he did both Blackirds and GSXR1000 and the latter are pretty hard to kill

[sidecar bob]

I didn't think shortys had anything good about them

If you ever beat us on a long bike I might take that comment with a little more than a pinch of shit.

[sidecar bob]

What motors? he did both Blackirds and GSXR1000 and the latter are pretty hard to kill

He did the worlds on a Blackbird & claimed it was a fuckin pile that ran cranks until he was tired.
Bum flipping Burt over cost a crank for sure though.

[Grumph]

More progress today.

Tomorrow arvo will be time to start working on the motor. I'll be fashioning an oil pickup minus the 'dogleg'. I'll also have a hoon at making a baffle, with the aid of what Pate told me was required.

Question time, are any of you guys already running an outfit aware or concerned about lateral movement between headstock and swingarm, and the effects that has on the crank bearings? I mean, if the motor is a bracing element, wont any twist be having a rather nasty effect on the crank and it's bearings.

As an egine builder I am concerned...I first saw this in a GSXR1100 on alky with Rob Holden riding - he worked the chassis hard enough we saw strange wear markings on the outer mains. The early 1100 chassis weren't particularly stiff and the motor was tied in pretty well so any flex showed up in the cases.
Given you have a Kawasaki I'd definitely be concerned. From the pics as far as I can see yours is different to the early ZX/ZZR series as i can't see a bolt in main bearing block so it may be better. Has it still got the Kawa drawback of one main feeding two bigends ? Nothing you can do about that. i used to put in a Mr Turbo mod of a direct oil feed to the bolt in block from the oil filter outlet via a hose and bulkhead fitting through the sump with a quill direct to that block.
Good luck with the pickup - get it wrong and it's good night nurse....I really don't like a cut sump on these. I drysumped one for a speedway chair which worked well in that application but when the motor went into a roadrace chair and things got moved round to suit it never worked as well again....

[Drew]

Sooooooo, 'she'll be right' isn't how this works? BUGGER!

Chair was built around an 1100r before the 12 went in as it turns out, so as long as the last owner didn't mess about too much with the chassis we might be good to go. (We has a short think about frame rails over the motor today. Wouldn't need to be massive to stiffen things up sufficiently).

One main oil feed, on flowing two big ends may indeed be the case. I'll have to take a closer look, but there are two small feed pipes in the sump area and I'll see where they go. Thought they were input shaft sorta zoned.

The off the shelf dry sump kit is a bit out of our price range. Perhaps Kai could have a think about selling the setup he has going begging.;)

My thinking with the oil pickup, relies on the sump volume increase being sufficient really. The low bit that's been lopped off has more than been made up for, (reckon I might get a jug of water and double check that on the morrow), but there's always a danger it's not enough.

[sidecar bob]

With a wet sump sidecar, it will either last 20 years without an issue, or it will fuck itself on the first outing. Are you a betting man?

[Kickaha]

If you ever beat us on a long bike I might take that comment with a little more than a pinch of shit.
Other people have already done that

He did the worlds on a Blackbird & claimed it was a fuckin pile that ran cranks until he was tired.
Bum flipping Burt over cost a crank for sure though.
Burt did two or three Blackbird cranks and I thought at least 2 GSXR cranks, Phil Law was the only person who had any success with the Blackbird, if it wasn't for a puncture at Teretonga he would have had a NZ title with one

[Drew]

With a wet sump sidecar, it will either last 20 years without an issue, or it will fuck itself on the first outing. Are you a betting man?I'm not in the financial position to start betting a motor.

Pate gave me some very helpfull advice about the baffle design, I'm just wondering if there might not be a few other things I can do to ensure we don't put windows in these casings like the last ones.

[Kickaha]

I'm just wondering if there might not be a few other things I can do to ensure we don't put windows in these casings like the last ones.

A dry sump kit would be a good start http://www.muzzys.com/ZX12_Dry_Sump/index.html

[Drew]

A dry sump kit would be a good start http://www.muzzys.com/ZX12_Dry_Sump/index.html
We've already looked at those. Did you notice the fuckin price? That's over half what the outfit cost.

I'll see what Kai says about selling what he's got, with a look to adapt it to the kwaka.

[Kickaha]

I dont remember the Kawasaki we ran having anything special done to it and we had the sump off that more than once, Dave ran them for a while so he'd also know what to do with it

[Drew]

I dont remember the Kawasaki we ran having anything special done to it and we had the sump off that more than once, Dave ran them for a while so he'd also know what to do with it
Can you text me his number then. Email would prolly be easier.

[sidecar bob]

We always add power up to the oil as extra insurance.
Hey, dont fret too much, I think the 'busa is the only dry sump sidecar out there.
Sometimes a new engine will turn up on the scene & a number of them will be destroyed before someone hits on the perfect sump. The '00 R6 engine was such a case.

[scrivy]

Other people have already done that
What if we brought a $150,000 short bike - would they beat us then?

Burt did two or three Blackbird cranks and I thought at least 2 GSXR cranks, Phil Law was the only person who had any success with the Blackbird, if it wasn't for a puncture at Teretonga he would have had a NZ title with one

What year was that?

[nodrog]

..... rather buy Gordie a windle....

What a top bloke :2thumbsup

[Grumph]

I'm not in the financial position to start betting a motor.

Pate gave me some very helpfull advice about the baffle design, I'm just wondering if there might not be a few other things I can do to ensure we don't put windows in these casings like the last ones.

The thing which made the earlier ZZR a hand grenade was mainly the separate bearing block for the main alongside the primary...which also fed two big ends....and was fed itself by a twisted piece of small diameter tube.
The Mr Turbo mod made the cranks last but oil surge from bad sumps then killed a few...

Yours looks from the pics to have a common rail type oil feed and no separate bearing block which should be better.
I note that overfilling may not be an option as the early 1200's were sensitive to oil level - too much and they wouldn't rev
Shouldn't worry a novice though...ride it on the torque curve.

If I had the motor I'd be checking clearances - aim for 1.6 thou mains and 1.8 thou big ends - and check the relief valve lift pressure.

[Deano]

I note that overfilling may not be an option as the early 1200's were sensitive to oil level - too much and they wouldn't rev
Shouldn't worry a novice though...ride it on the torque curve.



You're trying to tell a Mair not to thrash the shit out of it ? Bwahahahaha

He told me the optimum method of upshifting on the SV was to preload the gear lever and wait for the rev limiter.........

[Drew]

You're trying to tell a Mair not to thrash the shit out of it ? Bwahahahaha

He told me the optimum method of upshifting on the SV was to preload the gear lever and wait for the rev limiter.........
No I didn't, the SV stops making power before the limiter. On a supersport or superbike though, it's legal quickshifting. Or at least, it was before they made proper quick shifters legal.

[Drew]

The thing which made the earlier ZZR a hand grenade was mainly the separate bearing block for the main alongside the primary...which also fed two big ends....and was fed itself by a twisted piece of small diameter tube.
The Mr Turbo mod made the cranks last but oil surge from bad sumps then killed a few...

Yours looks from the pics to have a common rail type oil feed and no separate bearing block which should be better.
I note that overfilling may not be an option as the early 1200's were sensitive to oil level - too much and they wouldn't rev
Shouldn't worry a novice though...ride it on the torque curve.

If I had the motor I'd be checking clearances - aim for 1.6 thou mains and 1.8 thou big ends - and check the relief valve lift pressure.

All good info, cheers.

I'm giving some though currently, to running a remote sump as well to increase volume. Essentially that's the advantage to dry sumps anyway isn't it? Reliability of always having oil at the pickup.

[scrivy]

I'm giving some though currently, to running a remote sump as well to increase volume. Essentially that's the advantage to dry sumps anyway isn't it? Reliability of always having oil at the pickup.

My old '88 ZX10 in my old sidecar (now Gordies engine) had about a half a sump tank welded onto the left side of the main cut down sump to allow for more oil. Worked really well, and took about another litre of oil.

[Drew]

My old '88 ZX10 in my old sidecar (now Gordies engine) had about a half a sump tank welded onto the left side of the main cut down sump to allow for more oil. Worked really well, and took about another litre of oil.

Figured I wasn't being original in coming up with the extra tank idea. Just don't have space to have it welded straight to the side.

I had a slack day today. Alan started the glass on the seat though, so not all is lost.

[Deano]

No I didn't, the SV stops making power before the limiter. On a supersport or superbike though, it's legal quickshifting. Or at least, it was before they made proper quick shifters legal.

I know what you said !

[Drew]

I know what you said !I might have suggested you try it. But when I know it works, is on litre bikes.

I'll give it a hoon on teh chair too.

[Deano]

I might have suggested you try it. But when I know it works, is on litre bikes.

I'll give it a hoon on teh chair too.

I'm keen as a for a go at swinging too Mista. But if you deliberately chuck me off there'll be trouble !

[Drew]

I'm keen as a for a go at swinging too Mista. But if you deliberately chuck me off there'll be trouble !Run up the hillclimb in March?

[sidecar bob]

Run up the hillclimb in March?

2015?.....

[Deano]

Run up the hillclimb in March?

I think I'd prefer a smooth track but yeah, sounds like a plan.

[Drew]

2015?.....We've been working on the outfit you cock knocker. There are things that need to be taken into account though, that clearly weren't last time it got put on the track.

[scrivy]

There are things that need to be taken into account though, that clearly weren't last time it got put on the track.

What?? Tyre pressures, change lube, check brake pads? Fuel it up? Get powerades? Sunscreen???:yawn:

[scrivy]

Anyway, it's the end of the world in 3.5 hours - so looks like I was right - you're not gunna have ya rig on the track before I'm dead....:pinch:

[Kickaha]

What year was that? Whatever year Spike won it on the LCR, most likely around 03-05 ish, it was on the first ART long bike copy Phil built

What if we brought a $150,000 short bike - would they beat us then?
Possibly not although but I dont think any short bike built ever cost that much and you've been beaten by Adam who didn't need to spend anywhere near that and is riding a bike built in 1989

I think it's a pity World Champ and British F1 dont allow short bikes, I reckon it'd make it much more interesting

[Fast Eddie]

We've already looked at those. Did you notice the fuckin price? That's over half what the outfit cost.

I'll see what Kai says about selling what he's got, with a look to adapt it to the kwaka.

chur ill never use it bro, agip motor seems to oil itself well. however the setup is basically an oil tank and some oil lines and a modified sump and sidecover (i think) but its all for an fzr/yzf motor.. could you even use it? its homebuilt.. uv seen agip bike.. that sorta build finish and workmansh ;) haha na some of the welds are nice.




He told me the optimum method of upshifting was to preload the gear lever and wait for the rev limiter.........
... its how i do it and works.. ill put up pics when the gearbox and motor is in bits..

Run up the hillclimb in March?

yes please!

[Kickaha]

chur ill never use it bro, agip motor seems to oil itself well.
The Yamaha due to it's superior design doesn't need fancy sumps,dry sumps or any of that other shit though

[sidecar bob]

I think it's a pity World Champ and British F1 dont allow short bikes, I reckon it'd make it much more interesting

Interestingly, it was Dave Moly on Pinky with a Krauser 500 engine in it that got short outfits banned from the worlds.
as usual the long bike tossers spat the dummy when they got their arses handed to them by someone with virtually no budget.

[Drew]

chur ill never use it bro, agip motor seems to oil itself well. however the setup is basically an oil tank and some oil lines and a modified sump and sidecover (i think) but its all for an fzr/yzf motor.. could you even use it? its homebuilt.. uv seen agip bike.. that sorta build finish and workmansh ;) haha na some of the welds are nice.OK then, I thought you might have an external pump. Will just make our own.




yes please!You wanna know what way the road goes?

Six kilometers of left and right. Simple.

[Kickaha]

Interestingly, it was Dave Moly on Pinky with a Krauser 500 engine in it that got short outfits banned from the worlds.
as usual the long bike tossers spat the dummy when they got their arses handed to them by someone with virtually no budget.

I thought we'd had this discussion before and I had the year this supposedly happened on tape and there were no short bikes in it?

[Drew]

Hook me up with a copy of that tape old boy!

[Kickaha]

Hook me up with a copy of that tape old boy!

Do you still have a VCR? just got the 2012 British F1 champs as well

[Drew]

Do you still have a VCR? just got the 2012 British F1 champs as well
Jimmy and Sue have one, but the terrors might have filled it with playdough in all likelyhood.

I'm sure Kai is geek enough to convert it to DVD for us...KAI, wea tha fuck you at mofo? Oh yeah, Tauranga soaking up some sun.

[sidecar bob]

I thought we'd had this discussion before and I had the year this supposedly happened on tape and there were no short bikes in it?

For someone that claims to have read Moly's book, you are not too up with the play on its contents.

[Kickaha]

For someone that claims to have read Moly's book, you are not too up with the play on its contents.

I haven't ever claimed to have read that book, the last Sidecar book I looked at was "Sidecar Champions since 1923" if I remember to put it in my bag I'll bring it to Wangas

Good job we're filling this thread up with this crap otherwise noting would get posted in ti

[sidecar bob]

I haven't ever claimed to have read that book, the last Sidecar book I looked at was "Sidecar Champions since 1923" if I remember to put it in my bag I'll bring it to Wangas

Good job we're filling this thread up with this crap otherwise noting would get posted in ti

http://www.trademe.co.nz/books/nonfiction/sport/other/auction-545507811.htm
There ya go, buy it for yourself for Christmas you tight fisted cunt.
Youre not borrowing my personally signed copy.

[Kickaha]

http://www.trademe.co.nz/books/nonfiction/sport/other/auction-545507811.htm
There ya go, buy it for yourself for Christmas you tight fisted cunt.
Youre not borrowing my personally signed copy.

Done, I've been meaning to get it for a while

[Drew]

Good job we're filling this thread up with this crap otherwise noting would get posted in tiThis aint your sidecar build thread arsehole, where there would be a decade gap between updates.

We're working, we're motivated, and we'll have a chair going for teh Hillclimb, and possibly come to the test day before Hamsters national round, if ya don't need to enter to ride on the day.

[sidecar bob]

Done, I've been meaning to get it for a while

Good onya. There is virtually an entire chapter dedicated to
pinky, interestingly, the chapter is called "leader of the pack"

[nodrog]

Youre not borrowing my personally signed copy.

dude it doesnt count when you sign it yourself, unless you used your lefthand.

[Kickaha]

This aint your sidecar build thread arsehole, where there would be a decade gap between updates.
At least I've been racing a sidecar through pretty much all of that decade

We're working, we're motivated, and we'll have a chair going for teh Hillclimb, and possibly come to the test day before Hamsters national round, if ya don't need to enter to ride on the day.
Pretty shit choice of date as it clashes with Taupo Nationals round and you should be up doing that you pussies

[scrivy]

Pretty shit choice of date as it clashes with Taupo Nationals round and you should be up doing that you pussies

I don't agree with Kick much, but 'Here Here!!' You're onto it Kick!

[Drew]

At least I've been racing a sidecar through pretty much all of that decade

Pretty shit choice of date as it clashes with Taupo Nationals round and you should be up doing that you pussies How pray tell? Chair needs tech inspection and a new log book.

We have no idea if the motor will even work without fucking itself again, even though we are doing all that we can to avoid this.

Most importantly though, we don't want a repeat of the last time we raced nationals meetings. We would like to mix it up, and no time on the thing is not going to help there.

[Drew]

The date is unfortunate. It has always been held on the third weekend of March though, where the nats have not. So who has made the piss poor choice?

[scrivy]

How pray tell? Chair needs tech inspection and a new log book.
Piece of piss to organise.....

We have no idea if the motor will even work without fucking itself again, even though we are doing all that we can to avoid this.
Once you're married ya gotta fuck sumpin......

Most importantly though, we don't want a repeat of the last time we raced nationals meetings. We would like to mix it up, and no time on the thing is not going to help there.

FFS!!! Listen to him Kick, he's already making excuses for not being fast!! FFS!!! Where's that mongrel gone?? Oh, that's right, getting it's balls chopped in Feb.............:laugh:

[scrivy]

Possibly not although but I dont think any short bike built ever cost that much and you've been beaten by Adam who didn't need to spend anywhere near that and is riding a bike built in 1989


Yeah, but Adam is a good rider....

[jellywrestler]

The date is unfortunate. It has always been held on the third weekend of March though, where the nats have not. So who has made the piss poor choice?

Always? you've been sniffing glue again as this year, 2012, it was the 10&11 march, the SECOND weekend of march
The club changed their weekend to avoid a clash with the Nationals.

[Drew]

Always? you've been sniffing glue again as this year, 2012, it was the 10&11 march, the SECOND weekend of march
The club changed their weekend to avoid a clash with the Nationals.Well there ya go then, not always.


I'm not making excuses. We will be out there racing, but you cunts are just gonna need to fuckin wait. I have a wedding to plan...and attend, and the bike is not up to scratch yet.

[Kickaha]

We would like to mix it up, and no time on the thing is not going to help there. Yeah because you'll be in amongst it from day one on the track :lol:

Yeah, but Adam is a good rider....
So are others that have beaten you, no more than 15-20K and a good team would see you off

[Fast Eddie]

I'm sure Kai is geek enough to convert it to DVD for us...KAI, wea tha fuck you at mofo? Oh yeah, Tauranga soaking up some sun.

Yea can convert vcr to digital..

.. and yea in tga test riding sidecars in quiet neighbourhoods.. its mean :)

bikes nearly ready just gotta get brakes back.. no brakes at the mo, but rest of it looks good for wangas! yeee ha.

will chuck sm pics up tmoro

trace n s.carbob just had mrs eddie and i over at theirs for a mean feed n drinks, was a good evening
who made the sweet pasta salad? tina? trace?.. musta had gordys bukake dressing on it, was mint

[Fast Eddie]

.. and the bike is not up to scratch yet.

then scratch it..

[Drew]

Yeah because you'll be in amongst it from day one on the track :lol:

chances are pretty exponentially fuckin increased if we've ridden the thing before we race though aye.

[Drew]

then scratch it..

Nailed down the final fail safe for the oil feed last night. Just need to make some time to work on it now.

Frame rails to save the motor being a brace.

Remote res for added volume of oil.

Baffle plate in sump.

Brake bias doohicky.

Assemble.

Kick Kai's arse.

[sidecar bob]

So are others that have beaten you, no more than 15-20K and a good team would see you off
PMSL, clearly that didnt work when converted to Aussie dollars though.
I just checked the trophy again, it says "Eastern Creek. 1st place, formula 1 sidecar. 2012"
In your face bitch.
I think Pym spent $A70k on the build alone.

[Drew]

PMSL, clearly that didnt work when converted to Aussie dollars though.Everyone knows Aussies are pussies.

[Kickaha]

PMSL, clearly that didnt work when converted to Aussie dollars though.
I just checked the trophy again, it says "Eastern Creek. 1st place, formula 1 sidecar. 2012"
In your face bitch.
I think Pym spent $A70k on the build alone.


Thats because it has nothing to do with the amount of dollars spent, it is about the abilities of the guys riding it

In saying that just because someone does spend a lot of money doesn't mean they lack abilty either

[Kickaha]

Frame rails to save the motor being a brace.
Where are you putting them, across the top? around the sides? engine going to mounted to them as well?

Making our own hub thanks, the steel one is stupidly fucking heavy.
Are you going to do some before and after weights?

[Drew]

Where are you putting them, across the top? around the sides? engine going to mounted to them as well?

Gonna bring them around the sides of the motor. Would have too be quite high to clear the throttle bodies otherwise.

Front engine mounts will be soft mounted instead of solid, but still mounted to the headstock area where they are currently.

[Kickaha]

Isnt' there a rough equation for calculating weight loss equivalent to hp increase. Like 7 lbs (3kg) lost is worth about 1 hp.
Sweet, me and Gordy have gained an extra 2 HP then


Gonna bring them around the sides of the motor. Would have too be quite high to clear the throttle bodies otherwise.

Front engine mounts will be soft mounted instead of solid, but still mounted to the headstock area where they are currently.

Yeah I just looked back at how it was mounted, seems like it could have done with a couple of mounts off the bottom front of the engine if you weren't doing that

[scrivy]

Where are you putting them?
In his lunchbox...... :bleh: Where do you think he'll put them? Some new sex toy?

Are you going to do some before and after weights?
WTF?? He's going to the gym now?? He'll still be scrawny either way.... :laugh:

[Drew]

WTF?? He's going to the gym now?? He'll still be scrawny either way.... :laugh:

You're a weird guy Ace. A real weird guy.

[Kickaha]

He'll still be scrawny either way.... :laugh:

And you'll still be a cunt but it'd be an interesting comparison

Guy down here is an aircraft engineer bought an older outfit and built a single sided swingarm for it but when he weighed the thing it was heaps heavier so he didn't use it:laugh:

The swingarm systen on Gordys bike is quite good though, doublesided but still real easy to swap wheels

[Drew]

I considered making the right side of the swingarm removable. But it turns out the rear wheel is a piece of piss to take out already.

[nodrog]

Sweet, me and Gordy have gained an extra 2 HP then



have you cut your head off?

[Kickaha]

have you cut your head off?

Lot of time on the MTB in the last few weeks, although I think we might just have lost 3hp, I had a relapse and a heap of bacon sandwhiches for breakfast

[Drew]

Heineken sandwiches are where my weight comes from.

Still torn as to weather I'll be doing anything about it.

[Kickaha]

I considered making the right side of the swingarm removable. But it turns out the rear wheel is a piece of piss to take out already.

Yeah but it comes out with brakes and all that shit attached by the look of it, Gordys bike bike, brake and sprocket are all on the inside, axle nut and two cap screws and the outside of the swing arm comes off then a few nuts and the wheel is off while the brakes and sprocket stay in place on the hub

[Drew]

Yeah but it comes out with brakes and all that shit attached by the look of it, Gordys bike bike, brake and sprocket are all on the inside, axle nut and two cap screws and the outside of the swing arm comes off then a few nuts and the wheel is off while the brakes and sprocket stay in place on the hub

Brake disk and carrier just slide onto the hub. Take the axle out, lower the wheel, move the wheel left and the caliper and disc slide off a keyway and atay attached to the bike by the control arm for the brake caliper. So simple, it's fuckin briliant!

[nodrog]

Lot of time on the MTB in the last few weeks, although I think we might just have lost 3hp, I had a relapse and a heap of bacon sandwhiches for breakfast

thats ok you will lose most of that before first practice, I couldnt be arsed putting the ring gear back in, revs faster without it.

[Fast Eddie]

Kick Kai's arse.

better get practicing then bra!

should have brand new tyres (or bike) by the time your out on the track :D

and steve gave me someb tips to try setup the agip bike.

i've not touched it, i bought. it painted it and raced it (didn't whinge about it not being race ready like sooommme people... Drew.) but if i start playing with it i might even kill its understeer and get it handling even better!

bottom line.. get on the track n race it Drew bro! chop chop.. can't you just can the wedding n spend cash on racing instead? its what beaker would do

[Fast Eddie]

Brake disk and carrier just slide onto the hub. Take the axle out, lower the wheel, move the wheel left and the caliper and disc slide off a keyway and atay attached to the bike by the control arm for the brake caliper. So simple, it's fuckin briliant!

SSS all round for my bike. undo wheel nuts.. pull wheel off.. shweeeeet

[Drew]

better get practicing then bra!

should have brand new tyres (or bike) by the time your out on the track :D

and steve gave me someb tips to try setup the agip bike.

i've not touched it, i bought. it painted it and raced it (didn't whinge about it not being race ready like sooommme people... Drew.) but if i start playing with it i might even kill its understeer and get it handling even better!

bottom line.. get on the track n race it Drew bro! chop chop.. can't you just can the wedding n spend cash on racing instead? its what beaker would do

Working on maybe north Island nats rounds, but I really couldn't see it. Too fuckin expensive.

You get your chair sorted out man, or replaced, I don't want any excuses from you as to why you keep getting beaten by an inferior outfit. :laugh:

[Kickaha]

Brake disk and carrier just slide onto the hub. Take the axle out, lower the wheel, move the wheel left and the caliper and disc slide off a keyway and atay attached to the bike by the control arm for the brake caliper. So simple, it's fuckin briliant!
Sounds good, what is the front like?

and steve gave me someb tips to try setup the agip bike
What you listening to him for, ask your buddy Graeme

[Drew]

Sounds good, what is the front like?


Front is easy as he'll too. Got a dog system wheel center.

[sidecar bob]

Sounds good, what is the front like?

What you listening to him for, ask your buddy Graeme

What is wrong with it is as simple as shit. I cant believe you didnt work it out.
Clearly nobody down there has a clue about steering geometry.

[scrivy]

What is wrong with it is as simple as shit. I cant believe you didnt work it out.
Clearly nobody down there has a clue about steering geometry.

You can draw triangles with the front wheel??:shit:

[Kickaha]

What is wrong with it is as simple as shit. I cant believe you didnt work it out.
Clearly nobody down there has a clue about steering geometry.

Can't say I've ever really even looked at it, Kai didn't even start talking about it pushing the front until not long before he went North and regardless of the steering geometry it's the swingers fault anyway

So what was it?

[Drew]

What is wrong with it is as simple as shit. I cant believe you didnt work it out.
Clearly nobody down there has a clue about steering geometry.

Or nobody looked at it. Jay didn't mention understeer when he rode it, maybe something has just been bent as it's been shipped around the country.

[Weaver]

Ram air tubes. Who's got some helpful tips in regards to making some? Is there a length to diameter ratio or just make every thing fuckin' massive?

[Drew]

Ram air tubes. Who's got some helpful tips in regards to making some? Is there a length to diameter ratio or just make every thing fuckin' massive?I've been giving this some thought too. Let's see what the others have to say comparatively.

[Deano]

The ZX12 came out stock with a ram air induction set up didn't it ? Could be a start point?

[Drew]

The ZX12 came out stock with a ram air induction set up didn't it ? Could be a start point?

Prolly, but it is a lot short distance from the nose of a zx12, to the air box, than where we want our intake.

[Weaver]

From what I've read so far.
The bigger the air box the better, and at least 70mm diameter pipe. Although the length of the pipe would surly matter, which makes me think that the front right duct would be too far away.

[scrivy]

From what I've read so far.
The bigger the air box the better, and at least 70mm diameter pipe. Although the length of the pipe would surly matter, which makes me think that the front right duct would be too far away.

I've seen rigs with and without airboxes and with/without ram tubes. All sorts and some very quick rigs without ram tubes or airboxes. It's like sticking ya thumb over the end.... how much pressure build up do ya want, and how far ya wanna shoot???
I'd run without airbox and ram tubes.... I lean on the airbox - but I'd rather have it removed and lean on a frame.

[Tony.OK]

From what I've read so far.
The bigger the air box the better, and at least 70mm diameter pipe. Although the length of the pipe would surly matter, which makes me think that the front right duct would be too far away.

You'd think the length would only affect low speeds (air drag), once at pace as long as the intake is big enough to pressurise the airbox it'd be all good. Smooth internal pipe for less air resistance. Then you could play with velocity stacks to move the power curve around?

[Deano]

Diameter is more important than length isn't it ? lol

[Fast Eddie]

You get your chair sorted out man, or replaced, I don't want any excuses from you as to why you keep getting beaten by an inferior outfit. :laugh:

lol inferior.. look at all the work your doing to it!

your the one that will need the excuses why you arent beating me on a superior condition/maintained bike with larger capacity motor etc etc older, more experienced oh man.. the excuses your gonna have to come up with!! ;)

[Fast Eddie]

What you listening to him for, ask your buddy Graeme

har har



Clearly nobody down there has a clue about steering geometry.

lol.. no one shows up to race in south island in the first place so bit tricky to get advice from other racers down there..

anyway will play with setup later when we have a test day or two.

brakes are gone and cant get fluid through the lines, wish i had vacuum bottle and compressor here grrr

[Fast Eddie]

Can't say I've ever really even looked at it, Kai didn't even start talking about it pushing the front until not long before he went North..

i only got it not long before going north and wasnt riding it fast enough to slide. (edit: i also just assumed its my shit riding making it understeer lol) once we got to 1.55 it was noticeable it pushed front on right handers. Phil moving forward at hampers made a noticeable difference. anyway the old girl goes ok

in the wet it handles how i like tho front sticks back slides

[Drew]

lol inferior.. look at all the work your doing to it! your the one that will need the excuses why you arent beating me on a superior condition/maintained bike with larger capacity motor etc etc older, more experienced oh man.. the excuses your gonna have to come up with!! ;)We're getting it as good as we can, but essentially it's gonna take so much mongrel to get decent times, I might have to copy the way Scrivy and Bob's outfit turns inside out.

[sidecar bob]

Or nobody looked at it. Jay didn't mention understeer when he rode it, maybe something has just been bent as it's been shipped around the country.

Jay, it appears, just rides what was brung & makes up for mechanical inadequecay with a bottomless supply of raw talent.
The front king pin was virtually absolutely straight up & down, meaning that the tyre was turning dead flat on the ground & it was running off the outside edge, the tyre wear confirms this too.

[Kickaha]

The front king pin was virtually absolutely straight up & down, meaning that the tyre was turning dead flat on the ground & it was running off the outside edge, the tyre wear confirms this too.
That should have made it twitchy as all fuck even in a straight line as well though

[scrivy]

That should have made it twitchy as all fuck even in a straight line as well though

Twitchy????? You remember HD don't you??? It hit the wall...... couldn't control a fairly easy to recover slide....

[Kickaha]

Twitchy????? You remember HD don't you??? It hit the wall...... couldn't control a fairly easy to recover slide....
Nothing to do with it being twitchy, if it was too straight up and down it'd be all over the place even in a straight line

[scrivy]

Nothing to do with it being twitchy, if it was too straight up and down it'd be all over the place even in a straight line

I just thought that was Kai's lines....... :laugh:

[Kickaha]

I just thought that was Kai's lines....... :laugh:

What he was snorting coke as well?

[Drew]

I thought Kai's also complained that his steering was heavy as fuck. Another symptom completely at odds to zero castor.

[Fast Eddie]

Twitchy????? You remember HD don't you??? It hit the wall...... couldn't control a fairly easy to recover slide.... haha gtfo, swingers fault.


Nothing to do with it being twitchy, if it was too straight up and down it'd be all over the place even in a straight line
i can ride one handed down straights thats why i wave to everyone down puna straight at WOT, she tracks alright.


I just thought that was Kai's lines....... :laugh:
it is most of the time.


What he was snorting coke as well?
I love rails


I thought Kai's also complained that his steering was heavy as fuck. Another symptom completely at odds to zero castor.
meh ill happily never complain about bike again if brakes come back!

[Drew]

Understeer turning right, whilst on the gas, is not a set up issue. Unless weight bias is adjustable on the Agip, but things are gonna get ugly if you mount the motor on the steering stem.

[jellywrestler]

i can ride one handed down straights thats why i wave to everyone down puna straight at WOT, she tracks alright.


won't be doing that at the nats, you'll get blackflagged...

[Drew]

won't be doing that at the nats, you'll get blackflagged...
Really? Seems pretty extreem to me.

What rule states you have to have both hands on the bars, and how come that motard rider is allowed to ride if there is one?

[scrivy]

won't be doing that at the nats, you'll get blackflagged...

Is that why no-ones done the Nats lately? 'Cause you're not allowed to have fun anymore??

[Kickaha]

Understeer turning right, whilst on the gas, is not a set up issue. Unless weight bias is adjustable on the Agip, but things are gonna get ugly if you mount the motor on the steering stem.
It's understeer while turning left thats the problem

Is that why no-ones done the Nats lately? 'Cause you're not allowed to have fun anymore??
If you look at entry numbers over the last few years it's only the dicks that ride sidecars that have let the Nats down and 125Gp that are dropping off, 145 total entries for Ruapuna

[scrivy]

If you look at entry numbers over the last few years it's only the dicks that ride sidecars that have let the Nats down and 125Gp that are dropping off, 145 total entries for Ruapuna

Re-read my question Kick - Is it because you are not allowed to have fun anymore??
I race for fun - nothing else.
How many sidecars did Barry Sheene or the truck meeting at Taupo? They were just for fun too.... large numbers from memory... I think fun overrides pride anyday....

[Kickaha]

Re-read my question Kick - Is it because you are not allowed to have fun anymore??

Re read it yourself, you asked two questions the first of the two was "is that why no one does the nationals anymore", apart from the sidecar class and 125GP the numbers prove you wrong as you so often are

[scrivy]

Re read it yourself, you asked two questions the first of the two was "is that why no one does the nationals anymore", apart from the sidecar class and 125GP the numbers prove you wrong as you so often are

Dude, I don't race in any other class, so I can only talk about sidecars, and was only talking about the sidecar class! ;)
Not solo poofters...... as you implied I was.

You didn't answer the second part of the question......... :yawn:

[Kickaha]

You didn't answer the second part of the question......... :yawn:

Well I'm not sure, you started giving it a miss when you got your arse handed to you every time you went out, whats changed this year that you're doing it again ? oh thats right no one has entered that you cant beat

[scrivy]

Well I'm not sure, you started giving it a miss when you got your arse handed to you every time you went out, whats changed this year that you're doing it again ? oh thats right no one has entered that you cant beat
That I can't beat?? A few posts ago you reckon anybody on a 15k machine could whip me?? What's changed your mind? Petes costs more, Aarons costs more, windle in CHCH costs more, Farm boys costs more..........
From memory down South I did beat bum 12 races from 12. So even when I did go south I didn't get my arse handed to me as you imply.

Ummmm.... not sure why you think I give a flying fuck about winning. At the Taupo meeting I played with Adam and was faster than him, but let him past for the wins each time. Gee, I mustn't like trophies after all..... besides, Bob doesn't have a mantle piece....

As for down south this year - I dunno, ask Tracey, at the AGM 8 teams put their hands up to go south, so I went to make up more numbers - as racing with 12 is better than 6 (read 5)....... and quite frankly better value for money.
Let's just recap how many people wanted to go south when your mate bum wanted to?? errr..... next to zip.
Bum no mates fucked the nats dude, not me or teams from up north.... I go where the fun is, not the ass licking....

Another gentle reminder for you Kick, is that Bum paid people to turn up to race so he could win trophies (not 'cause he had a genuine interest in the rest of the class - infact as you know, quite the opposite)...... whereas I (and others in our class) have just helped people turn up to have fun in their sport.... for no trophy/prestige/spank ya monkey reason. I never knew Kai from a bar of soap, but have helped him for no gain to myself, but for his own enjoyment in our sport.
Oh, I've also organised the last 7+ HAGD's at a cost to me for everyone in our sport to enjoy, and those outside of our sport to enjoy. And taken my machine there to abuse. No trohies there to be had either Kick.... Just to spend $2000 each time fucking a gearbox for others to enjoy....

I'm going south to make enough numbers up for others to do the Nats. As Billy wanted our numbers up or we didn't race. Period.
I'm also doing Wangas. I absolutely hate the place. But again, to make up numbers for EVERYONE ELSE to be able to play.
Bob also gives out his BMW for others to race - what does he get out of that? He's not even in the same class!
Maybe I shouldn't go south. Would save me $1000's and I could do as Bob says - rather go to Fiji!

Does that make it a little clearer?
There's givers and takers Kick.............
Phil Sowersby is also a giver. What does he get out of it?

[Deano]

It's understeer while turning left thats the problem



Is that cause the rider is more likely to hit the wall first?


Not solo poofters......



Yet you are the ones that feel the need to ride with a 'buddy' ! Do you shower together too? (Drew would if him and Alan could both fit in the cubicle)

[scrivy]

Yet you are the ones that feel the need to ride with a 'buddy' ! Do you shower together too? (Drew would if him and Alan could both fit in the cubicle)

Are Hayden Padden & Sébastien Loeb gay too?

How else do you get the sweat off the middle of ya back?

[Kickaha]

blah, blah, blah, rantings of an angry madman
,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bull shit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit, bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bulls hit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit, bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bulls hit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,b ullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullsh it,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,bullshit,more crap with no subtance to it,more crap with no subtance to it,more crap with no subtance to it, more crap with no subtance to it

:yawn:
Sidecarbob (good cunt that he is) lets other people use his stuff because he like to see other people doing well on his gear, same reason I've lent my stuff out on several occasions and got people into other classes and paid for stuff for other people

We each do what we can :finger:

[nodrog]

cant we just all get along?

http://www.mother-ship.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/naked-gay-guys-cuddling.jpg

[scrivy]

We each do what we can :finger:

Exactly Kick. I might take the piss out of you with your racing, but I don't take the piss out of you regarding you helping other people do I?!
You seem to always like to put the boot in everytime I help others....
I can't figure that out.

The more people in our sport, the better it is for everyone. If I'm in a position to help others, I will.

[scrivy]

cant we just all get along?

http://www.mother-ship.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/naked-gay-guys-cuddling.jpg

That disturbs me Gordy..........
The fact that you had that on your hard drive......:gob:

[Drew]

From what I've heard, neither of you arseholes want to take this dick measuring contest to an actual measuring, so lets have this argument over a few drinks after Wanganui aye.

Warwick doesn't have far to fall if he gets hit, and Scrivy's back will seize up mid swing anyway.

The biggest threat would be a hernia by a spectator, laughing too hard at the idiots wincing from all the aches and pains.

[Deano]

From what I've heard, neither of you arseholes want to take this dick measuring contest to an actual measuring, so lets have this argument over a few drinks after Wanganui aye.

Warwick doesn't have far to fall if he gets hit, and Scrivy's back will seize up mid swing anyway.

The biggest threat would be a hernia by a spectator, laughing too hard at the idiots wincing from all the aches and pains.

You could finish off with a big gay sidecar team's orgy bwahaha

[Drew]

You could finish off with a big gay sidecar team's orgy bwahaha
Been drinking have we?

[Weaver]

Been drinking have we?

Just what I was going to ask.

[Deano]

Been drinking have we?

Maybe I haven't....and maybe I'm on my third beer.


Just what I was going to ask.

Oh, this from Big Gay Al after he's had a few and feeling the love right.........hahahah ;)

[Weaver]

Maybe I haven't....and maybe I'm on my third beer.

Oh, this from Big Gay Al after he's had a few and feeling the love right.........hahahah ;)

I think maybe more than three eh Deano? Perhaps breaky and lunch were Heineken sandwichs.

[Drew]

TAXI!

Just been up there to return some leathers I borrowed from him. Muther fucker was trying to gas himself in the garage, listening to the SV.

[kiwi cowboy]

From what I've heard, neither of you arseholes want to take this dick measuring contest to an actual measuring, so lets have this argument over a few drinks after Wanganui aye.

Warwick doesn't have far to fall if he gets hit, and Scrivy's back will seize up mid swing anyway.

The biggest threat would be a hernia by a spectator, laughing too hard at the idiots wincing from all the aches and pains.

:2thumbsupFunniest post on this thread goes to?.(must spread rep):nya:

[Deano]

TAXI!

Just been up there to return some leathers I borrowed from him. Muther fucker was trying to gas himself in the garage, listening to the SV.

Just reminding myself of the sound of victory! (Yeah I've had a couple of reds now!)

[Matt Bleck]

Just reminding myself of the sound of victory! (Yeah I've had a couple of reds now!)

I found your wagon bro!

http://i28.tinypic.com/2lsi0ie.jpg

[jellywrestler]

Is that why no-ones done the Nats lately? 'Cause you're not allowed to have fun anymore??

checked the stats over the last five years Scrivy, nats in most classes have grown each year

[sidecar bob]

Nothing to do with it being twitchy, if it was too straight up and down it'd be all over the place even in a straight line

Nev was shitting himself about the twitchiness just riding it down his street, Kai just thinks thats normal.
The bike has a handling problem, the bike has no castor, simple.
Hey, what the fuck would I know. As you were.

[Kickaha]

Nev was shitting himself about the twitchiness just riding it down his street, Kai just thinks thats normal.
Hey, what the fuck would I know. As you were.

Certainly didn't notice it while I've been on the side of it or when I rode it, is it adjustable? might be worth playing with

[Drew]

Does someone need a hug?

[sidecar bob]

Certainly didn't notice it while I've been on the side of it or when I rode it, is it adjustable? might be worth playing with

Its as simple as backing off two lock nuts on the top parallel arm & winding it half a turn.

[sidecar bob]

Does someone need a hug?

Does someone need teabagging? Merry Christmas ballbag.

[Kickaha]

Might not matter anyway, just got a txt saying trailer 2 has fallen through so he might not make it, anyway see you in a few hours walking out the door to go to the airport

[Drew]

Certainly didn't notice it while I've been on the side of it or when I rode it, is it adjustable? might be worth playing withI had a bit of a gander at it way back when Jay rode it, and Annan was trying to steal the brake rotor. I don't recall anything as simple as a caster rod in the classic sense, but the steering linkage was adjustable in length, and there wouldn't be a need for that if the front end couldn't be moved about.


I'm quite barred up about the system I saw on that french vid you put up. Simple and effective, and cheap and easy to get suspension for.

[sidecar bob]

I had a bit of a gander at it way back when Jay rode it, and Annan was trying to steal the brake rotor. I don't recall anything as simple as a caster rod in the classic sense, but the steering linkage was adjustable in length, and there wouldn't be a need for that if the front end couldn't be moved about.


I'm quite barred up about the system I saw on that french vid you put up. Simple and effective, and cheap and easy to get suspension for.

Yep, it runs from just above the front axle, back to the chassis parallel to the front arm, shortening it increases castor/ trail.
It spent a week at my place recently & I was also familiar with spongebobs virtually identical set up.

[Drew]

Yep, it runs from just above the front axle, back to the chassis parallel to the front arm, shortening it increases castor/ trail.
It spent a week at my place recently & I was also familiar with spongebobs virtually identical set up.My mental image thought that was the steering linkage. Shows how much attention to detail I spend.

I wasn't sure on weather or not it was polite to just go examining other peoples outfits and shit mind. Solo riders can be a bit cagey at such things, and I didn't know what all you sick cunts were like back then.

[jellywrestler]

I wasn't sure on weather or not it was polite you - polite- ha fucking ha

[scrivy]

checked the stats over the last five years Scrivy, nats in most classes have grown each year

I think there's a lack of comprehension on this site...... When I say 'no-ones done the nats', am I that stupid to imply solos too? My reference was only to sidecars - hence I said no-ones done them lately.... Forget me if I think that is easy to understand....

[scrivy]

I wasn't sure on weather or not it was polite to just go examining other peoples outfits and shit mind. Solo riders can be a bit cagey at such things, and I didn't know what all you sick cunts were like back then.

You think its alright to check out other peoples missus's........

[Drew]

You think its alright to check out other peoples missus's........

Fuck yeah. That's legit.

[scrivy]

Fuck yeah. That's legit.

Ummmm..... I'm picking you'll be racing yours way before I race mine again dude......

[Drew]

Ummmm..... I'm picking you'll be racing yours way before I race mine again dude......Better start a build thread, so we can all call you a useless cunt for not having it ready.

Lend us yer motor while you rebuild the frame aye?

[Kickaha]

Ummmm..... I'm picking you'll be racing yours way before I race mine again dude......

Only because you're so fucking hard on gear

[Drew]

Hehehe, Warwick said hardon.

[scrivy]

Hehehe, Warwick said hardon.

He only ever gets to say it though.......:pinch:

[scrivy]

Only because you're so fucking hard on gear

No, the unprotected 20 foot containers are hard on gear..........

[Kickaha]

No, the unprotected 20 foot containers are hard on gear..........

Only when some dick rides into them

[Weaver]

It was a productive day yesterday. Along with some other bits and pieces, we made up a baffle plate for the sump.

Also, an exhaust valve that came out of the blown motor.

[Grumph]

That valve looks familiar....I have a box here somewhere with 10 or so valves from a ZZR1100 which dropped a heap at a fast idle while being warmed up....it was a speedway motor which had done about 6 meetings. Turned out the early ZZR1100's had a batch of soft valves and the collets pulled through. Watch the clearances on the motor you have....

Nice baffle - but where does the oil get back down to the pickup ?

[Weaver]

Nice baffle - but where does the oil get back down to the pickup ?

We don't have the means to finish it all off yet. Namely a lathe.

Fitted the new zorst this afternoon. The one that was on it looked as though it should be on a small truck. In fact it was so overly large I'm thinking of fitting it to my Falcon.

[Drew]

Nice baffle - but where does the oil get back down to the pickup ?You'll notice there's a gap of about 5mm right around the plate, also around all of the penetrations, for oil return. Pickup is the next thing to make, but Alan isn't back at work yet to use the lathe. The pickup it came with wasless than ideal.

We should have looked through the box of bits, for the nut to go on the exhaust mount Al. I'll have one at Jimmy's pad if there isn't one there...Stupid UNF shit!

[nodrog]

throw that fuckin ceiling fan in the rubbish bin!

[Kickaha]

throw that fuckin ceiling fan in the rubbish bin!

Get the fuck back out in the garage and do your wiring

[Drew]

throw that fuckin ceiling fan in the rubbish bin!
Shrouded radiator mounts above it, I think we'll keep the fan thanks.

[nodrog]

Get the fuck back out in the garage and do your wiring

its finished


Shrouded radiator mounts above it, I think we'll keep the fan thanks.

its good for fuckall, unless you are planning on getting dinner from the kfc drive through?

[old rig]

You'll notice there's a gap of about 5mm right around the plate, also around all of the penetrations, for oil return. Pickup is the next thing to make, but Alan isn't back at work yet to use the lathe. The pickup it came with wasless than ideal.

We should have looked through the box of bits, for the nut to go on the exhaust mount Al. I'll have one at Jimmy's pad if there isn't one there...Stupid UNF shit!

the plate we made for ours fits tight around the out side and has a 40mm hole around the oil pick up with yours the oil can wash up the side and that what the plate is meant to stop hot oil is like water with a gap it wont be as good

[Drew]

the plate we made for ours fits tight around the out side and has a 40mm hole around the oil pick up with yours the oil can wash up the side and that what the plate is meant to stop hot oil is like water with a gap it wont be as good We researched it quite a bit. There is a heap of guys who use these motors in Morgan kit cars in the UK, and they all run a similar plate to us.

We've also got a fail safe system, a home made 'acusump' system.

[Weaver]

The MKII baffle. Opinions?