NZ Post - Free push bikes to come

[Murray]

2,000 jobs to be laid off - only made $167 million last year but hey - so what!!

How much profit is enough???

Understand economics but 2,000 jobs???

Can see a change of government coming!!

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/nz-post-slash-up-2000-jobs-5666515

[Paul in NZ]

Yeah its a bloody tricky one and while they made 167mil last year, revenues are dropping swiftly and costs are climbing. The board has acted like they are meant to do - like a sensible business.

Its a common trait with all traditional postal carriers globally.

Unfortunately - its also bloody hard to transition those kinds of businesses into new ways to make revenue.

[MisterD]

Can see a change of government coming!!

I've never voted National, but I might, just to say "thankyou" for the amusement generated by putting Michael Cullen in this position.

[Rhys]

2,000 jobs to be laid off - only made $167 million last year but hey - so what!!

How much profit is enough???

Understand economics but 2,000 jobs???

Can see a change of government coming!!

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/nz-post-slash-up-2000-jobs-5666515

So they should employ people just to give them a Job ?

Its a business not a charity!

[Murray]

So they should employ people just to give them a Job ?

Its a business not a charity!

Like winz, acc, doc etc etc its a Government department - They are there to provide a service which just so happened to make $167 mill last year.

Posties went onto ppm (pay per mail) last year which should be the solution to the problem - no mail no pay - however not good enough they have to take it a step further with the 3 day a week delivery.

They laid/laying off 142 workers in the Hamilton processing plant but HELLO they are creating 138 in Auckland processing (at what cost re redundencies, higher payrates in Auckland etc etc). Is that good business??

[Oscar]

2,000 jobs to be laid off - only made $167 million last year but hey - so what!!

How much profit is enough???

Understand economics but 2,000 jobs???

Can see a change of government coming!!

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/nz-post-slash-up-2000-jobs-5666515

How many letters have you posted this year?

[Maha]

Postal delivery workers are a real part of the smaller community/towns, over the last few months I have been working on our Caravan (when I can) and the postie would stop and chat about it, even get off her bike and come and have close look. We have three different posties that deliver on our street, two would be around in the morning but Jack from up the back normally cruises by sometime that suits him during the afternoon.

[98tls]

:wacko:Fuck me its bad enough now,i can get something here quicker from the states than i can from Auckland.

[rustyrobot]

How many letters have you posted this year?

And this is really the crux of it. No matter how badly I feel for the posties, and how counter-intuitive it seems to lay off people during a(n endless) financial downturn - I accept that there are just not letters being sent. They may however get jobs as couriers shifting TradeMe parcels about.

[Murray]

How many letters have you posted this year?

Company on average 80 a week

ppm system they introduced means pay per mail - i.e. staff get paid on number of items delivered. Biggest users are ezibuy, trade me , councils, etc

My point is its a government department making good money and 2,000 is a helluva a lot of jobs and especially as above systems have been introduced to reduce costs already.

[Oscar]

Postal delivery workers are a real part of the smaller community/towns, over the last few months I have been working on our Caravan (when I can) and the postie would stop and chat about it, even get off her bike and come and have close look. We have three different posties that deliver on our street, two would be around in the morning but Jack from up the back normally cruises by sometime that suits him during the afternoon.

I'd love to pop around and have a chat with you while I'm working, but I'm not sure the people that pay me would be that happy about it.
I'd also love to live in a smaller community/town but I can't afford to.

These people are paid to perform a service, not be socialworkers.

[Murray]

I'd love to pop around and have a chat with you while I'm working, but I'm not sure the people that pay me would be that happy about it.
I'd also love to live in a smaller community/town but I can't afford to.

These people are paid to perform a service, not be socialworkers.

They are on ppm - paid on what they deliver so they can take as much time as they like as long as its delivered on the day. Jeez stopping and having a chat is just so damn bad isnt it. Oscar - Grump from Sesame Street is it

[cynna]

wonder if that's on top of the 200 middle managers laid off and the 500 odd processing staff????????

[Murray]

wonder if that's on top of the 200 middle managers laid off and the 500 odd processing staff????????

I believe so

[Rhubarb]

Can see a change of government coming!!


Of course it's National's fault, isnt it.

This is a direct 'copy & paste' from the Labour Party website......
"Labour is the party of jobs. It is central to our history, and it is central to our priorities today. We have so many programs that will create and protect decent jobs for New Zealand workers."

I wonder what the CEO did for a job before NZ Post - Oh that's right, he was the Deputy Prime Minister For Labour !!!!!!!
Oh Mr Leopard, how your spots seem to have changed

BTW - All of the current politcal party's have plans and policies that I agree with and that I don't agree with. I'm not sticking up for, or putting down, any particular party here.


2,000 jobs to be laid off
More emotive headlines!
He actually said 1500 to 2000 over 3 years.
They employ around 10,000 people so many of the jobs will be cut (Cut! - another emotive term) through natural attrition e.g. people will retire, change careers, leave to have a family, go oversea's etc.
All of the same reasons that people come and go within the private sector.

It works out to be 5 to 7% of the entire workforce per annum (figures can be used so they appear to soften the news or create a hard hitting headlines. 5% = soft, 2000 = hard)

Headlines and Sound Bites never tell the full story.

Ironically the very medium that is responsible for NZ Posts demise is being used to complain or comment on NZ Posts demise - Internet and email.

Should tax payers money be spent paying Posties to walk the streets with 1/2 empty mail bags?

[IkieBikie]

More emotive headlines!
He actually said 1500 to 2000 over 3 years.
They employ around 10,000 people so many of the jobs will be cut (Cut! - another emotive term) through natural attrition e.g. people will retire, change careers, leave to have a family, go oversea's etc.
Headlines and Sound Bites never tell the full story.
Should tax payers money be spent paying Posties to walk the streets with 1/2 empty mail bags?

He actually said last week 900 up to 1000. Spokesman John Tulloch said the company had 2,200 delivery staff.

[Murray]

Should tax payers money be spent paying Posties to walk the streets with 1/2 empty mail bags?

P.P.M. (sigh)

[Oscar]

They are on ppm - paid on what they deliver so they can take as much time as they like as long as its delivered on the day. Jeez stopping and having a chat is just so damn bad isnt it. Oscar - Grump from Sesame Street is it

It doesn't matter how they're paid, if the service is economically not viable, why should it continue?

There are a bunch of people in this country who brag about small town living and the lifestyle they enjoy whilst sneering at the poor saps who have to live and work in cities. The people who whined about their hospitals, banks and post offices closing in the 80's and 90's, and talked about their "rights" to healthcare and banking services...when most of those sevices were being subsidised by the aforementioned poor saps.

Yep, I am named after the Green Bin Dweller and I'm just getting started...

[Oscar]

P.P.M. (sigh)

So when the system changed to PPM, did posties income reduce?
Should they continue in the job untill they're delivering five bits of mail a day?

You can say PPM all ya like, but it doesn't change the fact that less and less mail is being posted.

[Murray]

I'd love to pop around and have a chat with you while I'm working, but I'm not sure the people that pay me would be that happy about it.
These people are paid to perform a service, not be socialworkers.


They are on ppm - paid on what they deliver so they can take as much time as they like as long as its delivered on the day.


It doesn't matter how they're paid, if the service is economically not viable, why should it continue?


Excuse me, my middle quote (above) was aimed at your comment re stopping and having a chat and how they are paid does matter in this case - not the rest of the stuff you went on about - huff

[Murray]

So when the system changed to PPM, did posties income reduce?
Should they continue in the job untill they're delivering five bits of mail a day?

You can say PPM all ya like, but it doesn't change the fact that less and less mail is being posted.

Does it matter if they get paid for 5 bits of mail?? and yes a number of posties did lose jobs, as in the casual workforce they use to employ dried up and they got no work!

[Oscar]

Does it matter if they get paid for 5 bits of mail?? and yes a number of posties did lose jobs, as in the casual workforce they use to employ dried up and they got no work!

Er - so shouldn't PPM work for three days a week then?

[EJK]

Not as bad as 'Murica!!

http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/budget/158868-postal-service-losses-reach-39b-in-2013

[Murray]

Er - so shouldn't PPM work for three days a week then?

Thats the interesting part - suppose it depends on how much volume continues to drop and also what it evolves into as the feeling is Post will be having a lot more moped/CT110 bikes on streets instead of pedal bikes - faster delivery lower ppm rates and bigger load capacity (i.e. less staff).. Note some of the current cuts will be in replacing kiwibank/postshops with ATM's. Yeah favourite pet hate of mine going to banks etc and waiting in huge queues because "everyone" does it online now!

[Maha]

I'd love to pop around and have a chat with you while I'm working, but I'm not sure the people that pay me would be that happy about it.
I'd also love to live in a smaller community/town but I can't afford to.

These people are paid to perform a service, not be socialworkers.

Postie was on her 'smoko' break, even social workers are allowed one of them.

[cynna]

ppm system they introduced means pay per mail - i.e. staff get paid on number of items delivered..

stands for postie pay model

[SMOKEU]

I want a free push bike.

[imdying]

Pleased to see they're talking refocus on parcel delivery. That's just smart. USPS is cheap as chips and an excellent way to get your shit from the states, hopefully NZP will be as awesome.

[Gremlin]

USPS is cheap as chips and an excellent way to get your shit from the states, hopefully NZP will be as awesome.
USPS is cheap and awesome when it works. When your parcel doesn't turn up, no-one knows where it is...

As said, everyone is being emotive. 2000 is the upper range, and it's not happening by Christmas. This is going to happen over several years, when delivery volumes are expected to fall even further. As also said, there will be natural attrition during that time as well.

The company is responding now, because to react when they're in the shit is piss poor management. If run like a business, yes, they are meant to be profitable. Money isn't growing on trees.

[Tazz]

Thats the interesting part - suppose it depends on how much volume continues to drop and also what it evolves into as the feeling is Post will be having a lot more moped/CT110 bikes on streets instead of pedal bikes - faster delivery lower ppm rates and bigger load capacity (i.e. less staff).. Note some of the current cuts will be in replacing kiwibank/postshops with ATM's. Yeah favourite pet hate of mine going to banks etc and waiting in huge queues because "everyone" does it online now!

They just pulled the ATM OUT of the Kiwibank/Post Shop in Picton last year :facepalm:

Sad to see it change but if it isn't working it isn't working. I hope the prick that keeps on returning to sender my P.O. Box mail that has a valid address yet still the throws in the mail from the old owner in loses their job!

[pete376403]

Should tax payers money be spent paying Posties to walk the streets with 1/2 empty mail bags?
Tax payers money will be spent paying ex-post workers unemployment benefits.

(I guess that many posties won't have a lot of transferrable skills)

[oldrider]

Like winz, acc, doc etc etc its a Government department - They are there to provide a service which just so happened to make $167 mill last year.

Posties went onto ppm (pay per mail) last year which should be the solution to the problem - no mail no pay - however not good enough they have to take it a step further with the 3 day a week delivery.

They laid/laying off 142 workers in the Hamilton processing plant but HELLO they are creating 138 in Auckland processing (at what cost re redundencies, higher payrates in Auckland etc etc). Is that good business??

The Buses, the trains, the Post office and all the other Government services are there for everybody else but you to use!

When nobody uses them they have to close down, its just because of new and modern technology ... people prefer to use that!

Can't blame political parties for that .. blame progress .. if there was none we would all still be sitting in caves at night shivering! :cold:

[nzspokes]

Postal delivery workers are a real part of the smaller community/towns, over the last few months I have been working on our Caravan (when I can) and the postie would stop and chat about it, even get off her bike and come and have close look. We have three different posties that deliver on our street, two would be around in the morning but Jack from up the back normally cruises by sometime that suits him during the afternoon.

Interesting as there are only half a dozen runs in your village. And they have time requirements to when they should be off the run.

[nzspokes]

2,000 jobs to be laid off - only made $167 million last year but hey - so what!!

How much profit is enough???



Bikes wont be given away but recycled.

[mashman]

Tax payers money will be spent paying ex-post workers unemployment benefits.

(I guess that many posties won't have a lot of transferrable skills)

I hope they all turn to crime to feed their families.

[jasonu]

:wacko:Fuck me its bad enough now,i can get something here quicker from the states than i can from Auckland.

Yeah maybe for not much longer. The USPS are feeling the pinch too and are looking at similar cost cutting measures.

[jasonu]

USPS is cheap and awesome when it works. When your parcel doesn't turn up, no-one knows where it is....

The USPS has never lost anything of mine since I started using them 15 years ago. One package I sent via the USPS to UnZud was a month late and was found under a table in a sorting facility in Auckland...

[Ocean1]

Yeah maybe for not much longer. The USPS are feeling the pinch too and are looking at similar cost cutting measures.

Was about 8 years ago that someone did a bit of research on the supposedly instant and infallible email. The results showed that the USPS delivered >99.99% of it's mail, whereas a random selection of email showed only 99.8mumble% delivery. The conclusion was that if you wanted it delivered quick and dirty then email it, but if you wanted it sure then make with the paper.

Don't know if it still applies, my email was pretty much 100% until a couple of years ago, now I'm getting maybe just 96% due to what I suspect may be collateral damage from the corporate war over branding and access.

[98tls]

It doesn't matter how they're paid, if the service is economically not viable, why should it continue?

There are a bunch of people in this country who brag about small town living and the lifestyle they enjoy whilst sneering at the poor saps who have to live and work in cities.

Still sneering mail or no mail.Nobody has to live and work in the cities,its your choice.

[Woodman]

I hope they all turn to crime to feed their families.

:shutup::facepalm:

Mashmans new world order at work ................

[mashman]

:shutup::facepalm:

Mashmans new world order at work ................

No it isn't :bleh:. People losing their jobs through natural attrition is a none issue under the Newly Ordered World.

[Woodman]

No it isn't :bleh:. People losing their jobs through natural attrition is a none issue under the Newly Ordered World.

But you hope people who don't work to turn to crime.

[caspernz]

2,000 jobs to be laid off - only made $167 million last year but hey - so what!!

How much profit is enough???

Understand economics but 2,000 jobs???

Can see a change of government coming!!

http://tvnz.co.nz/business-news/nz-post-slash-up-2000-jobs-5666515

Ah ok, if you're gonna use numbers at least use them correctly. The snail mail business part of NZ Post is still profitable at present, but barely. The profit you mentioned is for the NZ Post group, which includes the likes of Kiwibank, CourierPost, Datamail...

In practical terms mail volumes keep going down, parcel volumes are going up. This change should have been instigated sooner, why should any business get to the point of relying on a subsidy?

But yeah, feel free to get back on your soapbox now...:facepalm:

[oldrider]

We buy things in Auckland today ... it's at our door first thing in the morning next day! (Freight free above $50.00) Courier service! :niceone:

Auckland to Otematata takes days (sometimes weeks) by fast post! :confused:

[Motu]

I'd also love to live in a smaller community/town but I can't afford to.

These people are paid to perform a service, not be socialworkers.

I thought you went to live rural close to a town with a pub and gas station?

My daughter is a Postie in this town, she is supposed to be the relief Postie, an easy number...but they work her hard, sometimes doing 2 rounds in a day, and being out on the streets after 5.00pm in winter in this town is not a good place for a girl.

Currently we have 3 runs in this town - one plan (before this Cullen bombshell) was to make it 2 runs, one day the Postie sorts, the next day delivers, thus making 3 delivery days a week, but still 6 working days. Seems a reasonable plan - cuts staff, cuts delivery days, those employed still get a full working day.

[mashman]

But you hope people who don't work to turn to crime.

So what? +chars

[Milts]

Regardless of whether this is necessary or not, it's piss poor management.

It's not hard to predict that mail is dropping off. Hence, NZ post will need fewer staff. Hence, they shouldn't have been hiring at the normal rate for the last five years. Viola! Reduced staff numbers without having to fire anyone.

On another note, the YouShop (international shipping) system run by NZ post is fantastic. They should be re-calibrating their strategy towards courier services rather than just saying 'fuck it' and throwing in the towel.

[nzspokes]

Regardless of whether this is necessary or not, it's piss poor management.

It's not hard to predict that mail is dropping off. Hence, NZ post will need fewer staff. Hence, they shouldn't have been hiring at the normal rate for the last five years. Viola! Reduced staff numbers without having to fire anyone.

On another note, the YouShop (international shipping) system run by NZ post is fantastic. They should be re-calibrating their strategy towards courier services rather than just saying 'fuck it' and throwing in the towel.

They have not been hiring much at all. Those that are there tend to stay.

[Motu]

They have not been hiring much at all. Those that are there tend to stay.

No, there have been 3 Posties retire in this town in the last 3 years, long time Posties, of those hired to replace them a couple have left already. They are not keeping up with the loses, that's why my daughters cruisey relief job has turned into a more than full time position.

[nzspokes]

No, there have been 3 Posties retire in this town in the last 3 years, long time Posties, of those hired to replace them a couple have left already. They are not keeping up with the loses, that's why my daughters cruisey relief job has turned into a more than full time position.

They have had restrictions on staff for some time. If a role is really needed then they get replaced. A lot now are on casual contracts. At least 5 years since I left.

[avgas]

I never understood why they let people go in 1,000's........surely sacking 10 a year for the last 50 years would have made more sense. Sounds like poor management to me. Paycheck to paycheck management.

[Swoop]

Regardless of whether this is necessary or not, it's piss poor management.
What else would you expect from a corporation under Michael the-fucking-retard Cullen?

After his efforts as liabour "finance (mis-management) minister" I wouldn't expect any postal deliveries in the forthcoming future.

[ckai]

Here's an interesting thought, previous business I was involved with several years again, stamps were 40c and went up to 50c. Bugger we said, but no big deal. I asked clients if they wanted invoices emailed but I was a little ahead of the industry. It was purely for a streamlining and convenience issue for me, nothing about money.

Fast forward to this new company I'm involved with and during this time, I think there's been 2 increases in stamp charges. When it hit the 70c mark we PUSHED for email invoices. We now post about 5-10% of invoices because of this. If the price stayed at say 50c, we wouldn't care that much even though cost of posting is much higher and labour intensive.

Chicken or the egg conundrum really. I have the business sense of if costs increase, streamline your business until you think there's nothing else. Then look harder. Increase charges as a very last resort. Most businesses are grossly inefficient and the first thing they do is increase charges then dabble with cost savings.

I wonder if the higher management still got bonuses over the last few years. I have a MASSIVE problem with higher management and directors laying staff off, then giving themselves a bonus. This is immoral but a lot do it. I hope this isn't the case for NZ Post. This sort of shit gives higher management in any company a bad name.