Any one have Round-up shares? [Archive] - Page 2

Honest Andy

7th August 2017, 22:34

Not just Historically. also currently as i said depending on the market the formulation changes quite often
next formulation could be back to what it was just a couple of seasons ago just like this current one.
http://msdssearch.dow.com/PublishedLiteratureDAS/dh_0960/0901b803809609ee.pdf?filepath=au/pdfs/noreg/012-10541.pdf&fromPage=GetDoc
http://www.dowagro.com/en-au/australia/news_and_resources/news_room/2017/03/grazon_extra#.WYg-dbpuLTA

Cool cool. Grazon "Extra". Different product again.

husaberg

7th August 2017, 22:49

Cool cool. Grazon "Extra". Different product again.

AS is tordon 50D, tordon brushkiller, tordon bruskiller XT, Tordon gold Tordon 2g and they are just the few i can remember off the top of my head.
AS i have said formulations change from year to year market to market.
Grazon has traditionally been a lower price point Dow product aimed at people that only buy on price rather than ecomonics of use.
looks like the last few years they have removed the picloram, likely to try and maintain the price point against the generics.

Honest Andy

8th August 2017, 07:03

AS is tordon 50D, tordon brushkiller, tordon bruskiller XT, Tordon gold Tordon 2g and they are just the few i can remember off the top of my head.
AS i have said formulations change from year to year market to market.
Grazon has traditionally been a lower price point Dow product aimed at people that only buy on price rather than ecomonics of use.
looks like the last few years they have removed the picloram, likely to try and maintain the price point against the generics.

Ok. So now you've done a bit of research you can see why I said you were wrong to say that grazon and tordon are the same.
:niceone:

husaberg

8th August 2017, 16:57

Ok. So now you've done a bit of research you can see why I said you were wrong to say that grazon and tordon are the same.
:niceone:
So lets see You claimed they were not Dow products.
You also claimed i was wrong in stating they have the same active ingredients when it seems like they have only very recently changed one version of grazon to one of the two Tordon active ingredients.
I have two words for you i will give you a hint (as you are clearly of Katmanesk intelligence) the second word is OFF

Honest Andy

8th August 2017, 17:28

So lets see You claimed they were not Dow products.
You also claimed i was wrong in stating they have the same active ingredients when it seems like they have only very recently changed one version of grazon to one of the two Tordon active ingredients.
I have two words for you i will give you a hint (as you are clearly of Katmanesk intelligence) the second word is OFF

nup. you still owe me a beer

:apint:

husaberg

8th August 2017, 17:32

nup. you still owe me a beer

:apint:

I think you would find that the yeast of your problems

Katman

8th August 2017, 19:48

nup. you still owe me a beer

Dude, you're clearly far too old for him.

Honest Andy

8th August 2017, 20:12

Dude, you're clearly far too old for him.

Now now kitty, don't get bitter, ales well that ends well

husaberg

8th August 2017, 20:24

Watch it old katman winestein should hop off. hes clearly only interested in pulling on your head for a draughty hand shandy, Andy.

Oakie

8th August 2017, 20:28

Oooh I think there's trouble brewing ...

Honest Andy

8th August 2017, 21:11

Naaahhh no-one's that sour are they? Just bored to cheers with weedspray.

husaberg

8th August 2017, 21:27

Any stout debate leaves stevo frothing at the mouth

Katman

5th November 2017, 09:10

https://s3.amazonaws.com/media.fooddemocracynow.org/images/FDN_Glyphosate_FoodTesting_Report_p2016.pdf

Kickaha

5th November 2017, 16:39

https://s3.amazonaws.com/media.fooddemocracynow.org/images/FDN_Glyphosate_FoodTesting_Report_p2016.pdf

That is quite an interesting read

Although it seems like pretty much all the links at the end of don't' work so it's hard to check the references

Katman

5th November 2017, 17:10

That is quite an interesting read

Although it seems like pretty much all the links at the end of don't' work so it's hard to check the references

They're not 'links' - they're references.

If you want to check them out you'll need to put in a little more effort than just trying to click on them.

Kickaha

5th November 2017, 17:27

They're not 'links' - they're references.

If you want to check them out you'll need to put in a little more effort than just trying to click on them.

There is a web address with each "reference", I would expect that to take me to the source material, it doesn't because they don't FUCKING work :finger:

So now I can't be arsed because it just got too hard

Katman

5th November 2017, 17:29

So now I can't be arsed because it just got too hard

No surprises there then.

Kickaha

5th November 2017, 18:42

No surprises there then.

Get fucked, I tried searching for a few of them

TheDemonLord

6th November 2017, 11:56

https://s3.amazonaws.com/media.fooddemocracynow.org/images/FDN_Glyphosate_FoodTesting_Report_p2016.pdf

It's interesting, that both the Authors work in the Organic Agricultural sector - It's almost like they have a vested, financial interest in what they are saying - which (as you are always so fond of telling us) means that we can't trust anything they say.

tri boy

7th November 2017, 05:08

Glyo is good, another glass inn keeper

Katman

11th August 2018, 16:43

https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/world/363875/monsanto-ordered-to-pay-289m-damages-to-cancer-victim

98tls

11th August 2018, 19:30

Old man used 245T or Tordon pretty much every day of his working life in my time anyway ie Solos spraying gorse,worked for him awhile when a young fella and can remember the taste of the stuff when the wind came up:wacko: that said last time i heard he is still going strong at 78,still riding to fwiw,not funny at the time but can laugh about it now i once when we were doing a job just south of Kaikoura had to get something outta the back of a Landcruiser and :brick: (didnt realize it at the time) must have knocked the tap attached to the hose which was attached to the tank:pinch: of Tordon on the back of said Landcruiser,we were all set up in the woolshed and early next morning awoke to a sea of red,not quite but thats how it felt at the time:innocent: killed everything inclusive of the pine trees around woolshed.

Kickaha

11th August 2018, 21:53

Old man used 245T or Tordon pretty much every day of his working life in my time anyway ie Solos spraying gorse

Those fuckers that worked for him used to have solo fights and spray each other with the shit

R650R

12th August 2018, 09:45

Its a bit like cigarettes I guess... some will smoke long term with no apparent ill effects aside from reduced lung capacity of some level...

Cancer is basically when your bodies repair mechanism goes haywire due to DNA corruption, essentially a massive amounts of cells are produced (tumour growth) or defective cells are produced like with some forms of leukemia.
So at some stage your DNA gets corrupted to varying levels, how bad depends on the type of exposure and what trigger elemsnts exposed to along with general overall health of your body and immune system.
Eg Cesium 137 isotope a by product of nucluear explosion is known to cause leukemia, there were huge documented cases in pacific after bomb testing there.
Now in a high dose scenario like that onset of the cancer is rapid... however thousands of km away you could ingest a minute amount of the same isotope and it lodges somewhere in your body, sitting there ticking away damaging your DNA strands, your body might cope with it or you might die from other causes before the cancer becomes apparent. Many cancers can take 20 years to fully manifest symptoms for diagnosis....

So long sotry short, yeah theres some hard buggers out there whove been exposed to stuff and survived, but it doesn't hurt to exercise caution and be safe. If you mwouldnt eat it, don't oput it on your skin, your bodies largest organ....

98tls

12th August 2018, 10:54

Those fuckers that worked for him used to have solo fights and spray each other with the shit

:yes: Yep they did,even without that you still ended up covered in the suff.We did a job on the old brickworks land in Christchurch,i was bloody young and had my first road bike ie a 500/4 Honda after finishing work took a trip up the summit road which went sour on the way back and ended up in hospital for a few weeks pretty banged up i can remember the doctor after i was all fixed up saying one of there major concerns was what they thought at the time was a rash covering my arms and legs:wacko: i had worn shorts at work that day and it was simply the red dye mixed with the Tordon.;)

russd7

12th August 2018, 15:50

:yes: Yep they did,even without that you still ended up covered in the suff.We did a job on the old brickworks land in Christchurch,i was bloody young and had my first road bike ie a 500/4 Honda after finishing work took a trip up the summit road which went sour on the way back and ended up in hospital for a few weeks pretty banged up i can remember the doctor after i was all fixed up saying one of there major concerns was what they thought at the time was a rash covering my arms and legs:wacko: i had worn shorts at work that day and it was simply the red dye mixed with the Tordon.;)

that red dye was pretty toxic shit on its own, i spent many an hour spraying with 245T early on then brushkiller and many many hours spraying ragwort with 50d, never used the dye till later years, never used masks and was normally in shorts and not much else.
i now spray coat with urethanes and epoxies and i do know that i can't be around any solvent based products for very long without wearing a good mask or i get light headed and i have always been fairly on to it as far as wearing PPE since starting to use this shit 8 yr ago.

i kinda figure that all the other shit that has built up in my system over years of not using PPE has made my body less tolerant to nasty shit. I have a young assistant and i won't let her use even clear meths without wearing a good mask.

it does piss me off when business owners don't understand appropriate PPE and simple things like the fact that a mask is a personal thing and should not be shared, masks are not a one size fits all, dust masks are in no way suitable for dust let alone chemicals and those cartridges have a very short life once taken out of the wrapper.

Oakie

12th August 2018, 17:49

'Use as directed'. Protect as directed.

Naki Rat

12th August 2018, 19:03

that red dye was pretty toxic shit on its own, i spent many an hour spraying with 245T early on then brushkiller and many many hours spraying ragwort with 50d, never used the dye till later years, never used masks and was normally in shorts and not much else.
i now spray coat with urethanes and epoxies and i do know that i can't be around any solvent based products for very long without wearing a good mask or i get light headed and i have always been fairly on to it as far as wearing PPE since starting to use this shit 8 yr ago.

i kinda figure that all the other shit that has built up in my system over years of not using PPE has made my body less tolerant to nasty shit. I have a young assistant and i won't let her use even clear meths without wearing a good mask.

it does piss me off when business owners don't understand appropriate PPE and simple things like the fact that a mask is a personal thing and should not be shared, masks are not a one size fits all, dust masks are in no way suitable for dust let alone chemicals and those cartridges have a very short life once taken out of the wrapper.Sounds like you have Multiple Chemical Sensitivity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiple_chemical_sensitivity)

We sell clothing and fabrics that amongst other qualities are certified pure and free from any chemicals. Our customer base includes individuals that are so sensitized to chemicals that they request their clothing orders to be packaged free from plastic and paper bagged inside the courier satchel so as not to be contaminated by the plasticiser off-gassing from the courier bag.

I spent a couple of summers back around 1980 spraying gorse with 245-T often being saturated by blown back spray and now have issues with diesel fumes, MSG and a few other things - linked?? Who knows for sure, but in today's safety conscious workplace I would have that doubt.

buggerit

12th August 2018, 21:22

Anyone for a roundup ready vege burger:sick:

granstar

12th August 2018, 22:08

Sounds like you have Multiple Chemical Sensitivity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiple_chemical_sensitivity)

So we can rule out Lion Red then " The most common symptoms chemical sensitivity are feeling tired, "brain fog" (short-term memory problems, difficulty concentrating), gastrointestinal problems, headaches, and muscle pain." according to wiki...

My work is with pesticides (a Certified Approved Handler), my masks by my choice are test fitted every 6 months, I log my mask use, cleaned every use, not shared, stored in a container, the filters and pre-filters get tossed every 10 hours, if they smell, or after 6 months used or not. Maybe overkill but I can think of nicer ways to decease. (After a recent talk attended on asbestos amongst N.Z's we all should be shitting, it lingers like cancer).

Often see people about spraying herbicides with paper masks, or in shorts, the SDS and labels are there to read and follow, those spray and walk away adds are a bit of a joke.

Wear your protection, condoms are cheaper than kids..

Naki Rat

13th August 2018, 15:12

....
Often see people about spraying herbicides with paper masks, or in shorts, the SDS and labels are there to read and follow, those spray and walk away adds are a bit of a joke.
Wear your protection, condoms are cheaper than kids..I spent 7 years in the Bay of Plenty owning/running a certified Organic orchard. The (non-organic) grower field days I attended in the first year or two were a lesson in the lifelong effects of spray (and sun) exposure with many of the long time orchardists exhibiting obvious health problems from both. "I've always done it that way and it's never hurt me" Yeah right!!

Interesting to note too that many in the organic community are 'born agains' following years of farming and horticulture that provided them with some pretty harsh lessons in terms of health issues for them, and in many cases their families (e.g. spray contaminated clothing into the family's washing).

russd7

13th August 2018, 18:31

I spent 7 years in the Bay of Plenty owning/running a certified Organic orchard. The (non-organic) grower field days I attended in the first year or two were a lesson in the lifelong effects of spray (and sun) exposure with many of the long time orchardists exhibiting obvious health problems from both. "I've always done it that way and it's never hurt me" Yeah right!!

Interesting to note too that many in the organic community are 'born agains' following years of farming and horticulture that provided them with some pretty harsh lessons in terms of health issues for them, and in many cases their families (e.g. spray contaminated clothing into the family's washing).

i used to shit myself when riding rural roads heading home around Te Puke and the kiwi fruit orchardists were out in their fully enclosed spray vehicles spraying that shit out over the roads for me to ride through, those mists used to stink.
as to your previous comment to me, its only solvent based products and i know it affects me so wear PPE to compensate, but as Granstar has stated i have been known to suffer from short term memory loss not attributable to Lion Red, probably had something to do with the whiskey tho but definately wasn't the gin

Naki Rat

13th August 2018, 19:22

i used to shit myself when riding rural roads heading home around Te Puke and the kiwi fruit orchardists were out in their fully enclosed spray vehicles spraying that shit out over the roads for me to ride through, those mists used to stink.
as to your previous comment to me, its only solvent based products and i know it affects me so wear PPE to compensate, but as Granstar has stated i have been known to suffer from short term memory loss not attributable to Lion Red, probably had something to do with the whiskey tho but definately wasn't the ginI was north of Tauranga and had avo's and citrus but those kiwifruit areas are being sprayed with Hi-Cane about this time of year and that shit is dangerous. One of its side effects is a fierce rash if you consume alcohol for about a week after exposure.
Bit rugged when it mucks with your ingestion of recreational chemicals :drinknsin:drinkup:

russd7

13th August 2018, 20:52

I was north of Tauranga and had avo's and citrus but those kiwifruit areas are being sprayed with Hi-Cane about this time of year and that shit is dangerous. One of its side effects is a fierce rash if you consume alcohol for about a week after exposure.
Bit rugged when it mucks with your ingestion of recreational chemicals :drinknsin:drinkup:

waqs early 80's when i was there, shifted out back of Hawera to get away from it and carried on sliding south over the years, still a red drinker and i don't drink wine, the naki days hold some awesome memories.

granstar

14th August 2018, 06:42

, probably had something to do with the whiskey tho but definately wasn't the gin

Sheesh, it was only one. :not:

Actually only started drinking Leon Rouge as a teen as everybody drank DB in those days unless you were a tough old man and drank Spigots. It was in order to stop others helping themselves to my beer from the fridge flat, no one down deep South, no one (apart from rail workers) drank red. Sundays I always had a beer where the others were knocking on back doors of pubs begging. This was all fine until a few years ago when someone from Northern territories drifted this way, but it is all good, I got less stingy in my old age (still not an imbiber of spigots -unless forced) and have concluded that if I shout beers, and hang about, I'll at least get half it back.:scooter:

Good to see in news they sending rockets to the sun, maybe they can dispose of some bad chemical, and plastics up there in future?.

jim.cox

14th August 2018, 06:53

still not an imbiber of spigots -unless forced

Hey, there is nowt wrong with Mr Speight's fine ale - and it was five cents a jug cheaper - $1.60 vs $1.65 for the other Lion and DB products

Katman

16th October 2018, 09:17

https://peerj.com/articles/5801/

Katman

16th February 2019, 09:15

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1383574218300887

Oakie

16th February 2019, 13:06

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1383574218300887

Be good if there was a 'plain English' version for duffers like me to read. Seriously ... sounds like a robust study by a fairly neutral organisation. If I had time in my life to read and understand it that would be nice. Perhaps when I retire in 7 years.

carbonhed

16th February 2019, 15:47

Be good if there was a 'plain English' version for duffers like me to read. Seriously ... sounds like a robust study by a fairly neutral organisation.

It's neither robust nor by a fairly neutral organisation.

Sorry... more reading for you.

http://www.eco-imperialism.com/keep-fraudulent-science-out-of-our-courtrooms/

Katman

16th February 2019, 15:53

Sorry... more reading for you.

Really?

A blog site?

TheDemonLord

18th February 2019, 08:25

Be good if there was a 'plain English' version for duffers like me to read. Seriously ... sounds like a robust study by a fairly neutral organisation. If I had time in my life to read and understand it that would be nice. Perhaps when I retire in 7 years.

It's a Meta-Study to start with (so no original experimental data), some of the studies they picked look to be eerily similar, with time-frames that aren't lining up with their laid-out sequence of events, using data from Sprayers and Handlers (who will invariably have an exposure far higher than the average person), this also happens to the single largest group (~55,000) with all the other studies having a very small sample size (less than 2,000 in all instances).

That's off the top of my head.