Who would be to blame? - NZ Herald crash article

[The End]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11378832


Having a look at the statistics for Motorcyclists, I see this one:


The motorcyclist lost control due to road conditions.
The road was slippery as the surface was bleeding or defective.

http://i.imgur.com/POY3BKS.png

Is there anyway the motorcyclist involved in this incident could make a claim against the local governing body in charge of roading/road safety?

Or are the local councils/road safety folks exempt from liability?

[unstuck]

Is there anyway the motorcyclist involved in this incident could make a claim against the local governing body in charge of roading/road safety?

Or are the local councils/road safety folks exempt from liability?

:killingme:killingme:killingme:killingme:killingme :killingme:killingme:killingme:killingme Fuck this place cracks me up.

[Oakie]

Ride to the conditions. Including the road conditions.

[Tazz]

Legitimate question, fully legal overseas as roading contractors/the council are paid to get it right.
I'd love to see it happen here so some of the half arse jobs they do have repercussions other than just to road users.

In that particular case the bleed doesn't look to be in a position where it can jump out at anyone though.

[Robbo]

The road is what the road is..... It will always throw different challenges at you like wet and slippery, bleeding tar, loose gravel, pot holes and corners, just to name a few.
It is your responsibility as a rider or driver to be 100% aware at all times and ride/drive to the road conditions. If you can't manage to do this and come unstuck then it is your own bloody fault.

[Tazz]

Wow if you apply the sentiment here to the 1kph over the limit thread it would be a lot shorter :lol: Essentially the same situation from that point of view, you're in control so it's your complete fault right?

Or not :laugh:


http://www.yankodesign.com/images/design_news/2010/04/04/whenyoustirtea01.jpg

[R650R]

Those reports are fairly basic but interesting. Also those images are google streetview so not necessarily as bad/good as at time of crash, not fully suitable for keyboard detectives.
I looked up a fatal truck crash of recent times and it said (among other causes) that the truck had a defective brake. This is quite common as if even one hub is out of adjustment when they check it afterwards it means the brakes are as a whole, techinically defective even if no real world drop in performance.

You would have trouble with arguing the road caused your crash unless it was a sudden failure of the tarmac like what happens around Wairakei with pumice base that causes pothole outbreaks in heavy rain. And by outbreaks I mean dozens over several hours. So you'd have to have something like that and multiple crashes, other wise if no one else is crashing how can you blame the road? (from a legal argument angle). Tar bleed is well known and a prudent driver/rider is expected to be aware of the risk, perhaps transit/ltsa could swallow their pride and put it in the roadcode as something to look out for.

BTW on of the trucking advocacy groups served an OSH notice on transit to fix certain bits of road that were causing trucks traction/safety issues. Within 24hrs by law they were required to act on the problem. In the short term this meant warning signs but eventually flowed on to the govt having to budget to fix road X as they are now all liable in chain of responsibility about a problem.

[haydes55]

Anecdote from USA. Speedway racing in the US doesn't have scrutineering at many tracks. If a car crashes because of a mechanical fault, the driver could sue the track for not ensuring their race car was safe. A lot of tracks still scrutineer over there, but with legal disclaimers etc.

What they usually never check though, is helmets being done up and correctly fastened. If they usually check a helmet is fastened and fits correctly, then forget just one, and that person has an accident. The track is liable and can be sued to oblivion.

Usually the drivers medical insurance will sue as they are the ones out of pocket from the crash.

[breakaway]

In the USA you can sue gun manufacturers for accidents arising from user negligence and sue mcdonalds when you spill hot coffee on your minge.

Not sure I'd be using their legal system to make any sort of point.

[Oakie]

Woman in the States a few years back sued a supermarket because a kid who was running up and down the aisles crashed into her and broke her leg. Yes, it was her own child.

[Tazz]

Yeah I would be avoiding US laws, they were not even slightly on my mind when I said overseas :sick:


sue mcdonalds when you spill hot coffee on your minge.

That was called for though. Was pretty shoddily (as we can expect) reported/exaggerated. She wasn't after that much (it was a days worth of earnings for hot drinks by maccas in the US and the courts call in the end). They refused to settle for less and the drink was like almost 90 degrees. 70 degrees is already a 'too hot to drink coffee'. 90 degress is melt your face (or genetials).

In summary fawk McDonalds and fawk the US :bleh:

[skippa1]

Ahhhhh the old blame game.....something bad happened to "joe" someone must be to blame as "joe" was just going about his business.

Nothing about "joe" not riding to the conditions, no personal responsibility.....just who do we blame other than "joe".....:niceone:

[bsasuper]

Is there anyway the motorcyclist involved in this incident could make a claim against the local governing body in charge of roading/road safety?

Or are the local councils/road safety folks exempt from liability?

Maybe when ACC stops covering motor vehicle accidents.

[jasonu]

In the USA you can sue gun manufacturers for accidents arising from user negligence and sue mcdonalds when you spill hot coffee on your minge.

Not sure I'd be using their legal system to make any sort of point.


Woman in the States a few years back sued a supermarket because a kid who was running up and down the aisles crashed into her and broke her leg. Yes, it was her own child.


Yeah I would be avoiding US laws, they were not even slightly on my mind when I said overseas :sick:



That was called for though. Was pretty shoddily (as we can expect) reported/exaggerated. She wasn't after that much (it was a days worth of earnings for hot drinks by maccas in the US and the courts call in the end). They refused to settle for less and the drink was like almost 90 degrees. 70 degrees is already a 'too hot to drink coffee'. 90 degress is melt your face (or genetials).

In summary fawk McDonalds and fawk the US :bleh:

Do you cunts really believe everything you see in the news?

[Tazz]

Do you cunts really believe everything you see in the news?


Was pretty shoddily (as we can expect) reported/exaggerated.

You tell me :laugh:

Think what you will but as downhill as things are slowly heading here, the US is still far worse/a shit hole by comparison.

[Milts]

That's an awesome interactive map. I wonder where they pulled the data from?
Makes for a great tool to see how accidents in your riding region happen...

[scumdog]

Do you cunts really believe everything you see in the news?

Yep, some of these guys REALLY need to visit Snopes!:rolleyes:

[awa355]

Ahhhhh the old blame game.....something bad happened to "joe" someone must be to blame as "joe" was just going about his business.

Nothing about "joe" not riding to the conditions, no personal responsibility.....just who do we blame other than "joe".....:niceone:

This garbage is just as bad. How not to think for yourself. :brick::brick:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11379122

[jasonu]

This garbage is just as bad. How not to think for yourself. :brick::brick:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11379122

Fuck me there are some soft cocks out there.
This one takes the cake

Drowsy Driver app
An educational app with tips on what to do to get home safely if you start to feel like nodding off at the wheel. The app includes a 15-minute power nap timer to help recharge the batteries before continuing on the journey.

[BigAl]

The road is what the road is..... It will always throw different challenges at you like wet and slippery, bleeding tar, loose gravel, pot holes and corners, just to name a few.
It is your responsibility as a rider or driver to be 100% aware at all times and ride/drive to the road conditions. If you can't manage to do this and come unstuck then it is your own bloody fault.

So you are saying that the road workers are not partially to blame for unsigned loose metal on the road? Surely there is a case there for negligence.

Potholes? As I know of at least 1 person who has had a payout from transit for potholes that have damaged car mags.

[Tazz]

So you are saying that the road workers are not partially to blame for unsigned loose metal on the road? Surely there is a case there for negligence.

Nahhhhhhhhh, why should they be responsible for their actions when you are covering them with yours :laugh:

[Robbo]

So you are saying that the road workers are not partially to blame for unsigned loose metal on the road? Surely there is a case there for negligence.

Potholes? As I know of at least 1 person who has had a payout from transit for potholes that have damaged car mags.

The onus is on you the road user to be observant. If you can't recognise loose metal or a pothole then you are an accident waiting to happen. Road workers can't be stationed to observe every kilometre of our roads 24/7 and a pothole can occur anywhere for many reasons as can loose metal. Have you ever heard of defensive driving/riding??

[haydes55]

The onus is on you the road user to be observant. If you can't recognise loose metal or a pothole then you are an accident waiting to happen. Road workers can't be stationed to observe every kilometre of our roads 24/7 and a pothole can occur anywhere for many reasons as can loose metal. Have you ever heard of defensive driving/riding??


I came around a corner on highway 22 a few months back, road looked perfect (nice change). Then I was in a 2 wheel slide towards the center line. The front probably drifted off line by a foot or 2 and the rear by further. But the entire road was covered in small gravel that was impossible to tell wasn't stuck down.... Until you're sliding through it. Road workers have to warn drivers of stretches of road where they have put gravel down, or sweep gravel off. It's pretty simple to do. A sign, 5 minutes with a broom, or 30 seconds with a street sweeper.

[BigAl]

Yep I agree Hayden, 22 is particularly bad and often you can't see metal down.

Contrary to what some say here, perhaps easier to see on play station games.:cool:

[corsaro128]

I got rekt pretty bad in Brisbane on my RS125 during a storm. A fuk HUGE bump the size of a big mac and about the same shape was just in the middle of the road. I went to over take a parked bus, looked over my shoulder to check behind me/ beside me and just hit it.
Visibility was low because of the rain (it was pissing)
Slid on my ass in front of like a thousand people, bike slid under the parked bus and then the bus rolled forward and flew like 4 feet in the air, with all the passengers lifting off their seats. Top lel. :headbang::headbang::headbang:

[breakaway]

Yeah I would be avoiding US laws, they were not even slightly on my mind when I said overseas :sick:

That was called for though. Was pretty shoddily (as we can expect) reported/exaggerated. She wasn't after that much (it was a days worth of earnings for hot drinks by maccas in the US and the courts call in the end). They refused to settle for less and the drink was like almost 90 degrees. 70 degrees is already a 'too hot to drink coffee'. 90 degress is melt your face (or genetials).

In summary fawk McDonalds and fawk the US :bleh:

The US has a user pays system. There's no ACC. A side effect of this is that hospitals have become for-profit entities (more than they are here) and charge extortinate fees that are not in line with reality, as in hundreds and hundreds of dollars for a bag of saline etc. It's common knowledge that when you get the bill and query it, they will knock thousands off because they have so many defaulters they are willing to 'negotiate' if it means payment vs non-payment. If you don't have medical insurance, prepare to either suck it up and live with your injury or get into soul crushing debt. This is what motivates a lot of these (what I consider to be frivolous) silly lawsuits.

She didn't deserve a dime. She fucked up by putting a cup of hot coffee inbetween her legs in her car for adding + stirring in sugar. I honestly don't think its relevant if the coffee was as warm as an old man's piss or or if it was on the verge of shifting to a plasmic state. It was her responsitibility to make sure it didn't spill on her. Yes, I am aware she initially only requested medical costs which according to wiki is $20k. That's a shit ton of money for a company to give up because someone was too stupid to keep hot liquid away from their minge. It's a drop in the bucket to a place like McD, but I can think of many food places for whom losing 20k wouldn't be. Sure theywould be insured but then the premiums would rise. Then it all just goes downhill from there.

Shit, it's not even the money that's the problem here. It's the (very dangerous) precedent it sets. The lady's win of the case above basically translated into "Do whatever the fuck you like with a product then if something goes wrong, then try bringing a law suit against the manufacturer for hundreds of thousands of dollars and everything will be fine". Or even try suing gun makers due to one person filpping out and going on a rampage. (https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=gun+manufacturers+sued&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb&gfe_rd=cr&ei=KyefVM7uEqzu8wfA-4CIBA)

This type of lawsuit has opened the doors for all sorts of friviulous lawsuits, like lazy parents whos' kids who get heart disease at age 15 due to eating mcdonalds for each meal since birth to sue the fast food chain for millions to get rich quick (which was luckily thrown out). It's one slippery slope alright.

Take some responsibility for your actions for fucks sake.

[jasonu]

The US has a user pays system. There's no ACC. A side effect of this is that hospitals have become for-profit entities (more than they are here) and charge extortinate fees that are not in line with reality, as in hundreds and hundreds of dollars for a bag of saline etc. It's common knowledge that when you get the bill and query it, they will knock thousands off because they have so many defaulters they are willing to 'negotiate' if it means payment vs non-payment. If you don't have medical insurance, prepare to either suck it up and live with your injury or get into soul crushing debt. This is what motivates a lot of these (what I consider to be frivolous) silly lawsuits.

She didn't deserve a dime. She fucked up by putting a cup of hot coffee inbetween her legs in her car for adding + stirring in sugar. I honestly don't think its relevant if the coffee was as warm as an old man's piss or or if it was on the verge of shifting to a plasmic state. It was her responsitibility to make sure it didn't spill on her. Yes, I am aware she initially only requested medical costs which according to wiki is $20k. That's a shit ton of money for a company to give up because someone was too stupid to keep hot liquid away from their minge. It's a drop in the bucket to a place like McD, but I can think of many food places for whom losing 20k wouldn't be. Sure theywould be insured but then the premiums would rise. Then it all just goes downhill from there.

Shit, it's not even the money that's the problem here. It's the (very dangerous) precedent it sets. The lady's win of the case above basically translated into "Do whatever the fuck you like with a product then if something goes wrong, then try bringing a law suit against the manufacturer for hundreds of thousands of dollars and everything will be fine". Or even try suing gun makers due to one person filpping out and going on a rampage. (https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=gun+manufacturers+sued&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb&gfe_rd=cr&ei=KyefVM7uEqzu8wfA-4CIBA)

This type of lawsuit has opened the doors for all sorts of friviulous lawsuits, like lazy parents whos' kids who get heart disease at age 15 due to eating mcdonalds for each meal since birth to sue the fast food chain for millions to get rich quick (which was luckily thrown out). It's one slippery slope alright.

Take some responsibility for your actions for fucks sake.

Best post I have read in ages.

[Tazz]

The US has a user pays system. There's no ACC. A side effect of this is that hospitals have become for-profit entities (more than they are here) and charge extortinate fees that are not in line with reality, as in hundreds and hundreds of dollars for a bag of saline etc. It's common knowledge that when you get the bill and query it, they will knock thousands off because they have so many defaulters they are willing to 'negotiate' if it means payment vs non-payment. If you don't have medical insurance, prepare to either suck it up and live with your injury or get into soul crushing debt. This is what motivates a lot of these (what I consider to be frivolous) silly lawsuits.

She didn't deserve a dime. She fucked up by putting a cup of hot coffee inbetween her legs in her car for adding + stirring in sugar. I honestly don't think its relevant if the coffee was as warm as an old man's piss or or if it was on the verge of shifting to a plasmic state. It was her responsitibility to make sure it didn't spill on her. Yes, I am aware she initially only requested medical costs which according to wiki is $20k. That's a shit ton of money for a company to give up because someone was too stupid to keep hot liquid away from their minge. It's a drop in the bucket to a place like McD, but I can think of many food places for whom losing 20k wouldn't be. Sure theywould be insured but then the premiums would rise. Then it all just goes downhill from there.

Shit, it's not even the money that's the problem here. It's the (very dangerous) precedent it sets. The lady's win of the case above basically translated into "Do whatever the fuck you like with a product then if something goes wrong, then try bringing a law suit against the manufacturer for hundreds of thousands of dollars and everything will be fine". Or even try suing gun makers due to one person filpping out and going on a rampage. (https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=gun+manufacturers+sued&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb&gfe_rd=cr&ei=KyefVM7uEqzu8wfA-4CIBA)

This type of lawsuit has opened the doors for all sorts of friviulous lawsuits, like lazy parents whos' kids who get heart disease at age 15 due to eating mcdonalds for each meal since birth to sue the fast food chain for millions to get rich quick (which was luckily thrown out). It's one slippery slope alright.

Take some responsibility for your actions for fucks sake.

Definitely agree for the most part, you don't have anyone else to blame when you cut yourself with knife that's to sharp but no doubt her risk assessment would have been different if she knew it was genital melting hot, instead of just hot.
You show a bit more respect to a carving knife over a butter knife type thing.

[AllanB]

Decades back a guy I know came off on some shingle spilled over the road on the hills. He battled the council for the repair costs based on the corner not being sign posted as a caution. Turned out the Council had had workers in the area and the spill was likely to be their care. If memory serves they contributed.

Good luck with that in Christchurch now - roads are stuffed and being poorly patched at best. Half of CHCH drivers could claim for wheel alignments due to the friggen pot holes.

[willytheekid]

Good luck with that in Christchurch now - roads are stuffed and being poorly patched at best. Half of CHCH drivers could claim for wheel alignments due to the friggen pot holes.

Yeah aye!...just blew a brand new set of headset bearings due to the ChCh "road repairs" :facepalm: (only had them put in last year!)

...one particular pot hole (RIGHT in the line of a motorcycle) is the fucker that I blame for the damage (nearly 20cm deep, over 40cm wide!...perfect for fucking up cyclists, moped's and motorcycles!:mad:...and it really hurts ya nuts!:pinch:...took em nearly 3months to re-fix! there "repaired" road<_<)

...I WISH I could send the road crew the fucking repair bill


do wish the local council would crack down on the shabby as shit repairs to roads down here...there a fucking joke!

[caseye]

Yeah aye!...just blew a brand new set of headset bearings due to the ChCh "road repairs" :facepalm: (only had them put in last year!)

...one particular pot hole (RIGHT in the line of a motorcycle) is the fucker that I blame for the damage (nearly 20cm deep, over 40cm wide!...perfect for fucking up cyclists, moped's and motorcycles!:mad:...and it really hurts ya nuts!:pinch:...took em nearly 3months to re-fix! there "repaired" road<_<)

...I WISH I could send the road crew the fucking repair bill


do wish the local council would crack down on the shabby as shit repairs to roads down here...there a fucking joke!

Since when do you need to be told about shit like this???? Aye, aye!
Just Do It!
Send the fucking council the bill, honestly mate, fuck em, it's been a long time since everything went tits up and to not have roads sorted by now is criminal to say the least.
Gentle Annie on Saturday ( after being at the Wanganui Street racing on Friday) road was absolutely dangerous!!! I say again, dangerous, tar bleed, no read, Just tar, in many corners, wet sticky and with absolutely No holding power for our sort of tyres either front or rears, we got through without any problems but we went particularly slowly. Riding to conditions is one thing, but having to ride/drive at 30 Kph at times because the road was so badly fucked up is not fun and we should send the bill for the whole day( today) it took me to properly clean both the bikes.
Otherwise though mate, have a bloody Good New Year.

[DMNTD]

..one particular pot hole (RIGHT in the line of a motorcycle) is the fucker that I blame for the damage (nearly 20cm deep, over 40cm wide!...perfect for fucking up cyclists, moped's and motorcycles!:mad:...and it really hurts ya nuts!:pinch:...took em nearly 3months to re-fix! there "repaired" road<_<)

Corner of Stanmore and Avonside?

[AllanB]

There is a rim cracker out by TaiTapu. Bet it catches all the mums off to the Raspberry Café.