The flu shot - your thoughts?

[caspernz]

So in the last 20 years or so I've had the flu shot 3 times, two consecutive years in the mid 90's and then earlier this year. Curiosity got the better of me to try it again, when following a medical check-up early this year I was more or less "talked into" having the flu shot.

As this winter is now drawing to a close, I can't help but make comparisons with the previous two winters where I've had the flu shot. With quite a comfortable margin, these 3 winters with the flu shot have seen way more off-colour days than in winters where I've gone without the flu shot?!?

Having quietly asked around within my circle on this topic, one almost can be seen as pro or con on a level that the global warming debate divides the masses... So imagine my surprise when I come across a number of folks who have had similar experiences to myself, where they feel worse off with the flu shot? Even had someone who works in the medical field laugh openly about the benefit of the flu shot, the kaching sound it makes in someones' till is about it, such was the response.

So I'm curious to hear of some good/bad experiences, after all as bikers we should be expected to be damn near as vulnerable to the flu as the elderly...

[bogan]

First point of order, the flu shot doesn't do shit against colds. So your off color days are likely more attributable to common colds and other things; perhaps the change in frequency has coincided with a change in lifestyle (food, old, fitness, temperature, exposure).

Secondly, I got the flu earlier this year (hadn't had a shot for about 5 years previously), lost week of work would pay for a good few decades worth of shots, so financially it stacks up as a preventative measure if there is even a 5% chance it'll prevent the flu. Some workplaces pay for it anyway. Just not seeing any downside to getting it.

[Big Dog]

The years it has been available free I have had it. So about 50% of the last 20 years.
Being fair I have been sick as often, sometimes longer with the jab.


So why do I still get it?
Am I that frugal I take something I don't want because it is free?
No, I get it because I generally have less days off work. A bit of a runny nose is way better than blowing liquids at both ends on a fever.

Sent from Tapatalk. DYAC

[Virago]

There' s a commonly held belief that you can get the 'flu from the 'flu jab. Wrong. You can however catch a random cold (the "Kiwi Flu") - many people like to link the two. For some reason people in this country don't like to say they have a cold - they "have the 'flu". And the 'flu jab will NOT prevent the common cold.

Having said that, you can still catch the 'flu after having the jab. With the viruses constantly mutating, along with the old strains hanging around, the vaccine is formulated for the best possible results, but it's not infallible. A few years ago both my wife and I got the swine 'flu some time after vaccination, yet it was supposedly included in the vaccine. We were really sick, but our GP assured us we actually had it quite mild - yikes.

The 'flu vaccine will NOT make you sick. You will however become autistic. ;)

[caspernz]

First point of order, the flu shot doesn't do shit against colds. So your off color days are likely more attributable to common colds and other things; perhaps the change in frequency has coincided with a change in lifestyle (food, old, fitness, temperature, exposure).

Secondly, I got the flu earlier this year (hadn't had a shot for about 5 years previously), lost week of work would pay for a good few decades worth of shots, so financially it stacks up as a preventative measure if there is even a 5% chance it'll prevent the flu. Some workplaces pay for it anyway. Just not seeing any downside to getting it.

Of course I can tell the difference between a cold and the flu. My point here is that my perception (by a comfortable margin) is that even a cold seems to take longer to recover from. Everything else being more or less equal, as in fitness/food/exposure, can't help the getting older bit though.

The theoretical part of getting the flu shot makes perfect sense, I'm just annoyed that the practical aspect is so far removed from the theory.

Oh and the cost of flu shot is irrelevant to me. Good to hear some positive responses though.

[jellywrestler]

Just not seeing any downside to getting it.

i had a big contract on a few years ago lasting about a month, working with a lot of people who weren't always up there in the healthy stakes. went and got a shot, they said after wards to stay away from people for about a week as you are much more likely to pick up the flu as your immune system is weakened trying to sort the vaccine out, pissed me off as if i'd known that i wouldn't have

[pritch]

The nurse at the my GP's surgery has been at me for sveral years but I have politely declined her kind offer. This year though she was so persistent that I told her to remind me next year.

The problem is that it's hard to find reliable information about the vaccination, conspiracy theories abound. You don't even have to leave KB to see that. It does appear though that the possibility exists that the vaccination may do very little to protect you against the particular strain of flu prevalent that year.

Anyhoo unless the GP gets a new nurse it looks like I'm getting a jab next year.

[nzspokes]

Ive had the real flu once, it fucked me up. I was in hospital for 3 days. Long time ago.

My work pays for it these days, Im first in line. Still get colds and stuff but not had the flu when taking the shots.

[bogan]

Of course I can tell the difference between a cold and the flu. My point here is that my perception (by a comfortable margin) is that even a cold seems to take longer to recover from. Everything else being more or less equal, as in fitness/food/exposure, can't help the getting older bit though.

The theoretical part of getting the flu shot makes perfect sense, I'm just annoyed that the practical aspect is so far removed from the theory.

Oh and the cost of flu shot is irrelevant to me. Good to hear some positive responses though.

I'd suggest you're erroneously attributing it to the flu shot; well unless you got the shot while you had the cold, I don't see how the two could be related.


i had a big contract on a few years ago lasting about a month, working with a lot of people who weren't always up there in the healthy stakes. went and got a shot, they said after wards to stay away from people for about a week as you are much more likely to pick up the flu as your immune system is weakened trying to sort the vaccine out, pissed me off as if i'd known that i wouldn't have

That is a bit shit, don't think I got told about that part either.

[AllanB]

I've always had one.

Meh - successive employers have paid for them.

[eldog]

Worth a shot, certainally seems to alleviate the worst effects I used to suffer

[Scuba_Steve]

My look into it (as company was giving em away free if you wanted) came back with it only having a 2 in 10 chance of working (upto 7 in 10 if you're suseptable to the flu from the start) so personally I skipped as 2/10 wasn't good enouth odds to prevent something I've never had or come close to, & I wasn't too intereted in helping create the "super flu" with unnessercery vaccinations

[Katman]

Never had one.

But that should come as no surprise to anyone.

[Blackbird]

Get 'em free every year Rob with no apparent side effects. Never used to bother but 5 years ago, I got the real 'flu and it really knocked me about. Started getting the jabs after that and whether it's pure chance or the vaccines actually working, no problems since.

[Oakie]

The flu shot is only ever for the worst 3 or 4 viruses around at the time. The ones that'll knock you over for a couple of weeks with potential to kill. It won't do anything for the minor ones. It's like having an armed guard around who can see and destroy the guy with the shotgun or carving knife who is after you but won't do anything about the guy who comes up and kicks you in the shin or calls you names.

Those flus where you feel crap for three days ... that's not what the vaccine is for.

[Berries]

The 'flu vaccine will NOT make you sick. You will however become autistic. ;)
Excellent, I like painting.

[FatMax]

Were any races of people exterminated by the same people that make the flu shot?
Does anyone have any evidence?
Ooops, wrong thread, sorry....

[R650R]

Never had it. Work in large workplace where it is available free, one guy out of two that took it in dept of about 20 people was quite off colour for few days.
Have had real flu couple times, my own immune system dealt with it ok, and prob dealt with it before other times to.

See that's one thing you never hear the medical 'industry' talk about, the measure of natural immunity. They make a big hysteria if say 10 people get chicken pox. But through various mechanisms those ten people will have exposed thousands of others before being sick enough to stay home yet it doesn't go full pandemic on us like they try to scare us.

Anyway the flu shot is made in advance at a guess of what will be the several prevalent strains six months before hand. However viruses constantly mutate, that's how we often get better as the virus mutates into weaker strain as it reproduces. There is ample evidence of various toxic additives (adjuvants) added to pad the mix out and preserve it etc, your injecting rubbish direct into your body.
A real vaccine should be administered orally like the polio used to be. The most important sentry cells that detect hostile virus and bacteria are in the mucous membrances of your mouth and throat, they then relase various enzymnes or signals to tell the white blood cells to get their shit together or similar game plan etc...

Humans and animals suruved many things for many years before the for-profit medical industry arrived....

[SVboy]

I work in a germ ridden environment and my employer pays for the shot, therefore I have it annually. I am fairly confident I have avoided any really bad flus for years, but did have a flu causing three days off work this winter. I hate any medication and avoid if possible, but I see this as the lesser of two evils, given a nasty flus potential to cause long term damage.

[Grumph]

I usually have a quarterly prescription renewal due around the start of winter. I always get offered the flu shot.
I always answer, no thanks, I've just sat in your waiting room for half an hour, pretty sure i've been exposed thanks...

Haven't had the flu for about 10 years now.

[caspernz]

I'd suggest you're erroneously attributing it to the flu shot; well unless you got the shot while you had the cold, I don't see how the two could be related.

Oh I agree with your logic, just odd how my number of days feeling like shite is way up in years with the flu jab...


I've always had one.

Meh - successive employers have paid for them.

Yeah well, it's on offer at my place of work as well, just finding a variety of responses to getting the jab, hence my initial question.


Worth a shot, certainally seems to alleviate the worst effects I used to suffer

Cool, so you're a believer then, certainly glad to hear it works nicely for some!


Get 'em free every year Rob with no apparent side effects. Never used to bother but 5 years ago, I got the real 'flu and it really knocked me about. Started getting the jabs after that and whether it's pure chance or the vaccines actually working, no problems since.

Cheers Geoff, yes I've had the real 'flu several times in Europe as a youngster, not a nice week at all...


The flu shot is only ever for the worst 3 or 4 viruses around at the time. The ones that'll knock you over for a couple of weeks with potential to kill. It won't do anything for the minor ones. It's like having an armed guard around who can see and destroy the guy with the shotgun or carving knife who is after you but won't do anything about the guy who comes up and kicks you in the shin or calls you names.

Those flus where you feel crap for three days ... that's not what the vaccine is for.

Of course, that's more or less my take on it as well. I've always wondered about the vaccine having to be based on bugs that in reality have already passed thru... So to use your bodyguard analogy, the jab would show up and shoot the bad guy after I've already copped a few slugs? Nah just joking, good to hear the variety of opinions and experiences.


Were any races of people exterminated by the same people that make the flu shot?
Does anyone have any evidence?
Ooops, wrong thread, sorry....

Oh we'll leave that angle for a day when I crack open a good bottle of single malt and smoke a cigar with a few of the bros...


Never had it. Work in large workplace where it is available free, one guy out of two that took it in dept of about 20 people was quite off colour for few days.
Have had real flu couple times, my own immune system dealt with it ok, and prob dealt with it before other times to.

See that's one thing you never hear the medical 'industry' talk about, the measure of natural immunity. They make a big hysteria if say 10 people get chicken pox. But through various mechanisms those ten people will have exposed thousands of others before being sick enough to stay home yet it doesn't go full pandemic on us like they try to scare us.

Anyway the flu shot is made in advance at a guess of what will be the several prevalent strains six months before hand. However viruses constantly mutate, that's how we often get better as the virus mutates into weaker strain as it reproduces. There is ample evidence of various toxic additives (adjuvants) added to pad the mix out and preserve it etc, your injecting rubbish direct into your body.
A real vaccine should be administered orally like the polio used to be. The most important sentry cells that detect hostile virus and bacteria are in the mucous membrances of your mouth and throat, they then relase various enzymnes or signals to tell the white blood cells to get their shit together or similar game plan etc...

Humans and animals suruved many things for many years before the for-profit medical industry arrived....

Yes Ray, natural immunity is a valid point. In order for us to build up immunity to something nasty, we first need to be exposed to it. But if we believe the flu jab propaganda then the jab achieves exactly that. Or maybe it's as simple as just giving us natural immunity to the worst of the active strains floating around at the time?

I just find it odd how the years I haven't had the flu jab I've had the distinct impression I've been better off in terms of off colour days, as illogical as this assertion may seem on the surface...


I work in a germ ridden environment and my employer pays for the shot, therefore I have it annually. I am fairly confident I have avoided any really bad flus for years, but did have a flu causing three days off work this winter. I hate any medication and avoid if possible, but I see this as the lesser of two evils, given a nasty flus potential to cause long term damage.

Yep, and on the surface your logic makes perfect sense.


Mmmm, so where does this leave me? My guess is just to keep getting the jab to boost my defences as the bank of natural immunity keeps improving...

[Akzle]

haven't injected any shit non-recreationally since i passed the age of reason.

I've been ill twice in the last decade. probably same or less for the ones preceeding.

never have the sniffles. no longer suffer migraines or headaches, and my autism is top notch.

[Virago]

Humans and animals suruved many things for many years before the for-profit medical industry arrived....

Many millions of them didn't...

[george formby]

I'm still keen on washing my hands and avoiding snotty, sneezy, people as much as possible. I reckon the jab is like hi viz, it only needs to work once to pay for itself. But meanwhile..

[Bassmatt]

Haven't read the thread, but the fact is very very few people catch actual influenza.

“[According to CDC statistics], ‘influenza and pneumonia’ took 62,034 lives in 2001—61,777 of which were attributable to pneumonia and 257 to flu, and in only 18 cases was the flu virus positively identified.”

A little more info here http://www.bmj.com/content/331/7529/1412
Plenty more on the net

So why would you bother?

[Ruahine]

Anyway the flu shot is made in advance at a guess of what will be the several prevalent strains six months before hand.

Correct.

However viruses constantly mutate, that's how we often get better as the virus mutates into weaker strain as it reproduces.

No, we get better because following infection, over time, our body is able to mount an effective immune response and clear the virus. While viruses do mutate, these are generally in the surface coat proteins to help it evade the immune system. The rate of mutation is not usually high enough to make a change in the viral strain within the time course of an individual infection.


There is ample evidence of various toxic additives (adjuvants) added to pad the mix out and preserve it etc, your injecting rubbish direct into your body.

Most vaccines contain a mixture of preservatives and antibiotics to prevent bacterial or fungal contamination. While there is a lot of emotive rubbish written about these, they are proven to be safe. Rarely some people can have allergic reactions, this is mostly around the egg proteins contained in vaccines made in eggs.

Adjuvants are added to increase the immune response to the vaccine, and so improve the efficacy of the immunisation. A commonly used adjuvant is aluminium. However most of the seasonal flu vaccines do not require adjuvants.


A real vaccine should be administered orally like the polio used to be.

Not sure what you mean by this.


The most important sentry cells that detect hostile virus and bacteria are in the mucous membrances of your mouth and throat,

This is not true. Mucosal immunity is no more "important" than any other. Your immune system works as a cohesive system. Polio was given as an oral vaccine as it was an attenuated live vaccine and polio infects through the mouth.

While the flu virus does infect through the mucosal membranes, the injected flu vaccine is either dead or is bits of the viral coat protein, it is unable to infect and is therefore not given orally. This does not mean its not a "real vaccine".

All vaccines have differing levels of effectiveness, this is not related to whether they are live or not but around their ability to induce immune memory in the patient.

FYI there is a live flu vaccine given nasally. Not sure if it is available in NZ but it has been used in the UK.

[eldog]

Not necessarily a true believer in vaccines, but it has certainly helped over the last couple of years I have had a shot compared to previous ones.

I have seen other succumb to the 'flu while i have only had relatively mild symptoms.

Yet I suffer from sinus, sniffles, runny nose, head aches as my job requires me to go from a air con office to a workshop (non air con) environment. I suffer these almost daily.

Most noticeable those who have kids of the school age who bring in all sorts of maladies and pass them on.

Surprisingly I have never had a sick day off work EVER.:yes:

Didnt realise Polio was transmitted by mouth - more research required for me.
My grandfather suffered from it and almost every other disease by the sounds of what the rellies tell me.:facepalm:

[pritch]

I think there's a basic misunderstanding of what the flu is. What it is, is serious. When there is a flu pandemic people die. Lots of them. After the end of WW1 many of the Kiwi soldiers waiting in the UK to come home became infected during the epidemic that occurred at that time and died.

As has been mentioned the WHO decides in advance which three or so strains will be included in the vaccination in any given year. If there is a different strain becomes an epidemic it may be that the vaccination will give only limited protection.

Ignoring the antibiotics, the mercury, the egg products and other additives that may cause allergic reactions, it's a shame they have to use dog kidneys. If they used sheep or cattle kidneys from animals that had been slaughtered anyway that'd be one thing, but no. Just remember when you get your jab that one of man's best friends gave his or her all so that you could have it.

[eldog]

Never knew about the dog related source......

things we take for granted never ceases to amaze me.

A few people i know recently have had pneumonia recently, i have seen the effects of double pneumonia, i really dont think they realise how close they were to not coming back.
They still carry on the way they were, no change in regime

[Ruahine]

Ignoring the antibiotics, the mercury, the egg products and other additives, it's a shame they have to use dog kidneys. If they used sheep or cattle kidneys from animals that had been slaughtered anyway that'd be one thing, but no. Just remember when you get your jab that one of man's best friends gave his or her all so that you could have it.

Some vaccines are prepared using an immortalised animal cell lines such as Madin Darby Canine Kidney cells (MDCK). While these were originally isolated from a dog kidney, the cells are grown in vitro. No further dog kidneys are needed. I think MDCK cells were isolated back in the 1950's.

So rest assured, you aren't killing a dog every time you get a vaccination.

There is a certain human cancer cell line that was isolated from a lady called Henrietta Lacks (called HeLa). While she died many years ago, scientists still use her cell line in cancer research today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Immortal_Life_of_Henrietta_Lacks

[bogan]

See that's one thing you never hear the medical 'industry' talk about, the measure of natural immunity. They make a big hysteria if say 10 people get chicken pox. But through various mechanisms those ten people will have exposed thousands of others before being sick enough to stay home yet it doesn't go full pandemic on us like they try to scare us.

Really? in both cases they talk about the jab consisting of an attenuated virus to increase our immunity to it, above that of natural levels.

As for those ten people, a big deal should be made, herd immunity is of immense benefit. Given how outbreaks work, the difference between a localised grouping of ten, and a pandemic, is not is large as the numbers alone would suggest.

[Virago]

Just remember when you get your jab that one of man's best friends gave his or her all so that you could have it.

:laugh: .

[YellowDog]

The missus has the flu jab every year. 3 weeks ago she got the flu and stopped breathing. Luckily, she was already at the doctor's surgery. They shat themselves, big style, but it was OK.

There are too many strains of the flu going around to make the flu jab worthwhile :o

[mada]

https://vimeo.com/160832061

[Mike.Gayner]

The missus has the flu jab every year. 3 weeks ago she got the flu and stopped breathing. Luckily, she was already at the doctor's surgery. They shat themselves, big style, but it was OK.

There are too many strains of the flu going around to make the flu jab worthwhile :o

Your logic is that if you cannot stop every strain of every disease then prophylactic treatment isn't "worthwhile"?

There are some true retards on this forum.

[jasonu]

Your logic is that if you cannot stop every strain of every disease then prophylactic treatment isn't "worthwhile"?

There are some true retards on this forum.

That's fucking rich coming from you.

[rocketman1]

I had a free flu shot back in 2001, I was so crook afterwards I swore I will never have another one.
A work colleague went down the same.
I spoke to my Doctor he said that the same thing had happened to him. He said never again.
I was told by another doctor that there is some evidence that some other diseases are being connected with those that have had flu jabs regularly.
Watch this space.
I have not had a real bad flu for years, I use Vitamin C & D supplements everyday, some of those around me have had bad flu, luckily not me. Touch wood.

[Paul in NZ]

I'm a type 1 diabetic... That's something that never flies alone so there are a few other things as well...

A cold this year turned into an infection and won me a trip in an ambulance to ED and a hospital visit. I've had the flu and it stuffed me up rather badly so I have a shot every year. Its never made me ill and it usually works although you do need to realise it is constructed in advance so they guess which strains will be about.

Vicki was kinda 'meh' about the shots - she got the flu 2 years back - it went to pneumonia and it came as close to killing her as you ever want to go. ie coming to in you bed surrounded by the full on crash team, every expensive machine that goes 'bing' and a man with a huge syringe full of adrenaline that was going into her heart shortly.. Shes had one ever since...

[avgas]

The flu vaccine is at terrible attempt of fixing the problem.
The vaccine only contains the easiest and least lethal strains of the virus. Most only get a vaccine that covers one or 2 strains because the other vaccine is very expensive.

It also infects the host with the virus and lets the body fights it off. The is very similar to just getting the virus itself. This is good if you are young and weak as the virus is localized and downgraded, and the body can fight it easier and be prepared. For the rest of us you are middle aged and healthy - all your doing is beating up your body, before the main fight. As the main fight is almost guaranteed to be a different strain, making your vaccine useless.

I'm not against vaccine's - just wasting of resources. When it covers at least 50% of the strains, then we stand a chance. Until then only the young and weak/old - who fear the strains of flu that the vaccine covers should consider it compulsory.
The rest of us will have to build our own immunity, and fear the things that all things fear - a new virus from a bird, pig, monkey or flying fox / bat.

Terrifying when you consider that if that Fly Foxes have dozens of viruses that would wipe humans out - but these viruses can't jump species......yet

[Ruahine]

The flu vaccine is at terrible attempt of fixing the problem.
The vaccine only contains the easiest and least lethal strains of the virus. Most only get a vaccine that covers one or 2 strains because the other vaccine is very expensive.


Not true.

There are 4 types of influenza virus, of these, Group A and B cause the most damaging symptoms in Humans.

Group C influenza is the "easiest and least lethal strain", usually causing only mild respiratory symptoms. Strains from this class are not covered in seasonal flu vaccines as they are not considered likely to cause epidemics.

Group D influenza do not cause disease in humans.

The current (2016) seasonal flu vaccine covers three strains - two from the A Group (H1N1 California, H3N2 - Hong Kong Virus) and one is from the B group (B60 Brisbane). There is also a quadravalant vaccine that covers all those plus another group B strain (B3073 Phuket).

Each year an attempt is made to determine which of the strains is most likely to cause an epidemic and an attempt is made to construct a vaccine. It is expensive and for that reason effort is focused on those strains considered most likely to occur in a certain geographical area and is prioritised on those that are potentially life-threatening.




It also infects the host with the virus and lets the body fights it off. The is very similar to just getting the virus itself. This is good if you are young and weak as the virus is localized and downgraded, and the body can fight it easier and be prepared. For the rest of us you are middle aged and healthy - all your doing is beating up your body, before the main fight. As the main fight is almost guaranteed to be a different strain, making your vaccine useless.


As mentioned previously, the seasonal flu vaccines available in NZ are not live virus. Therefore they do not "infect" the patient. They are either dead virus or bits of virus protein. While your body will have to mount an immune response it will not be dealing with a live virus that will be replicating and infecting the body. You cannot get the flu from the vaccine.

Your statement about beating up your body before the main fight is an interesting one. Each day your body is mounting immune responses against microbial invaders. Your immune system is so good at this that most of time you do not notice. It is more than capable of dealing with the immune challenge of a vaccine.

In fact the people who benefit most from the flu vaccine are those with poor immune systems, such as the elderly and those with other co-morbitiies such as diabetes or heart failure. This is why the government provides the flu vaccine to these groups of people. The fact that it is recognised to be safe to give to these patients shows how easily they are tolerated.

You are correct in that if you are infected with a strain not covered by the vaccine then you will have no protection. However it is not "almost guaranteed" to be a different strain. People forget that there are a number of other viral illnesses that present like influenza (the common cold for example). It requires a specific test to diagnose the flu.

It is also important to note that the vaccine is never 100% effective at preventing infection by the strain they are designed against (some vaccines are as low as 50% effective). However, and I think this is the pertinent point, some protection is better than none.

[Ruahine]

Some information about the 2016 seasonal flu vaccine available in NZ

http://www.influenza.org.nz/2016-seasonal-influenza-vaccines

[Paul in NZ]

Some information about the 2016 seasonal flu vaccine available in NZ

http://www.influenza.org.nz/2016-seasonal-influenza-vaccines

Those 2 posts are just awesome, intelligent and easy to follow - thanks....

[The Reibz]

We are required to have a flu jab everytime we go overseas now on a ship.
I have had it 3 times in the last 14 months. You are 100% guaranteed to get six within 6 weeks of getting it IMO. Most of ships company get it on the same day and about a month later most start getting sick. Coincidence?

Unfortunately we can not refuse it if we want to deploy. Arse

[caspernz]

Those 2 posts are just awesome, intelligent and easy to follow - thanks....

Agree, easy to comprehend. Much appreciated.


We are required to have a flu jab everytime we go overseas now on a ship.
I have had it 3 times in the last 14 months. You are 100% guaranteed to get six within 6 weeks of getting it IMO. Most of ships company get it on the same day and about a month later most start getting sick. Coincidence?

Unfortunately we can not refuse it if we want to deploy. Arse

And yet, it's this weird coincidence that bugs me. I know in theory the jab and getting sick are not related, but I don't buy it being coincidence on account of the regularity...

[Scuba_Steve]

I have not had a real bad flu for years, I use Vitamin C & D supplements everyday, some of those around me have had bad flu, luckily not me. Touch wood.

You should save your money, unless you're fighting off the possibility of scurvy those things are useless; and even if you were they shouldn't be your 1st, 2nd, or 3rd choice anyhow
Eat an orange & step outside... Success!

[bogan]

You should save your money, unless you're fighting off the possibility of scurvy those things are useless

Source?...

[Scuba_Steve]

Source?...

It's a 3D game engine made by Valve. No real relevance here tho

[328FTW]

My mother died to the flu, it can be really nasty.

I've also had it so bad I've been in the emergency room because I could barely breath properly and swallowing was on a new level of pain, flu + staph infection from your immune system being beat to shit means a bad time. That said vaccine isn't some cure all in that it's sorta like condom, you use it right it's a layer of protection not some sort of full proof immunity, sorta like how briscoes sometimes actually isn't having a sale, it's a reduced risk but not impossible.

Personally I don't get a shot, that's just observation from me reacting bad to it but like all things I just manage that by being aware of who has flu and making sure I'm careful around them....or just not around them at all.

[cold comfort]

Haven't read the thread, but the fact is very very few people catch actual influenza.

“[According to CDC statistics], ‘influenza and pneumonia’ took 62,034 lives in 2001—61,777 of which were attributable to pneumonia and 257 to flu, and in only 18 cases was the flu virus positively identified.”

A little more info here http://www.bmj.com/content/331/7529/1412
Plenty more on the net

So why would you bother?

This is the issue here for me. Where are the double blind studies done annually to prove the effectiveness of the vaccine ( not funded by the industry itself). For the record I work in a frontline medical facility, never had the flu,never had the jab, and am treated like a pariah for my choice. Of the many presentations with "flu like illness" most are treated onsite to alleviate their symptoms and discharged. Seldom are swabs taken and the causative organism identified. I am NOT antivax, having had the Hep A and ADT updates for a recent Asian trip. I just prefer my choices to be evidence based, which I am not convinced the influenza data is.
A worrying trend now is more people than ever are living with weak immune systems (hospitals, nursing homes etc) . Once fatal illness is now chronic and, with the over use of antibiotics, we are seeing super-resistant infections. So then the industry tells us we need even more vaccines...

[Paul in NZ]

This is the issue here for me. ...

Do some research - the info is out there. I wrote the company policy when te bir flu was going to devour us all... It works BUT its a percentage game - no absolutes...

Its a bit like rider training - you can give it to everyone but no guarantees it will stick