The journey that COVID-19 will take us on

[TheDemonLord]

odd what some people defend.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/31/coronavirus-trump-campaign-rallies-led-to-30000-cases-stanford-researchers-say.html
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/donald-trumps-positive-covid-test-at-least-seven-people-test-positive-after-white-house-event/ONK54TTPWOKZSPEY6LLF3OLK7M/
https://www.voanews.com/a/covid-19-pandemic_trump-events-leave-trail-covid-19-infections/6196697.html

I mean, do I need to post the BLM riots?

Isn't it funny how they aren't 'superspreader events', yet Conservative political rallies are. It's almost like there's an In-group/Out-group preference....

[pete376403]

As for the Scientists lying - What is your take when the estimated case models are wrong by either double or quadruple? Should anyone blindly trust groups that get it consistently wrong by such a large margin?
Would you use a Contractor who gave you a Quote for some work that was double or quadruple the quote from anyone else?

These are the questions, the 'following the Science' - that you have no answer for.

Well a contractor should know exactly what he is dealing with, the work to be done, the materials required. When there are unknowns the contractor will quote high, plus they will negotiate variances as the job proceeds. Also the contract is between two parties who both are in favour of a mutually successful outcome. The scientists, however, not knowing exactly what they are dealing with other than being aware the circumstances are evolving and who are doing the work for a customer who is openly hostile, Naturally they will go high, and be happy when it comes in lower. Unlike the contractor, there is no additional profit for them.

[F5 Dave]

I expect this article refers to the same study that Professor McLean is referring to – in the link I posted before Jim Mora asks him specifically about the stuff article with the 20x figure at around 2 minutes 29 seconds, whereupon he starts talking about the Lancet study and how the vaccine stacks up over there preventing transmission etc. Bear in mind it's all generalised for a radio audience (me!) of course.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/28/covid-vaccinated-likely-unjabbed-infect-cohabiters-study-suggests

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00648-4/fulltext

I guess the UK are also a lot further down the vaccine road than we are, so another way it might not be directly comparable (yet).

Ahh. So household contacts. Long close repeated exposure with no masks and shared eating. That makes sense huh?

[F5 Dave]

My question is; why does anyone not have TDL on ignore?

[husaberg]

My question is; why does anyone not have TDL on ignore?

I suspect it's a primal response like watching a car crash.
https://www.nbcnews.com/better/health/science-behind-why-we-can-t-look-away-disasters-ncna804966

"This data from our perceptual system then stimulates the amygdala (the part of the brain responsible for emotions, survival tactics and memory). The amygdala then sends signals to the regions of the frontal cortex that are involved in analyzing and interpreting data. Next, the brain evaluates whether this data (awareness of the disaster) is a threat to you, thus judgment gets involved. As a result, the 'fight or flight' response is evoked." Ever see a car accident happen and find yourself compelled to Google what happened? Dr. Mayer says this is also our survival instincts at work. "This acts as a preventive mechanism to give us information on the dangers to avoid and to flee from," he says.

Every time i actually i am tempted to look see his response or see it in a reply quoted by another i am reminded quickly why he's on ignore.
I only have two on Ignore both have a habit of replying to points that were never made 'and are generally quite irrational.

[mcshaz]

My question is; why does anyone not have TDL on ignore?

This quote helped me come to a much greater understanding of conspiracy theories:



Forgive some of the jargon, but this is from a presentation I just gave to a group of fellow psychotherapists last week about the three core appeals of Conspiracism:


Makes sense of an otherwise confusing and unpredictable world. Wars, poverty, disease, etc. are all due to a small group of evil humans/aliens/lizards – so they are within human control. [Projection]

Offers an appealingly simple worldview of good people vs. evil forces with sharp moral certainty and paths of righteous action. [Splitting]

Gives a sense of specialness – the masses are brainwashed and deluded “sheeple”, while they possess secret knowledge and can congratulate themselves on having seen through the deception. [Narcissism]


That specialness/narcissism factor is particularly problematic - and those smug grins are a bit of a tell for it.

When a conspiracy becomes more widespread and popular (and QAnon is definitely that), the more shame-prone conspiracists tend to adopt increasingly fringe and extreme conspiracies to keep their sense of personal specialness. That's what makes them vulnerable to further radicalisation....

It certainly helps understand comments like "the vaccine either works or it doesn't" - It has a variable effect, declining over time and with the evolution of new variants of the virus which are being selected in a Darwinian fashion to be more resistant (delta being the current one to reduce vaccine effectiveness). Some individuals will have minimal protection from the vaccine because of reduced immunity. However, we are clearly less likely to get the virus, less likely to transmit it, less likely to contribute to overwhelming of the health system because even if we contract the virus post vaccination, we are less likely to need hospital, ICU or die (each stage matched against unvaccinated cases who have reached the same stage of illness). The complexity of a non absolute or dichotomous reduction in risk, let alone statistical error terms, is simply too complex.

Further complexity is added by the concept that, by definition, science accumulates evidence and with that accumulating evidence alters and refines theories and predictions. We begin by extrapolating outside known data points (initially we hadn't seen COVID before, but SARS-CoV-1 and MERS and generally massive systemic inflammatory syndromes (SIRS) guided our understanding that there would be significant longer term debilitation in a significant number of survivors). As information evolves, the theories do as well. This is the hallmark of science. With such changes, we have more than halved the need for ventilation (induced coma) and mortality rate for people admitted to ICU, as compared to early in the pandemic. This is still far more deaths than one would wish and roughly 10 fold the number of deaths from influenza and a much, much higher rate of hospitalisation.

However theories which were important as evidence at the beginning are used as evidence against us by conspiracy theorists long after the usefulness of the theory has waned (in science all theories are wrong, but some are useful).

There are 2 more quotes to leave you with:




Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired.

(in more modern language - we cannot use logic to move someone from a position they did not use logic to arrive at)



Stupidity is a more dangerous enemy of the good than malice. One may protest against evil; it can be exposed and, if need be, prevented by use of force. Evil always carries within itself the germ of its own subversion in that it leaves behind in human beings at least a sense of unease. Against stupidity we are defenseless. Neither protests nor the use of force accomplish anything here; reasons fall on deaf ears; facts that contradict one's prejudgment simply need not be believed – in such moments the stupid person even becomes critical – and when facts are irrefutable they are just pushed aside as inconsequential, as incidental. In all this the stupid person, in contrast to the malicious one, is utterly self-satisfied and, being easily irritated, becomes dangerous by going on the attack. For that reason, greater caution is called for when dealing with a stupid person than with a malicious one. Never again will we try to persuade the stupid person with reasons, for it is senseless and dangerous.

The entire essay, smuggled out of a Nazi concentration camp by a camp guard (he was interned for being anti-Nazi rather than for religion, ethnicity or disability) is worth a read and can be read here (https://matiane.wordpress.com/2021/02/23/dietrich-bonhoeffer-stupidity-is-a-more-dangerous-enemy-of-the-good-than-malice/).

[TheDemonLord]

The scientists, however, not knowing exactly what they are dealing with other than being aware the circumstances are evolving and who are doing the work for a customer who is openly hostile, Naturally they will go high, and be happy when it comes in lower. Unlike the contractor, there is no additional profit for them.

See, I don't disagree - because what you've said here is essentially the same as:



Not only that, but as someone who just so happens to dabble a fair bit in Data and Data manipulation - I can personally assure you that the mathematical modelling that is published and presented to the Public is done in such a manner as to suit the objectives of the one presenting it.

Yet, pointing this out has somehow gotten several feathers ruffled....

[TheDemonLord]

My question is; why does anyone not have TDL on ignore?

I think the more interesting question is:

Why do a large number of those who supposedly have me on Ignore feel the need to constantly remind everyone that they do.

As if I'm somehow the great Kiwibiker Satan who must have catechisms of detestation posted every other post, lest my creeping influence corrupt their souls....

(well, I AM a DemonLord afterall....)

But it may surprise you - some people agree with me, some don't, some find that what I post (even if they don't agree with it) is interesting, some couldn't give two shits about what I post.

[TheDemonLord]

Every time i actually i am tempted to look see his response or see it in a reply quoted by another i am reminded quickly why he's on ignore.
I only have two on Ignore both have a habit of replying to points that were never made 'and are generally quite irrational.


Suuuuuuuuuuuuure. Keep saying that out loud, people might believe you... the problem is that you seem to be rather up-to-date with some of the things I post...

Just like everyone else that has me on so-called 'ignore'

[husaberg]

Ahh. So household contacts. Long close repeated exposure with no masks and shared eating. That makes sense huh?

What that first one ignores is that as vaccinated you are 20x less likely to pass on covid.

"People who are fully vaccinated against Covid yet catch the virus are just as infectious to others in their household as infected unvaccinated people, research suggests.
but these same vaccinated people are additionally far less likely to catch covid in the first place. so the point is rather mute.

Recent reports from the Victorian Department of Health find that unvaccinated people are 10 times more likely to contract Covid than vaccinated people.
We also know that vaccinated people are less likely to transmit the disease even if they become infected. The Doherty modelling from August puts the reduction at around 65 per cent, although more recent research has suggested a lower estimate for AstraZeneca. Hence for this thought experiment, we’ll take a lower value of 50 per cent.
If I were spending time with an unvaccinated person, then there’s some probability they’re infected and will infect me. However, if they were vaccinated, they’re 10 times less likely to be infected and half as likely to infect me, following the numbers above.

Hence, we arrive at a 20-fold reduction in risk when hanging out with a vaccinated person compared to someone who’s not vaccinated.

The exact number depends on a range of factors, including the type of vaccine and time since vaccination. But, Australians can expect a large risk reduction when mixing with fully vaccinated people.





"The vaccines protect for around 60 to 80+% against infection with SARS-CoV-2 but for over 90% against hospitalisation with COVID-19. In my country, protection is 95% against hospitalisation and 97% against ICU admission," she explains.
"This means that while the protection against infection is a bit lower - for Delta compared to Alpha and possibly with more time since vaccination - these vaccine breakthrough infections tend to be milder and not require hospitalisation." Brechje de Gier, who led the study at the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment in the Netherlands.

[TheDemonLord]

What that first one ignores is that as vaccinated you are 20x less likely to pass on covid.

"People who are fully vaccinated against Covid yet catch the virus are just as infectious to others in their household as infected unvaccinated people, research suggests.
but these same vaccinated people are additionally far less likely to catch covid in the first place.

Except for one teensy tiny detail - the figures cited (65% reduction in transmission and 50% reduction in transmission) are from a study that was within 14 days of Vaccination.

The longer term reduction in transmission (after 3 months) is only 20%.

If you run the same maths again, it's not 20 times less likely.

[TheDemonLord]

This quote helped me come to a much greater understanding of conspiracy theories:

Okay then - what Conspiracy theory have I advanced?

I've stated a position against Mandated, based on the Locke view of Natural Rights (which isn't exactly conspiratorial)
I've pointed to the data on Transmission rates with the Vaccine from reputable sources (Lancet and Nature)
I've pointed out that the Modelling data is consistently wrong (this is an observable fact)
The most you could say I've said that even verges on Conspiratorial is that Scientists have a vested interest in putting forward the most convincing sets of Data and evidence...


It certainly helps understand comments like "the vaccine either works or it doesn't"

The context of that statement happens to be key - If you believe that the Vaccine works, and you have taken the Vaccine yourself - then there is no reason why you should be worried about dying from Covid.

If you don't believe the Vaccine works, then you can't tell someone that 'You are following the Science' and make an argument based on the same Science that you ignore.


It has a variable effect, declining over time and with the evolution of new variants of the virus which are being selected in a Darwinian fashion to be more resistant (delta being the current one to reduce vaccine effectiveness).

No one is disputing that...


Some individuals will have minimal protection from the vaccine because of reduced immunity.

And therein is the issue - The liberal, natural rights viewpoint is that those Individuals are responsible for taking their own measures to ensure their own safety.

Just like when you ride a Bike, you are free to choose between a full set of Race Leathers or (if you are so inclined) a Singlet and set of Safety Sandalstm - You, the individual, get to decide the level of Risk you are willing to take.

In the totalitarian and oppressive viewpoint, Individual rights don't matter so long as there is someone, somewhere on the planet that *might* be at risk due to anyones actions.

I happen to be firmly in the Liberal camp (that is, classical british Liberalism, not the American 'Liberal')


However, we are clearly less likely to get the virus, less likely to transmit it, less likely to contribute to overwhelming of the health system because even if we contract the virus post vaccination, we are less likely to need hospital, ICU or die (each stage matched against unvaccinated cases who have reached the same stage of illness). The complexity of a non absolute or dichotomous reduction in risk, let alone statistical error terms, is simply too complex.

Sure, but the Transmit part is Key - the clamour for the Vaccination Mandates and 90% vaccination rates is based around Herd Immunity where the vaccine stops (or significantly inhibits) transmission. The initial effect on Transmission is high, but after a short amount of time (2-3 months) it's very very low - around 20-30%.


Further complexity is added by the concept that, by definition, science accumulates evidence and with that accumulating evidence alters and refines theories and predictions. We begin by extrapolating outside known data points (initially we hadn't seen COVID before, but SARS-CoV-1 and MERS and generally massive systemic inflammatory syndromes (SIRS) guided our understanding that there would be significant longer term debilitation in a significant number of survivors). As information evolves, the theories do as well. This is the hallmark of science. With such changes, we have more than halved the need for ventilation (induced coma) and mortality rate for people admitted to ICU, as compared to early in the pandemic. This is still far more deaths than one would wish and roughly 10 fold the number of deaths from influenza and a much, much higher rate of hospitalisation.

Sure, I can forgive early estimates as being wildly inaccurate, in fact I even pointed out that with a small sample set and small amount of time, that small variation could be extrapolated out to a wildly incorrect prediction.

However, when you look at the predictions from October this year (so 1.5 years worth of Data and hundreds of millions of Data points) when the Models are still out by a double and even quadruple compare to observed reality - One has to call into question the methods used and considering that these Models are what Public Policy is based on....


However theories which were important as evidence at the beginning are used as evidence against us by conspiracy theorists long after the usefulness of the theory has waned (in science all theories are wrong, but some are useful).

Not correct - all Theories are falsifiable - which is not that they are wrong, but that they are ready to be rejected at a moments notice should new evidence be discovered.

However even that is not entirely correct - we know, for example, that Newtonian Physics isn't quite right - it breaks when we get to super massive or super small objects, however as a Theory goes, it's good enough to get us to the Moon and Back.

To go back to my comments about innaccurate Models - the Model of reality that Newtonian Physics creates is accurate enough for us to go about our day-to-day lives and do great things, so we keep it around (despite knowing it's not 100% correct)



The entire essay, smuggled out of a Nazi concentration camp by a camp guard (he was interned for being anti-Nazi rather than for religion, ethnicity or disability) is worth a read and can be read here (https://matiane.wordpress.com/2021/02/23/dietrich-bonhoeffer-stupidity-is-a-more-dangerous-enemy-of-the-good-than-malice/).

See, what's interesting about that Essay, is that it shows very much the continental mindset of a top-down society. Replace the word 'Stupidity' with the word 'Jew' - Does it read differently than any Nazi Propaganda?

The argument is the same essential form: "We could create the Perfect society if we could just get rid of X" - whether X is a group of people (Jews, Blacks, Rich people, Stupid People etc. etc.)

The irony being that the same mindset that put him in the camp is the same mindset that he displays.

The Liberal position says that some people will be stupid and we should advise them on the best course of action, but then leave them alone to live their life - sometimes they will fail and learn from the error of their ways, sometimes they will fail catastrophically, sometimes they will succeed or at least succeed in living their life as they see fit.

This is the British conception of a Bottom-up (hehehehe) society, where the state limits it's interaction with the individual to the smallest degree possible.

[nerrrd]

Ahh. So household contacts. Long close repeated exposure with no masks and shared eating. That makes sense huh?

So really it's not so much whether you're vaccinated or not, it's the environment / length of exposure etc that counts, assuming you have Covid in the first place (see below). The cases in the Henderson Rest Home are probably a good example of that happening.


What that first one ignores is that as vaccinated you are 20x less likely to pass on covid.

"People who are fully vaccinated against Covid yet catch the virus are just as infectious to others in their household as infected unvaccinated people, research suggests.
but these same vvaccinted people are additionally far less likely to catch covid in the first place. so the point is rather mute.

Yes that is a good point. By being vaccinated you're minimising your chances of catching Covid in the first place and thereby being able to it on to others, which amounts to the same thing.

I'll get there eventually.

[husaberg]

Yes that is a good point. By being vaccinated you're minimising your chances of catching Covid in the first place and thereby being able to it on to others, which amounts to the same thing.
.

Be careful of anyone that likes to ignore that point. or who claims to know more than the actual medical experts without any medical training short of a boys brigade first aid badge.
You should be also weary of someone's claims without a second thought, that as a IT help desk dweeb they know more than the FBI about security, or more about the US law than the US supreme court.

[R650R]

Okay then - what Conspiracy theory have I advanced?

I've stated a position against Mandated, based on the Locke view of Natural Rights (which isn't exactly conspiratorial)
I've pointed to the data on Transmission rates with the Vaccine from reputable sources (Lancet and Nature)
I've pointed out that the Modelling data is consistently wrong (this is an observable fact)
The most you could say I've said that even verges on Conspiratorial is that Scientists have a vested interest in putting forward the most convincing sets of Data and evidence...



The context of that statement happens to be key - If you believe that the Vaccine works, and you have taken the Vaccine yourself - then there is no reason why you should be worried about dying from Covid.

If you don't believe the Vaccine works, then you can't tell someone that 'You are following the Science' and make an argument based on the same Science that you ignore.



No one is disputing that...



And therein is the issue - The liberal, natural rights viewpoint is that those Individuals are responsible for taking their own measures to ensure their own safety.

Just like when you ride a Bike, you are free to choose between a full set of Race Leathers or (if you are so inclined) a Singlet and set of Safety Sandalstm - You, the individual, get to decide the level of Risk you are willing to take.

In the totalitarian and oppressive viewpoint, Individual rights don't matter so long as there is someone, somewhere on the planet that *might* be at risk due to anyones actions.

I happen to be firmly in the Liberal camp (that is, classical british Liberalism, not the American 'Liberal')



Sure, but the Transmit part is Key - the clamour for the Vaccination Mandates and 90% vaccination rates is based around Herd Immunity where the vaccine stops (or significantly inhibits) transmission. The initial effect on Transmission is high, but after a short amount of time (2-3 months) it's very very low - around 20-30%.



Sure, I can forgive early estimates as being wildly inaccurate, in fact I even pointed out that with a small sample set and small amount of time, that small variation could be extrapolated out to a wildly incorrect prediction.

However, when you look at the predictions from October this year (so 1.5 years worth of Data and hundreds of millions of Data points) when the Models are still out by a double and even quadruple compare to observed reality - One has to call into question the methods used and considering that these Models are what Public Policy is based on....



Not correct - all Theories are falsifiable - which is not that they are wrong, but that they are ready to be rejected at a moments notice should new evidence be discovered.

However even that is not entirely correct - we know, for example, that Newtonian Physics isn't quite right - it breaks when we get to super massive or super small objects, however as a Theory goes, it's good enough to get us to the Moon and Back.

To go back to my comments about innaccurate Models - the Model of reality that Newtonian Physics creates is accurate enough for us to go about our day-to-day lives and do great things, so we keep it around (despite knowing it's not 100% correct)



See, what's interesting about that Essay, is that it shows very much the continental mindset of a top-down society. Replace the word 'Stupidity' with the word 'Jew' - Does it read differently than any Nazi Propaganda?

The argument is the same essential form: "We could create the Perfect society if we could just get rid of X" - whether X is a group of people (Jews, Blacks, Rich people, Stupid People etc. etc.)

The irony being that the same mindset that put him in the camp is the same mindset that he displays.

The Liberal position says that some people will be stupid and we should advise them on the best course of action, but then leave them alone to live their life - sometimes they will fail and learn from the error of their ways, sometimes they will fail catastrophically, sometimes they will succeed or at least succeed in living their life as they see fit.

This is the British conception of a Bottom-up (hehehehe) society, where the state limits it's interaction with the individual to the smallest degree possible.

ThatÂ’s prob too intellectual for many on hear to grasp.

The term Conspiracy Theory is bandied about as some catch all attempt at an insult by those whose belief systems and coping mechanisms ate threatened by an idea proposed to them.
A conspiracy is just an idea that two or more people MAY have conspired to conduct an action of some kind that is generally unlawful or fraudulent.
Our OWN NZ govt thinks it happens so OFTEN they just made new anti price fixing and cartel laws for businesses.
The most well known conspiracy theories alledge wrong actions by govts or perhaps corrupt officials within those govts and their organisations...
And we all know govts NEVER lie or decieve beahahaaahaaaa
And anti-conspiratites show how narrow their mental depth is by assuming that if one believes in one theory then they must believe in all of them. But funniest of all they act as publicists for the govts own fake conspiracy movement Qanon/wiki/Assange/Alex Jones..... etc
The paid bloggers all froth at the mouth of you dare mention their daddy George soros lol


https://youtu.be/XmzFuml18bA

[Kickaha]

The paid bloggers all froth at the mouth of you dare mention their daddy George soros lol


Anyone who mentions George Soros/Rothschilds/Illuminati/NWO/Great reset etc/agenda 21 in any capacity to do with any of this crap or any other conspiracy is a fuckwit

[bmwilly]

Anyone who mentions George Soros/Rothschilds/Illuminati/NWO/Great reset etc/agenda 21 in any capacity to do with any of this crap or any other conspiracy is a fuckwit

Well said , considering the person you quoted thinks himself intelligent .

[husaberg]

ThatÂ’s prob too intellectual for many on hear to grasp.



Conspiracy theorists are ridiculed for their far-fetched beliefs. Just like any other religious nutters.

just like the other theories you have posted about covid that have zero factual basis.


Well well well, our journey into communist hell continues.

There has only been 1650 alleged cases (out of 700,000 tests!!!!) of the virus, but what has spread faster has been submission to communist control.
Nearly 2 million have downloaded the Covid app so you can be sent to a govt “ health” camp to catch the virus if you didnt already have it.

But yay 3 million kiwis have said no to turning their phone into govt spy device.

Tommorow is D-day, public transport will be the barometer of how many of us have rolled belly up to mask wearing.
Hopefully most will say screw this shit and drive their cars to work.

You don’t have to wear a mask if it affects your physical or mental health and you do NOT need to present documents to prove this.

Out and about it’s refreshing to see nearly No one scanning the qr code thingy.

It’s quite clear now as the mountain of contradictions grow that it’s not about stopping the “virus”..


Masks are for destroying social interaction and communication with strangers. You know those moments in life when some shitbag is bashing his missus and enough of you make visual contact to know you’ve got each other back and intervene.
But with masks there will never be any Flight 93 “lets roll” moments of bravery, you’ll never know if your fellow citizen is a Karen or Stasi as you reluctantly board the blacked out train carriage...
A cop will never see your friendly smile, never know you like them and not let you off that minor stop sign indescretion...


Why would they join when they already have CIA controlled Facebook to play with?


I’m very happy that someone of intelligence on the other side of this debate can see the glaring hypocracy and failings that such a “ passport” produces.... especially given that even with known highly effective vaccines a significant number of vaccinated people are still vulnerable, the measles debate proves that and they had years to fix that issue.

Note the timeline of names, first it was the Wuhan virus, then it was SARS Corona virus 2 (cause there was already a previous SARS Corona virus but they didnÂ’t close the world over that one six to ten years ago), the SARS Cov2..... suddenly was being called Covid and covid 19, an acronym that makes zero sense grammatically or scientifically unless your talking and KNOWING about

Certificate
Of
Vaccination
Identification
D....

Why arenÂ’t new strains called covid 20 or covid 21?????
Why are there a dozen different vaccines for different regions when this virus loves to travel.
How will human body cope with multiple vaccines in short time frames for those who travel a lot?

WeÂ’ve been blasted with fear porn about super spreaders and how cleverly contagious and resistant this virus is but you wonÂ’t kill grandma if you have your papers and your 80%? effective jab. Would grandma ride in your car if the brakes worked 80% of the time?

Oh and kids arenÂ’t getting the jab as apparently they donÂ’t get or spread the virus thatÂ’s bullshit. And anyone with kids knows the lil snot nose super spreaders give everyone everything as they just donÂ’t comprehend the hole sickness and hands things at that age.
Whose always sick at work? ItÂ’s the people with kids catching bugs off their kids weÂ’ve all been able to witness that for years...,


https://t.co/GABDB6b0Rm

ARE YOU PREPARED FOR AN INTERNET BLACKOUT & ELECTRICAL GRID DISRUPTION


These inconveniences suffered this week with Google going down are NOTHING compared to what is probably coming down the road, and which could be imminent.

Imagine what life will be like with no Internet at all for an extended period of time, and where electrical service could become very unstable and also be down for an extended period of time.

For those who have been paying attention, the Globalists have actually been warning us that this is coming for sometime now.

Earlier this year Health Impact News reported about Event 201 which was hosted by the World Economic Forum and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and was a simulation of a worldwide pandemic and the response to that pandemic in October of 2019, just weeks before the now infamous COVID19 virus was identified in Wuhan, China.

Almost everything predicted during that simulation has now actually happened, except for one thing: an Internet blackout.


But he did visit the Wuhan lab several years ago with Obama and gave them 1.5$M of taxpayer money....


Too many scientists are coming out now and saying this virus is not natural. Its a bio warfare weapon and probably a race specific one too.
China was set to become the worlds new super power by 2050 as per there goal, an economic and military powerhouse that wouldnt be threatened by sanctions anymore.
USA knows they cant win a hot war so resorted to this. But they stuffed up by outsourcing the final component to a chinese lab to provide plausible deniability if they got caught. They got bit in the arse by poor chinese quality control and ended up witha weak version of what they wanted.
It was released at the world military games in wuhan just like a similar story on tom clancy novel about "terrorists". One of their own bought it home accidently and caused a mini outbreak in USA which was the vaping deaths which didnt stay in news long....
The Chinese are smart and know they getting done over so they playing 4D chess and milking it to murder political dissidents and havea good sweep out of their society. They know by playing it up they could cripple us economically with lockdowns as they knew our leaders would panic.
Thats why Trump was so quick in closing borders because he knew what was at play.
The virus is a minor nuisance though, its a acheived their goal though, a world wide communist police state lockdown that they never got with 911 as that wasnt scary enough for the masses to give away freedom.
As per usual with an "unprecedented " event they held an exercise simulating the same months earlier called Event 201...

[F5 Dave]

ThatÂ’s prob too intellectual for many on hear to grasp.

. . . ]
Intulektuals no how too spel beta

[FJRider]

I'm only suggesting that Governments should be trusted as far as they can be thrown. Their track record (both in this country and globally) isn't exactly glowing.

If the distance I could throw a fat cunt like you ... was how much you could be trusted ... :shifty:


I agree it's a guess, but the 'based on facts and strategies used overseas that worked' is a bit more of an issue. I've got my opinion as to which Facts and Strategies where chosen, based on certain ideological sympathies - the fact that we picked the strategy used by China and not Taiwan....

We haven't had too many Covid Pandemics in our National (or Labour) history ... but by the fewer deaths and number of new cases daily, lower than similar sized countries/populations ... they actually seem to have a policy that works. More seem to be upset at their perceived loss of freedoms ... than the potential for their own loss of life. That could never happen to them ... ??? :shifty:


Sure, The Government could declare a National Emergency and has done it in the past.
Governments have also been overthrown (violently or otherwise) in the past.

I'm quite happy to wait for the next election. Much safer and easier. I forecast NO change of Government. To vote you need at least be on the Electoral roll.

And in the last election ... Half of those that COULD vote ... DIDN'T.

NZ apathy at it's finest ... :shifty:


Just a thought.

In my opinion ... you are incapable of original thought ... :shifty:


Remember one of the key pillars that upholds the English style of democracy that we have is that Governance is done with Consent.

The Labour Government was voted in by a majority vote. Thus they HAVE Public Consent ... :shifty:


I can't name the ones I've personally interacted with, obviously - to answer the second part though - what do the Ministers and the Health leaders talk about? It's always about 'The Numbers'. Or for a different perspective - Google 'DHB Diversity' - and you'll see plenty of results about the various Diversity programs in our Health system - why is that?

So ... You got nothing ... :shifty:


Do you care what colour the person treating you is?
Does anyone here care about it?
What about Sexuality? Do you care if your nurse likes sucking dick or licking Vag?

I don't.

And yet to the Hospital Administrators, these things are important because the numbers don't align in their spreadsheet.

You now claim Hospital Administrators are Government advisors ... ?? or have some say in Government policy ... :shifty:


Actually, quite the opposite - I refuse to massage the Data to make it look more favorable and I've had some very fun meetings with the Board about it. Just like being a competent Mechanic or Builder means you can recognize cowboyism when you see it - and as above - predictions that are out by a factor of 4.

So who is the one bullshitting?

To quote the post I quoted you on ...
Not only that, but as someone who just so happens to dabble in a fair bit in Data and Data manipulation - I can personally assure you that the mathematical modelling that is published and presented to the Public is done in such a manner as to suit the objectives of the one presenting it. it seems to imply you do it in a manner to suit your objectives ... or your employers ... :shifty:


Well, I'm not sure who you are spying on when they sleep, but it certainly isn't me....

Just a poorly executed dig at you.


The right thing has never been to force other people to comply with your fears.
The right thing has always been to uphold other people's freedoms and rights.

But it IS the right thing for a Government to act in what they believe is in their country's populations best interest. Having been voted in by public majority ... they have the mandate to do that ... :shifty:


Well - what would you rather - A Government that tries to interfere with your personal life or one that leaves you alone?

If they are acting in my best interests ... my personal life has little to do with it. With Covid issues ... my life could be at stake.

If I live to moan about it later ... I'll be happy enough ... :shifty:


I'm fairly certain I could guess with some pretty reasonable accuracy (it's not like you've been shy or coy) - but therein lies the virtue of my position:

Therein lies the difference of our opinions ... I could never include Virtue in any description of you (or me).

I have been known to be a total prick ... :shifty:


You might think I'm a Cunt, fair enough - that's your want and your right And I would not and will not infringe upon that right to soothe my feelings.

What I think is (obviously) obvious ... :killingme



That's the difference between my position - I value your freedoms as much as I value my own and I would celebrate the fact that you are free to think of me as you wish and to express that opinion - rather than trying to force you to do something because of my fears/insecurity.

As you are reportedly residing in or near Auckland ... I can assure you that I currently enjoy a great deal more freedoms ... than YOU currently do ... :killingme


Just like making other people get vaccinated because of your fears.

I encourage people to get vaccinated ... a pretty cheap life insurance. No fear involved whatsoever ... :killingme

[TheDemonLord]

Anyone who mentions George Soros/Rothschilds/Illuminati/NWO/Great reset etc/agenda 21 in any capacity to do with any of this crap or any other conspiracy is a fuckwit

Can you point to a post I've made that references any of those?

[TheDemonLord]

If the distance I could throw a fat cunt like you ... was how much you could be trusted ... :shifty:

No more or no less than you'd trust any other random on the Internet that you'd never personally met. Remember, my position of Freedom doesn't require you to trust me, quite the opposite in fact.


We haven't had too many Covid Pandemics in our National (or Labour) history ... but by the fewer deaths and number of new cases daily, lower than similar sized countries/populations ... they actually seem to have a policy that works.

We've had 2 (not including this one) in my memory...

Sure, we seem to be successful - is that due to good Government policy? I have my doubts. I think it's more due to our very isolated nature, good natural land borders and low population density.

I look at the Taiwan model as being much better, considering they have much much much much higher population density and a higher median age.


More seem to be upset at their perceived loss of freedoms ... than the potential for their own loss of life. That could never happen to them ... ??? :shifty:

It's almost like there's an ideal there, something akin to over 500 years of philosophical thought that Freedom, even when the price is Death, is preferable to tyranny...


I'm quite happy to wait for the next election. Much safer and easier. I forecast NO change of Government. To vote you need at least be on the Electoral roll.

And in the last election ... Half of those that COULD vote ... DIDN'T.

NZ apathy at it's finest ... :shifty:

Well, the choice is between Cunt number 1, Cunt number 2, Communist Cunt, Racial Supremecist Cunt and Saint Seymour....



In my opinion ... you are incapable of original thought ... :shifty:

And yet, I consistently post original commentary - just another opinion of yours not based in reality ;)


The Labour Government was voted in by a majority vote. Thus they HAVE Public Consent ... :shifty:

Was and Had. If an election was run tomorrow, I'm not sure it would be the landslide last time - I'm not sure if Stalinda has pissed off enough of the swing voters yet, but the growing discontent with her I've seen in places where previously she was held in good standing is pleasing to see.


So ... You got nothing ... :shifty:

Admitedly, because of Privacy, I can't give out details - but there is enough information publicly to infer that to be the case.


You now claim Hospital Administrators are Government advisors ... ?? or have some say in Government policy ... :shifty:

Just look at the senior ranks of the Police, they advise the Ministers, the Ministers derive Policy (and in some cases, the Police actually draft the policy....)
Why do you think the Health sector would be any different? That senior Hospital officials would have a seat at the table?



To quote the post I quoted you on ... it seems to imply you do it in a manner to suit your objectives ... or your employers ... :shifty:

We all do our work in a manner that best suits our Objectives - whether that's to do the best job possible, to advance up the career path or to clock in, do the bare minimum, clock out and have enough coin for Beers and food.

For me personally, my objective is to give the wider business the most accurate view of what the different business units are doing and to find better ways to display patterns and information to enable the senior management to make the best strategic decisions.


But it IS the right thing for a Government to act in what they believe is in their country's populations best interest. Having been voted in by public majority ... they have the mandate to do that ... :shifty:

Sure - the question becomes - what is the populations best interest?

Freedom (my position) or Health?

I increasingly take the view that Government should be limited almost to the point of just upholding a Citizens Natural Rights (very much the US Constitutional model) - but with an acknowledgement of certain public goods should be provided via Taxation (roads, public infrastructure, the DHBs etc.)


If they are acting in my best interests ... my personal life has little to do with it. With Covid issues ... my life could be at stake.

IF.

That's a pretty big If.

Who do you think has the best understanding of the risks to your life? A Bureaucrat and scientist who have never met you, heard of you or interacted with you and don't have to pay the consequences for you if they are wrong,

Or you? Who has lived your life and has the ultimate consequence of getting it wrong hanging over your head?


Therein lies the difference of our opinions ... I could never include Virtue in any description of you (or me).

I have been known to be a total prick ... :shifty:

You can be virtuous in some ways and a total prick at the same time, they aren't mutually exclusive. I've got a fairly consistent track record on this forum of appealing on behalf of people I fundamentally disagree with, on their freedom to speak as they see fit. I've also never let a difference of opinion on a given topic cloud my judgement of a persons character - consequently, when someone I am disagreeing with on one topic does something I agree with, I'm never shy from repping them and commenting my approval.

And I know that you know this because I quite frequently rep posts of yours where you say something inciteful or interesting


As you are reportedly residing in or near Auckland ... I can assure you that I currently enjoy a great deal more freedoms ... than YOU currently do ... :killingme

Am I?

I believe my location says 'Not in Gulf Harbour' - which leaves a very large percentage of the rest of the country that I could be residing in. And since I'm feeling somewhat generous - it's an area that is in Level 2, so once again - your assurance fall like Egg upon your face ;)



I encourage people to get vaccinated ... a pretty cheap life insurance. No fear involved whatsoever ... :killingme

As do I.

In fact, on another forum I'm a member of, I send a very long PM to someone who asked whether they should or shouldn't - firstly declaring my absolute opposition to Mandates, then giving the scientific reasons why they should.

I don't know if they got jabbed or not, but I've said in this thread and elsewhere that I, myself, have had my 5G upgrades (well, 50% complete, second one is booked in).

My opposition is only on the Mandates and the disregard for personal choice, freedom, the Bullying of people who don't wish to get Jabbed, the issue around the Government messaging for herd immunity that ignores transmission rates and the statement by Stalinda about a 2-tier society.

Those are the things I'm vehemently against.

[sugilite]

For me personally, my objective is to give the wider business the most accurate view of what the different business units are doing and to find better ways to display patterns and information to enable the senior management to make the best strategic decisions.
I know you mentioned your boss is onboard with your work time kb posting. However, do your reports to senior management include advising them that all the business units would very much benefit from their staff posting on personal interest forums for large swathes of the working day? Or does this "freedom" just apply to you and a handful of other freedom loving first tier elites? :devil2:. :bleh:

[TheDemonLord]

I know you mentioned your boss is onboard with your work time kb posting. However, do your reports to senior management include advising them that all the business units would very much benefit from their staff posting on personal interest forums for large swathes of the working day? Or does this "freedom" just apply to you and a handful of other freedom loving first tier elites? :devil2:. :bleh:

That's covered under Research and Development time and investigating new and emerging technologies :laugh:


Plus, I type very quickly

[TheDemonLord]

Now, some may remember a while ago, I pointed out that Masks and the wearing of them had more to do with Political Ideology than anything else - and several people joined in a spirited critique...

https://twitter.com/i/status/1455888129982935043

It's only a 1 minute video - but if you watch to the end, you'll hear that the Labour MP in a moment of pressure admit that it is indeed Ideological...

[sugilite]

I felt there was a "in the sense that" coming but she was cut off. Though maximum points to her for polly hypocrisy at it's finest. A Bi-partisan affliction I'm afraid.
Congratulations on what is in essence pointing out a single individual from team left that may agree with you though :msn-wink:

[TheDemonLord]

I felt there was a "in the sense that" coming but she was cut off.

Actually, I think that she realised what she'd just said, the look on her face when she tries to walk it back, she knows she's said something that she shouldn't have.


Though maximum points to her for polly hypocrisy at it's finest. A Bi-partisan affliction I'm afraid.

Oh definitely - from that interview section (it's about an hour long) there's a good discussion about the MP code of Conduct and the Conservatives wanting to change the rules because one of their own was caught afoul of it.


Congratulations on what is in essence pointing out a single individual from team left that may agree with you though :msn-wink:

I think it's more finding an individual who was foolish enough to outright say it.

[R650R]

Anyone who mentions George Soros/Rothschilds/Illuminati/NWO/Great reset etc/agenda 21 in any capacity to do with any of this crap or any other conspiracy is a fuckwit

Mainstream news and a govt minister....

I’m curious as to why people who don’t believe any conspiracies would even care about the name of a billionaire being mentioned?


https://youtu.be/5I7sTPFlMLA

[F5 Dave]

Mainstream news have fact checkers. Dicks like you have confirmation bias.

[TheDemonLord]

Mainstream news have fact checkers.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes

[pritch]

I’m curious as to why people who don’t believe any conspiracies would even care about the name of a billionaire being mentioned?


Soros is a wealthy individual and it is accepted that he has on occasions used his wealth to support causes that he favoured. Trump and the more witless right would have it that anti Trump protestors in the USA were paid by Soros. The only person who paid actors to be in crowds was Trump. They also have it that Soros was a Nazi collaborator, although he was just a child during the war.

Soros is a bogeyman for the right, if you see his name brought up it is safe to assume the person doing it is an idiot.

[pritch]

This is somewhat amusing, in a gallows humour sort of a way. Conspiracy theorists tend to blissfully ignore all sorts of contradictions.

https://youcanknowthings.com/2021/06/30/pandemic-contradictions-a-sign-of-false-information/

[pritch]

An interesting article about life in LA. Some would have us believe life there has returned to normal. Not quite.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/08-11-2021/back-to-normal-yeah-right-a-covid-reality-check-from-a-new-zealander-in-la/#.YYgrvirEet0.twitter

[pete376403]

An interesting article about life in LA. Some would have us believe life there has returned to normal. Not quite.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/08-11-2021/back-to-normal-yeah-right-a-covid-reality-check-from-a-new-zealander-in-la/#.YYgrvirEet0.twitter

Ian Taylor says LA is safer, because (paraphrasing) they follow the rules https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/11/coronavirus-why-kiwi-businessman-sir-ian-taylor-feels-safer-from-covid-19-in-los-angeles-than-in-new-zealand.html

[Ocean1]

An interesting article about life in LA. Some would have us believe life there has returned to normal.

It's been quite some time since LA could believably claim any semblance of normalcy, for any reasonable definition of that word.

[R650R]

Another suspicious news article.....

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-man-who-intentionally-caught-virus-wishes-he-hadnt-done-it/

Now how would someone do this given a known positive case would be in isolation?
Surely the police will charge him with something, bit like careless driving causing injury to yourself he’s guilty of kniwingly transmitting a notifiable public health diseases to himself.

Local supermarkets has vaccine tent in carpark, should be inside at checkout then at least your doung something productive waiting in que.
Still shortages various products despite their shop normal campaign. Surely someone in management needs to realise shopping patterns have changed and they need to have all checkouts manned.
I think most people are doing same as me, going less often but filling the trolley therefore reducing exposure risk and the need for the mask wearing hassle. It’s like as if they think making the experience as miserable as possible will force peoplevto shop online or click n collect

[husaberg]

Surely the police will charge him with something, bit like careless driving causing injury to yourself he’s guilty of kniwingly transmitting a notifiable public health diseases to himself.


So in your opinion should the police also charge those willfully spreading misinformation as well?

[TheDemonLord]

So in your opinion should the police also charge those willfully spreading misinformation as well?

Well, they could start by arresting themselves and every Politician....

[R650R]

Well, they could start by arresting themselves and every Politician....

And people who repeatedly intentionally misquote others out of context to paint a picture that suits themselves cause they can’t present a valid argument of their own.
The best thing about ignoring empty baseless echos is they diminish on a logarithmic scale of insignificance, so satisfying :)

[R650R]

This is not an anti vaccine post

It’s about the media distortion, check out the crowds, this thousands of people not hundreds

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300449296/covid19-live-parliament-on-high-alert-as-hundreds-march-to-protest-vaccine-mandates

If this was a climate protest Taxcinda would be saying it’s a mandate for change....

First time they have locked doors of parliament they are that scared of the “smallest” protest ever outside.....
It’s unusual for all of an affected group to protest so any time you get a reasonable size group show up it shows your not just dealing with a small fringe group. It shows a reasonable part of the population has issues with elements or part thereof in new laws or changes. The spin on this will be a Masterclass in propoganda to listen to.

[nerrrd]

This is not an anti vaccine post

It’s about the media distortion, check out the crowds, this thousands of people not hundreds

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300449296/covid19-live-parliament-on-high-alert-as-hundreds-march-to-protest-vaccine-mandates

If this was a climate protest Taxcinda would be saying it’s a mandate for change....

First time they have locked doors of parliament they are that scared of the “smallest” protest ever outside.....
It’s unusual for all of an affected group to protest so any time you get a reasonable size group show up it shows your not just dealing with a small fringe group. It shows a reasonable part of the population has issues with elements or part thereof in new laws or changes. The spin on this will be a Masterclass in propoganda to listen to.

My guess as to why the security is so tight would be that the reasons behind the protest are a mostly irrational, internet-driven overreaction.

You can't reason with people who won't listen to reason. It's extremely depressing to watch.

[pete376403]

Looking at the protest, how many there are damning the Government while collecting benefit money from that same government every week?

[F5 Dave]

It shows how misinformed people are that they are more afraid of the vaccine than the virus. The virus doesn't care. It will seek.them out. And the dicks who spread that misinformation will never stop to consider their cunty actions.

[pete376403]

On RNZ this morning: A team of academics have been studying the spread of Covid-19 untruths since February last year, to help improve science communication.

Noted that white supremists are posting using language to encourage Maori not to get vaccinated, while at the same time blaming Maori for spreading the virus. https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018816961/covid-19-what-the-disinformation-project-has-found

[TheDemonLord]

Noted that white supremists are posting using language to encourage Maori not to get vaccinated, while at the same time blaming Maori for spreading the virus. https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018816961/covid-19-what-the-disinformation-project-has-found

I'm quite curious to see the data used for that assessment.

[TheDemonLord]

My guess as to why the security is so tight would be that the reasons behind the protest are a mostly irrational, internet-driven overreaction.

That assessment could be applied to any of the recent Protests....

But it does show that there is one standard of behaviour for 'approved' protests (BLM, Climate change etc.)
And a completely different standard of behaviour for verboten protests (Anything outside the Left-wing milieu)


You can't reason with people who won't listen to reason. It's extremely depressing to watch.

Indeed...

Which is why people are protesting the Government because they aren't listening to reason ;)

[pete376403]

I'm quite curious to see the data used for that assessment.
Listen to the broadcast, ask the research team.

[pete376403]

This is not an anti vaccine post

It’s about the media distortion, check out the crowds, this thousands of people not hundreds

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300449296/covid19-live-parliament-on-high-alert-as-hundreds-march-to-protest-vaccine-mandates.


Call that a protest? we had more people at parliament for the Bikoi!

[TheDemonLord]

Listen to the broadcast, ask the research team.

Well, I did a bit of Google-Fu to see if I could read anything, but nothing published as of yet.

[pete376403]

Well, I did a bit of Google-Fu to see if I could read anything, but nothing published as of yet.
She was on RNZ this afternoon (panel with Wallace Chapman). might be able to re-listen.

[TheDemonLord]

She was on RNZ this afternoon (panel with Wallace Chapman). might be able to re-listen.

No disrespect to RNZ or to either her or Wallace, I don't think she will be going into line-by-line detail on the Data on a Radio show.

I'm skeptical of the Claim, first and foremost because quite simply I don't think 'White Supremecists' are capable of that level of Grand Deception....

[R650R]

No disrespect to RNZ or to either her or Wallace, I don't think she will be going into line-by-line detail on the Data on a Radio show.

I'm skeptical of the Claim, first and foremost because quite simply I don't think 'White Supremecists' are capable of that level of Grand Deception....

Yeah they all pretty stupid. To articulate that a lunatic fringe minority group could influence the decisions of people that’s would despise them the most could only be a desperate invented lie of lunatic leftist ideology.

But that’s all they got when their policies and ideas are soley based on race and gender.


https://youtu.be/EevoRUakA88

[R650R]

Looking at the protest, how many there are damning the Government while collecting benefit money from that same government every week?

Prob not too many as the vaccine mandate cements their free paycheck. Most would be teachers and healthcare workers affected by latest update.
Dont forget via working for families a large portion of nz get a “ handout”

[Berries]

Yeah they all pretty stupid.
To be fair though, they have been championing the use of face masks for some time.

[F5 Dave]

And the big group on their high power motorcycles doing wheelies. :killingme


Fortunately the reports changed to give more the impression through pictures that they looked like gang members rather than real bikers.

[Laava]

Was a typical NZ protest group. Most are there purely for the excitement. Fucking pathetic.

[R650R]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/hawkes-bay-today/news/covid-19-delta-outbreak-toby-manhire-the-protest-that-revealed-a-new-ugly-dangerous-side-to-nz/

Not too bad an article although of course he thinks q anon is real. Looks like media bias is coming home to roost. What they don’t grasp is although they are seeing a nasty few at one end of bell curve.... there’s a big fat wad of silent majority in middle of bell curve who don’t respect the crap inaccurately news we get.
That’s why fluff news is still begging for subscribers

[pritch]

First time they have locked doors of parliament they are that scared of the “smallest” protest ever outside.....
It’s unusual for all of an affected group to protest so any time you get a reasonable size group show up it shows your not just dealing with a small fringe group. It shows a reasonable part of the population has issues with elements or part thereof in new laws or changes. The spin on this will be a Masterclass in propoganda to listen to.

These fuckwits had Trump flags and had threatened to kill Ardern. They wanted a rerun of Trump's failed coup attempt. Being the intellectuals that they are, some had their names and photos on social media. Two things: there would seem sufficient information to prosecute them, Judith said she'd never seen such security at Parliament. Good. I trust it included armed SAS diplomatic squad members.

Funny thing about crowd numbers, the crowd awaiting the return of JFK Jr was reported to be in the hundreds. It looked more like thousands to me. I haven't seen enough photos of these fuckwits to judge. They were talking of bring the country to a stop with a massive gridlock. They grossly overestimate their numbers. The country is nearing 90% vaccinated. So they would be trying to recruit the other 10% who have identified themselves as highly suggestible. Not all of them would be up for a massive protest though.

I trust none of you were there on your bikes. Were they Bishop Brian's Harley mates?

[R650R]

High speed lead poisoning now comes with a side of covid....

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/300451032/new-lynn-homicide-man-senselessly-shot-dead-outside-motel-had-covid19

[R650R]

These fuckwits had Trump flags and had threatened to kill Ardern. They wanted a rerun of Trump's failed coup attempt. Being the intellectuals that they are, some had their names and photos on social media. Two things: there would seem sufficient information to prosecute them, Judith said she'd never seen such security at Parliament. Good. I trust it included armed SAS diplomatic squad members.

Funny thing about crowd numbers, the crowd awaiting the return of JFK Jr was reported to be in the hundreds. It looked more like thousands to me. I haven't seen enough photos of these fuckwits to judge. They were talking of bring the country to a stop with a massive gridlock. They grossly overestimate their numbers. The country is nearing 90% vaccinated. So they would be trying to recruit the other 10% who have identified themselves as highly suggestible. Not all of them would be up for a massive protest though.

I trust none of you were there on your bikes. Were they Bishop Brian's Harley mates?

Let’s stick to the facts aye?

Last time I checked freedom of expression of political and religious ideals was in bill of rights, so why’ve care if couple have trump flags.
No one threatened to kill, otherwise they woukd have been promptly arrested and media would have been jacking off all over themselves in a frenzy of adjectives.
The FBI wasn’t involved so there was never going to be any patsies fronting a fake coup attempt. In fact the highlight moment was the kiwi politeness when one over eagerbprotestor pushed a barrier over the other people uprighted it, kiwi as!!!
Like any protest the teachers always a few fringe elements but even the media regarded it as highly peaceful and that’s on our scale not the BLM peaceful scale.
I’d never go to any protest like that, dangerous place to be when a false flag event could be staged.., oh andvprotedt is pointless when an act or order has already been passed. Even opposition parties rarely ever undo what they argued against.

[Dadpole]

Let’s stick to the facts aye?

Last time I checked freedom of expression of political and religious ideals was in bill of rights, so why’ve care if couple have trump flags.
No one threatened to kill, otherwise they woukd have been promptly arrested and media would have been jacking off all over themselves in a frenzy of adjectives.
The FBI wasn’t involved so there was never going to be any patsies fronting a fake coup attempt. In fact the highlight moment was the kiwi politeness when one over eagerbprotestor pushed a barrier over the other people uprighted it, kiwi as!!!
Like any protest the teachers always a few fringe elements but even the media regarded it as highly peaceful and that’s on our scale not the BLM peaceful scale.
I’d never go to any protest like that, dangerous place to be when a false flag event could be staged.., oh andvprotedt is pointless when an act or order has already been passed. Even opposition parties rarely ever undo what they argued against.

:yawn:.......

[F5 Dave]

Let’s stick to the facts aye?

Last time I checked freedom of expression of political and religious ideals was in bill of rights, so why’ve care if couple have trump flags.
No one threatened to kill, otherwise they woukd have been promptly arrested and media would have been jacking off all over themselves in a frenzy of adjectives.
The FBI wasn’t involved so there was never going to be any patsies fronting a fake coup attempt. In fact the highlight moment was the kiwi politeness when one over eagerbprotestor pushed a barrier over the other people uprighted it, kiwi as!!!
Like any protest the teachers always a few fringe elements but even the media regarded it as highly peaceful and that’s on our scale not the BLM peaceful scale.
I’d never go to any protest like that, dangerous place to be when a false flag event could be staged.., oh andvprotedt is pointless when an act or order has already been passed. Even opposition parties rarely ever undo what they argued against.
You? The facts? Fuck I'm not going to read any further in case I puke. You are KBs no.1 misinformation centre.

[husaberg]

Let’s stick to the facts aye?


Wow, that's an odd statement considering what you have previously posted about covid cures and all sorts of other misinformation....
How empty must your life if you have to get your kicks jilling off to the reaction you get trolling by pushing silly conspiracies on the net



The noun Pandemic is not mentioned in that post, does one not understand grammar.
Every disease is a Pandemic in the modern world as they all spread “across the country or roundvthe world”.
1600 people sick in a country of 5 million is no crisis worth destroying jobs and lives for.


Well well well, our journey into communist hell continues.

There has only been 1650 alleged cases (out of 700,000 tests!!!!) of the virus, but what has spread faster has been submission to communist control.
Nearly 2 million have downloaded the Covid app so you can be sent to a govt “ health” camp to catch the virus if you didnt already have it.

But yay 3 million kiwis have said no to turning their phone into govt spy device.

Tommorow is D-day, public transport will be the barometer of how many of us have rolled belly up to mask wearing.
Hopefully most will say screw this shit and drive their cars to work.

You don’t have to wear a mask if it affects your physical or mental health and you do NOT need to present documents to prove this.

Out and about it’s refreshing to see nearly No one scanning the qr code thingy.

It’s quite clear now as the mountain of contradictions grow that it’s not about stopping the “virus”..


Masks are for destroying social interaction and communication with strangers. You know those moments in life when some shitbag is bashing his missus and enough of you make visual contact to know you’ve got each other back and intervene.
But with masks there will never be any Flight 93 “lets roll” moments of bravery, you’ll never know if your fellow citizen is a Karen or Stasi as you reluctantly board the blacked out train carriage...
A cop will never see your friendly smile, never know you like them and not let you off that minor stop sign indescretion...


Spare a thought for the unfortunate households this Xmas....

The households where Karen’s live.....

Instead of milk and cookies they will leave hand sanitiser and toilet paper out for Santa....

But he won’t be here Xmas nite Jonny, he has to stay in quarantine for two weeks first...

I can’t belueve comrade afdrn has t used this.... kids are very observant, how come Santa has freedom of travel?


The media are tripping over themselves trying to solve the mystery of why Africans aren't dying from covid as badly as the west.
Africans routinely take a cheap safe anti malaria drug invented in n 1960's called hydroxychloroquine....
Scooby Doo would solve that puzzle faster



So many vids about the Biden regime now investigating the “ outrageous” wuhan lab conspiracy its hard to choose which one to post ����������


Your odds of dying from Covid in NZ is about the same as winning Powerball....
People dream of winning powerball, actively visit known powerball superspreader hot zones twice a week in hope of winning...

Meanwhile about 6 times as many people die in drink drive car crashes.
We even have mass random surveillance testing for that too, typically about 1.5-2% are ‘ infected’ with the influence of alcohol.....
Would we tolerate say a 24hr lockdown every time you bought a beer at bar?
Or after your night at the bar you don’t leave through the front door, a govt agent escorts you to a ‘quarantine ‘ facility which you can’t leave for 24 hrs.
Just imagine that, we would ABSOLUTELY save 150 lives a year
The govt will NEVER do that so why all this crap with the virus where the potential victim has a 93% chance of not even needing hospital treatment...


As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????


Well it seems the MORE deadly and MORE contagious delta variant failed to deliver... just think about that, the infected person came on a flight where people would have taken masks off at times to eat and drink and all shared the same inflight tier facilities. THEN they sauntered all over a MAJOR metropolitan area and thefe was no outbreak.
Guess that’s why an ever nastier version lambda? Starts with L has just been “ discovered”....

Oh but we’ve locked down so quick, yes but not before the exposure events and not before all those exposed on weekends away returned to provincial centres.

One has to wonder if the new respiratory infection in young kids is a result of the sterility of lockdown life not letting there immune systems learn properly in early development months as the age band is very low.

[TheDemonLord]

These fuckwits had Trump flags and had threatened to kill Ardern. They wanted a rerun of Trump's failed coup attempt. Being the intellectuals that they are, some had their names and photos on social media. Two things: there would seem sufficient information to prosecute them, Judith said she'd never seen such security at Parliament. Good. I trust it included armed SAS diplomatic squad members.

They had Flags?!? Heavens!

I follow some fairly spicy anti-Ardern media pages (The Memes are hilarious) - plenty of people have expressed things like:

"I wish she'd fuck off to the UN already"
to
"I wouldn't piss on her if she was on fire"

I have not seen anything that looks like a serious death threat, and were there serious death threats, as R650 rightly pointed out, they would be headline news.

As for Parlimentary security (SAS not included), I hear that the Toilets have never been so well-armed....

But all of this is to show that if you protest for a cause that is 'approved', you are treated one way, if you protest for a cause that isn't approved, it's a completely different way.

[Berries]

I’d never go to any protest like that, dangerous place to be when a false flag event could be staged.
Has anyone seen my camel?

Jasper Carrott on Youtube won't embed (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYYo49R_ZS0)

[pritch]

Let’s stick to the facts aye?

LOL. And that interrogative is spelled 'eh'.


No one threatened to kill, otherwise they woukd have been promptly arrested and media would have been jacking off all over themselves in a frenzy of adjectives.

This was all being discussed on Telegram which is evidently a bastion of mental illness posing as free speech.



The FBI wasn’t involved so there was never going to be any patsies fronting a fake coup attempt.

LOL really? Fuck!



I’d never go to any protest like that, dangerous place to be when a false flag event could be staged

I won't laugh this time though, it's just getting sad.

If you believe that you are seriously deluded. Are you on Telegraph?

[R650R]

LOL really? Fuck!




Babylon bee fbi video won’t embed too much truth lol

[R650R]

This was all being discussed on Telegram which is evidently a bastion of mental illness....Are you on Telegraph?

No but you seem to spend a lot of time on there’s for an adult along with twatter and those other dark web forums you mention all time like channel 3 and nonymous...

I gets plenty enough material Fromm mainstream news sources to confirm my material pisted here.

And I know umm correct when I get e reply of rabid characters assaninstions and childish attempts at insults instead of factual counter arguments..... lots and lots of dimishing echos but little facts
Although to your credit you do post lots of unlinked facts from unknown sources speaking anonymously to our unnamed reporter on a completely unbiased left wing extremist blog page

[R650R]

Has anyone seen my camel?

Jasper Carrott on Youtube won't embed (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYYo49R_ZS0)

Thanks thats taking us all back to a better world . Is jasper still alive or did he get cancelled by political correctness...

Funny thing is in London you prob could have a genuine case of someone looking for a lost camel haha...


https://youtu.be/oYYo49R_ZS0

[Dadpole]

And I know umm correct when I get e reply of rabid characters assaninstions and childish attempts at insults instead of factual counter arguments..... lots and lots of dimishing echos but little facts

When you post such inane drivel don't be surprised when nobody deems you worthy of serious debate.

[TheDemonLord]

This was all being discussed on Telegram which is evidently a bastion of mental illness posing as free speech.


Was it?

I'm rather skeptical of that claim, given the nature of Telegram (end-to-end Encryption for anonymity) and the fact that there's no hard evidence put forward publicly.

[F5 Dave]

When you post such inane drivel don't be surprised when nobody deems you worthy of serious debate.
Think you spelt insane wrong:msn-wink:

[Dadpole]

Think you spelt insane wrong:msn-wink:

LOL. They both apply. :laugh:

[nerrrd]

This is appalling but not especially surprising to me.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-glen-eden-father-of-seven-dies-at-home-daughter-says-he-tried-to-get-help/BEKTBLTD3QY4FJEWHKCEJTPORQ/

I don't think you could call this "slipping through the cracks" given how hard the family appears to have tried to get help for him, just a complete failure of care.

Will be interesting to see what the official response is to this case (and the other home isolation deaths so far).

[Kickaha]

This is appalling but not especially surprising to me.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-glen-eden-father-of-seven-dies-at-home-daughter-says-he-tried-to-get-help/BEKTBLTD3QY4FJEWHKCEJTPORQ/

I don't think you could call this "slipping through the cracks" given how hard the family appears to have tried to get help for him, just a complete failure of care.

Will be interesting to see what the official response is to this case (and the other home isolation deaths so far).

That is fucking disgusting, they should have just rung an ambulance, I wonder if the others that died at home had a similar experience

[mashman]

This is appalling but not especially surprising to me.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-glen-eden-father-of-seven-dies-at-home-daughter-says-he-tried-to-get-help/BEKTBLTD3QY4FJEWHKCEJTPORQ/

I don't think you could call this "slipping through the cracks" given how hard the family appears to have tried to get help for him, just a complete failure of care.

Will be interesting to see what the official response is to this case (and the other home isolation deaths so far).

Wonder if he was a smoker... coz they left me to die at home for that reason over the period of 10 months. Eventually got hospitalised when Wifey picked up the phone and explained the situation as I kneeled hypoxic on the floor. Slipped through the cracks or written off by another complacent doctor? Likely the former, but hey, when the odds are in your favour, no need to examine people further, just play the odds and then say sorry afterwards.

[pritch]

Was it?

I'm rather skeptical of that claim, given the nature of Telegram (end-to-end Encryption for anonymity) and the fact that there's no hard evidence put forward publicly.

Be as skeptical as you like. I read a lot of news, probably much more than most. I have more time. If I see an item I may not necessarily recall where.

Parler was a noted RWNJ means of communication, and I did join to keep an eye on what the imbeciles were uo to. That was enough, I don't need further confirmation so I didn't sign up for Telegram.

Your faith in end to end encryption is touching but possibly misinformed? The idiots making the threats had used what appeared to be their real names and photographs.
I assume those receiving the messages can take screen shots? And bear in mind that some Telegram "influencers" have hundreds of thousand of subscribers, any one of whom could be a journalist, law enforcement, or just be sane.

[mulletman]

Cant understand why the PM wants to let AK people out of AK for the summer holidays...'covid is coming' (to the rest of NZ) says Chris Hipkins , knowingly letting possible infected people beyond AK is BS. Let AK people go level 1 in AK then see if it gets out of hand or not and whether the health system can cope Before letting them out to greater NZ.

Meanwhile Andrew Little said 'the system was only prepared for 100-120 hospital admissions a day not 150-200 , why gamble on other DHBs preparedness if AK ones are not coping ?

Sure it will get down here and get a foot hold somewhere and maybe other parts of NZ but why open the flood gates ?

[pritch]

Cant understand why the PM wants to let AK people out of AK for the summer holidays...'covid is coming' (to the rest of NZ) says Chris Hipkins , knowingly letting possible infected people beyond AK is BS. Let AK people go level 1 in AK then see if it gets out of hand or not and whether the health system can cope Before letting them out to greater NZ.

Meanwhile Andrew Little said 'the system was only prepared for 100-120 hospital admissions a day not 150-200 , why gamble on other DHBs preparedness if AK ones are not coping ?

Sure it will get down here and get a foot hold somewhere and maybe other parts of NZ but why open the flood gates ?

A major reason will be all of the pressure being applied by the opposition leader, David Seymour, and by minor party politicians like Judith Collins, as well as various industry spokespersons. All of whom are more concerned with money than with people, and who seem to believe the virus will work to their timetable.

[R650R]

Cant understand why the PM wants to let AK people out of AK for the summer holidays...'covid is coming' (to the rest of NZ) says Chris Hipkins , knowingly letting possible infected people beyond AK is BS. Let AK people go level 1 in AK then see if it gets out of hand or not and whether the health system can cope Before letting them out to greater NZ.

Meanwhile Andrew Little said 'the system was only prepared for 100-120 hospital admissions a day not 150-200 , why gamble on other DHBs preparedness if AK ones are not coping ?

Sure it will get down here and get a foot hold somewhere and maybe other parts of NZ but why open the flood gates ?

She is terrified of regime collapse. For weeks now we heard from the govt that Auckland couldnÂ’t/wouldnÂ’t sustain another level 4 lockdown for a variety of reasons.
Soon as she said that people saw the glint of weakness and ran with it...
Call them rentamob or whatever but the recent various large protests showed people are really worn out from the lockdowns and other stuff and prepared to break rules to protest.
She is terrified of having happen what is going on in Australia, and over there the police have way much more resources but only just keeping things in check.
Also itÂ’s at time of peak vaccine effectiveness for bulk of population so itÂ’s prob great time for exposure to help the body experience it and build immune system for the next strain that is coming.
And three million people on AucklandÂ’s beaches prob wouldnÂ’t end to well either....

LetÂ’s not forget the two shots for summer bro... weÂ’ve just had a big propoganda campaign to get vaxxed so we can go back to do the things we love, all that 90% bullshit too. So people would be asking why did we get jabbed if no freedoms etc.... they ran a slick media campaign and now they have to deliver or the illusion of success falls apart for them.
If you play poker long enough eventually someone calls your hand, JackieÂ’s been talking like she holding four aces....

[F5 Dave]

So it is propaganda to get people vaccinated is it?

Because of the desire to get chips into people yeah? Please tell us more oh wise one. Because we sooo respect what you say.:yawn:

[TheDemonLord]

Your faith in end to end encryption is touching but possibly misinformed? The idiots making the threats had used what appeared to be their real names and photographs.
I assume those receiving the messages can take screen shots? And bear in mind that some Telegram "influencers" have hundreds of thousand of subscribers, any one of whom could be a journalist, law enforcement, or just be sane.

Look, I'm not going to say 'False Flag', but you have a messaging system think Facebook Messenger (primarily 1 to 1 communication), as opposed to a distribution system (like Instagram) - which is primarily 1:1 communication with some group functionality - You want me to believe that people who are distrusting of the Government, would use their real identities and that one of them would be so upset at this, that they would take a screenshot and send it to the very institution(s) that they are opposed to?

Does that sound more reasonable or less reasonable than some Activist fabricating 'evidence' to 'justify' their actions?

But by all means, if you can show the original report, I'd be interested to read/see it - as I said, I'm skeptical.

[R650R]

Look, I'm not going to say 'False Flag', but you have a messaging system think Facebook Messenger (primarily 1 to 1 communication), as opposed to a distribution system (like Instagram) - which is primarily 1:1 communication with some group functionality - You want me to believe that people who are distrusting of the Government, would use their real identities and that one of them would be so upset at this, that they would take a screenshot and send it to the very institution(s) that they are opposed to?

Does that sound more reasonable or less reasonable than some Activist fabricating 'evidence' to 'justify' their actions?

But by all means, if you can show the original report, I'd be interested to read/see it - as I said, I'm skeptical.


Well they would if they were fake FBI patsies....

Anyone whose spent five mins reading into any conspiracies knows that “encryption” is only for govt agencies. Anything used by general public is WIDE OPEN to read via manufacturer installed backdoors in chipsets and devices/operating systems.
Quite surprised by the gangs caught up in all this, thosecfellas have lots of spare time to read in slammer and thought they’d be last to trust electronic Comms.
Even the KGB went back to typewriters 10 years ago as they kneecap anything could be cracked/ hacked read....

[pete376403]

Well they would if they were fake FBI patsies....

Even the KGB went back to typewriters 10 years ago as they kneecap anything could be cracked/ hacked read....IBM Selectric typewriters at the US Embassy in Wellington in the mid 80s (I serviced the typewriters as Thorndon was in my territory) had extra heavy flywheels on the motors as it was discovered that selection of each character put a different load on the motor, resulting in a variation of the hash/noise put on the power line. In theory this could be captured and decoded. The flywheel served to smooth out the motor under varying load. Would also have required the bad guys to have access to the power line the typewriter was plugged into but paranoia knows no bounds.

[nerrrd]

Cant understand why the PM wants to let AK people out of AK for the summer holidays...'covid is coming' (to the rest of NZ) says Chris Hipkins , knowingly letting possible infected people beyond AK is BS. Let AK people go level 1 in AK then see if it gets out of hand or not and whether the health system can cope Before letting them out to greater NZ.

Meanwhile Andrew Little said 'the system was only prepared for 100-120 hospital admissions a day not 150-200 , why gamble on other DHBs preparedness if AK ones are not coping ?

Sure it will get down here and get a foot hold somewhere and maybe other parts of NZ but why open the flood gates ?

I think they're still going to try to manage the border aren't they, so only the fully vaccinated and those who test negative will (in theory) get through? Isn't some explanation of how that is supposed to work coming this week? Might not turn out to be a practical option.

Auckland is already effectively at level 1 as far as a significant number of it's inhabitants are concerned, and has been for a while. Dropping restrictions here despite the rising numbers of cases is a a tacit acknowledgement of that. And that's a reasonable course of action under the circumstances, since there's only so much the authorities can do if enough people choose not to comply anymore.

The only game in town now is high levels of vaccination softening the blow enough for the country to get through the next couple of months relatively unscathed. If you look over at Victoria, that's going to mean 5 to 10-ish Covid deaths every day for a significant length of time (and bear in mind if you asked anyone in the know prior to Covid who had the better health system, Victoria or NZ, pretty sure they'd have said the former).

Still worth taking reasonable precautions yourself against catching it, regardless of what the Government is saying. By Xmas we should have a better idea of how well the vaccination program has actually worked and how our system is coping – who knows, maybe they've timed it perfectly and our numbers stay comparatively low.

[TheDemonLord]

IBM Selectric typewriters at the US Embassy in Wellington in the mid 80s (I serviced the typewriters as Thorndon was in my territory) had extra heavy flywheels on the motors as it was discovered that selection of each character put a different load on the motor, resulting in a variation of the hash/noise put on the power line. In theory this could be captured and decoded. The flywheel served to smooth out the motor under varying load. Would also have required the bad guys to have access to the power line the typewriter was plugged into but paranoia knows no bounds.

That sounds awfully similar to a bug that the British discovered in one of their encryption devices that was based off of the Enigma machine, they knew about it, but declined to tell anyone about, sold the machines to their allies knowing that they would be able to decrypt their messages if needed.

Buggered if I can remember any more details about it, but it rings a rather large bell.

[F5 Dave]

So reading the listener article over breakfast, prolly a month old, but a survey of the ICU organisations about the country - we have 3.6 ICU beds actually deployable with staff and machines per 100,000 peeps. Just 1 space ahead of Mexico. It has 1/2'd since 2001 through successive governments. So any politician standing and pointing the finger the other way should have it broken off.

[Naki Rat]

A 3 hour YouTube coverage of this US Senate hearing has been deleted by YouTube but this one of the highlights is still up, for now. The submissions to this hearing are troubling to say the least and despite me being double vax'd I can see why some of the anti brigade hold the views they do. Something not right is going on here.


https://youtu.be/lkVN3KwDfvI

[F5 Dave]

There's an awful lot of covid injuries. Far out swamping any lawyers trying to make money in merca.

[Naki Rat]

The way I'm seeing things it's a numbers game. There is definitely a chance of copping an adverse reaction to the vaccination but the odds are far lower for that than suffering a serious result if the virus comes on board. Collateral damage is one way of looking at this unfortunately.

The vaccine isn't totally protective but it significantly reduces your chances of contracting the virus and reduces the severity of symptoms if you do end up with a 'breakthrough' infection. Again a way to sway the statistics in your favour.

The governments (internationally) are shit scared of what this virus is capable of doing including to existing health systems and to their populations so they're cranking out the pro-vax propaganda because that's the only tool they have in their toolbox currently and they would be vilified if they failed to at least try to mitigate the fatality rate that's coming. Admitting to the vaccine injuries would be counterproductive in what is already a difficult sell to some sectors of the population with many of those being Maori and if fatalities are significantly higher in that group the government will be blamed on racial terms. A bit of a no win situation in that respect.

We're in for a rough time for the next year at least so batten down the hatches and we do whatever we can to be a survivor at the other end. I'm just glad we're in NZ and not in some of the more densely populated regions particularly in the Northern Hemisphere.

In regard to my approach in accepting my double vaccination I took measures to mitigate the risks, as I see things.

1. Microdose with aspirin prior to and for a week after vaccinations to minimise clotting potential.
2. Insist that the practitioner aspirates (draws back) the syringe prior to injecting the vaccine in to confirm that it is going into muscle tissue and not IV.
3. Drink plenty of water in the days following vaccination to maximise elimination of bodily byproducts resulting from the immune system stimulation that occurs.

In regard to my aspiration comment above this video explains it well:

https://youtu.be/HsACTX0_ihs

[FJRider]

No but you seem to spend a lot of time on there’s for an adult along with twatter and those other dark web forums you mention all time like channel 3 and nonymous...

I gets plenty enough material Fromm mainstream news sources to confirm my material pisted here.

And I know umm correct when I get e reply of rabid characters assaninstions and childish attempts at insults instead of factual counter arguments..... lots and lots of dimishing echos but little facts
Although to your credit you do post lots of unlinked facts from unknown sources speaking anonymously to our unnamed reporter on a completely unbiased left wing extremist blog page

Perhaps ... you need to install Spellcheck on your computer ... :yes:


Just saying ... ;)

[F5 Dave]

The way I'm seeing things it's a numbers game. There is definitely a chance of copping an adverse reaction to the vaccination but the odds are far lower for that than suffering a serious result if the virus comes on board. Collateral damage is one way of looking at this unfortunately.

The vaccine isn't totally protective but it significantly reduces your chances of contracting the virus and reduces the severity of symptoms if you do end up with a 'breakthrough' infection. Again a way to sway the statistics in your favour.

The governments (internationally) are shit scared of what this virus is capable of doing including to existing health systems and to their populations so they're cranking out the pro-vax propaganda because that's the only tool they have in their toolbox currently and they would be vilified if they failed to at least try to mitigate the fatality rate that's coming. Admitting to the vaccine injuries would be counterproductive in what is already a difficult sell to some sectors of the population with many of those being Maori and if fatalities are significantly higher in that group the government will be blamed on racial terms. A bit of a no win situation in that respect.

We're in for a rough time for the next year at least so batten down the hatches and we do whatever we can to be a survivor at the other end. I'm just glad we're in NZ and not in some of the more densely populated regions particularly in the Northern Hemisphere.

In regard to my approach in accepting my double vaccination I took measures to mitigate the risks, as I see things.

1. Microdose with aspirin prior to and for a week after vaccinations to minimise clotting potential.
2. Insist that the practitioner aspirates (draws back) the syringe prior to injecting the vaccine in to confirm that it is going into muscle tissue and not IV.
3. Drink plenty of water in the days following vaccination to maximise elimination of bodily byproducts resulting from the immune system stimulation that occurs.

In regard to my aspiration comment above this video explains it well:

https://youtu.be/HsACTX0_ihs
Did you get the AstraZeneca vaccine? Because you sound a little confused.

[mashman]

'Most vaccinated' place on earth cancels Christmas (https://www.rt.com/news/540442-gibraltar-cancels-christmas-covid/)... obviously they need more boosters.

[MarkH]

How bad would it be if there was a country filled with anti-vaxxers?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/russia-the-nation-with-half-a-million-secret-covid-19-deaths/I645MUOXB4XZVXV5VTXOGYJMWQ/

Shit, real bad. I guess that answers the question - "why not just let everyone decide for themselves if they want a vaccine or not?". It should be obvious why many governments are putting pressure on their citizens to get vaccinated.

[F5 Dave]

Well it's a good thing those ruskies didn't get vaccinated. I hear the side effects include bitching about how spoons stick to you or make you unlucky at poker. . . . Whilst still being alive.

[R650R]

I see Jackie girl has abandoned the 90% project already. Guess they fed their computer model for that gamble the same favourable data they cherry pick for their climate models. So nice when real world data trumps the experts best guess....

Now you can’t leave Auckland (at the great escape date) unless your double vaxxed or produce negative tests within 72hrs... BUT the great unwashed(unvaxced)south of the border can freely ENTER but it’s all a bit Hotel California cause once you check in you can’t leave!
Or do they not care about those people being super spreaders back to provinces????

And those 72 hr tests are worthless in busy metropolitan environment where between testing and leaving you could have an exposure event.
Do they think anything through or just do stuff to make it look like they care?
You couldn’t make up a comedy script this good!!!!

[husaberg]

And those 72 hr tests are worthless in busy metropolitan environment where between testing and leaving you could have an exposure event.
!
Exactly what is your medical or scientific training again?
its going to be interesting to see you avoid this question again...........you know just for the sake of consistency....
Because its rather odd that a truck driver would know more than medical and scientific professionals about medicine and science.
like how you first said covid was a hoax
Then it was nothing to worry about
Then how people didn't die from it
then how we didn't need the lock downs and control
then how masks were some sort of conspiracy
now its they are not doing enough to stop its spread
Anyone would think you were just trolling for attention...:killingme
like stevo the sockcucker, yokel or asstingr.

[Berries]

Now you can’t leave Auckland (at the great escape date) unless your double vaxxed or produce negative tests within 72hrs... BUT the great unwashed(unvaxced)south of the border can freely ENTER but it’s all a bit Hotel California cause once you check in you can’t leave
I bet there are thousands of people straining at the bit to get in to Auckland as soon as possible.

[Berries]

Not.





mfc10ch

[R650R]

I bet there are thousands of people straining at the bit to get in to Auckland as soon as possible.

You’d be surprised... let’s not forget modern lifestyles.... long distance relationships, training/work opportunities, specialist recreation areas/activities, plain old catching up with family and friends.

[MarkH]

I bet there are thousands of people straining at the bit to get in to Auckland as soon as possible.

I lived in Auckland for 15 years, got some friends there that I'd like to catch up with. I'm fully vaxxed, so I'm just waiting for Auntie Cindy to let me know it is OK to see my Auckland friends.

[FJRider]

Not.





mfc10ch

Auckland ... the gateway to Covid. Go and see if your vaccine actually works.



Or not ...






What could possibly go wrong ... ??

[pritch]

You’d be surprised... let’s not forget modern lifestyles.... long distance relationships, training/work opportunities, specialist recreation areas/activities, plain old catching up with family and friends.

Specialist recreation activities? Stealing motorbikes, dealing meth, robbing dairies and liquor stores, listening to gang shoot outs?
I'd be surpised if anybody much at all wanted to go to Auckland. It would be a long way down my list.

[R650R]

Specialist recreation activities? Stealing motorbikes, dealing meth, robbing dairies and liquor stores, listening to gang shoot outs?
I'd be surpised if anybody much at all wanted to go to Auckland. It would be a long way down my list.

Sadly non of those activities are confined to Auckland. They are endemic in all areas of NZ. It’s just the bigger population and more media gets it coverage.
A recent article summarising court case of gang shootout outside nightclub reported 13 gang related shootouts in a 15 month period in HB. Pretty much only the McDonalds burgers and nightclub one made news.

[pritch]

Sadly non of those activities are confined to Auckland. They are endemic in all areas of NZ. It’s just the bigger population and more media gets it coverage.
A recent article summarising court case of gang shootout outside nightclub reported 13 gang related shootouts in a 15 month period in HB. Pretty much only the McDonalds burgers and nightclub one made news.

On one occasion when I was flying out of the country I mistakenly booked a motel in South Auckland so as to be handy to the airport for the early start. The area around the motel was like another country. Shops boarded up, everything was tagged. Almost every shop that remained was a liquor shop, the others were curry shops. Although, to be fair, the curry shop I used served great curry. Most New Zealanders don't even know what sad broken arsed places large chunks of Auckland are.

[TheDemonLord]

On one occasion when I was flying out of the country I mistakenly booked a motel in South Auckland so as to be handy to the airport for the early start. The area around the motel was like another country. Shops boarded up, everything was tagged. Almost every shop that remained was a liquor shop, the others were curry shops. Although, to be fair, the curry shop I used served great curry. Most New Zealanders don't even know what sad broken arsed places large chunks of Auckland are.

Quoting for Truth.

[jato]

On one occasion when I was flying out of the country I mistakenly booked a motel in South Auckland so as to be handy to the airport for the early start. The area around the motel was like another country. Shops boarded up, everything was tagged. Almost every shop that remained was a liquor shop, the others were curry shops. Although, to be fair, the curry shop I used served great curry. Most New Zealanders don't even know what sad broken arsed places large chunks of Auckland are.

I would agree with that - a fair few years ago i accompanied a badly hurt racer to middlemore on a sunday afternoon and emerged from the hospital in the early hours of monday morning only to get myself lost trying to head south. one of my (many) wrong turns in the van was into a dodgy backstreet of maybe Otahuhu and out of the gloom came 30 or so creatures that appeared to try and block me in ... i was in no mood for that and managed a meaningful 3 point turn and gunned the mitsi out of there ... if you were a lost tourist and stopped to ask for directions you would likely of made the front page of the Herald.

[eldog]

Petticoat Junction 7x08 Sorry Doctor, I ain’t takin’ no shots

:doctor:

Still relevant today

[eldog]

A week or so ago, 3 of my friends passed away, within 1 week.

1 died a week after diagnosis of cancer.
1 died after a long battle with cancer and other issues

1 died after trauma at home, self induced accident. Went to hospital, expecting only xrays and a couple of broken ribs, out in a few days .... Tested and diagnosed with Covid, was double jabbed.
Surprised everyone. Passed away a few days later. Shocked everyone. May not have died from C19 directly, but it sure didn’t help things.


a few days later, I met a person who had had C19 when in UK about a year earlier, told me it laid him down for 4 days. 2 of his friends fit and in their 30’s passed away.

Sure made me me happy I am double jabbed. As well as flu jab this year.

Sobering.

[R650R]

I would agree with that - a fair few years ago i accompanied a badly hurt racer to middlemore on a sunday afternoon and emerged from the hospital in the early hours of monday morning only to get myself lost trying to head south. one of my (many) wrong turns in the van was into a dodgy backstreet of maybe Otahuhu and out of the gloom came 30 or so creatures that appeared to try and block me in ... i was in no mood for that and managed a meaningful 3 point turn and gunned the mitsi out of there ... if you were a lost tourist and stopped to ask for directions you would likely of made the front page of the Herald.

Otahuhu is a nice place. 20 years ago I used to deliver booze to south and west Auckland and I never had a problem with anyone except one rich lady in Kelston who refused to drive around my truck parked on the “wrong” side of carpark lanes while I unloaded... admittedly it’s prob gone downhill a bit since then but so has the whole country with the meth epidemic.
One thing that stuck in my mind though at time was little suburb setvof four shops down a culdesac in Wymondley which is a poorer sub section of greater Otara.
It was the ONLY store at time to have two full time security gaurds at door in daytime. They didnÂ’t wear a uniform but you knew who they were!
Anyhow those chaps were prob just checking you werenÂ’t a rival gang. If your a normal person going about business and respectful to others your fine.

[R650R]

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300459073/covid19-positive-case-in-hawkes-bay-case-given-permission-to-travel-from-auckland

Another cover up in progress???? It’s funny how one minute they release details of people’s occupations and reasons for travel and vaccines status quite freely then reverts to oh we don’t know another time.

This case was included in Akld numbers as it says they were tested there before they were given permission to travel to HB. Close contacts already tested negative that means they’d must have known on Friday to get all that done.
No locations of interest yet? Like how long does it take to ask someone where they been?
A repeat of our last case where they said no location interest then added kmart next day...

I feel sorry for the vulnerable people out there who will be worried needlessly by this lack of information. They shouldn’t say anything until they know all the details.

[R650R]

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300459073/covid19-positive-case-in-hawkes-bay-case-given-permission-to-travel-from-auckland

Another cover up in progress???? It’s funny how one minute they release details of people’s occupations and reasons for travel and vaccines status quite freely then reverts to oh we don’t know another time.

This case was included in Akld numbers as it says they were tested there before they were given permission to travel to HB. Close contacts already tested negative that means they’d must have known on Friday to get all that done.
No locations of interest yet? Like how long does it take to ask someone where they been?
A repeat of our last case where they said no location interest then added kmart next day...

I feel sorry for the vulnerable people out there who will be worried needlessly by this lack of information. They shouldn’t say anything until they know all the details.

Hoho ho it’s all unraveling big time now....

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/hawkes-bay-today/news/covid-19-delta-outbreak-two-napier-locations-of-interest-revealed

Been in HB since Monday last week!
They can’t decide which day he was in book store correctly....
Two police officers exposed....
Another article reports local DHB only knew because a family member queried it.
UNBELIEVEAble incompetence....
Popular liquor store also visited... that is in close proximity to all the major takeaway outlets....

[husaberg]

Hoho ho it’s all unraveling big time now....

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/hawkes-bay-today/news/covid-19-delta-outbreak-two-napier-locations-of-interest-revealed

...
oddly you were calling out how restrictions were earlier totally uncalled for .........

The noun Pandemic is not mentioned in that post, does one not understand grammar.

Every disease is a Pandemic in the modern world as they all spread “across the country or roundvthe world”.

1600 people sick in a country of 5 million is no crisis worth destroying jobs and lives for.
You must be kind of special. Were you too busy trolling to notice you were earlier not in favour of restrictions?
Yet now the GOVT is not doing enough....
Maybe you would like to explain how you were wrong earlier or are you just wrong now.
It will interesting to see you ignore the rather obvious hypocrisy of your posts. As per usual

[R650R]

I see we’re past 10k cases now including season one total of 2000ish....

Interestingly original covid gone completely and now all cases are delta????

And how come we got a steady rate of 200ish new cases a day given how contagious it is, you’d think the growth would be non linear....

[nerrrd]

And how come we got a steady rate of 200ish new cases a day given how contagious it is, you’d think the growth would be non linear....

It’s almost as if there might be some preventative measures we could take which might limit the spread…

[Kendog]

I see we’re past 10k cases now including season one total of 2000ish....

Interestingly original covid gone completely and now all cases are delta????

And how come we got a steady rate of 200ish new cases a day given how contagious it is, you’d think the growth would be non linear....

I agree with you R650R, the govt are doing an amazing job managing the country so that we don’t have a linear growth in cases.

[ief]

Do you lot ever consider that you both might be wrong/ right?

Perhaps you should.

[TheDemonLord]

Do you lot ever consider that you both might be wrong/ right?

it wouldn't be half as much fun if that were the case...

[ief]

Lol,

one ever witnessed a discussion between christians and moslims?

If you're an athiest that's quit something... this seems more the former sort, hehe.

Bunch of know it alls who know zilch pretending to know the truth...

Carry on ;)

[R650R]

Hoho ho it’s all unraveling big time now....

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/hawkes-bay-today/news/covid-19-delta-outbreak-two-napier-locations-of-interest-revealed

Been in HB since Monday last week!
They can’t decide which day he was in book store correctly....
Two police officers exposed....
Another article reports local DHB only knew because a family member queried it.
UNBELIEVEAble incompetence....
Popular liquor store also visited... that is in close proximity to all the major takeaway outlets....

It keeps getting better....

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/hawkes-bay-today/news/covid-19-delta-outbreak-concern-in-napier-over-movements-of-covid-19-case-who-arrived-from-auckland

Both stores were advised they did not need to do a deep clean.... this is in great contrast to anywhere else a previous delta case has visited. Still no details about the person which actually tells you a lot when you understand the things this govt doesn’t like to talk about....

[mulletman]

I agree with you R650R, the govt are doing an amazing job managing the country so that we don’t have a linear growth in cases.


Were doing....until they let Aucklanders leave Auckland thats coming up.

[husaberg]

It keeps getting better....

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/hawkes-bay-today/news/covid-19-delta-outbreak-concern-in-napier-over-movements-of-covid-19-case-who-arrived-from-auckland

Both stores were advised they did not need to do a deep clean.... this is in great contrast to anywhere else a previous delta case has visited. Still no details about the person which actually tells you a lot when you understand the things this govt doesn’t like to talk about....


odd as you said this earlier


The noun Pandemic is not mentioned in that post, does one not understand grammar.

Every disease is a Pandemic in the modern world as they all spread “across the country or roundvthe world”.

1600 people sick in a country of 5 million is no crisis worth destroying jobs and lives for.

Your odds of dying from Covid in NZ is about the same as winning Powerball....
People dream of winning powerball, actively visit known powerball superspreader hot zones twice a week in hope of winning...

Meanwhile about 6 times as many people die in drink drive car crashes.
We even have mass random surveillance testing for that too, typically about 1.5-2% are ‘ infected’ with the influence of alcohol.....
Would we tolerate say a 24hr lockdown every time you bought a beer at bar?
Or after your night at the bar you don’t leave through the front door, a govt agent escorts you to a ‘quarantine ‘ facility which you can’t leave for 24 hrs.
Just imagine that, we would ABSOLUTELY save 150 lives a year
The govt will NEVER do that so why all this crap with the virus where the potential victim has a 93% chance of not even needing hospital treatment...


Well it seems the MORE deadly and MORE contagious delta variant failed to deliver... just think about that, the infected person came on a flight where people would have taken masks off at times to eat and drink and all shared the same inflight tier facilities. THEN they sauntered all over a MAJOR metropolitan area and thefe was no outbreak.
Guess that’s why an ever nastier version lambda? Starts with L has just been “ discovered”....

Oh but we’ve locked down so quick, yes but not before the exposure events and not before all those exposed on weekends away returned to provincial centres.

One has to wonder if the new respiratory infection in young kids is a result of the sterility of lockdown life not letting there immune systems learn properly in early development months as the age band is very low.


So many vids about the Biden regime now investigating the “ outrageous” wuhan lab conspiracy its hard to choose which one to post 😂😂😂😂😂

Well well well, our journey into communist hell continues.

There has only been 1650 alleged cases (out of 700,000 tests!!!!) of the virus, but what has spread faster has been submission to communist control.
Nearly 2 million have downloaded the Covid app so you can be sent to a govt “ health” camp to catch the virus if you didnt already have it.

But yay 3 million kiwis have said no to turning their phone into govt spy device.

Tommorow is D-day, public transport will be the barometer of how many of us have rolled belly up to mask wearing.
Hopefully most will say screw this shit and drive their cars to work.

You don’t have to wear a mask if it affects your physical or mental health and you do NOT need to present documents to prove this.

Out and about it’s refreshing to see nearly No one scanning the qr code thingy.

It’s quite clear now as the mountain of contradictions grow that it’s not about stopping the “virus”..


Masks are for destroying social interaction and communication with strangers. You know those moments in life when some shitbag is bashing his missus and enough of you make visual contact to know you’ve got each other back and intervene.
But with masks there will never be any Flight 93 “lets roll” moments of bravery, you’ll never know if your fellow citizen is a Karen or Stasi as you reluctantly board the blacked out train carriage...
A cop will never see your friendly smile, never know you like them and not let you off that minor stop sign indescretion...



As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????




The media are tripping over themselves trying to solve the mystery of why Africans aren't dying from covid as badly as the west.
Africans routinely take a cheap safe anti malaria drug invented in n 1960's called hydroxychloroquine....
Scooby Doo would solve that puzzle faster

[MarkH]

Were doing....until they let Aucklanders leave Auckland thats coming up.

Wait, what is the issue with that? You are not really suggesting that the >90% vaccinated Aucklanders should be locked in to their city forever are you?

[Naki Rat]

Did you get the AstraZeneca vaccine? Because you sound a little confused.Thrombosis risk isn't restricted to the AstraZeneca vaccine, which I imagine is where you're coming from. There have been a few cases of this following Pfizer vaccine in Aussie. Besides it's not as though microdosing with aspirin is a major imposition if it mitigates a risk factor.

[husaberg]

Wait, what is the issue with that? You are not really suggesting that the >90% vaccinated Aucklanders should be locked in to their city forever are you?
As far as i am concerned they should be all taken to the Great Pit of Carkoon and thrown in to feed the Sarlacc

[pete376403]

remind you of anyone?

[Berries]

Wait, what is the issue with that? You are not really suggesting that the >90% vaccinated Aucklanders should be locked in to their city forever are you?
Burn them.

Burn them all.

[mulletman]

Wait, what is the issue with that? You are not really suggesting that the >90% vaccinated Aucklanders should be locked in to their city forever are you?

No , let Auckland go green now and see if the 90% works out ok , ya got loads of beaches , malls and whatever else most people seem to want, if the infection rates dont take off let them loose in Jan sometime.

[MarkH]

No , let Auckland go green now and see if the 90% works out ok , ya got loads of beaches , malls and whatever else most people seem to want, if the infection rates dont take off let them loose in Jan sometime.

I think you are delusional. There are over 1.5m Aucklanders and many must have friends & family outside of those borders. With weddings & funerals and other events happening that they are missing out on, surely you could understand why fully vaxxed people in Auckland would be very unhappy at the way this government is treating them. Auckland are not going to be going green for quite some time, but the fully vaxxed Aucklanders will be getting a bunch of freedoms which is well deserved IMO. I'm glad I'm not still in Auckland, they will be up around 15 weeks of lock-down by the time they get to change to the red light status next week.

[pete376403]

And now there is another variation (B.1.1.529) that will make C-19 seem almost benign - at present mostly in South Africa but at least one case in Hong Kong so expect here eventually.

[husaberg]

And now there is another variation (B.1.1.529) that will make C-19 seem almost benign - at present mostly in South Africa but at least one case in Hong Kong so expect here eventually.
how could that be pete our resident covid expert said africans had the covid cure all along

The media are tripping over themselves trying to solve the mystery of why Africans aren't dying from covid as badly as the west.
Africans routinely take a cheap safe anti malaria drug invented in n 1960's called hydroxychloroquine....
Scooby Doo would solve that puzzle faster

Nothing to do with Trump.
If you widened your reading circle to sources outside the mainstream media machine you’ll find plenty of independant sources were saying hey we experimented with this and had some success.

Hydroxyclhoriquine has been around since 60’s been used years officially as anti malaria drug and its super cheap.

This statement has been fact checked and found to be true.

[R650R]

And now there is another variation (B.1.1.529) that will make C-19 seem almost benign - at present mostly in South Africa but at least one case in Hong Kong so expect here eventually.

Right on que I called that earlier.... forgot to start a thread about the names for next varieties....

But you can’t make up stuff like this.... the latest version is called Nu....

Even deadlier than the deadlier delta which was deadlier than the original season one deadly flavour...
Told you all ages ago this never ends, I’m gonna buy more shares in pfizzler

[nerrrd]

Right on que I called that earlier.... forgot to start a thread about the names for next varieties....

But you can’t make up stuff like this.... the latest version is called Nu....

Even deadlier than the deadlier delta which was deadlier than the original season one deadly flavour...
Told you all ages ago this never ends, I’m gonna buy more shares in pfizzler

Instead of making it up you might like to familiarise yourself with the Greek alphabet.

Too soon to call whether this is anything to worry about, ‘lambda’ was in the news a while back and has faded from view.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/covid-19-coronavirus-lambda-variant-may-be-more-dangerous-than-delta/DYS3HGZQQMQOOVYHIB6DSZR5FI/

[husaberg]

Right on que I called that earlier....
This post of yours is at odds with reality.
https://i.pinimg.com/600x315/52/1a/46/521a46c6292d0574c1054b762b0f0b85.jpg
first you said it was a fake flu
then it was created in a lab
then its harmless
then its ultra deadly as and not being managed correctly
then its cured by this
then its something you put in your bottom for pleasure.
then you say you called it from the start..please

[mulletman]

I think you are delusional. There are over 1.5m Aucklanders and many must have friends & family outside of those borders. With weddings & funerals and other events happening that they are missing out on, surely you could understand why fully vaxxed people in Auckland would be very unhappy at the way this government is treating them. Auckland are not going to be going green for quite some time, but the fully vaxxed Aucklanders will be getting a bunch of freedoms which is well deserved IMO. I'm glad I'm not still in Auckland, they will be up around 15 weeks of lock-down by the time they get to change to the red light status next week.


Yes its crap for Aucklanders....but why possibly make it crap for the rest of NZ ?

What you're implying is fully vaxd people are not capable of spreading C19 - thats delusional.

[R650R]

Instead of making it up you might like to familiarise yourself with the Greek alphabet.

Too soon to call whether this is anything to worry about, ‘lambda’ was in the news a while back and has faded from view.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/covid-19-coronavirus-lambda-variant-may-be-more-dangerous-than-delta/DYS3HGZQQMQOOVYHIB6DSZR5FI/

I see the marketing dept has rebranded it Omnicron but in earlier stories it was going to be called Nu

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/botswana-new-covid-variant-nu-south-africa-vaccines-b968170.html


https://youtu.be/WZhFPXi86fg

[R650R]

I think you are delusional. There are over 1.5m Aucklanders and many must have friends & family outside of those borders. With weddings & funerals and other events happening that they are missing out on, surely you could understand why fully vaxxed people in Auckland would be very unhappy at the way this government is treating them. Auckland are not going to be going green for quite some time, but the fully vaxxed Aucklanders will be getting a bunch of freedoms which is well deserved IMO. I'm glad I'm not still in Auckland, they will be up around 15 weeks of lock-down by the time they get to change to the red light status next week.

Exactly right. The cities on a knife edge the protests show that and the situation in Australia shows what were in for if we try to coup people up in a hot humid akld summer. People love to bash Auckland, religion and racial minorities but it’s quite clear the virus is spreading around NZ now through the various people that have to travel in professional/occupational capacity.
But wait there’s more.... the new version is going to be another excuse to rejigger lockdown/traffic light levels when that arrives.
The timing couldn’t be worse for NZ, as usual a dollar too short and a day too late our new strategy and system is out of date already....

[nerrrd]

I see the marketing dept has rebranded it Omnicron but in earlier stories it was going to be called Nu

Or the early reporting was wrong and it was a later variant all along (...Lambda, Mu, Nu, Xi, Omicron, Pi, Rho etc...). But yes, Omicron sounds way cooler.

[mashman]

So, at the approximate end of year 1 we had Alpha, Beta and the beginnings of Delta. Today we have Omicron, which is another 9 letters, variants, after Delta in about the same period of time. That's some gain of function. With any luck the findings of Mike Yeadon and crew will hold with regards to the shifts in variant being tiny, therefore allowing the vaccines to afford some protection against further mutations. Failing that, just carry a piece of paper around so that you can say you made the effort to stamp it out despite it getting so far... bugga that the product released to do that job was never designed to do that job... but hey, your piece of paper makes you more special than me and therefore I am in awe of your superior morality despite you continuing to go about destroying the very place you and future generations rely on for life whilst telling me that I'm likely to do that if I catch a cold :killingme........

[husaberg]

So, at the approximate end of year 1 we had Alpha, Beta and the beginnings of Delta. Today we have Omicron, which is another 9 letters, variants, after Delta in about the same period of time. That's some gain of function. With any luck the findings of Mike Yeadon and crew will hold with regards to the shifts in variant being tiny, therefore allowing the vaccines to afford some protection against further mutations. Failing that, just carry a piece of paper around so that you can say you made the effort to stamp it out despite it getting so far... bugga that the product released to do that job was never designed to do that job... but hey, your piece of paper makes you more special than me and therefore I am in awe of your superior morality despite you continuing to go about destroying the very place you and future generations rely on for life whilst telling me that I'm likely to do that if I catch a cold :killingme........
Yet you were the guy that earlier claimed there was a 100% successful cure earlier for Covid.


Yes. Tens of thousands of lives have been saved using multi-drug therapies. When an Ozzy MP and a Multi-Drug therapy doctor from california compared notes relatively recently, Oz had 7000 cases, 450ish hospitalisation and 100+ deaths. The Doc from cali has treated 6000 covid cases with his multi-drug therapy. 4 required a visit to hospital and 0 died. Not hard to track. That Doc has been doing this since Oct 2020. Mucculough back in June/July 2020 enough so to produce an as yet to be peer reviewed paper. I'm not sure how many the other 500, at least, doctors have saved, but they're all still practicing given their success ratio is somewhat kick ass and them using nothing but their medical training to apply drugs appropriately. There are noises being made regarding Italy's successful use of HCQ (devil drug) used in multi-drug therapies is working wonders for keeping people away from hospitals and death, but as yet I'm yet to find any concrete numbers on that. And so on.

So yes. Very much yes. Done and dusted yes. Why still unrecognised? Your guess is as good as mine.

[F5 Dave]

That's because he's a completely stupid cunt.

[nerrrd]

I see the marketing dept has rebranded it Omnicron but in earlier stories it was going to be called Nu

Yes indeed you’re right, it was a marketing decision, they chose to skip Nu and Xi.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127121064/covid19-why-its-called-omicron-and-everything-else-you-need-to-know-about-the-new-variant

[pete376403]

Yes indeed you’re right, it was a marketing decision, they chose to skip Nu and Xi.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127121064/covid19-why-its-called-omicron-and-everything-else-you-need-to-know-about-the-new-variant

"The WHO said Nu was too easily confounded with the word “new”, while Xi was a common surname." - especially among Chinese Premiers, who are known to take offence at things that may or may not be directed against them. I guess its safe to say there will not be a Pooh (bear) variant, either https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/new-covid-variant-called-omicron-not-xi-avoid-offending-chinese/

[R650R]

Well here comes the traffic light bullshit system. Just like real traffic lights there being installed in the name of safety but restricting movement more.

Sorry granny you can’t come to lil Johnny’s fifth birthday at the restaurant or your daughters wedding reception because you don’t own a smartphone and will never learn to use one even if it was free.
This is total heartless bullshit that businesses won’t be able to accept the purple card or letter of vax.
The phone system is still open to abuse, we all know certain segments of society’s will happily lend their phone to an unvaxxed to go getvtakeaways etc....
And yet another govt app your Zforced to download and install.

And it makes no sense at all for one region to be red but people still allowed to travel to other regions and do things there they wouldn’t be allowed in own region eg go gym.

[F5 Dave]

Because the virus cares about what's fair.

Everyone is a winner and everyone gets a participation prize. Happy now?

[R650R]

This post has been edited by a moderator so is no longer valid

[husaberg]

Well here comes the traffic light bullshit system. Just like real traffic lights there being installed in the name of safety but restricting movement more.

Sorry granny you can’t come to lil Johnny’s fifth birthday at the restaurant or your daughters wedding reception because you don’t own a smartphone and will never learn to use one even if it was free.
This is total heartless bullshit that businesses won’t be able to accept the purple card or letter of vax.
The phone system is still open to abuse, we all know certain segments of society’s will happily lend their phone to an unvaxxed to go getvtakeaways etc....
And yet another govt app your Zforced to download and install.

And it makes no sense at all for one region to be red but people still allowed to travel to other regions and do things there they wouldn’t be allowed in own region eg go gym.


Unbelievable.... ministry doesn’t list workplace as location of interest....

Makes a mockery of all the official information we have been given about how contagious this virus is....

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-auto-repair-business-in-hastings-closed-for-10-days-after-staff-member-tests-positive/XPSTSGNOQMLG6PL4B4UASPH274/


Do you consider it odd that the DHB have never asked you about what they should do
Or could it be that they are the actual experts in this and you are not equipped to offer help as you are neither qualified or have the capacity to think logically.

I find it funny how ll of a sudden you are thinking they are not taking it seriously enough as for the last year you have been snipping they have not done enough.



The noun Pandemic is not mentioned in that post, does one not understand grammar.


Every disease is a Pandemic in the modern world as they all spread “across the country or roundvthe world”.

1600 people sick in a country of 5 million is no crisis worth destroying jobs and lives for.

Your odds of dying from Covid in NZ is about the same as winning Powerball....

People dream of winning powerball, actively visit known powerball superspreader hot zones twice a week in hope of winning...

Meanwhile about 6 times as many people die in drink drive car crashes.
We even have mass random surveillance testing for that too, typically about 1.5-2% are ‘ infected’ with the influence of alcohol.....
Would we tolerate say a 24hr lockdown every time you bought a beer at bar?
Or after your night at the bar you don’t leave through the front door, a govt agent escorts you to a ‘quarantine ‘ facility which you can’t leave for 24 hrs.
Just imagine that, we would ABSOLUTELY save 150 lives a year
The govt will NEVER do that so why all this crap with the virus where the potential victim has a 93% chance of not even needing hospital treatment...


Well it seems the MORE deadly and MORE contagious delta variant failed to deliver... just think about that, the infected person came on a flight where people would have taken masks off at times to eat and drink and all shared the same inflight tier facilities. THEN they sauntered all over a MAJOR metropolitan area and thefe was no outbreak.

Guess that’s why an ever nastier version lambda? Starts with L has just been “ discovered”....

Oh but we’ve locked down so quick, yes but not before the exposure events and not before all those exposed on weekends away returned to provincial centres.

One has to wonder if the new respiratory infection in young kids is a result of the sterility of lockdown life not letting there immune systems learn properly in early development months as the age band is very low.


So many vids about the Biden regime now investigating the “ outrageous” wuhan lab conspiracy its hard to choose which one to post ����������

Well well well, our journey into communist hell continues.


There has only been 1650 alleged cases (out of 700,000 tests!!!!) of the virus, but what has spread faster has been submission to communist control.
Nearly 2 million have downloaded the Covid app so you can be sent to a govt “ health” camp to catch the virus if you didnt already have it.

But yay 3 million kiwis have said no to turning their phone into govt spy device.

Tommorow is D-day, public transport will be the barometer of how many of us have rolled belly up to mask wearing.
Hopefully most will say screw this shit and drive their cars to work.

You don’t have to wear a mask if it affects your physical or mental health and you do NOT need to present documents to prove this.

Out and about it’s refreshing to see nearly No one scanning the qr code thingy.

It’s quite clear now as the mountain of contradictions grow that it’s not about stopping the “virus”..


Masks are for destroying social interaction and communication with strangers. You know those moments in life when some shitbag is bashing his missus and enough of you make visual contact to know you’ve got each other back and intervene.
But with masks there will never be any Flight 93 “lets roll” moments of bravery, you’ll never know if your fellow citizen is a Karen or Stasi as you reluctantly board the blacked out train carriage...
A cop will never see your friendly smile, never know you like them and not let you off that minor stop sign indescretion...



As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????

[mashman]

The epidemiological relevance of the COVID-19-vaccinated population is increasing (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanepe/article/PIIS2666-7762(21)00258-1/fulltext)

"Many decisionmakers assume that the vaccinated can be excluded as a source of transmission. It appears to be grossly negligent to ignore the vaccinated population as a possible and relevant source of transmission when deciding about public health control measures.".

Yeah, but decision makers backed into a corner by a vaccinated mob screaming that the entire population needs to be vaccinated coz they too think otherwise....... comedic. The blind leading the blind.

"In Israel a nosocomial outbreak was reported involving 16 healthcare workers, 23 exposed patients and two family members. The source was a fully vaccinated COVID-19 patient. The vaccination rate was 96.2% among all exposed individuals (151 healthcare workers and 97 patients). Fourteen fully vaccinated patients became severely ill or died, the two unvaccinated patients developed mild disease [[4]]".

Box office takings for The Matrix will be probably be down lol... on absolutely no scientific grounds. Massa will be pleased

[onearmedbandit]

This post has been edited by a moderator so is no longer valid

Political interference? What are you on about? I fixed your broken link, so it actually went to the page you were referencing.

[F5 Dave]

No man, you are really a lizard elite suppressing his truth radiance.

[husaberg]

This post has been edited by a moderator so is no longer valid
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-6ac474452fd4b502a3d273f781e56ae8-lq

[R650R]

Big u-turn by govt on takeaway food outlet workers......

Surely one of the highest risk exposure places so why the change of heart....

Especially when it’s a place the demographic of the unvax is likely to be proportionally visited more by the unvax...,

Logic????

[husaberg]

Big u-turn by govt on takeaway food outlet workers......

Surely one of the highest risk exposure places so why the change of heart....

Especially when it’s a place the demographic of the unvax is likely to be proportionally visited more by the unvax...,

Logic????

Logically as a truck driver we expect you to know less than a scientist or medical professional, yet because of the dunning kruger effect, a tiny pecker and underlying issues with sexual performance, You actually believe you are qualified to suggest opinions relating to epidemiology and medicine.

[mashman]

Big u-turn by govt on takeaway food outlet workers......

Surely one of the highest risk exposure places so why the change of heart....

Especially when it’s a place the demographic of the unvax is likely to be proportionally visited more by the unvax...,

Logic????

Studies have found that the virus prefers fine dining.

[nerrrd]

Wasn’t it just confusion over whether a takeaway qualifies as a retail business or hospitality business? If nobody sits down to eat, surely that’s no different to a supermarket (retail).

[R650R]

Studies have found that the virus prefers fine dining.

Lol I’ve noticed also now that when there is an exposure event they only say people who were in store at certain time have to go get test. Where as prev if you were somewhere on same day you had to get tested. Is the virus supposed to be highly contagious or not?

I see businesses are having trouble with how many passes they’ve have to check as govt said reasonable amount. I would have thought under commie dictatorship reasonable means all of them lol...

I think even vaccinated people are going to prefer to use businesses that opt not to check purely to avoid the hassle, and what’s the point of worrying if we have close enough to 90% anyway

[mashman]

Lol I’ve noticed also now that when there is an exposure event they only say people who were in store at certain time have to go get test. Where as prev if you were somewhere on same day you had to get tested. Is the virus supposed to be highly contagious or not?

I see businesses are having trouble with how many passes they’ve have to check as govt said reasonable amount. I would have thought under commie dictatorship reasonable means all of them lol...

I think even vaccinated people are going to prefer to use businesses that opt not to check purely to avoid the hassle, and what’s the point of worrying if we have close enough to 90% anyway

Tis just one absurdity after another innit. So long as every individual business keeps to the rules, the virus won't spread as widely.

Commie? I dunno, you n TDL should get a room some night. These 'procedures' are in place for health and safety purposes. Logic, reason and common sense dictates that in the early days of a pandemic that everyone be checked in order to monitor transmission. Commie indeed.

There'll be no hassle once they're all barcoded/chipped/branded (I did it for everyone) ;)

[pritch]

Lol I’ve noticed also now that when there is an exposure event they only say people who were in store at certain time have to go get test. Where as prev if you were somewhere on same day you had to get tested.

It's been like that for a long time. Still, there will likely be changes as they get more information. Remember, it's a hundred years since we had a pandemic like this and there wasn't a manual for COVID. Well, the US had one but Trump tossed it.


I think even vaccinated people are going to prefer to use businesses that opt not to check purely to avoid the hassle, and what’s the point of worrying if we have close enough to 90% anyway

How much hassle is it exactly? I have been several places that wanted to check my vaccine pass, it's in the wallet on my phone and it's the only thingin there. Takes just a couple of seconds to show it.

[george formby]

How much hassle is it exactly? I have been several places that wanted to check my vaccine pass, it's in the wallet on my phone and it's the only thingin there. Takes just a couple of seconds to show it.

It is a hassle. I was working in a restaurant on Saturday night and each guest was checked. The few who were organised made it quick, the rest less so. A table of 5 took nearly 15 minutes to be seated. It made good service difficult.

Soooooo, I took myself into town today and now have a credit card sized laminated Vax pass nestled in my wallet beside teh driving licence.

Pop, scan, thank you Mam.

Still got it on my phone if anyone is a bit suss on it.

[F5 Dave]

Point to note. If you get a sw update check hasn't dropped Google pay record off where you saved it.

Easy enough to reload but need to find the email again and have data coverage.

[TheDemonLord]

Commie? I dunno, you n TDL should get a room some night.

Can I just say, I love that amongst my Fanclub, I love that I'm the benchmark for Anti-Communism.



I feel that this should be some form of Achievement unlocked.

[R650R]

Can I just say, I love that amongst my Fanclub, I love that I'm the benchmark for Anti-Communism.



I feel that this should be some form of Achievement unlocked.

Who’d have ever thought that the evils our ancestors died fighting against would become the new populist ideals that the Dunning-Kruger stricken minorities would embrace in some bizarro new world utopia.

I guess if your into self arm and other mental disorders then mass starvation and no freedom of personal choice/travel/religion/accomodation/education/occupation is prob pretty appealing.

[R650R]

It is a hassle. I was working in a restaurant on Saturday night and each guest was checked. The few who were organised made it quick, the rest less so. A table of 5 took nearly 15 minutes to be seated. It made good service difficult.

Soooooo, I took myself into town today and now have a credit card sized laminated Vax pass nestled in my wallet beside teh driving licence.

Pop, scan, thank you Mam.

Still got it on my phone if anyone is a bit suss on it.

Nice that someone understands this a little. I guess some people are so enamoured thinking they are doing something special to help society they are overlooking the mechanics of this.

Unless youÂ’ve ever worked in a real job involving some kind of mechanical or machine process works with repetitive cycles people wonÂ’t understand the true implications on cycle time of everyday activities.
We are now ALL that annoying person in the que holding things up by talking to cashier/hunting for loose change/writing a cheque/ordering a coffee in sole crew servo etc....
This all creates a new problem which of course will be solved when we get our RFID microchips implanted under our skin or the UV forehead tattoos.

IÂ’m a shorts and t shirt kinda bloke so when I go shopping I donÂ’t have space to carry much.
Now when I get out of car I need to grab two sets of keys, wallet, phone and a mask. ItÂ’s a three handed job that is so impractical.

Btw does anyone else see the folly of presenting your smartphone within breathing distance of the “inspector” at a busy venue given this is the device we constantly touch and handle. Just one infected inspector could be a superspreader at a large event.

[mashman]

Who’d have ever thought that the evils our ancestors died fighting against would become the new populist ideals that the Dunning-Kruger stricken minorities would embrace in some bizarro new world utopia.

Dipshits who don't understand the difference between communism and totalitarianism, that's who ;)


I guess if your into self arm and other mental disorders then mass starvation and no freedom of personal choice/travel/religion/accomodation/education/occupation is prob pretty appealing.

That's not a description of communism. Reds under the bed fever got you good boy, which is odd given you claim to understand totalitarians. I guess youz still their sucker after all :jerry:

[TheDemonLord]

Dipshits who don't understand the difference between communism and totalitarianism, that's who ;)

In theory there's a difference....

But in practice....


That's not a description of communism.

Nah....

It's just a description of what happens every time it's attempted...

[pritch]

Now when I get out of car I need to grab two sets of keys, wallet, phone and a mask. ItÂ’s a three handed job that is so impractical.



That's completely normal. No normal person should have any difficulty with that. Hmmmm.

[F5 Dave]

Pop em in your handbag if your skirt doesn't have pockets.

[FJRider]

I’m a shorts and t shirt kinda bloke so when I go shopping I dont have space to carry much.
Now when I get out of car I need to grab two sets of keys, wallet, phone and a mask. It’s a three handed job that is so impractical.

Buy (bigger ??) a man-Bag. Problem solved .


Btw does anyone else see the folly of presenting your smartphone within breathing distance of the “inspector” at a busy venue given this is the device we constantly touch and handle. Just one infected inspector could be a superspreader at a large event.

Print off your covid pass. Laminate it for easy / regular cleaning. You have it in your hand a lot less than your phone, so less risk of spreading anything.

[F5 Dave]

Or he could stop complaining like a whinny bitch.

But why stop now?

[husaberg]

Or he could stop complaining like a whinny bitch.

But why stop now?

Without the ability to be a winey troll I am picking he might have to take a look at why he needs to troll on the internet as he has no success in life plus why everyone thinks hes a tool.

[MarkH]

Buy (bigger ??) a man-Bag.

LOL - 'man'.
Check who you are referring to!

[R650R]

Buy (bigger ??) a man-Bag. Problem solved .



Print off your covid pass. Laminate it for easy / regular cleaning. You have it in your hand a lot less than your phone, so less risk of spreading anything.

Being a very pragmatic person I’m well aware of various work around me we can all come up with for life’s problems... necessity being mother of all invention.

The ONLY people who carry a man-bag in my neighbourhood are p dealers and fry heads, it’s not a good look at all....

The govt FORCES one badly thought out mandate after another on us without taking time to think about reality or implementation, I will continue to ruthlessly critique that. We PAY them to operate a monopoly service and we unfortunately continue to get poor results.


https://youtu.be/TZp9bu8pmeQ

[pritch]

We PAY them to operate a monopoly service and we unfortunately continue to get poor results.



Seriously?

USA deaths per million 2,300 plus
UK deaths per million 2,000 plus
NZ deaths per million 9 (rounded up)

You can whinge and mumble nonsense but we were very lucky to have this government. Luxon wants to open the country up. He cares more about money than people. Collins would have been no better.

[F5 Dave]

And English would have followed Keys playbook and never considered closing the border to tourists in March 2020. Jeez imagine the state we would have been in?

[TheDemonLord]

Jeez imagine the state we would have been in?

Potentially our freedoms intact and our rights protected...

[pete376403]

Potentially our freedoms intact and our rights protected... right to die included? I'll pass on that as long as possible

[husaberg]

right to die included? I'll pass on that as long as possible
plus the right for the family to sue those needlessly infected by no vaxed or for the should the anti vaxers or their family get to sue the govt as if they die or get a preventable diseases?

[husaberg]

Seriously?

USA deaths per million 2,300 plus
UK deaths per million 2,000 plus
NZ deaths per million 9 (rounded up)

You can whinge and mumble nonsense but we were very lucky to have this government. Luxon wants to open the country up. He cares more about money than people. Collins would have been no better.

From memory Ireland has 100 deaths a week in a country the same size as NZ
Luxon got given a heap of Air NZ shares i bet he wants the country opened up

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/116981435/two-million-reasons-why-christopher-luxon-will-want-new-air-new-zealand-ceo-greg-foran-to-do-well


In an announcement to the New Zealand stock exchange (NZX) on Tuesday the airline disclosed Luxon was issued 692,368 Air New Zealand "rights" on October 21.
At the company's current share price of $2.85 the offer is worth $1.97m, but could be worth a lot more depending on how much the company's share price changes over the next few years.

[FJRider]

Being a very pragmatic person I’m well aware of various work around me we can all come up with for life’s problems... necessity being mother of all invention

The ONLY people who carry a man-bag in my neighbourhood are p dealers and fry heads, it’s not a good look at all....

Cargo pants/shorts with pockets held closed with Velcro. Your manliness [sic] remains intact.


The govt FORCES one badly thought out mandate after another on us without taking time to think about reality or implementation, I will continue to ruthlessly critique that. We PAY them to operate a monopoly service and we unfortunately continue to get poor results.

Taking immediate action to (try to) limit the effects of a WORLD WIDE pandemic ... is better than spending the first six months talking about what they should/might do ... and doing nothing.

If they are near nationwide vaccination of 90% of the residents of this country ... that last 10% of argumentative and opinionated deadbeats wont be missed that much if Covid gets them (maybe better off without them). There are larger percentages of death numbers in other countries ... so even then ... NZ will still look good in the numbers game.

[TheDemonLord]

right to die included?

Yes.


I'll pass on that as long as possible

Oh, so you'll be turning in your Motorcycle licence then?

[FJRider]

Potentially our freedoms intact and our rights protected...

And the freedoms and rights of the large numbers of the dead as it's end result ... would also be protected.

But would THEY really care ... ??

[TheDemonLord]

plus the right for the family to sue those needlessly infected by no vaxed

I mean, if you could prove that the Virus came from a specific person to another specific person beyond all reasonable doubt, then sure...

But good luck with that...


for the should the anti vaxers or their family get to sue the govt as if they die or get a preventable diseases?

Just think that through for more than 5 seconds.

Once you set that precedent - every family of anyone who dies during the inevitage Flu season could sue the Government.

[TheDemonLord]

And the freedoms and rights of the large numbers of the dead as it's end result ... would also be protected.

But would THEY really care ... ??

Whilst there is no way to definitively know for sure, those who have risked their lives for Freedoms and rights generally don't regret doing so.

[FJRider]

... Whilst there is no way to definitively know for sure

Look at the countries that DID keep their borders open.


... those who have risked their lives for Freedoms and rights generally don't regret doing so.

Going to stop the Germans/Japanese/North Koreans/North Vietnamese/Iraqis/Taliban invasions ... is a little different to stopping a world wide Pandemic.

And the ones (still alive) that participated in the action to stop the above invasions and actually FOUGHT for those freedoms ... are the very one's most at risk FROM the Pandemic now.

I'm sure they'll thank you for your planned inaction's and arguments ... To protect YOUR rights (as you see them) and YOUR FREEDOM to buy a coffee without being asked for a vaccination pass ... <_<

And the funny bit is ... after all that ... you STILL regard yourself as being intelligent ... :laugh:

[FJRider]

I mean, if you could prove that the Virus came from a specific person to another specific person beyond all reasonable doubt, then sure...

But good luck with that...

Actually they CAN and DO ... NOW. That's why the scanning/signing in at the places you go to is required. They call it Contact Tracing. You might have heard of it ... if your head wasn't so far up your own ass.


... Just think that through for more than 5 seconds.

See above ... and think about that for more than 5 seconds.

[FJRider]

Yes.

You have the right to die by your own hand. If you choose to. But you won't ... because your hand spends most of it's time on your cock.


Oh, so you'll be turning in your Motorcycle licence then?

Risking death by riding a motorcycle ... is not the same as certain death if you ride a motorcycle.

Don't judge everybody by your own lack of ability to ride a motorcycle.

[TheDemonLord]

Look at the countries that DID keep their borders open.

External Borders are one thing, internal restrictions are another.


Going to stop the Germans/Japanese/North Koreans/North Vietnamese/Iraqis/Taliban invasions ... is a little different to stopping a world wide Pandemic.

Why?

Because the claimed existential threat is a Virus and not a country with intent?

If the end result is Identity papers, discrimination, enabling power hungry moral busy-bodies, encouraging informing and government tyranny - does it look much different?

It only took a few years for the Germans to go from Yellow Stars to suspicious Showers. We've now got the equivalent of the Yellow Star and a group of undesirables that the Government thinks it's okay to discriminate against...


And the ones (still alive) that participated in the action to stop the above invasions and actually FOUGHT for those freedoms ... are the very one's most at risk FROM the Pandemic now.

What an interesting point...

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/coronavirus/video-2274724/Video-dont-sod-83-year-old-Yorkshires-thoughts-Tier-3.html

That's not the only one, there's a few interesting interviews with Elderly people who resent the fact that Young People's freedoms were taken away supposedly for their safety, when they weren't even asked...


I'm sure they'll thank you for your planned inaction's and arguments ... To protect YOUR rights (as you see them) and YOUR FREEDOM to buy a coffee without being asked for a vaccination pass ... <_<

*everyone's rights.
*everyone's freedom.

And that way, Everyone is free to assess the level of Risk they are comfortable with taking.


Actually they CAN and DO ... NOW. That's why the scanning/signing in at the places you go to is required. They call it Contact Tracing. You might have heard of it ... if your head wasn't so far up your own ass.

I imagine a Lawyer (in the context of a Civil Suit) would have an absolute field day with Contact Tracing being used as proof of Transmission in the sense of 'Beyond all reasonable doubt'.

Contact Tracing works on a number of presumptions - most notably that there is no other active transmission happening and that everytime the Virus infects someone, it's severe enough to be reported (either by Doctors visit or other).


Risking death by riding a motorcycle ... is not the same as certain death if you ride a motorcycle.

So, is a 99% survival rate Risking Death or Certain Death?

Take your time, I'll wait.

[FJRider]

External Borders are one thing, internal restrictions are another.

Internal restrictions .. ??? is that when somebody's cock wont fit in your ass. Somebody posted that you were a tight ass ... ;)



Why?

They fought or our freedoms ... with bullets flying in their direction. In deserts .. jungles .. and in freezing temperatures. You do it on a computer ... sitting on your boyfriends lap.


Because the claimed existential threat is a Virus and not a country with intent?

If the threat isn't real ... don't get vaccinated.

Oh wait ... YOU DID.


If the end result is Identity papers, discrimination, enabling power hungry moral busy-bodies, encouraging informing and government tyranny - does it look much different?

I have always had identity documents ... one is my drivers license. If they scan my Covid pass ... they can ask to see my drivers license to CONFIRM my identity. Why would that be if the Covid pass was a valid (proof of) IDENTITY document .. ??

The Covid pass merely confirms that the person named on the pass has had the appropriate vaccinations as listed to the respective national health number. It is not proof the pass holder IS the person named ON the pass.



It only took a few years for the Germans to go from Yellow Stars to suspicious Showers. We've now got the equivalent of the Yellow Star and a group of undesirables that the Government thinks it's okay to discriminate against...

Right about now they're building slums to house them. Well ... actually ... they haven't built the thousands of houses they claimed they would for the homeless and needy ... so the great unwashed/un-vaccinated might be safe from that for a while yet. Watch this space I reckon ... ;)


What an interesting point...

They elderly WANT the jab to speed the process of getting back to as things were. Nothing mentioned about that particular pensioner was (in the past) fighting for our freedoms ... ;)


That's not the only one, there's a few interesting interviews with Elderly people who resent the fact that Young People's freedoms were taken away supposedly for their safety, when they weren't even asked...

None of them was mentioned was fighting for our freedoms in the past ... you just showed elderly people that need the vaccine to stay alive. Do you WANT them not to NOT get the vaccine and die. Just to prove some point you have (still waiting for that by the way) that you claimed you have.


*everyone's rights.
*everyone's freedom.

I am not aware of ANY of MY rights being compromised. Nor ANY of my freedoms ... although my essential travel letter helps in this regard.

Funny part of it is ... I've NEVER been asked for it.

Go figure ... :killingme



And that way, Everyone is free to assess the level of Risk they are comfortable with taking.

I did and I got the appropriate jabs. It reduced the risks ... not removed them. I'm comfortable with that.


I would be happier when everybody is vaccinated. I would be comfortable with that.

And with them losing all their freedom to choose for themselves ... surely not.

The REAL risk is the horde of un-vaccinated being allowed to continue to roam (freely and with few restrictions) in our society.


I imagine a Lawyer (in the context of a Civil Suit) would have an absolute field day with Contact Tracing being used as proof of Transmission in the sense of 'Beyond all reasonable doubt'.

You've been watching too much American TV ... A reasonable case .. same time/same virus/at the same place./security camera footage of all involved parties at that same place ... "Beyond reasonable doubt" isn't really that difficult to prove. Even here in NZ.


Contact Tracing works on a number of presumptions - most notably that there is no other active transmission happening and that everytime the Virus infects someone, it's severe enough to be reported (either by Doctors visit or other).

As above ... proof of same time/place etc. Most businesses nowadays have security cameras as a matter of course in case of robbery etc.


So, is a 99% survival rate Risking Death or Certain Death?

The pandemic isn't over yet. Until Covid (and all it's various strains) are wiped out ... THEN you can talk about the survival rates ... ;)


Take your time, I'll wait.

An easy question.

Idiots may take longer to answer ... But the idiots still don't understand that the Covid problem will be around for a while yet.

The NEXT strain of it might kill a few more. The un-vaccinated will be asking why they were allowed to be "Misled" by those various web sites they visited ... weren't shut down (it can't be THEIR fault) ... :shifty:


watch this space ... ;)

[pritch]

Potentially our freedoms intact and our rights protected...

Including the right to die. Most people who want to open the country up are somewhet limited conceptually. If our COVID casualty rate was the same as other countries we would have 10,000 dead by now. It doesn't cross their tiny minds that they, or their family members, might be included in the 10,000. They view all negative things as happening to someone else. Actually that's typical of right leaning people. They don't care about anything - unil it affects them.

Anyone who doubts that can check it out. There are several key examples in the USA involving presidents, their wives, or prominent politicians.

[F5 Dave]

Pleas stop quoting TDL hes such a fuking thick cunt. I try not to read it but occasionally skim a bit and feel myself getting stupider for the interaction. Bit like R666 who is going major mashed potato.

[Berries]

Oh, so you'll be turning in your Motorcycle licence then?
Nah, that does not work. If I die on my bike it will mean I fucked up and I have nobody to blame but myself.

If I die of Covid then then the prick who gave me it is the problem. And it sounds like after next week it will probably be some prick from Auckland wanting to have a holiday who gives it me. Gee, thanks.

[R650R]

Including the right to die. Most people who want to open the country up are somewhet limited conceptually. If our COVID casualty rate was the same as other countries we would have 10,000 dead by now. It doesn't cross their tiny minds that they, or their family members, might be included in the 10,000. They view all negative things as happening to someone else. Actually that's typical of right leaning people. They don't care about anything - unil it affects them.

Anyone who doubts that can check it out. There are several key examples in the USA involving presidents, their wives, or prominent politicians.

We’d think nothing in comparison though if a similar amount of troops died in a conflict zone. Let’s say 911 had been based in Indonesia instead of Afghanistan and hordes of fishing boat terror cells were constantly headed our way. Nothing short of a drawn out Vietnam style disaster in the jungle would have been required.
Your forecast 10,000 dead would mostly have been advance deaths of obese, ill, and elderly who may have got pneumonia or normal flu in the next few winters anyway like one of my grandparents did.
Over last two years your 10,000 averages out at 13 people a day, spread around the home country you’d hardly call that dropping like flies in the street as media tried to make out.
Right leaning people thinking of short term pain for long term gain. We’ve smashed our economy and burdened our grandchildren with eternal debt that will cause much bigger pain.
Some lockdown was necessary but way it’s been mismanaged has created unnecessary damage economically, mentally and spiritually.

[R650R]

Nah, that does not work. If I die on my bike it will mean I fucked up and I have nobody to blame but myself.

If I die of Covid then then the prick who gave me it is the problem. And it sounds like after next week it will probably be some prick from Auckland wanting to have a holiday who gives it me. Gee, thanks.

No it will prob be a truck driver brothel and motel hopping around the country delivering the made/imported in Auckland goods you bought online such is our modern economy. Let’s not forget your wedding outbreak in South Island one of the biggest clusters in season one....

[R650R]

Oh dear.... so dangerous to have 10 doses of the safe vaccine even though we have no data that says that would be dangerous. You have to love all these Pandora’s box of perplexing problems permutating from the randomness of human behaviour

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127245863/covid19-man-receives-up-to-10-vaccines-in-one-day

[TheDemonLord]

Nah, that does not work. If I die on my bike it will mean I fucked up and I have nobody to blame but myself.

Does it?

Are you saying it's impossible for you to die on a Motorbike due to someone elses error?
And are you saying it's impossible for you to kill someone else, whilst you survive due to your error?


If I die of Covid then then the prick who gave me it is the problem.

If you Die of Covid, it will most likely be because you didn't take steps to protect yourself.

[TheDemonLord]

Including the right to die.

Yes.

I've been very absolute on this point, yet people still bring it up as some form of 'Gotcha'. There's probably 100 things that you use/do/enjoy that are potentially Lethal to you and to others, yet you no doubt continue to use them and enjoy them and doubtless believe that it is your right and freedom to do so.

I happen to just be a little more universal on that last point.


Most people who want to open the country up are somewhet limited conceptually. If our COVID casualty rate was the same as other countries we would have 10,000 dead by now.

Maybe, maybe not. There are many factors to consider - e.g. Population Density springs to mind. Geographic Isolation is another.


It doesn't cross their tiny minds that they, or their family members, might be included in the 10,000. They view all negative things as happening to someone else. Actually that's typical of right leaning people. They don't care about anything - unil it affects them.

I simply want my natural rights and freedoms to be respected.


Anyone who doubts that can check it out. There are several key examples in the USA involving presidents, their wives, or prominent politicians.

Okay then, what about Taiwan - they didn't have mass lockdowns, yet have a very low death rate despite having a significantly higher population Density. The UK had massive Lockdowns and a very high death toll.

[TheDemonLord]

Pleas stop quoting TDL hes such a fuking thick cunt. I try not to read it but occasionally skim a bit and feel myself getting stupider for the interaction. Bit like R666 who is going major mashed potato.

Seems like you need a bit of self discipline then if you don't want to read what I write, but you just can't help yourself.

I would also like to point out that if I was as stupid as you claim you'd easily be able to scroll passed what I write. One might conjecture that part of the compulsion (by your own admission) for you to read what I write is that there is something in there that you are struggling to contend with.

[TheDemonLord]

Internal restrictions .. ??? is that when somebody's cock wont fit in your ass. Somebody posted that you were a tight ass ... ;)

I'm not sure where this obsession with me being Gay has come from, probably projection.



They fought or our freedoms ... with bullets flying in their direction. In deserts .. jungles .. and in freezing temperatures. You do it on a computer ... sitting on your boyfriends lap.

What can I say, I'm a very handsome Man...

And I'll agree that there is a difference between those that face bullets and people like me (which is incidentally why I hold those that served in High regard - and yes, that includes you) - But one doesn't have to face Bullets to oppose an Immoral act done by the Government.

The Anti-Slavery movement was decided by a series of Legal Arguments without a shot fired (American Civil War not withstanding)


If the threat isn't real ... don't get vaccinated.

Oh wait ... YOU DID.

Yes, because I decided that due to my weight, it was prudent to get it due to the (very) slight risk if I did get it and the (for me) non-existant risk if I did. I'm happy to report that like all Vaccines I've ever had - the worst side effect was a slightly sore arm for about 24 hours.

Now, if I had a history of adverse reactions to the Vaccine or I was in physically better shape, I might make a different decision - probably not, since the science supporting the Vaccine was pretty solid.



I have always had identity documents ... one is my drivers license. If they scan my Covid pass ... they can ask to see my drivers license to CONFIRM my identity. Why would that be if the Covid pass was a valid (proof of) IDENTITY document .. ??

With the exception of Age-Restricted areas, when did you have to produce your identity documents just to visit a business?


The Covid pass merely confirms that the person named on the pass has had the appropriate vaccinations as listed to the respective national health number. It is not proof the pass holder IS the person named ON the pass.

"The Yellow Star merely confirms that the person is of Jewish Ancestry and has the appropriate level of Jewery as listed to the respective Ethnic Health Number"



Right about now they're building slums to house them. Well ... actually ... they haven't built the thousands of houses they claimed they would for the homeless and needy ... so the great unwashed/un-vaccinated might be safe from that for a while yet. Watch this space I reckon ... ;)

Okay... I laughed....


They elderly WANT the jab to speed the process of getting back to as things were. Nothing mentioned about that particular pensioner was (in the past) fighting for our freedoms ... ;)

So it's shifting the Goal Posts then.... Granted I've not interviewed everyone above the age of 85 - but I have seen a number of very public interviews where they are displeased at the lockdowns and restrictions of their freedoms (and everyone elses) that is being done (supposedly) in their name.


None of them was mentioned was fighting for our freedoms in the past ... you just showed elderly people that need the vaccine to stay alive. Do you WANT them not to NOT get the vaccine and die. Just to prove some point you have (still waiting for that by the way) that you claimed you have.

As per the Lady "I've not got many years left, and I don't want to spend them being stuck inside" - She wants Freedom for all.

Just like me.


I am not aware of ANY of MY rights being compromised. Nor ANY of my freedoms ... although my essential travel letter helps in this regard.

Funny part of it is ... I've NEVER been asked for it.

The last part is key - that's the point I'm making - I outlined earlier why some business are choosing to pay lip service to the rules (and good on them), And one of the reasons is because there's still an ideal of individual freedom and liberty that the rules run contrary to.

And before Pritch jumps on his 'This is RWNJ propaganda' - I'd like to reference Sir Keir Stamer (Leader of the UK Labour Party). I'll preface this with there is not a whole lot I agree with Sir Keir on, so when I do agree with him - you can take it that it isn't coming from a place of Bias or favouritism:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/covid-vaccine-passports-keir-starmer-b1825276.html


I did and I got the appropriate jabs. It reduced the risks ... not removed them. I'm comfortable with that.

Exactly.

So did I.

And if anyone else I come into contact with has chosen differently, I believe myself to be protected against them.

Government intervention


And with them losing all their freedom to choose for themselves ... surely not.

The REAL risk is the horde of un-vaccinated being allowed to continue to roam (freely and with few restrictions) in our society.

Considering how you grilled me when I copy-pasta'd your name to a quote that wasn't you, I feel I'm well placed to return the favor.

However on your question The Real Risk? To Whom? I'm vaccinated, so are you - the most likely scenario is we get knocked down for a week (like a serious case of the Man-Flu).

So exactly who is this horde a threat to? If the vaccine stopped transmission, I could grant you those that are immuno-compromised and can't get the Vaccine, but since it doesn't - they are also at risk from someone who is vaccinated.


You've been watching too much American TV ... A reasonable case .. same time/same virus/at the same place./security camera footage of all involved parties at that same place ... "Beyond reasonable doubt" isn't really that difficult to prove. Even here in NZ.

A reasonable case, on the preponderance of Evidence - Sure.
Beyond all reasonable doubt? They would have great fun - because the burden of proof would be on the Crown to prove that it could only have been the individual that infected them and not someone else - and for that the lawyer would simply state 'Asymptomatic Carriers'.

Not to mention you'd also have the issue of Mens Rea - Husa posted articles about people being charged for knowingly infecting other people, but it's that word 'knowingly' - you'd have to know you had the Virus and went out anyway.

Good luck with that.



As above ... proof of same time/place etc. Most businesses nowadays have security cameras as a matter of course in case of robbery etc.

Security cameras have enough problems with quality of footage, with capturing robberies. I'm not sure how they would be able to capture the transmission of a Virus some 50nm big.

Maybe 4K resolution will change that... maybe not...



The pandemic isn't over yet. Until Covid (and all it's various strains) are wiped out ... THEN you can talk about the survival rates ... ;)

With 269 Million cases, I think we can safely say we have a sufficient sample set to make some reasonable conclusions. 99% survival rate.





An easy question.

Idiots may take longer to answer ... But the idiots still don't understand that the Covid problem will be around for a while yet.

The NEXT strain of it might kill a few more. The un-vaccinated will be asking why they were allowed to be "Misled" by those various web sites they visited ... weren't shut down (it can't be THEIR fault) ... :shifty:

watch this space ... ;)

Ah yes, the Dreaded Omicrom, with 0 deaths associated with it, by the WHO.

I don't doubt that Covid will be around for a while, likely it will be like the seasonal Flu - we'll get our Jabs every year, some old people will die directly from it or from complications due to it, life will go on.

Or the Government will continue to pursue an illiberal course of Tyranny and then who knows - I've got my preferred outcome...

[husaberg]

https://pics.me.me/thumb_arguing-withatrump-supporter-is-like-playing-chess-with-a-pigeon-6408098.pnghttp://www.quickmeme.com/img/f4/f46a8e4240505be1304e90eeee7a7a8af1c7403ed8ec0897eb 7d170733ab9800.jpghttps://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/S4a73xoFuVCXMmbdo7WF5V_JUuTOfMibiGToXWErGzN4x22CUR 4ySvs-h1CiNaBDC1TkD3_4NZPXJZtx0Xna_KnLCfLgIhr2SscJ4ITnUv LyIX9FNDu8zTdXzF7Zrb-tg1z0oOZ_-vIFrvTf8A_OTJrJslRYO6OG6JU

[FJRider]

I'm not sure where this obsession with me being Gay has come from

Its ok. It's legal now.


What can I say, I'm a very handsome Man...

I'm sure he thinks the same ...


But one doesn't have to face Bullets to oppose an Immoral act done by the Government.

One your last post's said it was just illegal. Now it's immoral. What changed.. ??


The Anti-Slavery movement was decided by a series of Legal Arguments without a shot fired (American Civil War not withstanding)

How they decided to end it is irrelevant. That didn't start the Anti-slavery movement in the first place. It would be the worst example of Mans inhumanity to man ... which is why The majority of the public opinion said it had to end. And so it did.

Those against the Covid Pass system are very much the minority. A subtle difference between the two arguments.


Yes, because I decided that due to my weight, it was prudent to get it due to the (very) slight risk if I did get it and the (for me) non-existant risk if I did. I'm happy to report that like all Vaccines I've ever had - the worst side effect was a slightly sore arm for about 24 hours.

Life will be better for you ... if you were a skinny useless Islamophobic prick.


Now, if I had a history of adverse reactions to the Vaccine or I was in physically better shape, I might make a different decision - probably not, since the science supporting the Vaccine was pretty solid.

The anti-vaccine crowd say exactly the opposite. How come ... ??


With the exception of Age-Restricted areas, when did you have to produce your identity documents just to visit a business?

Read my post ... I said I CAN produce a valid identity document (my drivers license) if required ... to confirm the person named on my covid pass (which is NOT a valid identity document) is really me. I have not yet been required to produce it for that reason. Nor have I said I have been asked to produce it.


"The Yellow Star merely confirms that the person is of Jewish Ancestry and has the appropriate level of Jewery as listed to the respective Ethnic Health Number"

"The Yellow Star" was a symbol as a group identity. Not necessarily of their ancestry ... just their beliefs. A Gang patch isn't much different actually ... :lol:



Okay... I laughed....

How nice.


So it's shifting the Goal Posts then....

You do it all the time. Why shouldn't I ... ??


As per the Lady "I've not got many years left, and I don't want to spend them being stuck inside" - She wants Freedom for all.

Just like me.

When you're old/fat/gay/Islamophobic/useless ... inside might be safer.


The last part is key - that's the point I'm making - I outlined earlier why some business are choosing to pay lip service to the rules (and good on them), And one of the reasons is because there's still an ideal of individual freedom and liberty that the rules run contrary to.

I thought you were coming to the point ... but no.

You were wrong on both cases. I did point out where you were wrong. So ... still waiting for the point.

And I don't do your links.




Exactly.

So did I.

And if anyone else I come into contact with has chosen differently, I believe myself to be protected against them.

Government intervention

Do not believe you are totally protected. There are no guarantees in that regard.

Are you feeling lucky .. ??


Considering how you grilled me when I copy-pasta'd your name to a quote that wasn't you, I feel I'm well placed to return the favor.

I did you no favors. And you gave me an apology. Matter ended.


However on your question The Real Risk? To Whom? I'm vaccinated, so are you - the most likely scenario is we get knocked down for a week (like a serious case of the Man-Flu).

Only a week .. I can live (excuse the pun) with that. I have over 60 days sick leave owing ... :lol:


So exactly who is this horde a threat to? If the vaccine stopped transmission, I could grant you those that are immuno-compromised and can't get the Vaccine, but since it doesn't - they are also at risk from someone who is vaccinated.

Good question ... seeing as they are allowed to roam free. If people that are vaccinated can spread the virus to those un-vaccinated ... I can see a few issues coming up though ... :lol:


A reasonable case, on the preponderance of Evidence - Sure.

Yep. A fair trial .. then jail them. DONE.


Beyond all reasonable doubt?

As above ...


Not to mention you'd also have the issue of Mens Rea - Husa posted articles about people being charged for knowingly infecting other people, but it's that word 'knowingly' - you'd have to know you had the Virus and went out anyway.

I don't read his posts. He is NOT on ignore. I just choose not to read them ... just keep on scrolling ...


Good luck with that.

To just think you could be infected ... gets you jail time if you actually infect somebody with aids..


Security cameras have enough problems with quality of footage, with capturing robberies. I'm not sure how they would be able to capture the transmission of a Virus some 50nm big.

Maybe 4K resolution will change that... maybe not...

In Cafe's ... masks are not worn while eating or drinking. In robberies ... they usually are.

Note the subtle difference .. ??


With 269 Million cases, I think we can safely say we have a sufficient sample set to make some reasonable conclusions. 99% survival rate.

The last innings hasn't started yet. Until the last ball has been bowled ... and then we'll see who the winners are.


Ah yes, the Dreaded Omicrom, with 0 deaths associated with it, by the WHO.

I did say the next strain. Hopefully the last strain. Not the latest strain. Please try to keep up.


I don't doubt that Covid will be around for a while, likely it will be like the seasonal Flu - we'll get our Jabs every year, some old people will die directly from it or from complications due to it, life will go on.

Time will tell. You may be right. But I wouldn't bet on it.


Or the Government will continue to pursue an illiberal course of Tyranny and then who knows - I've got my preferred outcome...

You are entitled to your opinion. Regardless of how illogical and unbalanced your statements have been to date.

[F5 Dave]

Golly that's s lot of answers.

[husaberg]

Golly that's s lot of answers.
commie bastards and Muslims and feminists making him a low decile incel.

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-f359df1de82dc02563c08aaaa276f88b-lq

[pete376403]

The anti vaxxers, fearful in their belief that the vaccine is dangerous and who paid a guy to take their shots for them are going to look even more stupid when someone who has had ten times the recommended dose in one day doesn't suffer any of the effects that they were so scared of. Sort of blows that argument away

[pritch]

Okay then, what about Taiwan - they didn't have mass lockdowns, yet have a very low death rate despite having a significantly higher population Density. The UK had massive Lockdowns and a very high death toll.

You seem to have missed the point completely, but since you ask.

In round 1 they went for herd immunity, the government would not shut down air travel to the UK. Later when a new variant emerged in India, Boris kept flights from India going for about five weeks because he wanted trade talks with Modi.

Johnson has consistently fucked the response every time. When it became evident, even to him, that the virus was out of Control they locked down. Well, normal people did, government cronies partied and toured the country. Virus? What virus?

[husaberg]

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-8e0d0c55b1d606640999d0536d0d0887-lq

[TheDemonLord]

Its ok. It's legal now.
I'm sure he thinks the same ...

Either way, your point?

The argument I'm making has as much to do with someones sexuality as a bicycle has to do with a Duck.


One your last post's said it was just illegal. Now it's immoral. What changed.. ??




How they decided to end it is irrelevant. That didn't start the Anti-slavery movement in the first place. It would be the worst example of Mans inhumanity to man ... which is why The majority of the public opinion said it had to end. And so it did.

Actually, how they decided to end it is entirely relevant. And no, it wasn't decided by Majority Public Opinion, quite the opposite in fact - it was decided on a point of principle:

That individuals had inherent rights and freedoms, not granted by the government but that were innate to them as Individuals and that it was a moral wrong for the Government to infringe upon them.

It's the same argument that was made to end Segregation and it's the same argument I, and others who subscribe to British Liberalism, point to when it comes to Vaccine Passports


Those against the Covid Pass system are very much the minority. A subtle difference between the two arguments.

Well, according to you, it's everyone in your home town, so that would paint a slightly different picture. I'd suggest it's more likely there are ~10% opposed to it absolutely (like myself), ~10% who are entirely on board with it and ~80% who think it's wrong but go along with it anyway because they don't want to be imposed upon.


Life will be better for you ... if you were a skinny useless Islamophobic prick.

Well, I'm working on the Skinny part, the others I'm sadly not able to. And don't worry, I'm working on the post to address the Islamophobic comments - but please keep them coming, they are ammunition...



The anti-vaccine crowd say exactly the opposite. How come ... ??

I dunno, you'd have to ask them. I'd hazard a guess that the bulk of their arguments would come down to something like 'Massive financial benefit provides massive incentives to cut corners' - but that's not a theory I subscribe to. I'm more than happy to dig up the vaccination thread and point to where I defend against this argument, at length.

I'm also fairly certain that in that thread I stood by my conviction that I believed that State Mandated Vaccinations would be wrong.


Read my post ... I said I CAN produce a valid identity document (my drivers license) if required ... to confirm the person named on my covid pass (which is NOT a valid identity document) is really me. I have not yet been required to produce it for that reason. Nor have I said I have been asked to produce it.

Can =/= Must.

One is currently the Law, but again - good on your local businesses for ignoring it


"The Yellow Star" was a symbol as a group identity. Not necessarily of their ancestry ... just their beliefs. A Gang patch isn't much different actually ... :lol:

Just like someone who is not vaccinated on non-medical grounds is a symbol of their beliefs (rightly or wrongly), and they are being discriminated against, by the Government.

And interesting you raise Gang Patches, I can see the point you're making, however 2 issues:

1: It isn't being done at the behest of the Government
2: It doesn't discriminate Gang Members from entering, only if they are flying colours.



You do it all the time. Why shouldn't I ... ??

Your argument is that the elderly want to live forever so we absolutely must protect them at all costs.
My argument is to point to some of the Elderly who say that they are opposed to the restrictions of everyones rights and freedoms, on their (supposed) behalf.


When you're old/fat/gay/Islamophobic/useless ... inside might be safer.

And if I decide that inside is safer for me, then inside is where I will stay.
But it is not up to some faceless busy-body civil servant to decide that I need to be protected and need to stay inside.



I thought you were coming to the point ... but no.

You were wrong on both cases. I did point out where you were wrong. So ... still waiting for the point.

And I don't do your links.

The point is starring you in the face, by your own admission, yet you refuse to acknowledge it:

Discrimination, based on personal belief, is wrong.

That is why so many businesses are either ignoring, not enforcing or are working around the rules, it's why you've not been asked - because the owners of those businesses know it's wrong.


Do not believe you are totally protected. There are no guarantees in that regard.

Are you feeling lucky .. ??

Yes. Very. And sure, there's no Guarantees - but I've taken the number of precautions (for me) that I think are reasonable.



Only a week .. I can live (excuse the pun) with that. I have over 60 days sick leave owing ... :lol:

There you go, no harm, no foul.


Good question ... seeing as they are allowed to roam free. If people that are vaccinated can spread the virus to those un-vaccinated ... I can see a few issues coming up though ... :lol:

The only real issue I see is that if people who are vaccinated, pass the disease onto people who cannot get vaccinated for various reasons.



Yep. A fair trial .. then jail them. DONE.

As above ...

I mean, I'd be interested to see what happened if it went to trial, but my money would be on a lawyer ripping to shreds the fundamental assumptions made in Contact Tracing, not to mention a Competent Lawyer claiming:

"How do you know that it was my client that passed the disease direct to your client? There were other people in the shop who could also be asymptomatic carriers - do you have negative test results for all of them?"


I don't read his posts. He is NOT on ignore. I just choose not to read them ... just keep on scrolling ...

To just think you could be infected ... gets you jail time if you actually infect somebody with aids..

And that's as it should be, if you know you have a disease and deliberately infect someone else with it then sure. It's that knowing part that is required.



In Cafe's ... masks are not worn while eating or drinking. In robberies ... they usually are.

Note the subtle difference .. ??

I'm waiting for someone to abuse the new mask rules and commit a series of crimes, hell it may already been happening but not being reported on...


The last innings hasn't started yet. Until the last ball has been bowled ... and then we'll see who the winners are.

I mean, sure - if the next variant is small pox levels of deadly, you might have a point, but the Fatality rate has gone from about 4% (when it was first discovered) down to less than 1%.

Even if you account for the Vaccine, in the initial stages it moved from 4% down to 2% - which is what we would expect for a Virus that primarily affects just the elderly.


I did say the next strain. Hopefully the last strain. Not the latest strain. Please try to keep up.

And no doubt, before Omicrom was discovered, you'd have said the same thing. But don't worry guys, I'm sure the next one will be super-duper deadly....


You are entitled to your opinion. Regardless of how illogical and unbalanced your statements have been to date.

My statements have been made from a consistent logical viewpoint, with it's roots in Individual liberty. As above, I'm happy to direct you to the Vaccination thread from years ago and you can see how consistent this position of mine has been.

[TheDemonLord]

You seem to have missed the point completely, but since you ask.

In round 1 they went for herd immunity, the government would not shut down air travel to the UK. Later when a new variant emerged in India, Boris kept flights from India going for about five weeks because he wanted trade talks with Modi.

Johnson has consistently fucked the response every time. When it became evident, even to him, that the virus was out of Control they locked down. Well, normal people did, government cronies partied and toured the country. Virus? What virus?

And you'll note how badly the Government hypocrisy has been received by the English Public, it may even result in Boris stepping down.

A lot of Britons weren't too happy with the Lockdown (again, believing them to be illiberal and against British principles) - My contention is that the 'success' in NZ that is laid at the feet of Government intervention has some very rocky foundations, especially when other areas tried similar approaches, but didn't get the same results.

[TheDemonLord]

The anti vaxxers, fearful in their belief that the vaccine is dangerous and who paid a guy to take their shots for them are going to look even more stupid when someone who has had ten times the recommended dose in one day doesn't suffer any of the effects that they were so scared of. Sort of blows that argument away

That's pretty hilarious actually!

I didn't realise that it was Anti-Vaxxers that had organised it.

[TheDemonLord]

commie bastards and Muslims and feminists making him a low decile incel.

I mean, having kids and being married automatically makes me not an Incel - but, keep trying.

[pritch]

I didn't realise that it was Anti-Vaxxers that had organised it.

Actually it's a fairly safe to infer that the people who paid him to have "their" vaccine were anti vax. Strange as that behaviour is, it would be off the chart weird if they were pro vaccine.

[husaberg]

oh noos for Boris
when you fuck up the EU exit an fuck up covid as bad as trump


350256
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/dec/07/cover-ups-and-credibility-johnsons-denials-no-longer-carry-much-weight

https://www.theweek.co.uk/news/uk-news/955125/do-falling-poll-numbers-spell-end-boris-johnson

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-popularity-tory-voters-b1966743.html

[FJRider]

... The argument I'm making has as much to do with someones sexuality as a bicycle has to do with a Duck.

I know. I just like wasting your time. I have nothing better to do where I am at the moment. Not much on TV. I might as well argue with you. I have the next three weeks off .. so I might not be on her much. That will let you have some quiet time with your boyfriend.


That individuals had inherent rights and freedoms, not granted by the government but that were innate to them as Individuals and that it was a moral wrong for the Government to infringe upon them.

What about the one's your god gave you .. ??


It's the same argument that was made to end Segregation and it's the same argument I, and others who subscribe to British Liberalism, point to when it comes to Vaccine Passports

The word Segregation has a bad connotation ... and rightfully so. The practice of restricting a person's rights and privileges in society, based on skin colour, faith or ethnicity, has become unacceptable in our Western culture, even though it's still practiced in some isolated areas. But segregation for health reasons ... cannot be compared with segregation for reason of faith or Race and ethnicity.


Well, according to you, it's everyone in your home town, so that would paint a slightly different picture. I'd suggest it's more likely there are ~10% opposed to it absolutely (like myself), ~10% who are entirely on board with it and ~80% who think it's wrong but go along with it anyway because they don't want to be imposed upon.

I live in Dunedin. about 19% would be unvaccinated. I have more respect for that 10% sticking to their guns and not getting the vaccine ... than those mouthing off on how wrong it all is ... and got the jabs anyway. As I've already said ... it is NOT illegal to NOT get the jabs.
likely there are different

Well, I'm working on the Skinny part, the others I'm sadly not able to. And don't worry, I'm working on the post to address the Islamophobic comments - but please keep them coming, they are ammunition...

Good luck with all that. Let us know when you slim down to an XXL ... I'll buy you a cream cake.


I dunno, you'd have to ask them.

More likely you and they have different agendas ... the vaccinated have a sort of foot in both camps ... but like to be seen as having principals. The un-vaccinated however ... usually have personal reasons. The reasons are usually actually irrelevant. Usually based on ignorance or stupidity. The un-vaxinated are allowed in Supermarkets ... the superspreader location of modern times. Thus ... I like to go to places where there is less risk of contracting the virus.


I'm also fairly certain that in that thread I stood by my conviction that I believed that State Mandated Vaccinations would be wrong.

Stand up more often ... it's good exercise.


Can =/= Must.

One is currently the Law, but again - good on your local businesses for ignoring it

They (as you do) have their own agendas. Not necessarily the legal one ... the trick to achieve is not getting caught out.


Just like someone who is not vaccinated on non-medical grounds is a symbol of their beliefs (rightly or wrongly), and they are being discriminated against, by the Government.

THEY don't have to wear a yellow star (or any OTHER such symbol)


And interesting you raise Gang Patches, I can see the point you're making, however 2 issues:

1: It isn't being done at the behest of the Government
2: It doesn't discriminate Gang Members from entering, only if they are flying colours.

I didn't say SAME THING ... I said ... Not much different.

1. Gang Patches are banned in MOST Government agencies.

2. And Gang Patches are banned from MANY/MOST drinking/eating businesses ... and most public places ... and establishments.


Your argument is that the elderly want to live forever so we absolutely must protect them at all costs.
My argument is to point to some of the Elderly who say that they are opposed to the restrictions of everyones rights and freedoms, on their (supposed) behalf.

Only a few want to die. Those living want to enjoy their life. Those nearing their life's end want to make the most of the time they have left ... a few things on their bucket list still to tick off. As such ... restrictions on their movement ... even if it's for their own good ... are not appreciated (Understatement).


And if I decide that inside is safer for me, then inside is where I will stay.
But it is not up to some faceless busy-body civil servant to decide that I need to be protected and need to stay inside.

If you're vaccinated ... YOU don't need to stay inside ... REMEMBER .. ??


The point is starring you in the face, by your own admission, yet you refuse to acknowledge it:

Discrimination, based on personal belief, is wrong.

I mentioned my view on discrimination earlier. See a few paragraphs up.


That is why so many businesses are either ignoring, not enforcing or are working around the rules, it's why you've not been asked - because the owners of those businesses know it's wrong.

I've been asked many times now ... only a few did not. I probably wont go back to those places. That's MY choice ... not theirs.


Yes. Very. And sure, there's no Guarantees - but I've taken the number of precautions (for me) that I think are reasonable.

Good for you.


There you go, no harm, no foul.

Depends on the variant involved.


The only real issue I see is that if people who are vaccinated, pass the disease onto people who cannot get vaccinated for various reasons.

If YOU were one of those people ... what actions would you take .. ?? continue to take your rights to freedom and roam freely ... or stay safe. At HOME .. ??


I mean, I'd be interested to see what happened if it went to trial, but my money would be on a lawyer ripping to shreds the fundamental assumptions made in Contact Tracing ?"

We have discussed this before. To date nobody has been charged with passing on the virus. It may be up for discussions when that happens.


I'm waiting for someone to abuse the new mask rules and commit a series of crimes, hell it may already been happening but not being reported on...

Unlikely.



My statements have been made from a consistent logical viewpoint, with it's roots in Individual liberty. As above, I'm happy to direct you to the Vaccination thread from years ago and you can see how consistent this position of mine has been.

BULLSHIT. Just based on your own self-centered indulgence and ignorance.

[R650R]

The anti vaxxers, fearful in their belief that the vaccine is dangerous and who paid a guy to take their shots for them are going to look even more stupid when someone who has had ten times the recommended dose in one day doesn't suffer any of the effects that they were so scared of. Sort of blows that argument away

I do love how the experts say it might not work properly because he had too much 😂

[husaberg]

I do love how the experts say it might not work properly because he had too much ��
I love how you comment on experts opinions when you have no educational, practical experience or qualifications on medicine or science

[TheDemonLord]

Actually it's a fairly safe to infer that the people who paid him to have "their" vaccine were anti vax. Strange as that behaviour is, it would be off the chart weird if they were pro vaccine.

I've only skim read the headline to be fair on this - my initial impression was that someone did it as a stunt to prove it was safe - but eitherway, the Irony is hilarious.

[TheDemonLord]

oh noos for Boris
when you fuck up the EU exit an fuck up covid as bad as trump


This is nothing to do with Brexit.

The problem for Boris is 2-fold:

1: Weak response to the Migrant Crisis. Many Britons would be perfectly happy with the Royal Navy blockading the channel and firing a warning shot across the bow of any dingy, boat or other vessel trying to gain access illegally to the UK. Priti Patel has been trying (and her points based immigration system was well received in Conservative Circles) but the simple fact is that Boris is not upholding the Law

2: Double Standards on Covid. Perhaps the best example is to compare Her Majesty, the Queen - with BoJo. When Prince Phillip Died, The Queen could have rightly said at the funeral 'Sod the Rules, I want to be with my Family' - No one would have blamed her - but she decided to play by the same rules as everyone else (whether or not she agrees with them, I don't know) so as to set the example.

Bojo on the other hand, has been caught out multiple times ignoring the rules of taking advantage of special exemptions for Government in ways that the British consider inappropriate. And if there is one thing that will piss off the British Public more than anything, it's double standards by our Leaders. Common Law means one rule for everyone.


I'm hoping that Priti Patel ousts him as Leader, or Kemi Badendock, or Jacob Rhees-Mogg (although the latter has been a bit weak on English Principles since joining the front Bench).

I'd kinda like it to be Kemi - just as the ultimate 'Fuck you' to the Diversity crowd.

[TheDemonLord]

I know. I just like wasting your time. I have nothing better to do where I am at the moment. Not much on TV. I might as well argue with you. I have the next three weeks off .. so I might not be on her much. That will let you have some quiet time with your boyfriend.

Is it wasting my time if I engage in it? I've said multiple times I like to argue - if you are willing to participate, then jolly good.


What about the one's your god gave you .. ??

Knock yourself out (https://www.crf-usa.org/foundations-of-our-constitution/natural-rights.html)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_rights_and_legal_rights

It's a good explanation of firstly Locke's conception of 'God Given Rights', which was initially made from a Protestant Christian viewpoint, but later it was realised that the same arguments could be made without the appeal to a God, but to an appeal of the individual - and those God Given rights become Natural Rights.



The word Segregation has a bad connotation ... and rightfully so. The practice of restricting a person's rights and privileges in society, based on skin colour, faith or ethnicity, has become unacceptable in our Western culture, even though it's still practiced in some isolated areas.

Based on Faith, you say?

What is it that you think Anti-Vaxxers have? They are just as fervent and Zealous in their conviction as any Born-again Christian...


But segregation for health reasons ... cannot be compared with segregation for reason of faith or Race and ethnicity.

It absolutely can. As a Hypothetical, if the State were to take away all the people with say Down Syndrome and lock them up in a care facility 'for their own protection and their health' - we would absolutely condemn that as wrong.

The bit that you are omitting is that there needs to be an initial act. We don't preemptively lock people up. We can certainly segregate an individual or a small group of individuals who have a deadly disease, but up until this point we have never segregated people from society just because they might have a disease.


I live in Dunedin. about 19% would be unvaccinated. I have more respect for that 10% sticking to their guns and not getting the vaccine ... than those mouthing off on how wrong it all is ... and got the jabs anyway. As I've already said ... it is NOT illegal to NOT get the jabs.

I have no issue with the Vaccine. None. My contention has always been with the compulsion, by the Government, to GET the Vaccine - such as Passports, job loss etc.

Two different concepts.


Good luck with all that. Let us know when you slim down to an XXL ... I'll buy you a cream cake.

Last pair of jeans I bought (this year) were a Large... And I prefer Choccy Cake.


More likely you and they have different agendas ... the vaccinated have a sort of foot in both camps ... but like to be seen as having principals. The un-vaccinated however ... usually have personal reasons. The reasons are usually actually irrelevant. Usually based on ignorance or stupidity. The un-vaxinated are allowed in Supermarkets ... the superspreader location of modern times. Thus ... I like to go to places where there is less risk of contracting the virus.

And that's absolutely fine - the bit we both agree on is that Governments trying to compel people, using force and discrimination, to undergo a medical procedure that they don't want to, is wrong.

I doubt we agree on much passed that...


Stand up more often ... it's good exercise.

I prefer to Swim.


They (as you do) have their own agendas. Not necessarily the legal one ... the trick to achieve is not getting caught out.

Or to effect Change...


THEY don't have to wear a yellow star (or any OTHER such symbol)

Not yet, but we've got identity papers (the Vaccine Passport), which puts us about at 1938 Germany...


I didn't say SAME THING ... I said ... Not much different.

1. Gang Patches are banned in MOST Government agencies.

2. And Gang Patches are banned from MANY/MOST drinking/eating businesses ... and most public places ... and establishments.

Sure, but one can take off their Gang Colours and entire the premises...

It's not the Gang MEMBER that is prohibited, it's the Gang Colours.


Only a few want to die. Those living want to enjoy their life. Those nearing their life's end want to make the most of the time they have left ... a few things on their bucket list still to tick off. As such ... restrictions on their movement ... even if it's for their own good ... are not appreciated (Understatement).

And there we have it - the people we are supposedly helping, don't want our Help, they want Freedom, just like me.


If you're vaccinated ... YOU don't need to stay inside ... REMEMBER .. ??

But the point remains, if I change my opinion, I have the ability to stay inside.


I've been asked many times now ... only a few did not. I probably wont go back to those places. That's MY choice ... not theirs.

Likewise, the Businesses that comply with Tyranny loose my business.


If YOU were one of those people ... what actions would you take .. ?? continue to take your rights to freedom and roam freely ... or stay safe. At HOME .. ??

I can't fully answer that, but my answer would be: What do they do during Flu Season? That would be the answer - they have choices to make about their own safety.


We have discussed this before. To date nobody has been charged with passing on the virus. It may be up for discussions when that happens.

Not Covid, not yet - but there is precedent that people who know they have a deadly Virus (such as HIV) and knowingly fail to take steps to prevent passing on the disease.

So I could see that if someone knows they have Covid and went out and spread it - sure, prosecute them. But if you don't know you have it - good luck...


BULLSHIT. Just based on your own self-centered indulgence and ignorance.

Interesting comment - because by your own admission, there's people whose posts you don't read because you don't care for and by your own admission, you are wasting time - If it was just 'self-centered indulgence and ignorance', then I very much doubt you'd engage.

You know that I've long stood on principles for all, I've publicly and privately defended people I disagree with, when I felt they were getting undue attention from the Mods - and you know that in this regard I've long been very consistent - which is Freedom and Liberty.

[TheDemonLord]

Something I was reminded of whilst reading this thread:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVYqB0uTKlE

Specifically the first part, the idea of 'proving who you are' to freely access things is against British Ideals

[husaberg]

Don't tell me, the commies and the feminists along with the islamics are conspiring to make him an Incell.
Constantly making up stories, of how boris and trump are not the true hero's of Covid
Everyone knows its true the Nazis were left wing
TLDR knows more about covid than doctors, more about the law than Judges and more about National security than the FBI
the commies are trying to disarm him as he is onto their tricks , its his god given right to have firearms he doesn't need to protect him against commies an anyone he doesn't like
This will follow a whole heap of rebuttals to points you never made, misdirections to avoid points you did make, that he tries to twist all the while a constant refusal to admit hes is clearly wrong when faced with overwhelming evidence.
Pretty close?

[TheDemonLord]

Don't tell me the commies and the feminists along with the islamics are conspiring to make him an Incell.
Constantly making up stories of how boris an trump are the true hero's of Covid
Nazis were left wing
He knows more about covid than doctors more about the law than Judges and more about National security then the FBI
the commies are trying to disarm him as he is onto their tricks ad its his god given right to have firearms he doesn't need to protect him against commies an anyone he doesn't llke
followed by a whole heap of rebuttals to points you never made misdirections to to points you did made that he tries to twist all the while a nstant refusial to admit hes is clearly wrong when faced with overwhelming evidence.
Pretty close?

You alright? You seem to be having some form of Forum Aneurysm.

[husaberg]

Stalin again you say, the little dickens.

[pritch]

Priti Patel has been trying (and her points based immigration system was well received in Conservative Circles) but the simple fact is that Boris is not upholding the Law.


Priti Patel's law means that the Royal Life Boat Service can be prosecuted if they rescue drowning would be immigrants. Patel is as thick as pig shit and twice as nasty.



I'm hoping that Priti Patel ousts him as Leader, or Kemi Badendock, or Jacob Rhees-Mogg (although the latter has been a bit weak on English Principles since joining the front Bench).

This has to be a troll. Although you do consistently admire the most appalling people.

For those who have no idea who Priti Patel is, I offer these. All are humerous although one is unintentionally so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xk4EMBXxG5A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DrsVhzbLzU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGL-g5S58Pk

That last might be the firat time I've heard 'Blowers' speaking without mentioning seagulls.

[TheDemonLord]

Priti Patel's law means that the Royal Life Boat Service can be prosecuted if they rescue drowning would be immigrants. Patel is as thick as pig shit and twice as nasty.

Rescue and bring back to England.

It's not the Rescuing that's illegal, it's the bringing them to England that's illegal. And it's so that certain groups of people (NOT the RNLI) aren't tempted to help people enter the country illegally.

I mean, if I was to play the same cards your side of the aisle likes to play - I'd just call you a Sexist Racist, because how dare you say anything mean against a Woman of Colour :lol::lol::lol::lol:

T
his has to be a troll. Although you do consistently admire the most appalling people.

For those who have no idea who Priti Patel is, I offer these. All are humerous although one is unintentionally so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xk4EMBXxG5A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DrsVhzbLzU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGL-g5S58Pk

That last might be the firat time I've heard 'Blowers' speaking without mentioning seagulls.

More *clear* racism and *clear* Sexism....

But to address the actual point:

Kemi Badendock - She's everything that the Left Wing loves champion under the guise of intersectionality/CRT and she has absolutely None of their nonesnse - she knows of it's Marxist roots and is very vocal about opposing it.

JRM - The Most Toff of Toffs, but consistently espouses the British Liberal viewpoint of 'Let the People decide' and 'The collective decisions of the British People are better than decisions in Whitehall'

Priti The Barbarian - She's been trying to address the Migrant crisis and IMO been sabotaged by her own department constantly, but she's finally cudgeling them into submission. And also like Kemi - she's a Woman of Colour, so by the standards of the Left - they cannot say anything mean or nasty about her, ever - otherwise that's proof of Misogyny, Sexism and Racism.

The UK has a Border and it is well within it's right to decide who does and who does not get to come in, either temporary or permanently. Almost all of the people who are illegally trying to get into the country are young men, some of whom have been denied Asylum or denied Visas, but they think they can just ignore that and come anyway and the reason they think that, is because we let them.

All it would take, for the boats to stop, is if the Royal Navy started firing warning shots across the Bow. Henry the 8th and Elizabeth the 1st had a pretty good understanding on how the Royal Navy might be used to stop boats full of people trying to illegally enter your country...

[R650R]

Priti Patel's law means that the Royal Life Boat Service can be prosecuted if they rescue drowning would be immigrants. s.

So will this actually happen, prob not. There are many things in law like how cops and ambos have no immunity from running red lights it’s just that the authorities use their discretion. I can’t see any British court standing to hear such a case if ever brought forward.

The same lawsuit have existed for lorry drivers for decades. You commit an offence if arriving in UK with an illegal on or in your vehicle whether or not you knew.

[R650R]

Well our media have been totally suckered in to lockdown rebranding with the article about how Jacinda reluctant to change traffic light levels too soon as we haven’t been in it for very long...,,
WTF!!!!’ we’ve been in lockdown since August they’ve tinkered with it since then with new made up delta levels and now the traffic light name and they portray it a second something new.....,
Just remember when she smile she in six months time and says we all in green light level she Sc really saying hey suckers were in level two lockdown forever....

[pritch]

I mean, if I was to play the same cards your side of the aisle likes to play - I'd just call you a Sexist Racist, because how dare you say anything mean against a Woman of Colour :lol::lol::lol::lol:


Women of colour probably get cut some slack initially, but Patel is not only stupid, she appears to be devoid of any redeeming qualities. IIRC there were charges of mistreating parliamentary staff found to be justified by inquiry. This would normally be cause for resignation but that wasn't forthcoming, and Johnson let it slide. Patel is one of those awful people who pull the ladder up behind them. Her parents arrived in Britain as refugees from Uganda, but she has no empathy for others in similar straits.

There is probably nobody in Johnson's cabinet worthy of promotion. The cabinet members were chosen for two criteria: that they were staunch Brexiteers, and blind loyalty to Johnson. There are presumably much better candidates outside cabinet and as Johnson's star fades we may discover who they are.

Meanwhile Britain continues its sad slide to third world status.

[FJRider]

Priti Patel's law means that the Royal Life Boat Service can be prosecuted if they rescue drowning would be immigrants.

Those illegal immigrants trying to enter the country are unlikely to be the ones calling the Lifeboat Service. The boats they get to cross the Channel are barely capable of being seaworthy ... let alone having radios capable of calling the life boat service. Some of those emigrants trying that lark may not even have life-jackets.

But the Life Boat Service have their own point of view.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/jul/28/rnli-hits-out-migrant-taxi-service-accusations

As I see it ... the difference between legality and illegality in bringing the Refugees ashore on British territory is ... if there is "Intent" (or not) for them to assist an emigrants (illegal) entry into the country. The Services Charitable status would severely be put at risk if they tried to coverup any assistance that they gave to anybody ... or be seen as assisting the illegal entry of any person into the country.

[FJRider]

... It's not the Rescuing that's illegal, it's the bringing them to England that's illegal.

Nope ... not even that. It would need to be proven (In a Court of Law) that they were "facilitating illegal immigration".

Many persons that they have rescued from sinking ships ... may not have had time to get their passport from their cabins. From YOUR point of view ... ANY person being "Rescued" ... must have an official recognized and current International Passport BEFORE being taken aboard the RNLI rescue boat.

Do you really think THAT will happen ... ??


And it's so that certain groups of people (NOT the RNLI) aren't tempted to help people enter the country illegally.

The Royal National Lifeboat Service is a Charitable organization. As such ... their funding would disappear if they were publicly seen/proven as engaging in an illegal action or activity.

However ... there are many getting well paid to "assist" in some way ... those seeking (illegal) entry the country.


I mean, if I was to play the same cards your side of the aisle likes to play - I'd just call you a Sexist Racist, because how dare you say anything mean against a Woman of Colour :lol::lol::lol::lol:

It would need to be comments that were said (or inferred) regarding to a specific sex ... to be sexist. To be racist ... Colour doesn't need to be mentioned ... just inferred. Like the words ... "Them/they" ... is enough to infer a prejudice. The end result of such possible interpretation ... is super sensitive selection of wording in ... Public statements made by Public figures. Some such statements ... are actually quite laughable.

[pritch]

Comments on the current state of Britain

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJKUND80BjU

[Kickaha]

I had someone in at work yesterday who gave me the run down on covid and the vaccines, apparently the ultimate goal in all of this is to reduce the world population down to half a billion people, the cull has started

[george formby]

I had someone in at work yesterday who gave me the run down on covid and the vaccines, apparently the ultimate goal in all of this is to reduce the world population down to half a billion people, the cull has started


:killingme

I had that chucked at me a couple of times. When I asked them how "Teh Elite" would make more money and live a life of luxury if they killed everybody, it kinda turned their side of the conversation into really small words. Er, but, um and so forth.

At least they never called me a sheep.

[F5 Dave]

Some say a comet will fall from the sky
Followed by meteor showers and tidal waves
Followed by fault lines that cannot sit still
Followed by millions of dumbfounded dipshits
And some say the end is near
Some say we'll see Armageddon soon
I certainly hope we will
I sure could use a vacation from this
Stupid shit, silly shit, stupid shit
One great big festering neon distraction
I've a suggestion to keep you all occupied
Learn to swim, learn to swim, learn to swim
'Cause Mom's gonna fix it all soon
Mom's comin' 'round to put it back the way it ought to be
Learn to swim, learn to swim
Learn to swim, learn to swim
Learn to swim, learn to swim
Learn to swim, learn to swim​

[TheDemonLord]

Some say a comet will fall from the sky
Followed by meteor showers and tidal waves
Followed by fault lines that cannot sit still
Followed by millions of dumbfounded dipshits
And some say the end is near
Some say we'll see Armageddon soon
I certainly hope we will
I sure could use a vacation from this
Stupid shit, silly shit, stupid shit
One great big festering neon distraction
I've a suggestion to keep you all occupied
Learn to swim, learn to swim, learn to swim
'Cause Mom's gonna fix it all soon
Mom's comin' 'round to put it back the way it ought to be
Learn to swim, learn to swim
Learn to swim, learn to swim
Learn to swim, learn to swim
Learn to swim, learn to swim​

Fuck L. Ron Hubbard, and fuck all his clones
Fuck all these gun-toting hip gangster wannabes
Yeah, fuck retro anything, fuck your tattoos
Fuck all you junkies, and fuck your short memory
Yeah, fuck smiley glad-hands with hidden agendas
Fuck these dysfunctional insecure actresses

[onearmedbandit]

I had someone in at work yesterday who gave me the run down on covid and the vaccines, apparently the ultimate goal in all of this is to reduce the world population down to half a billion people, the cull has started


:killingme

I had that chucked at me a couple of times. When I asked them how "Teh Elite" would make more money and live a life of luxury if they killed everybody, it kinda turned their side of the conversation into really small words. Er, but, um and so forth.

At least they never called me a sheep.

I've turned that argument back on them. If 'they' wanted to lower the population it doesn't make sense to kill off the obedient majority, rather it makes more sense to kill off the dissidents. 'They' still need skilled people, to fly and maintain their planes, to produce food, to maintain infrastructure, etc to innovate and improve the quality of life for 'them'. So create a pandemic that requires a vaccine, those who oppose, the very ones you want to kill off will refuse and then in a few months start releasing an agent be it airborne or in the food chain that only kills those who did not take the vaccine. Add in to the conversation that third world countries, those nations who depend on international support, are struggling to get access to the vaccine and you will make their eyes spin as they can't argue against a controlling group creating and manipulating this event, as that is the basis of their very own argument.

[husaberg]

I've turned that argument back on them. If 'they' wanted to lower the population it doesn't make sense to kill off the obedient majority, rather it makes more sense to kill off the dissidents. 'They' still need skilled people, to fly and maintain their planes, to produce food, to maintain infrastructure, etc to innovate and improve the quality of life for 'them'. So create a pandemic that requires a vaccine, those who oppose, the very ones you want to kill off will refuse and then in a few months start releasing an agent be it airborne or in the food chain that only kills those who did not take the vaccine. Add in to the conversation that third world countries, those nations who depend on international support, are struggling to get access to the vaccine and you will make their eyes spin as they can't argue against a controlling group creating and manipulating this event, as that is the basis of their very own argument.

If you were to produce a disease with an aim to kill people off ebola or the sars variant ie a more deadly one might be a better place to start....

The fatality ratio is less than 1% for people younger than 25, 6% for those aged 25 to 44, 15% for those aged 45 to 64, and more than 50% for people 65 or older, officials said.
Ps Fraser, Did they ask you which arm you prefered for the jab:scratch:

[onearmedbandit]

If you were to produce a disease with an aim to kill people off ebola or the sars variant ie a more deadly one might be a better place to start....

The details matter not, it's just a thought experiment for them to consider a possible scenario which combines manipulation and depopulation, something a lot of them believe but twisting it against their position.


Ps Fraser, Did they ask you which arm you prefered for the jab:scratch:

I always get asked, and always have to explain why.

[R650R]

I've turned that argument back on them. If 'they' wanted to lower the population it doesn't make sense to kill off the obedient majority, rather it makes more sense to kill off the dissidents. 'They' still need skilled people, to fly and maintain their planes, to produce food, to maintain infrastructure, etc to innovate and improve the quality of life for 'them'. So create a pandemic that requires a vaccine, those who oppose, the very ones you want to kill off will refuse and then in a few months start releasing an agent be it airborne or in the food chain that only kills those who did not take the vaccine. Add in to the conversation that third world countries, those nations who depend on international support, are struggling to get access to the vaccine and you will make their eyes spin as they can't argue against a controlling group creating and manipulating this event, as that is the basis of their very own argument.

I’m not saying anything in support of that conspiracy but.... you are missing how the Elite think.... while average Joe might have 2,5,10, 20 year life goals if they’ve really switched on (most people don’t) the elite have generational goals.... eg at this stage in their gameplan all they want is the next generation growing up thinking it’s normal to HAVE to carry a cellphone 24/7 and record/report ALL your movements and purchases to the state.
Also with electronic bookings it becomes very easy in future to decide who gets what shot..... be it an effective/placebo/destructive/downgrade if that is desired.
Anyhow back to timelines the Elite are very happy to take one for the team in the bugger picture. If 500,000 people could not sustain current luxuries for them that’s no big deal. They get their kicks from control and it’s power not the bling stuff....
And just look how fast the worlds population exploded to 7 billion with industrialised agriculture. A replacement reproduction scheme via approved reproducers could restock the species rapidly with new “people” with no knowledge of past human freedoms or ideals. Much like how a new CEO gets rid of previous staff and hires all new people. To instal a new system you destroy the old one first.

[Berries]

Fucking hell.



Nanu nanu.

[pete376403]

I’m not saying anything in support of that conspiracy but.... you are missing how the Elite think.... while average Joe might have 2,5,10, 20 year life goals if they’ve really switched on (most people don’t) the elite have generational goals.... eg at this stage in their gameplan all they want is the next generation growing up thinking it’s normal to HAVE to carry a cellphone 24/7 and record/report ALL your movements and purchases to the state.
Also with electronic bookings it becomes very easy in future to decide who gets what shot..... be it an effective/placebo/destructive/downgrade if that is desired.
Anyhow back to timelines the Elite are very happy to take one for the team in the bugger picture. If 500,000 people could not sustain current luxuries for them that’s no big deal. They get their kicks from control and it’s power not the bling stuff....
And just look how fast the worlds population exploded to 7 billion with industrialised agriculture. A replacement reproduction scheme via approved reproducers could restock the species rapidly with new “people” with no knowledge of past human freedoms or ideals. Much like how a new CEO gets rid of previous staff and hires all new people. To instal a new system you destroy the old one first.

Obviously a cut and paste from some conspiracy website - the biggest clue is there are none of R650s usual spelling and grammar mistakes. But, humour us - if the masses are (nearly) all killed off, who will the "elites" have to lord their power over? If "elite" becomes the new normal, what good will their power if everyone has the same power? Sounds a bit communist where everyone is equal. Who is going to be in charge - the Party?

[F5 Dave]

To be fair, it sounds like a fucking good idea for the sake of the planet, and think how the roads would be clear on sundays. I'm pretty confident I'll be one of the elite. I'll add it to my online CV just to be sure.
Sweet.

[pritch]

I’m not saying anything in support of that conspiracy but.... .

And that right there is the funniest part.

[mashman]

Sick people are easier to control and manipulate than healthy people. They are also more profitable. The herd needs thinning/global production needs to halve while the financial economy demands that the physical economy grow, if "Teh Elite" are going to have a planet to control the resources of.

The owners of production, by reason of self-inflated ego (coz there aint no logic reason or common sense involved), want the financial economy to continue. "Teh Elite" and not "Teh Elite" share the sme planet. Given the responses to the dirty "unproductive units" that I've read on here over the years, "Teh Elite" will have all the support they need to do whatever they wish......................

[mashman]

Obviously a cut and paste from some conspiracy website - the biggest clue is there are none of R650s usual spelling and grammar mistakes. But, humour us - if the masses are (nearly) all killed off, who will the "elites" have to lord their power over? If "elite" becomes the new normal, what good will their power if everyone has the same power? Sounds a bit communist where everyone is equal. Who is going to be in charge - the Party?

How can everyone be equal and yet someone needs to be in charge? You sure you know what communism is bruv (and for the record I Am not a fan of the notion given the structures of control that it employs, hence RBE).

[TheDemonLord]

To be fair, it sounds like a fucking good idea for the sake of the planet, and think how the roads would be clear on sundays.

I remember someone in Christchurch who had a similar idea...

[R650R]

Obviously a cut and paste from some conspiracy website - the biggest clue is there are none of R650s usual spelling and grammar mistakes. But, humour us - if the masses are (nearly) all killed off, who will the "elites" have to lord their power over? If "elite" becomes the new normal, what good will their power if everyone has the same power? Sounds a bit communist where everyone is equal. Who is going to be in charge - the Party?

They would still have control over about 495,000 at least, that will keep them occupied. The main thing they want control over is our knowledge and education. The slaves on the plantation have learnt to read and that’s dangerous for them.
We are at a tipping point in humanity where rapid open sourcing of technology, education and production tools threaten the established heirachy. Current govts survive because they are a monopoly service.
For example the asset base and knowledge of food production fishing and farming, Maori could walk away today and create their own parallel internal economy. Overnight the govt would lose 20% of its tax income. Then what day another 10-5% of population who have close connection to Maori families and friends join them, the govt has a big problem. This is a potential problem when you look at how popular the tiny house/greenie/hipster/Van life/gear down employment culture has become. People are realising that working til 65 at maximum potential to service a ridiculous mortgage is not best idea after all....
We al ready see parallels where this works eg private hospitals/resthomes function alongside stage models through subscription/insurance methods. What’s to stop other private ventures/collaborations making state services redundant...,

[Kickaha]

None of you cunts who have had the vaccine are going to Heaven either, apparently it alters your DNA from what you were born with and God wont recognise you because of that

[F5 Dave]

If he doesn't recognise me brilliant, I'll rock on up as a door to door salesman, then sneak in round the side and go knobble the cunt while he's asleep.
Course I'll have to bring him back to life, and then into existence, but it's worth it for the giggles.

[husaberg]

Fucking hell..
If they do its unlikely to be consensual and highly likely to be painanal.


None of you cunts who have had the vaccine are going to Heaven either, apparently it alters your DNA from what you were born with and God wont recognise you because of that
That's an interesting point as those unvaxed are more likely to die
and find fairy tales more appealing than facts and science

[pete376403]

How can everyone be equal and yet someone needs to be in charge? You sure you know what communism is bruv (and for the record I Am not a fan of the notion given the structures of control that it employs, hence RBE).

"Communism" as it is/was practised is not Communism that Marx would recognise. Using the promise of equality to overthrow the existing power (eg Russia, China) then installing a new dictatorship to replace the previous dictatorship ie "meet the new boss, same as the old boss"is probably something more along the lines of fascism.

[TheDemonLord]

"Communism" as it is/was practised is not Communism that Marx would recognise. Using the promise of equality to overthrow the existing power (eg Russia, China) then installing a new dictatorship to replace the previous dictatorship ie "meet the new boss, same as the old boss"is probably something more along the lines of fascism.

And here is your weekly reminder that all the Fascists were Former Communists...

Funny that...