View Full Version : 99' Bandit 250 coilpack and HT leads help
Hello Guys.
To make long sotry short:
My little bandit is missing sometimes when it's high humidity only at low rpm (that means pretty much every morning on my way to work).
I've been told that these are worn HT leads arcing on the frame and rocker cover, etc.
Somebody told me (i'm not sure whether that is correct) that my model's HT leads are hardwired into a coilpack, so basically to rpelace them I need to replace the whole coilpack (and then I do not know which one, as there are two). Can somebody confirm/deny that ?
I emailed Colemans for quote and they are wanting around $250 per coilpack, which I think is far to excesive.... so if I have to replace both coilpacks then it's twice that... aswell they suggested to get HT leads at repco, and that got me really confused...
Any other places I can look for the part I need ?
and is it possible to replace HT leads without replacing the coil ?
Thanks in advance,
Mops.
Can you tell me what happens/ what you do? my bandit does this too and fortunately for me its covered under warrenty still...
basically it misfires when on low rpm (under 5k), like constantly... i.e. it not that it's gonna miss one or two cycles, but it will be misfiring until your relase throttle - missing occurs when engine is on load, if you accelerate gently you might get away without missing. sometimgs it's more pronounced and works, making eg. moving off the light very difficult, and uphill almost impossible. Problem occurs more likely on cold engine, but occus on warm/hot aswell.
I noticed it worsens as the bike is NOT used. if i used it every day then it's almost never a problem. if I dont use the bike throughout the weekend monday and tuesday it misses somwhat. I was using my car for a whole week few weeks ago and then on monday and tuesday bike was virtually unrideable. I rode it very slowly to work and back and eventually it got better into full operating capability by the end of that week...
yeap same as mine (sounds alot worse though), i ride mine every day thoug so who knows......
what octane are you using?
bp 98.
once i filled gull's 96 and it was noticably worse.
yea.... does yours ever bog down and refuse to rev?
i think i might whip the tank off again and see what i can see......
again, if I ride it every day then missing is non-exsistent.
what do you mean bog down ? constant missing on one pot does sounds like bogging down. when it's not missing then it revs hard and all...
sometimes my bike refuses to rev over 2k rpm for anywhere between 20 seconds and 5 minutes.. after which it roars into life and i drop the throttle.
Mine has a slight miss but lately it hasnt been firing at all on one cyclinder.
Ive got a cycleworks exhaust on mine too, what about you?
MikeyG
2nd May 2006, 14:58
Before going and spending up on coils and HT leads I would get your ignition advance checked. It could be something as small as a broken/perished vacum hose from the carbs to the ignition unit.
I don't have much experience working on bikes but this is what I would check on a car engine.
well, if one pot is not fireing, you will get a significant loss of power - bike will be unrideable pretty much.
out problem could be caused aswell by some contamination in the carb or stuck float...
um any idea where abouts this vacuum hose is? or looks like? or runs to/from (more specifically)?
foxrider was having problems with his too, he said his mate put new plugs in and played around with the ht lead order.
yeh, my boss (old biker) told me to replace plugs first. bike runs wasted spark, so i ht leads can be rearanged in certain combination. I'll pull the tank off this weekend and see what is going on. aswell i'll get a fresh set of plugs anyways...
MikeyG
2nd May 2006, 15:11
No idea where it is or even if it will have a vacuum hose b'cos all my experience is on car engines.
Did some work on a mates skyline the other day. Has CDI ignition for each cylinder (6 cylinders). Replacing the CDI's and plugs was going to cost him $30 for a plug and $250 for a CDI for each cylinder = $280 per cylinder. He was better off going to an auto electrician and getting them to find out what was wrong and just getting that part replaced. I'd suggest the same to you.
Another thing to check is dirt/moisture. Pull off the spark plug leads and clean the top of the plugs and the inside of the HT lead/plug cap. A peice of rag on the end of a small screwdriver works well for cleaning the inside of the cap. A SMALL spray with CRC or WD40 can help battle moisture but clean them before spraying. It's surprising how much crap gets up inside the plug cap and how much difference it makes.
Unless you have a workshop manual, wiring diagram, and know what you are doing with electrics you are more likely to make things better than worse by playing with the HT lead order.
mikeyG, thanks for concern.
I insalland and tune standalone ECU's on cars, so i know about ignition systems and EFI hardware. I rebuild car engines myself, so I'm not a noob you know :)
all tho I never got to know carbs.... i sorta know how they work but dont have much experience with them.
MikeyG
2nd May 2006, 15:51
Sounds like you're all clued up on ignitions systems then and have probably tried anything I can suggest. There's another similar thread on the site today. See link below.
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=28692
F5 Dave
2nd May 2006, 17:22
Just to clear up, no vacuum hose on bikes. No distributor either if you're looking.
No safteybelts, no doors & more often than not, no 10 disc CD changer & pump'n stereo.
Repco HT leads will be silicon & that won't work well on a bike. Need to stick with copper leads. First thing is check the plug caps. They have a resistor in them & it will read about 5k to maybe 12kohm. If you tried from plug to plug on a dual coil then 30 would sound about right, though it varies. Buy a cheap multimeter from Dick Smith for about $0. It will be useful later in life & will have a manual. Suzuki coils aren't too flash. Just put some Honda ones on my RF as one coil was a bit dicky, though I pulled out the suzuki leads & plugged them into the Honda coils which do screw (clamp) up, unlike the Suz ones which are just a spike & a clip that breaks, maybe could be glued in place with Epoxy. Maybe. Dyna sell aftermarket coils.
HOWEVER. Pull the plugs & see if one of them (maybe the sidestand side) is darker than the others, If so then your carbs may be leaking petrol into that cylinder as the bike sits & fouling one or more plugs. A new plug will fix it, but not for long & plugs often don't clean properly despite appearance.
cant wait till tommorow when i walk into the bike shop and suggest that they pay $1k to replace the coils on my bike :rofl:
so ? how did it go wasp ?
I'm thinking to replace spark plugs first.
colemans quoted me $20 per plug.....
anybody knows any other place to get them cheaper ?
go who what me go where? my contact lenses havnt even arrived yet...
I'll go there tonight and let ya know, i bet they spew.
im also considering doing the plugs first. um they told me $7 a plug...
hm........
maybe it's different model....
:)
good luck !
Phurrball
4th May 2006, 15:38
Hmmm - $20 a plug sounds like iridium plugs. $7 sounds more like it. I just whacked a set of NGK CR8E plugs in my Bandit after fuel consumption deteriorated. Back to normal now.
I don't think I've been having the same extent of problems as you guys, but my bike doesn't like low revs (under 5K) that much either. It's OK, I just feel it should be better. Have been thinking I may need to bite the bullet sometime and get the carbs stripped and cleaned to return performance and efficiency.
I can't say I've ever looked that closely at the coilpacks to know if the HT leads are integrated or not.
Let me know how you both get on - I'm watching with interest.
Phurrball/Ross
well he didnt quite hit the roof but i made sure we were outside just incase...
Says hes gonna look into finding some, they did have 3 bikes, mine and a green one, the other was used for parts (nicked the stock handle bars for mine) but sadly they've sold it :doh:
but yea he seemed quite happy to switch em over, not sure what he'll say if i mention new ones....
i bet the problem goes away gradually as we head back to summer too...
right the bikes in the shop at the moment getting operated on (yeap at this very time), ill call them after lunch tommorow to see whats what...
im guessing theyre dynoing it and comparing it to the green one they've got there at the moment.
also when i was out riding last night with rg100 it was running fairly well, apparently it shoots massive red/blue flames out the back of the exhaust when it back fires too (not sure if thats a sign of something but it sounds cool to me :D, and yea i know the air filter can catch fire during a back fire so lets just hope it doesnt)
allright, well... last night I insulated both coild from the fuel tank.
the thing is that coild are mounted on very close to the fuel tank. When i took off the tank I noticed deposits of white/yellowish powder on both coils where the leads joint the coils - from what i understand these were the signs of sparks arcing there. i whacked two thick rubber pads over suspicous spots and went for a ride. seemed much better, but still some missing (alltho much less than perviously)... this morning i've benn playing with choke and at some point it stopped missing alltogether and it work much better now...
I'll update if anything changes.
oooh that sounds like a good idea, i think (no where near sure) that i had some yellow around the coil packs.
just called the bike shop, mech said he'd call me back later so i said i'd just call at 4, i asked if he'd found anything yet and he simply said it looks like an electrical problem.
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