Noise Cameras?? Oh yes! Check this out

[wkid_one]

Noise cameras are being trialed in OZ to catch loud vehicles


The State government environmental departments of Australia have been trialling a noise camera to capture excessively loud vehicles.

There is no draft legislation however it is understood that the mooted noise cameras will be used to capture engine-braking trucks ONLY, as there are no current in-service rules that apply to the exceedingly-loud braking systems or tests developed that are able to be applied in the field (in-service). Only with in-service testing similar to speed cameras can this source of noise be captured.

The proposed offence is "Objectionable Noise". Penalties have yet to be announced

If the camera is set to a certain trigger level, it can pick up similar sounds, quieter and closer to the microphone. It is anticipated that each recording and subsequent photograph will be listened to and viewed by an enforcement officer. If it is found that a vehicle other than a truck has triggered the camera, the vehicle may be directed to be tested in accordance to the Australian Vehicle Standards Rules. It will then of course be required to comply with the relevant noise level for its production year and vehicle type.

The trigger point is expected to be quite high, in the order of 110dB(A) to capture the very loud vehicles. It may, however, also capture an excessively noisy motorcycle passing the capture point that produces noise in the same frequency range.

Motorcyclists need to understand that there is no real way state noise enforcement agencies can apply the "drive-by" noise test level to a vehicle on the road, even if stock, as the testing regime for new motorcycles is reliant on a number of constants, not present in normal use.

Motorcycles, when tested by the drive-by method are required to pass by the sound meter at a very specific speed, gear position and throttle position. It is not used in-service as it is costly and difficult to do correctly. It is, however, the method used to test new vehicles in order to meet Australian Design Rules approval for sale in Australia. Stationary noise testing is the accepted method of testing exhaust noise in-service and this can only be performed whilst the motorcycle is stationary, due to the number of variables present on the road.


NB: Chris Coote is involved with the MCC of NSW, researching noise legislation and forthcoming revisions.

[FROSTY]

holey crap batman-and wot the auzzies do we are sure to follow.
mind you dont they have dba meters in testing stations already?

[pete376403]

Hope NZ follows Victorias lead and refunds some $14 million in fines dues to faulty speed cameras. Also another $6 million to people who have lost there license as a result of incorrect speed cameras.

Nah, not a hope. Even if NZ speed cameras were faulty the Govt would bang through some legislation declaring them, like the Pope, infallible.

[k14]

That is such a joke. It is impossible to measure the sound coming from a single vehicle without getting interference from heaps of others. What happens when a group of 10 harleys drive past the camera at the same time? 140db or so?? It is such a joke. I highly doubt it would be adopted here, a decent lawyer would get the fine thrown out straight away. The noise test (can't remember the standard, ADR something i think??) has to be conducted to the highest accuracy that this is just a joke.

[Two Smoker]

I completely agree, what a joke, what if the "loud" Vehicle is on the otherside of the road and does not trigger off the device even though it is over 110db right next to it????? And there will be so much interference, such as wind noise.......

[pete376403]

Don't warry, if the Govt want to do this they will. Like the O/P says, the recording will be listened to. The listenee will be an expert, who knows exactly who pays his salary. Thus, he will have no problem selecting the noisy vehicle. Just to be on the safe side, the legislation will declare the noise camera and the expert witness to be infallible.

[SPman]

The listenee will be an expert, who knows exactly who pays his salary.
I like that one Reggie! :2thumbsup

[Lou Girardin]

The noise thing really bugs me. I love the sounds of V twins, triples especially, V8's, V12's. 4 cyl bikes are mostly OK. But they should ban every bloody rotary and most Jap turbos with those wanker blow-off valves.
We need noise quality legislation, not quantity.

[spudchucka]

The noise thing really bugs me. I love the sounds of V twins, triples especially, V8's, V12's. 4 cyl bikes are mostly OK. But they should ban every bloody rotary and most Jap turbos with those wanker blow-off valves.
We need noise quality legislation, not quantity.
Abso_bloody_lutely!!

[Coldkiwi]

hoooo boy i'd like to see that one work (ok, no I wouldn't really), but i'd like to see them try and get it past a decent lawyer in a case! no doubt they'll set some bollocks dB(A) rating that has no possible connection to the ISO standard test (as referenced in our land transport act and almost certainly used by the aussies- we don't know any better than to copy them).

wind noise wouldn't be a problem (wind socks keep all but the highest winds out) with a decent set up but it'd be easy to tamper with them! (find one, tape a yogurt carton over it!). other traffic noise could be very problematic tho... especially on a dual (or more) carriageway.

a driveby measurement of vehicles on a highway really is daft because its almost always vehicles being abused that make the worst noise. I'm sure they could tie it up in legalise and block the logic holes with law dog baffle to make it into a revenue spinner tho.... just don't get too close when some rich sucker gets his QC mate stuck into it and rips it wide open for all to see. (like our little situations with green stickered car cases getting thrown out)

[pete376403]

My bro-in-law works for Southwards (oem muffler makers, among other things) and he was telling me that they have trouble doing noise tests in NZ - he has been told there is no where in NZ that is quiet enough to test a car on the road with NO background noise. In Aus they have to take the cars way into the outback.

Another funny they came up with is that not much of the total noise of a vehicle is exhaust. Most of it is tyres on the road. In fact, a new Falcon makes more noise coming toward the meter than going away from it.

[Motu]

In fact, a new Falcon makes more noise coming toward the meter than going away from it.

ColdKiwis gunna jump on ya for that one.

I wonder how much noise control has prompted water cooled bikes,rather than other concerns.A chain driven air cooled bike is far noisier on a drive by then a watercooled shaft drive bike.

[pete376403]

I'd say 50/50 noise and emissions. An air cooled motor can't be held to tight tolerances so as well as all the rattles there's going to be ring sealing problems until it gets up to operating temp. While it's not a problem here, the Clean Air act in the US was a mojor incentive for makers to clean up their motors. Hence two strokes died in California long before the rest of the word.

Would noise also be the reason that HD use belt rather than chain on their bikes?

[Coldkiwi]

ColdKiwis gunna jump on ya for that one.

I wonder how much noise control has prompted water cooled bikes,rather than other concerns.A chain driven air cooled bike is far noisier on a drive by then a watercooled shaft drive bike.

:msn-wink:

promise I won't.. not too hard anyway :)

Noise coming off vehicles is pretty much 95% dependant on what type of vehicle it is and what the vehicle is doing. Assuming a vehicle is passing you at about 15m away....

For bikes and cars at no speed, its mostly engine casing and a bit of exhaust (depending on the exhaust system)
During acceleration for bikes and cars its dominated by casing/exhaust
At steady highway speeds, its almost all tyre noise for 90% of cars and about 75% exhaust/casing and 25% chain/drive system for bikes

Trucks are similar to cars despite having a stack load more wheels to generate tyre noise. During engine braking of course, its all exhaust stack noise (I measured a truck putting out nearly 50dBA while engine braking down the northern motorway at a distance of about 600 metres late one night!!)

[Coldkiwi]

Would noise also be the reason that HD use belt rather than chain on their bikes?

wouldn't have thought so given how much racket the dman things make anyway. Dunno what the advantages in a belt are other than less cleaning?

[spudchucka]

Would noise also be the reason that HD use belt rather than chain on their bikes?
Perhaps they just shake and vibrate so much a chain just keeps falling off the sprockets??

[Lou Girardin]

Hope NZ follows Victorias lead and refunds some $14 million in fines dues to faulty speed cameras. Also another $6 million to people who have lost there license as a result of incorrect speed cameras.

Nah, not a hope. Even if NZ speed cameras were faulty the Govt would bang through some legislation declaring them, like the Pope, infallible.

No way, if Insp John Kelly is typical of Police hierachy, he maintains that our Stalkers are more accurate than the manufacturer does. Then goes on to confuse K and Ka band frequencies. (Autocar December)

[spudchucka]

No way, if Insp John Kelly is typical of Police hierachy, he maintains that our Stalkers are more accurate than the manufacturer does. Then goes on to confuse K and Ka band frequencies. (Autocar December)
I wouldn't think Inspector Kelly would be overly concerned about how the things work, as in what band they utilise. He should only be concerned that the things do work and are being used as per the manufacturers guidlines. It isn't as if he is out there issuing tickets.

[pete376403]

There is a song called "My God, how the money rolls in" to the music of "MY Bonnie" This verse seems appropriate:

My mother asks home politicians
To play in a night full of sin.
My father pops in with a camera.
My God, how the money rolls in!
Chorus
Rolls in, rolls in, my god how the money rolls in, rolls in!
Rolls in, rolls in, my god, how the money rolls in!

[danb]

I think it’s a good idea if it can work properly.

I am sick of the bloody hoons in their cars revving the shit out of them and doing burnouts down my road.

Instead of cameras use people. There are plenty of the unemployed in Auckland etc to do this and would be more accurate in the first place.

I also think there should be some rules in what type of exhaust system you have on you car.. Good test to have when you get your warrent.

[pete376403]

How loud is loud? How are you going to measure it? How much noise is background / how much is the vehicle? What if there's more than one vehicle, on who's authority are you going to get all the others shut down? And so on.
There are too many worms in that particular can.

[Coldkiwi]

I think it’s a good idea if it can work properly.

I am sick of the bloody hoons in their cars revving the shit out of them and doing burnouts down my road.

Instead of cameras use people. There are plenty of the unemployed in Auckland etc to do this and would be more accurate in the first place.

I also think there should be some rules in what type of exhaust system you have on you car.. Good test to have when you get your warrent.

2 things....
1) measuring sound is not as easy as you would think. uneducated people are not the best choice. I've been doing it for 2.5 years now and I still make mistakes
2) there are rules on exhaust noise... do a search on the site and you will find some very long and informative threads about the whole shooting match. It came up last year and was obviously of concern to a lot of us.

[spudchucka]

All that is needed is clear and concise legislation, (bloody near an impossibility in this country) and an easily understood set of guidlines for exhaust modification. Just testing noise is too subjective unless it is in a controlled environment, (unless it is a rotary with a big bore, they should be written off the road because they sound bloody awful).

[danb]

All that is needed is clear and concise legislation, (bloody near an impossibility in this country) and an easily understood set of guidlines for exhaust modification. Just testing noise is too subjective unless it is in a controlled environment, (unless it is a rotary with a big bore, they should be written off the road because they sound bloody awful).

I just think when a "supped" car goes buy what a bloody fool, Seriously they spend all there money on there cars and what does it prove. Big Sweet nothing. Its not so bad when you have heeps in the bank, you have a house, makeing ends meet very nicely etc. I mostly refer to the people in there teens and 20's etc. I mean for bikers its like a learner on an R1 or ebullient as well. They have all these magic cars and what do they do... End up round a power poll and annoy the bloody residents of this country.

Its the trouble with teenagers they are all like sheep, want to copy each other and having to prove them selves to each other. I’m only 18 and I just think its joke. I have a Toyota corolla 1.3l "tank" (shit in the steering :no: ) and I just drive the thing. Its luckily if it even get a wash every month :confused: . I have done no modifications or anything to it either. I couldn’t give a shit if some one laughs at me saying I drive heap of shit around town. It does the job and that’s all I it need to do.
Sure people take pride in there hobbies and stuff like that, just the same as Bikers would do, but casing a nucence in the community and putting other people on the road at risk is just going too far.

[PZR]

wouldn't have thought so given how much racket the dman things make anyway. Dunno what the advantages in a belt are other than less cleaning?
I think they have belts so they do not have to clean all that excess chain lube off the shiney bits. Sounds like too much hard work to me.

SHAFT DRIVE RULES!!! Oooooh Yeah:yes: