Ducati vs ZZR14

[Quartermile]

Hi

Why when you look at the sad world of cages:sick: almost any ferarri would smoke almost any random nissan etc, but when you return to the real world of bikes:yes: a bike from Kawasaki (ZZR14) is the fastest production bike not a Ducati or maybe Aprilia????

[SuperDave]

www.justfuckengoogleit.com

[James Deuce]

Hi

Why ....(random question)????

You're an odd little man mate.

[sugilite]

It's all about niche markets for the Itallians, they concentrate on V twin sports bikes that are made to corner. They do not have the R & D budget to produce motorcycles for every catagory like the Japanese factories do.

[nudemetalz]

You're an odd little man mate.




You said that to me as well at the cafe the other day, Jim.

What's the guts ? ;) lol

[Big Dave]

Hi

Why when you look at the sad world of cages:sick: almost any ferarri would smoke almost any random nissan etc, but when you return to the real world of bikes:yes: a bike from Kawasaki (ZZR14) is the fastest production bike not a Ducati or maybe Aprilia????

In a straight line only.

[Edbear]

Granted, but the MV 1000 is pretty damn fast! And it's called the Ferrari of motorcycles.

The Ities are determined not to be left behind in the sportsbike arena despite their smaller budgets compared to the Japs. I think they do pretty well, considering.

[Quasievil]

Granted, but the MV 1000 is pretty damn fast! And it's called the Ferrari of motorcycles.




Errr no that would be the Ducati is the ferrari of motorcycles

[Crisis management]

Maybe its the question thats wrong, if you compared Ferrari's with Maserati's then that would be a better analogy to comparable sportsbikes.
After that its what colour / style / noise / brand you like personally.
Maybe its a secret plot by Spank me to keep people on this site arguing??, Sorry, healthy discussion..

[98tls]

Hi

Why when you look at the sad world of cages:sick: almost any ferarri would smoke almost any random nissan etc, but when you return to the real world of bikes:yes: a bike from Kawasaki (ZZR14) is the fastest production bike not a Ducati or maybe Aprilia???? yea but the zzr14 looks like a big fat overweight whore compared to a duc....lets say roseanne compared to elle macpherson...:yes:

[Squeak the Rat]

What was the question?

The italians will be up there again. Just as soon as they change the rules......

[Finn]

Errr no that would be the Ducati is the ferrari of motorcycles

While Ducati has always been called "The Ferrari of motorcycles" this is by association only. Being italian and red. However, MV has real Ferarri bloodlines with with development of the F4 engine. This is mentioned on their website. The "F" in F4 is even the Ferarri font.

[Quasievil]

While Ducati has always been called "The Ferrari of motorcycles" this is by association only. Being italian and red. However, MV has real Ferarri bloodlines with with development of the F4 engine. This is mentioned on their website. The "F" in F4 is even the Ferarri font.

Ya reckon?
I always associated Ducati with Ferarri because both have such a long history in Motor Racing, and to this day both brands are winning races as they have done for years, this coupled with being Italian I reckon pairs them a up in a spiritual kinda way closer that Augusta does. Now that Ducati have the Desmosedici GP7 V4 I wonder the relevance of MV closeness is minimised.

Its all kinda bollocks any way, one has two wheels one has four, and all of them are fucking awesome bits of Italian Kit, and all 3 brands belong in the thoroughbred stable of machinery.

[Finn]

Well yes, the Ducati winning streak helped. MV are starting to build a name in the Superbike world with some recent wins in the UK. Once they sort out their ownership & debt, I hope to see them represented in more racing, maybe even MotoGP.

http://www.mvagusta.net/history/15

Form MV's Website...

Cagiva Motor engineers faced with a blank sheet of paper strove to do their best, starting out on the basis of the technical assumption that an MV Agusta bike, to be true to its heritage, had to have a 3 or 4 cylinder in-line engine. This configuration was totally absent in European motorcycles, so Claudio Castiglioni found himself faced with the choice of either buying a Japanese engine or creating a totally new one. He chose the second option, and started out with a project developed by Ferrari, referred to as F4, and then developed up until the present day by MV Agusta technicians and engineers.
The engine was created using exclusive solutions such as the radial valve arrangement and removable transmission, the first solution inherited from the broken up Ferrari and the second from the Cagiva GP. Industrial production of the new engine began at the same time as the design of the riding and aesthetic aspects, entrusted to the great master Massimo Tamburini, director of the CRC (Cagiva Research Centre). Tamburini already had many years' experience dressing this type of propulsor unit, accumulated during his years with Bimota (which stands for Bianchi, Morri and Tamburini). The first prototype was completed on the eve of the 1997 salon in Milan and exhibited to the press for the first time on September 16 of that year. The reporters were amazed by the marvel before their eyes, the MV Agusta F4. Red and silver just like its ancestors, with that organ pipe exhaust pipe that brings to mind lost symphonies, the MV Agusta F4 was an immediate success, the ideal object of a motorcycle lover's desire. The subsequent process of industrialisation was divided into two distinct stages: the first with production of a limited run of 300 F4 Gold Series bikes, with carbon bodies, magnesium parts and an engine with crankcases cast in earth anticipating the construction of the S model, destined for a broader range of users thanks to its price, cut by half over that of the previous version. In April 1999 the F4 Gold Series was presented in action on the Monza racetrack for the first time, attracting the attention of over a hundred trade publications. The bike was impressive for its speed of over 280 km/h and its extraordinary cycling component, universally considered to set the new standard. Despite its price of over 68 million lire, the F4 Gold Series was snapped up by the wealthiest and most dedicated motorcycle lovers all over the world. These included King Juan Carlos of Spain, F1 driver Eddie Irvine and countless prominent names in finance and fashion. Production of the new MV Agusta required a complete reorganisation of the productive cycle, converting the Schiranna plant for production of engines only, while final assembly was transferred to the new productive plant in Cassinetta di Biandronno. The new productive set-up was also a result of the production of the new F4 S, derived from the Gold Series and destined for a wider range of users and therefore produced in much larger numbers. This was the basis for all of today's variants: the special Senna series, the sporty SPR and the new Brutale. And this is where history ends and the news begins.

[Lou Girardin]

MV has a far more illustrious GP history than Ducati. If your memory goes back further than the last 10 years that is.
Check out the MV's at the Classic race meetings.

[Quasievil]

If your memory goes back further than the last 10 years that is.


Nope unfortunetly.
So in ancient history MV was a parallel to the thorough bred of Ferrari but lost it, now Ducati has it , and MV want it back?

Be cool to see MV out on the track at a higher level, ie GP , WSB, the Italians can sock it to the Japs if it wants to, last GP was testimony to that, bloody great to I reckon.

[onearmedbandit]

Ferrari's racing success is only really a recent thing anyway. The early days of Ferrari's racing history are not that glamorous, despite Enzo's fantastic media-spin.

[Lou Girardin]

Ferrari's racing success is only really a recent thing anyway. The early days of Ferrari's racing history are not that glamorous, despite Enzo's fantastic media-spin.

What? Apart from F1, where they've won more races than anyone else. They had a stranglehold on Le Man's in the 60's. Until Henry got all miffed and threw cubic money and a 7 litre engine into the GT's to beat the 4 litre Ferraris.

[pritch]

MV has a far more illustrious GP history than Ducati. .

Exactly what I was thinking. MV Agusta dominated the bigger classes in GP racing for years.

[Marmoot]

Hi

Why when you look at the sad world of cages:sick: almost any ferarri would smoke almost any random nissan etc, but when you return to the real world of bikes:yes: a bike from Kawasaki (ZZR14) is the fastest production bike not a Ducati or maybe Aprilia????

I do beg to differ.

Building a japanese car that can smoke any ferarri in a straight line wouldn't even take a fraction of a Ferarri's cost (cue over 1000bhp cars here).
Same as ZZR14 smoking a ducati on a straight.

Try comparing them in a race track with corners.....

For me? I'd love to take them both home. Threesome is always great :love:

[Lou Girardin]

I do beg to differ.

Building a japanese car that can smoke any ferarri in a straight line wouldn't even take a fraction of a Ferarri's cost (cue over 1000bhp cars here).
Same as ZZR14 smoking a ducati on a straight.

Try comparing them in a race track with corners.....

For me? I'd love to take them both home. Threesome is always great :love:


Let's talk about cars in production and run as they come from the factory, shall we. Otherwise Ferrari has a rather quick car that's racing at the moment, that would demolish any Nishondazdayota.

[Marmoot]

Let's talk about cars in production and run as they come from the factory, shall we. Otherwise Ferrari has a rather quick car that's racing at the moment, that would demolish any Nishondazdayota.

Proportional Study. Gotta proportion the pricetags on the cars being compared.

if Ducati cost 1.5 times the ZZR, you gotta compare the Ferrari with something 2/3 the price of it too.

So, if you take Modena 360 at $300,000 then you gotta compare it with a $200,000 toyota......damn big turbos will go into the budget. :yes:

A million dollar one-off ferrari shouldn't go in there as I dunno what you gonna do with $660,000 spent on a Toyota.....bling it with Diamonds? :mellow:

[Marmoot]

On the note of it, I wonder what is the price tag on Ferrari F1 if it ever be brand new in a showroom somewhere.........

And I wonder if the Honda F1 would be much cheaper for being jap car and all.....

And which one is more expensive, Honda RCV GP bike or Ducati Desmo GP bike?

What about the superbike? I heard Duc 998 was way cheaper than RC45?


P.S.
If comparing cars as it goes, I bet Mitsi Evo 9 would be faster than Modena 360 in the icy roads........time and place for everything, I guess?

[James Deuce]

Be cool to see MV out on the track at a higher level, ie GP , WSB, the Italians can sock it to the Japs if it wants to, last GP was testimony to that, bloody great to I reckon.

Pah! WSB is for lollypop sucking weenies.

Nice to dominate a series by cheating.

**sits back to wait for a beating from Quasi**

[Eddieb]

While Ducati has always been called "The Ferrari of motorcycles" this is by association only. Being italian and red. However, MV has real Ferarri bloodlines with with development of the F4 engine. This is mentioned on their website. The "F" in F4 is even the Ferarri font.

I think you'll find Ducati's association with Ferrari goes back much further than that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrari#The_.22Cavallino_Rampante.22
The prancing horse has not always been uniquely identified with the Ferrari brand: Fabio Taglioni used it on his Ducati motorbikes. Taglioni's father was, in fact, a companion of Count Francesco Baracca (Original owner/creator of the symbol), a legendary "asso" (ace) of the Italian air force during World War I, who painted it on the fuselage of his planes.) and fought with him in the 91st Air Squad. But, as Ferrari's fame grew, Ducati abandoned the horse; this may have been the result of a private agreement between the two brands.

[Quasievil]

No one should compare cheap production modes of transport like Honda, kawasaki etc against soul filled works of art that have high specification performance charachteristics such as that of Ducati and Ferarri.
Thats just wrong.

thing is with Ferarri and ducati, everyone would like one in their shed , if they say they dont they are lying.

Crash a Kwaka "oh bugger oh well get another one in the morning"
Crash a Ducati "life is over"

[Finn]

Speaking of Ferrari, my brother just picked up this on Friday. Notice how arrogance runs in our family? He's parked on a pedestrian crossing.

[James Deuce]

Speaking of Ferrari, my brother just picked up this on Friday. Notice how arrogance runs in our family? He's parked on a pedestrian crossing.

I get the distinct impression that you possess the greater measure of good taste in your family.

[Lou Girardin]

So, if you take Modena 360 at $300,000 then you gotta compare it with a $200,000 toyota......damn big turbos will go into the budget. :yes:



Don't matter, you'll still look like a mouth-breathing retard in the Toymotor.

[Crisis management]

No one should compare cheap production modes of transport like Honda, kawasaki etc against soul filled works of art that have high specification performance charachteristics such as that of Ducati and Ferarri.


You've obviously never owned an early Ducati have you? Try keeping the electrics intact, the gear change spring tension "tensioned" and having to stop every two hours to tune the carbs on an early 750.
I even got passed by a triumph once which was really disillusioning...

[Lou Girardin]

soul filled works of art that have high specification performance charachteristics such as that of Ducati and Ferarri.


I'd agree with the 916/998. The 999 would look almost as good if they'd finished the tailpiece.
Probably a case of the designers pranzo con troppo vino. (Too much wine at lunch)

[Finn]

I get the distinct impression that you possess the greater measure of good taste in your family.

Thanks Jim, I think so too. He still tucks his shirts in on the weekends as well.

[Edbear]

Errr no that would be the Ducati is the ferrari of motorcycles



Not that you have a bias, of course....<_<

[rwh]

Hi

Why when you look at the sad world of cages:sick: almost any ferarri would smoke almost any random nissan etc, but when you return to the real world of bikes:yes: a bike from Kawasaki (ZZR14) is the fastest production bike not a Ducati or maybe Aprilia????

Disclaimer: I'm pretty new to bikes, so no doubt people will scream at my naiivity.

I had wondered about this, and then something occurred to me. When you choose a bike over a car, you've already thrown away the big boot and passenger space that might make you hesitate to choose a sportscar over a sedan (or wagon ...). There's (comparitively speaking) stuff all difference between any maker's road bikes (whether sportsbike or tourer) and their race bikes, when compared to a car, where an Accord is very different from an NSX, let alone an F1 car. About all they need to do to make a road bike is find somewhere for some lights, an alternator and a numberplate.

So a bike manufacturer (or bike division of a larger manufacturer) can afford to be almost as focussed as Ferrari is anyway.
Sound reasonable?

Richard

[SPman]

Errr no that would be the Ducati is the ferrari of motorcycles
They were always called the Maserati of motorcycles, back in the 70's....

and having to stop every two hours to tune the carbs on an early 750.
Huh - I never had any trouble on my GT750 - mind you, Amals were a piece of piss to keep tuned...

[onearmedbandit]

What? Apart from F1, where they've won more races than anyone else. They had a stranglehold on Le Man's in the 60's. Until Henry got all miffed and threw cubic money and a 7 litre engine into the GT's to beat the 4 litre Ferraris.


I'll back my claim up some more tonight Lou.

[The_Dover]

When it comes to bikes give me a jappa anyday of the week.

Even a honda.

did I type that out loud?

[Crazy Steve]

I raced one two weeks ago...

Amost 1second faster....:yes:

Crazy Steve..

[Finn]

I raced one two weeks ago...

Amost 1second faster....:yes:

Crazy Steve..

You're crazy Steve.

[Crazy Steve]

I dont think sooooooooo.....

Me beaty the Kawasaki Zx1400.....:shit:

Now me have fastest production MotorCycle in The WORLD.....

Ha Ha.....

Also....that same day a Harley raced that Zx1400 and beat it to....:yes:

Crazy Steve...

[Grantasaurus]

Finn, tell your brother he's a munter for buying a Ferrari in Cabriolet form. Secondly, tell him to man up and get a proper manual, the F1s just look silly, they don't have that Ferrari trademark exposed gear linkage gate.

Oh, and more on topic, MV Agusta have a far better racing pedigree than Ducati, especially pre 70s when they had a record 37 world championships in various classes (From a 70s "On Two Wheels" magazine). Ducati didn't really start winning races in any great numbers until 1975.

[WRT]

Speaking of Ferrari, my brother just picked up this on Friday. Notice how arrogance runs in our family? He's parked on a pedestrian crossing.

Damn, you'd think for all the money they cost that you'd at least get matching seats. There's only two of the damned things after all.

[Finn]

Finn, tell your brother he's a munter for buying a Ferrari in Cabriolet form. Secondly, tell him to man up and get a proper manual, the F1s just look silly, they don't have that Ferrari trademark exposed gear linkage gate.


Would it rip your undies if I told you it was mainly for his wife? The F1 gearbox has a crude auto mode. Anyway, I give those rims about 3 days and their relationship about the same.

[Finn]

Damn, you'd think for all the money they cost that you'd at least get matching seats. There's only two of the damned things after all.

That's my niece's child seat. I said you ain't gonna pick up chicks with that bro.

[Bonez]

Disclaimer: I'm pretty new to bikes, so no doubt people will scream at my naiivity.

I had wondered about this, and then something occurred to me. When you choose a bike over a car, you've already thrown away the big boot and passenger space My bike has a boot and space for a passenger...........

[Grantasaurus]

Yes, it did rip my undies thanks Finn. What does he drive if that's the wifes car to go down and get her nails done in?

[Fatjim]

They were always called the Maserati of motorcycles, back in the 70's....

But now that fatjims got a duk they'll be called the fiats...

[Finn]

What does he drive if that's the wifes car to go down and get her nails done in?

The maid....

[imdying]

Dukes are cool, at least they were till the 999 came out :no: Desmodici should go a loooong way to redressing that though, it actually looks like a finished product :yes:. Soul is like character... marketing crap to smear over designs in a hope that the customer won't notice.

[kro]

I kinda look at it differently, whilst some Italian marques such as Ferrari, and Lamborghini have enjoyed accolades for fast vehicles over the years, they have not always been the fastest, but their efforts in trying to be, have rewarded them with all you can ever ask for, and that is consistently outstanding vehicles. Having your car name instantly bring images of fast, low, winged, red sports cars to peoples heads, means that your brand is synonymous with speed, because you have earnt that association.
Italian bikes for me, don't conjour up the same images. As much as it may anger some people on these forums, when I think Ducati, I think relatively slow ordinary, often ugly bikes, this association stays when you throw Guzzi, Laverda and Gilera into the mix. To be the best/fastest, you have to have striven for that goal for a long time, firstly to get good enough to actually achieve it, and secondly, to get that vehicle makers name into peoples heads as being prestigious.

Before red-repping me for my apparent Euro-bashing, my opinion of these bikes stems from my involvement with the older models, whereas now, all these names have metamorphosized into some of the sexiest hardware on the planet.

[Titanium]

No one should compare cheap production modes of transport like Honda, kawasaki etc against soul filled works of art that have high specification performance charachteristics such as that of Ducati and Ferarri.
Thats just wrong.

thing is with Ferarri and ducati, everyone would like one in their shed , if they say they dont they are lying.

Crash a Kwaka "oh bugger oh well get another one in the morning"
Crash a Ducati "life is over"

Not to forget BMW ........:yes:

[NhuanH]

Speaking of Ferrari, my brother just picked up this on Friday. Notice how arrogance runs in our family? He's parked on a pedestrian crossing.
and where in the world is this brother of yours?

[imdying]

thing is with Ferarri and ducati, everyone would like one in their shed , if they say they dont they are lying.Ferrari :yes:, Ducati :no:

I would however have a GSXR1000 with carbon wheels, carbon fairing and some ohlins goodness, plus a matching GSXR600 to ride to work on, for the same price as a 999R in my shed. If I had those already, I could find a home for a 996 or 998 though :D

[Finn]

and where in the world is this brother of yours?

Monaco. Next question: Then what the hell am I doing here then? Good question.

[NhuanH]

Monaco. Next question: Then what the hell am I doing here then? Good question.
Answer: Finn's secret role playing relationship as Aunty Helen's submissive?

[Big Dave]

If it's got 4 wheels and you get 'in' it I wouldn't compare it to a Vespa. Cause I'd rather have the Vespa.

All that money you'd think the seats would at least match, funn.

[Finn]

If it's got 4 wheels and you get 'in' it I wouldn't compare it to a Vespa. Cause I'd rather have the Vespa.

All that money you'd think the seats would at least match, funn.

Would you believe he's actually got a Vespa.

[Lou Girardin]

Italian vehicles have never been about being the fastest. Sometimes they are, sometimes they're not.
They're about soul, and how they feel. That's why a cheap Fiat feels more like a racer than any Jap econobox.
One of our guys at work tried a CBR1000RR back to back with an RSV at a track day. He said that while the CBR was faster, the Aprilia handled better, cornered faster, and felt like it was in a different league.

[The_Dover]

the Aprilia handled better, cornered faster, and felt like it was in a different league.

is it going to get relegated and a points deduction for cheating too?

[Lou Girardin]

is it going to get relegated and a points deduction for cheating too?

Probably. But it doesn't wear dresses and make up, or sleep with a transvestite.

[The_Dover]

Probably. But it doesn't wear dresses and make up, or sleep with a transvestite.

What has Finn been telling you?

[Lou Girardin]

What has Finn been telling you?

It's on wikipedia www.sodomandbegorrah.com