Relationship separation?

[Winston001]

The thread on children of divorce touched me and I thought a new thread might be worth while.

My question is this: how many of us wish our parents had separated years ago instead of toughing it out? I certainly do..................but wonder if the reality would have been a lot worse than the stable family life we had.

No physical violence but dad verbally abused mum and put her down. He's now 87 and still does it to her.

And so I ponder my own marriage which is fragile - all my fault. Not repeating my fathers mistakes, but making other ones and my wife is a truely lovely person who deserves to be loved and cherished.

[janno]

Being aware of mistakes is a huge step, Winston. It gives you the option of not repeating them.

I am leaving my husband of nearly eight years because he refuses to consider he has some serious attitude problems. Despite constantly saying that marriages take work, he refused to go to counselling after the second time. I'm the one who has to sort my problems out, apparently.

But I am relationship number four for him that has gone down the gurgler for very similar reasons. And the only constant is him. We don't have children, luckily, but if we did I'd still be leaving. Because what sort of role models are miserable parents? Kids aren't stupid. They pick up on every bit of tension in the house.

[canarlee]

Because what sort of role models are miserable parents? Kids aren't stupid. They pick up on every bit of tension in the house.

how very true!

[Joni]

Well said Janno.

At the end of the day what kind of lesson are you teaching your children, when they see you being hurt and abused day in and say out. Self respect and self love are huge gifts a parent can give... and that is not the way to go about it.

You see over and over children repeating their parents mistakes, because on a sub-conscious level it’s all they know.

My Grandfather has smacked my Grandmother around as long as my Mother and I can remember.... that abuse, pain and hurt has permeated all the children’s lives in some way or another... like you say Janno, children are not stupid... they know... and many, like my mother, have grown up to be very sad and confused adults.

PS – Good on you for leaving… you go girl. Only the best… onwards and upwards… and all that :wari:

[Dilligaf]

Oh yeah :bye: I actually asked Mum why she stayed with Dad - and she replied that back then with 4 kids and him controlling all the money, there was not the social support for a woman to leave. So we endured his beatings, then when that got him no respect, beating Mum for the things we did wrong (and making sure we heard). Oh happy days...
But get this, now when she could walk away with half, even now into their 70s they are still together. The physical abuse stopped about 20 years ago but not the constant verbal attacks go on...
And when we confronted him on his treatment of us, he replied that he didn't know what we were talking about "You were well disciplined". mmmmmmmmmkay. :bs:
I've given up trying to understand other's relationships - you never know what or why. And our family, it's now like the elephant in the room. Which could also explain why I live in a different country...
But I am happy to say that I am one of the one in four who managed to break the cycle.

[avgas]

Now you know you need to be a better person for her.....what are you going to do about it?
A relationship is earned, its harder than any job, more demanding than any child, more expensive than any item.
Good way to think about it is your at war, its you and every guy out there - the only advantage you have over them is you have your women, now you just have to keep her.

[Joni]

A relationship is earnedDamn well said! :yes:

Pity not everyone sees it that way eh?

[ManDownUnder]

Strangely - no. I think my Mum and Dad probably got their timing right (despite them failing to perfectly manage the aftermath). They got married, grew apart and when things stopped working the marriage ended.

Well - that's what I think I saw anyway, what little a 13 year old can see... and what little I can accurately recall from 25 years ago.

[ManDownUnder]

The thread on children of divorce touched me and I thought a new thread might be worth while.

My question is this: how many of us wish our parents had separated years ago instead of toughing it out? I certainly do..................but wonder if the reality would have been a lot worse than the stable family life we had.

No physical violence but dad verbally abused mum and put her down. He's now 87 and still does it to her.

And so I ponder my own marriage which is fragile - all my fault. Not repeating my fathers mistakes, but making other ones and my wife is a truely lovely person who deserves to be loved and cherished.

Hey... show her what you just wrote... it'll be a bloody good starting point for the talking you have coming up. If you can tell it like it is to us (and that last line kinda sums up a hell of a lot)... she needs to know too...

I hope she does...?

[BarBender]

Love on its own just doesnt cut the mustard...

[Winston001]

Now you know you need to be a better person for her.....what are you going to do about it?

A relationship is earned, its harder than any job, more demanding than any child, more expensive than any item.

Yeah, well said. I'm trying, and we are going to counselling which is traumatic but good. My wife is my rock and I don't deserve her.

[ManDownUnder]

Yeah, well said. I'm trying, and we are going to counselling which is traumatic but good. My wife is my rock and I don't deserve her.

Been there man... amasing what comes out huh? Keep going dude... keep going. Don't give up till the fat lady's run out of breath...

[janno]

Love on its own just doesnt cut the mustard...

Oh, abso-bloody-lutely!

Because that's what my husband and I had, along with intense physical attraction (too much info, huh?!).

But when the "boing" factor fades, which it always does, you've got to have friendship and common ground to take over.

Then, according to my parents who were married 30 years before Mum died, the love and attraction comes around again, but in a different, stronger and better way.

Which is what I'm going to make sure I get next time!

[007XX]

And so I ponder my own marriage which is fragile - all my fault. Not repeating my fathers mistakes, but making other ones and my wife is a truely lovely person who deserves to be loved and cherished.

And you have just proven that you love her, that you understand and accept there is an issue you BOTH have to work out, and you are taking steps to do so...
She is a very lucky lady too...not many man out there would be willing to air their problems to a complete stranger to save their marriage...it takes guts and honnesty! So good on you for that.

One thing though if I may...I do not know you nor your situation, but make sure to be honnest with yourself, your wife and your counsellor...what I mean is: it takes two in a marriage to make things work...
I am not saying the fault lies with someone else, but more: forget about laying blame on someone (aka: yourself ) for the past, and truly understand what needs to be mended and work on that as a positive for your future together...be sure to communicate effectively, it is cruciayou both know you really understand what the other person is saying!

Be strong, you are a good man...and baby steps, nothing happens overnight!
Anytime you want to talk, we're all there if it can help.

[Curious_AJ]

And you have just proven that you love her, that you understand and accept there is an issue you BOTH have to work out, and you are taking steps to do so...
She is a very lucky lady too...not many man out there would be willing to air their problems to a complete stranger to save their marriage...it takes guts and honnesty! So good on you for that.



not to mention leaving it open to a BUNCH of strangers mind you...

its weird, I grew up with stable parents and my friends all had stable parents til i came here to NZ. Now most people I know have split parents or similar... some of which i know is because both parents weren't willing to talk about their problems with eachother, instead someof them would talk to me (the little non-related teen in the room) about it... i was like *doi* It was a bit of a shock, seeming as I had grown up with the situations i had...

but yeah, I definately agree with everyone who has said, that you DO love her, we can see that, and now all you need to do is figure out how to change ways, make sure your wife knows you love her.. and then all you can do is wait for her to take the initiative, which I'm sure would happen, as you do seem to know the right direction to go in.

[Mom]

Mate you said it all with your first post.......If you truely feel like that then give it everything and then more to save your relationship!! I hope you can sort something out.

I think that there is much more to it though, than...should the parents have separated earlier....

I was officially married the first time for 28 years. Lived with him for a couple of years before the wedding. We were seperated for 6 years when I divorced him. So about 25 years in total. I was raised in what could best be described as a totally dis-functional family, so you would think that I would have been aware of not repeating the mistakes of my parents eh? Well many of them I didn't, thank God but....

I knew for perhaps 7 years that the marraige was over, but remained in a destructive, abusive relationship until I simply had enough! I believe you have to have your head in "that" space before you can take the steps to end something.

The first thing I did when I was on my own was to get my head examined! I could not believe that an intellegent woman could have stayed and put up with the kind of crap that I had. Taking back control of your thinking when you have been totally demoralised and been made to think you were going crazy. When you knew you were stupid and could never manage anything by yourself, you had no money and 3 kids to support, and worst, knowing and then being actually told, that he would be the worst enemy I could ever make effectively kept me where he wanted me.

I still to this day have no idea where the strength came from to call it over, well I do but if say it here it will be confirmed I am actually crazy.....LOL. It was the hardest thing I have ever done, I tried so many ways to get us help. He even agreed to counselling, mind you not one of my "red haired, hairy armpitted, man hating lesbian" friends, one of his fav sayings...lol. He was to organise someone he trusted, but was too busy....*sigh* his loss!

I remember in the dark early days after we split, sitting on the floor of the lounge with the kids, eating icecream out of the container with them, with a comedy video playing. That was all I allowed in the house, comedy and laughter and happy things. I apologised to the kids for all the shit that was going down, one of them said "dont apologise Mom, we lived with him too"

Everyone takes their own path in this life, some stay in bad relationships because they want to, some stay because they cant see past the how, some stay because they dont want to rock the boat. Most important though, some stay because it is worth working through the crap to get to the wonderful thing a great relationship can be!

[Curious_AJ]

just a little of my 2 cents here, though I have never been married and these relationships were short term (6 months and 10 months respectively)

I know how hard it is to get away from someone that harms you in some way and abuses you in several... the first guy (lets call him boob1) abused me physically and mentally for 6 months til i was eventually able to fly away and get my mates to help me out... then the second (lets call him boob2) did far worse.. what's more is that boob2 was clingy... that made it WAY harder to get away as he gave me the guilts every time i tried to get away, and in the state i was, i believed the lies and believed that it was my falt that all that was happening to me etc... but again, got away (as was stalked for a while however) but all turned out okay after a period of a couple of months....

this is getting off topic...

all in all though... I have learnt not to make the mistakes i made then, and how to stay away from relationships of that sort so that I can eventually marry someone who is well-suited to me and me to them...

bottom line, when you find someone who you love THAT much.,. and who you are willing to do ANYTHING for, and if you have realised your boo boos, it can't do anything BUT work out!!

[Edbear]

I don't deserve her.


Is that how she feels...?

[Winston001]

Is that how she feels...?

Fortunately no. She is helping me through a rough patch when she is really the one who has been wronged - an amazing lady.

[Winston001]

............

Everyone takes their own path in this life, some stay in bad relationships because they want to, some stay because they cant see past the how, some stay because they dont want to rock the boat. Most important though, some stay because it is worth working through the crap to get to the wonderful thing a great relationship can be!

Good thoughts, thankyou.

This is intensely personal stuff and I'm staggered to find myself posting on a biker forum about it. Especially since these matters are very private for me. But I've read some very humbling and honest stuff here over the last couple of years and respect the essential decency of members on this forum.

I appreciate all of the advice people. We'll work it out, and the big plus is our three happy children whom we'd do anything for.

[86GSXR]

Good luck Winston001, there are so many different circumstances out there and I'm sure you'll find the best solution to yours :yes:

[chanceyy]

My wife is my rock and I don't deserve her.

why do you not think you deserve her ??


Is that how she feels...?

well said


Fortunately no. She is helping me through a rough patch when she is really the one who has been wronged - an amazing lady.


so you are really really fortunate then .. & You do deserve her .. ;)


good luck no relationship is easy & takes work on both sides .. guess that is why most fail today .. someone is not prepared to put the work in ...

[sugilite]

To all intents and purposes my parents were rock solid.
My own marriage has not been, mostly being my own fault.
Last year was the very worst with my wife and I separating.
Having two houses opposite each other was a blessing and a curse. It meant that I was right across the road from my four children. That for sure was a blessing. Unfortunately I cannot say the same being across the road from my then ex!

We had many volatile arguments which on 3 occasions turned to physical violence aimed towards myself. Two of those occasions were witnessed by my children.
I/We kept the lines of communications open with our kids and both showed them love and nurtured them as best we could.
It was not easy for any of us by any stretch of the imagination. Our kids continued to get good grades at school and be cheerful most times through out.

The first 6 months of this year have been the hardest of my life hands down. I have gone through many painful experiences and have transformed all parts of my life. The person I've been for the last eight years has been all but banished and replaced with the new 2007 model Sugilite. I've not raced since my ill fated nats attempt. This has been my choice and one day I will share some of my experiences leading up to, and throughout this time period. For now, just know that the disappointments of that part of my life (failed nats attempt) paled into utter insignificance of what I went through from January to June of this year. Motorcycle racing after all is only about who can go fastest in a circle, in the larger scheme of things, big fucking deal.

I fought HARD to save my marriage, to win my wife back from the arms of another man. I found strength I never knew I had.
The morning after my 1st night back with my wife I came out of the bedroom to find my youngest daughter had drawn a picture of two happy people in bed. I asked her if it had been Mummy and her (she had pretty much been sleeping with her mother for the best part of 2 years) to which she happily replied, No, that is you and mummy. It blew me away and she never once asked to sleep with her mother. (though I have put her in her mothers bed from time to time since)
For a 6 year old to be that selfless was amazing to me. That experience reduced me to tears and for sure the happiness of my kids went up several notches from that point forward.
You know it is good when your at a teacher parent night and the teacher tells you they wish they had 30 versions of your child in their class :yes:

My children witnessed things I wish they had not, but throughout they stayed strong and positive. For this I am grateful beyond what mere words can convey. They helped me to focus and simply survive my greatest ordeal.

The pain I suffered was beyond my comprehension. The pain I inflicted on others who did not deserve it was despicable. I cannot change anything I did, only live a better life and try my best to atone for my wrongs for those I can communicate with and by sending out Love and Light to those I can no longer interact with.

Though I've been quiet on kiwibiker this year, I'd like to take the time to thank some KBers who supported me, most not realizing how much their kind words meant to me...some of those being from the likes of Goblin, Kiwifruit, WT, TWR, and Joni amongst others.

[Edbear]

Fortunately no. She is helping me through a rough patch when she is really the one who has been wronged - an amazing lady.



Yeah, the reason I asked was that my wife had the same view, and actually thought I was an idiot for marrying her! Hard thing to combat. She seemed to be trying at times to give me excuses to justify leaving. Nearly worked a couple of times...

I think after 30 years, she does accept she is worth loving and we have become firm friends as well as lovers, partners and everything else that marriage means.

Our three kids, now all grown up are everything we could want in children! Especially our eldest daughter has showed amazing insight over the years and has been a rock for her mum. My wife, I think, has finally been able to put the trauma of her past behind her and allow herself to find happiness. As time has gone by, her true nature has been able to come to the fore and the qualities I saw in her as a troubled teenager have blossomed. The past is always there of course, but you can deal with it, even if it means accepting professional help. And you can become whoever you want to become.

I know that your wife will be very encouraged by seeing you trying hard to make the necessary changes. I am so very proud and moved by the strenuous efforts my wife has made to listen to advice and encouragement and change herself. I admit, too, that I have changed a lot and learned a lot about so many issues. I have really tried hard to listen and understand, to not react but bite my tongue and wait. To break the cycle of reaction that tears relationships apart, and to look at myself and identify traits that were unhelpful. As has been noted, it takes two, but if those two are willing to change and want to succeed, they most certainly will.

[chanceyy]

there are some very very personal posts on this thread .. kudos to you guys for sharing & good luck to all of you working on relationships to forge a better future


Its hard when someone sabotages a great relationship cause they feel they do not deserve the love... until they come to the realisation that they do deserve it ... it sure is a long hard road to hoe ...

[janno]

there are some very very personal posts on this thread .. kudos to you guys for sharing & good luck to all of you working on relationships to forge a better future




Yes, I second that. Especially glad that there are males opening their hearts, as so often we women are allowed to but men are pressured to keep a manly silence. It must get very lonely at times if you take that path.

[MyGSXF]

My old man said to me several times.. "we only stuck together for the sake of you kids".. my reply the last time he said it.. "I sure don't thank you for that dad" <_<

41 years of marriage now & they are still together.. still the same old mice going round & round in circles in the same old wheel... :thud: