What would bring YOU to watch a race meeting?

[FROSTY]

Folks The nationals are attracting smaller and smaller crowds.
15000 of you lot come along to Battle of the streets and similar numbers to Whanganui
So what attracts you there??
What can be done to attract you to a track meeting?
I really would like feedback from non racers please.

FEEDBACK SO FAR IS FANTASTIC--THANKYOU ALL THOSE THAT HAVE CONTRIBUTED

1)plentyof clean loos
2)plenty of shade.
3)exclusive seating areas at a premeum price.
4)viewing areas to watch the inpit action up close (viewingthe tight leathers)
5)big screens for the action you missed
6)quality food not just chips and hotdogs
7)other forms of entertainment-possibly a rally
8)entertainment for kids -thinking over EVERY north island track I can picture an area sutable for that
9)bigger range of bike types -not clones
10)local community involvement-
11) good comentary
12)Lots of trade stalls
13) A decent program-riderr/bike profiles

[Cajun]

something else to look at while there, aka stands by suppliers of parts.

[James Deuce]

Not having to travel for 2 hours minimum.

[imdying]

Free entry to the track would help.

[ArcherWC]

GIRLS GIRLS and more GIRLS :done:
















oh and
Good food
decent comentator

[Paul in NZ]

Combine it with a bike rally - usual stuff - beer tent, band, overnight accomodation (tents OK) - make it worth the trip. Local classic club might want to put on a show - maybe a track day the day before?

Trade stalls, win a prize.... etc

[yungatart]

Not having to fork over huge dollars to watch.
Availability of food other than greasy chips and hot dogs.

[White trash]

Everybody taht's said "free entry", your votes are worthless sorry. VMCC didn't charge a single spectator fee all winter. Doesn't work.

[White trash]

decent comentator


Sorry mate, I'll be racing :D

[imdying]

Everybody taht's said "free entry", your votes are worthless sorry. VMCC didn't charge a single spectator fee all winter. Doesn't work.Pfft... idiot... I'm not saying hang your entire enticement package on that one thing :rolleyes:

[Katman]

Combine it with a bike rally - usual stuff - beer tent, band, overnight accomodation (tents OK) - make it worth the trip.

Good idea. I'm sure the station across the road would be approachable about using one of the paddocks that was used for parking during the A1GP.

[Maha]

something else to look at while there, aka stands by suppliers of parts.

Indeed a surpeme idea


GIRLS GIRLS and more GIRLS :done:


Ya heeeeeeeesssssss yet another suggestion thats well worth looking into!

Not having to fork over huge dollars to watch.
Availability of food other than greasy chips and hot dogs.

Yeah we need Sushi!

[jim.cox]

What can be done to attract you to a track meeting?

Sorry Frosty,

I dont think there is anything that would attract me as a spectator.

I'd rather use the time to go riding

[Mrs Busa Pete]

GIRLS GIRLS and more GIRLS :done:
















oh and
Good food
decent comentator



BOYS,MEN,BOYS,MEN

























oh and
Good food
decent comentator

[FROSTY]

Not having to travel for 2 hours minimum.


Im hearing ya dude-BUT pearoa gets 14000 and they almost all travel 2-8 hours to be there -no matter where it is some folk are gonna hafta travel
good food --yep
trade stalls--yep
rally --hmmm -lotsa boooze n stuff -could work as there is a camping area next to the old taupo pits that coulkd be set up
Girls-kinda goes with the trade stalls I think
Free entry--kinda defeats the point -but I wanna keep entry costs to around $10 each

[FROSTY]

BOYS,MEN,BOYS,MEN
MRS busa--you need ya own login

[snot]

Trade stands, displays, etc.
Yeah a variety of food is definately the go too.

[NC]

hot guys in leathers... no san fransisco bikers though..*shudder*

[Sully60]

Sorry mate, I'll be racing :D

He didn't say common tater:spudwave::bleh:

[Mrs Busa Pete]

MRS busa--you need ya own login






:bleh::bleh::bleh::bleh::bleh::bleh::no:

[Tank]

Very few race events get 5000 people to them thease days - so it would have to be something special.

And that means advertising.

And that means siginifant $$$$.

Its a big ask. I was involved in events for a while and it seems that the majority of sucessful events started off small and got bigger and bigger and bigger - until they became HUGE.

Starting off with 5000 people in Taupo is going to be an uphill battle with no history to the event.

[Mrs Busa Pete]

hot guys in leathers... no san fransisco bikers though..*shudder*

YEP WITH NICE BUTTS :woohoo:

[riffer]

I'm surprised no-one's mentioned this yet.

But what about an international quality field of entrants?

That would get me there tomorrow. :niceone:

[FROSTY]

Thanks riffer -thats SERIOUS money -- like those guys get paid to apear

[riffer]

I know, dammit.

But I reckon that's what will bring them in.

How about live bands, stunt shows... again, its all money.

At the end of the day, the only other thing you've got is going to be absolutely brilliant racing.

Or lots and lots and lots of really scarey looking crashes.

[judecatmad]

Not having to travel for 2 hours minimum.



+1 to that....but that's one of the joys (:whistle:) of living in Wellington - to go anywhere worthwhile, there's a trek involved :weep:

[Maha]

MRS busa--you need ya own login

She has....its hubby that needs a change


YEP WITH NICE BUTTS :woohoo:

Come on Pete....think of something more original....:cool:

[The Stranger]

MRS busa--you need ya own login

No Frosty, the boys are for Pete.

[James Deuce]

Im hearing ya dude-BUT pearoa gets 14000 and they almost all travel 2-8 hours to be there -

Simply can't do it with kids in tow with a 4-7 hour turn around. Little point going to a meeting by myself.

It is an issue, and not just for me. There are plenty of people I know who would like to go, but there's nothing but buckets and speedway in the Greater Wellington Region. Some kids travel well, some don't.

That's one of the things that bugs about racing in NZ. Racing groups ask what stops you from turning up to a race meeting, and if you mention travel time, you get dismissed instantly. NZ has built Race Tracks is STUPID places, and they usually have all the amenities of a back block sheep station.

NZ race tracks don't work as a family event and I reckon that's why motorsport is the perennial struggler in the NZ sporting scene.

[avgas]

Rangi bikes - slow ones with lots of rattles and broken bits.
Rat race would be awesome

[James Deuce]

I'm surprised no-one's mentioned this yet.

But what about an international quality field of entrants?

That would get me there tomorrow. :niceone:

Because no one expects to see that in NZ ever again. We stretch to support A1GP, the Motorsport equivalent of Aussie Rules.

[NC]

YEP WITH NICE BUTTS :woohoo:

Heh you read my mind..*ahem..filthy bastard*

But it's all about the arms and sexy backs, thighs etc..( I'm perv :D )

[FROSTY]

Jim thank you--ok lets go with that tot for a mo- what WOULD your kids travel 5 hours for? -a carnival? kids entertainment?
Im not dismissing your feedback -but building a racetrack in upper hutt is a bit beyond my budget sorry :devil2:

[car]

something else to look at while there, aka stands by suppliers of parts.

Plus one on that. All the spectacle and tat -- show and shine, intermission stunt show, promotional stalls from manufacturers/ importers, hot dog stands, bouncy castle, Harrier jumpjet flyover and the opportunity to buy bike-related crap.

[avgas]

kids carnival would be pretty cool. bouncy castles n the like

[cowboyz]

right. Firstly it would take me getting a day free from work, then the kids organised, then I would be there. I go to wanganui (note the lack of H's) every year because the view of the compeditiors rock. You can be about 10m away from them if you choose. At Taupo and Manfield you are a fair way away from the action. That is a big reason why Street races has so much appeal. I couldnt care less if there are scanty girls running round. I go for the bikes not the woman. Some stores would be nice which accomodate road riding rather than trying to push expensive track gear onto you. The rest is gravy really.

[Pumba]

Not having to travel for 2 hours minimum.


Yes, but in saying that a group of us have riden tho Wanganui and back on boxing day to watch the racing for the last three years ans I know a hell of a lot of other people that do a simular thing

Why?

For me its a good ride with good people, and you get to watch good racing at your destination.

[Weaver]

Jim thank you--ok lets go with that tot for a mo- what WOULD your kids travel 5 hours for? -a carnival? kids entertainment?
Im not dismissing your feedback -but building a racetrack in upper hutt is a bit beyond my budget sorry :devil2:

Well i can do a whip around and i'm sure we can manage to get about $50 to help you out. I'll even let people set up tents on my front lawn.......for $35 a night :cool:

[klingon]

Things that would make a race meeting appeal to me (in the same way street races do):

- Decent places to get decent food - cafe-style tents where you can actually sit down to consume your coffee & scone. And places that serve actual meals like big brekkies, with real plates and real cutlery.

- Shade! I get so overheated & burned at a lot of those summer events that it's one of my prime requirements to know that there will be shade available. Better still, some kind of water feature that would let me cool off. Water slides aren't just for the kids you know! :D

- Somewhere secure to leave my gear so I can arrive on a bike, then stash my helmet, boots & jacket so I don't have to carry them with me all day.

OK so maybe I'm not your target market for attending race meetings. But if you want 5000 people to attend, you're going to need a very broad target market!

[FROSTY]

No klingon you're wrong--the very reason I raised the question in GBR not Racing forum is to get the opinions of as wide a range of people as possible -us racers at times tend to say--but they should!! rather than asking -why aren't they??
Shade is a really good point

[deanohit]

good food --yep
trade stalls--yep
rally --hmmm -lotsa boooze n stuff -could work as there is a camping area next to the old taupo pits that coulkd be set up
Girls-kinda goes with the trade stalls I think
Free entry--kinda defeats the point -but I wanna keep entry costs to around $10 each
Good food, yep, but I go to watch the racing, drives my mate nuts when I just want to sit there eating in the stands.
Trade stalls, great idea but see above for me.
Girls are definitely a bonus.
I'm not worried about travel time, a rally for those who want to would be awesome, bonfire and a local live band would really set it off.
I'd be happy to pay $20-30 to camp some where the night as long as there will be entertainment.
Entry costs, happy to pay $10-20

Good luck with setting this up mate!

[Paul in NZ]

Make into a festival - how many people go to the cold kiwi etc

Look at the burt munro event - something worth the travel.

A decent band in a decent venue (Taupo) along with other activity (swap meet or rally etc) maybe even themed events each year..

Look at the Goodwood meetings in the UK

Look at the old LeMans 24 hours - lots to do - lots to see...

[FROSTY]

whats the normal attendance numbers at Ck or even sulpher city??
Taupo lends itself really well to the combined rally/race meeting thing--the new pits are "up top" so the race teams would be based there
Rally goers would be in the "old" pits which is parking for a fair few bikes and tents n stuff --dunno about the bomfitre idea though -avgas and fire---scarey

[Paul in NZ]

I'd say the Pukekohe Classic festival of speed would be the biggest spectator wise... Theres a LOT to see there..

The poms do these kinds of events well - bouncy castle for the kids (eh bah gum lad) plus all kinds of alternate attractions. I certainly would not go to watch 6 hours of tedious racing....

The last wanganui we went to was only 'cos we could go see Jimmy Barnes after, stay the night, meal etc - great weekend away... Motorcycle racing is not really exciting except to the die hard enthusiasts anymore, bikes are all non descript clones from the stands and our partners find it insanely boring... You have to provide a reason for a non motorcycle partner to come as well

[kiwisfly]

How about reservered seating Frosty? Went to the V8's in Auck for 4 years (from Wellington) and one of the attractions was reserved seating that allowed you to get up & wander about the displays, pit walk & get food/drink then get back to you seat.
I would pay a higher rate for the privilage.
A giant screen would be awesome for showing the live action, pulling in the thrils ad spills moments on replay and possbly provide a revenue stream with advertising?
Easy pit access that allows the folk to get close to the real live racers.
Wanganui do the "big show" on the night ie Jimmy Barnes. He's unrealistic I know but could be room for a concert that wil bring punters in that want to make a full weekend of it.
Try & nail the better weather period.
Still thinking about it, will get back to ya!

[FROSTY]

The JB thing whilst a bloody good thing was a coincidence only
I like the reserved tickets idea -maybee corperate boxes later WHEN it takes off

[Paul in NZ]

Yeah but there are always decent bands doing summer tours...

How about running it new years eve - the place is PACKED with people looking for something to do..

[Mom]

Things that would make a race meeting appeal to me (in the same way street races do):

- Decent places to get decent food - cafe-style tents where you can actually sit down to consume your coffee & scone. And places that serve actual meals like big brekkies, with real plates and real cutlery.

- Shade! I get so overheated & burned at a lot of those summer events that it's one of my prime requirements to know that there will be shade available. Better still, some kind of water feature that would let me cool off. Water slides aren't just for the kids you know! :D

- Somewhere secure to leave my gear so I can arrive on a bike, then stash my helmet, boots & jacket so I don't have to carry them with me all day.

OK so maybe I'm not your target market for attending race meetings. But if you want 5000 people to attend, you're going to need a very broad target market!


No, you sound perfect target market to me and have raised some important considerations. Taupo is a great spectator track, you can get close to the racing, and even better see quite a bit of it from one spot if you choose to, I think being close to the action may be a big draw card for street races personally.

FROSTY, a 6 hour endurance race is a big ask of any spectator, you will need to have something else to amuse the non-fans! I took my kids to Taupo for a race meeting when they were between 5 and 10 yrs of age, they were bored shitless and went about making my life hell, till there was a bit of a woopsie right in front of us......then they were keen!

For me, a personal interest in the people riding, open pits.......so I can have a perve (at the bikes too!), and say hello to people. As others have said, food available, TOILETS! Drink, water as well as beer. Obviously Girls.........I get my perve time in the pits :o

Names riding!

Charge an entry fee......$20 a head is not a problem, let the kids in free! (under 14?)

Do you have any idea what attendance numbers used to be for the Castrol 6 hour races? Is 5000 people too big an ask?

[montsta56]

I always find events on a Sunday Are better attended.
Heaps of people have to work at least part of Saturdays.
You probably Already know this Frosty as most of ya Track DAy's are on Sunday....Thank GOd!!!

[MVnut]

I go to most meets in my area but at the mo I work every day so to get to Taupo would be an effort...........Castrol 6 Hour would do it though, oh yeah..and girls.:cool:

[FROSTY]

Mom etc--For a 6 hour race for safety and logistical reasons having people waundering round the pits would be a nightmare
But-there are some really good viewing platforms right over the top of the pits -as in full lenth of the pits

[Katman]

Frosty, would you propose to run it as a strictly 'production class' event?

[Pancakes]

Yep the kids and wife like seeing things happen not clone bikes (this is what most people who aren't into bikes see, my boss could tell the difference between my bike and a co-workers VTR1000 with micron cans bar the colour!)
Something thats not real bogan, less leather tassles and more variety. There are lots of corporates just waiting to get their hands on people, things like the M&M's bouncy race thing is supplied and run for free with mini M&M's packet for each kid and the kids race up and down there instead of driving their old's nuts.

Are you talking 6 hrs straight or a 6 hour race day? Could get some stunters? Open pits or a decent view is a winner for me, I'd rather watch that than alot of racing.

The replay screen is a good idea so people catch the highlights and get up close. Again sponsors I'm sure would supply a big screen and have their brand on it half the time? I used to organise the odd event and think this is do-able. Of course you guys will be in the red and worn to the bone before you have the acid test of seeing the lines at the gates.

[FROSTY]

Frosty, would you propose to run it as a strictly 'production class' event?
Mate Im not even thinking that far atm-more asking the question of normal folk (as normal as KB folk get) -what would attract them
I figure theres gota be something we in NZ racing are missing and burying heads in the sand isnt gonna solve it

[Shaun P]

A site or web page showing the competitors and bikes/sponsors so people know who they are and what they are watching, and run a pole to see who the favorites are.
Just to build it up a bit.

[janno]

A rally attached would get me along, with a decent band at night.

A fair with half to three quarters of stalls being non bike stuff being run in conjunction would also keep a lot of partners and children happy.

Good variety of food, not just greasies and softdrinks.

Plenty of shade tents and areas.

More loos than you can shake a stick at.

Bike gear stands with DECENT DISCOUNTS!! ie not just their normal rates with a generous 5% off. And plenty of road stuff, not just racing stuff.

Vintage bikes, including racing bikes, display - that's always really cool.

The last Laverda concourse in Brisbane had the local swingers bike club with a stall, and they weren't side car enthusiasts either. Unfortunately none of them looked like they do in the movies. . .

[FzerozeroT]

Long shot (but you asked for thoughts) I would travel for unique bikes, if you run a 6 hour race with nothing else just round and round you might get people for the start and finish but in between I would head into taupo or do a lap of the lake! how about 6hr is run on new half and old half has separate goings-on, ask bike distributors to put on demo's of the latest bikes doing laps (visual demo's not test rides), try and get some exotics going around, Britten, Two-stroke motoGP, Nitro dragbike, mini-moto, desmosedici :)

or make the six hour super interesting by making the rules something like one set of tires for the race :P would enable privateers to enter, otherwise the tyre bill for some racers would end up being their yearly allowance, never mind the gas etc. or a six hour gymkhana, do one lap, get off and iron a shirt, do another lap, do a handstand. I think I need to get more sleep.

[Paul in NZ]

besides - you are asking in the wrong place..

The real question is what would get non motorcyclists to come along?? What would get the HD set to come along? (they have $$ to spend) the moto cross guys?

Clubmans racing or trackday during the day... Maybe stadium moto cross in the infield?

Clean up track and pits

The 6 hour could start late afternoon with a period when lights must be used. During this time - bar opens, band plays etc - big finish at 10pm. Prize giving on stage followed by band until 1pm

Breakfast in the morning - ride home

[Katman]

Mate Im not even thinking that far atm-more asking the question of normal folk (as normal as KB folk get) -what would attract them
I figure theres gota be something we in NZ racing are missing and burying heads in the sand isnt gonna solve it

I think one of the major attractions of the Castrol 6 Hour for 'normal' folk was that they could turn up on their bike and see virtually the exact same bike competing in the race - and immense satisfaction was gained if 'your' bike won the event. (See where I'm coming from). The manufacturers were behind the event largely because "what wins on Sunday, sells on Monday".

[Tim 39]

Frosty - I'll be honest, a 6 hour endurance race will be hard to get spectators for. My opinion is that people like a little break and then a different class of bikes and riders to come out. A bit of variety.

I like the idea of getting spectators to turn up to more events a lot. Someone (and everyone as a whole) needs to organise this a bit more, because it is realy good for the sport having more spectators at events. The ideas like the rallies going to events seem to work realy well ie the Burt Munro draws heaps of spectators and it hasn't been going long. Then it becomes like the brass monkey where it's just what you go to each year if you're a motorbiker

[Paul in NZ]

Get these guys to play the gig - I'd come for SURE!

http://www.bigjohnbates.com/

As for the classes thing - not required if you can get dealers etc to enter big teams - you need big fields - night / day all the drama

[DEATH_INC.]

Rangi bikes - slow ones with lots of rattles and broken bits.

I guess I could enter......:eek5:

[Mr Merde]

Frosty,

Its a big ask and has set my mind working ( no mean feat).

I have been to the Le Mans race on 6 occasions.

Firstly I went for the racing but 24 hours is a long time to concentrate on the one thing.

6 hours are less but for a spectator you are probably talking about 8-10 hours of being there and entertainment.

Food is important. As are toilet facilities. A bike show, stunt show, merchants display, kids entertainment etc. Somewhere to chill. Decent live reporting of the race.

Its a lot to ask of 5000 people in NZ to attend anything apart from rugby etc.

In my opinion you need to advertise on a larger scale than this forum. Really push it.

Hope this helps.


Merde

[DEATH_INC.]

Make into a festival - how many people go to the cold kiwi etc
Yep, the gp and sbk in aussie are like this, you camp there all weekend, big marqee and bands etc on the sat night.
Good food is a necessity as is some bloody shade......
pretty much what has been covered, trade stands and entertainment ( stunt riders etc), entry needn't be cheap, it's just gotta be worth it.

[DEATH_INC.]

I think one of the major attractions of the Castrol 6 Hour for 'normal' folk was that they could turn up on their bike and see virtually the exact same bike competing in the race - and immense satisfaction was gained if 'your' bike won the event. (See where I'm coming from). The manufacturers were behind the event largely because "what wins on Sunday, sells on Monday".
Mmmm yeh..... but...... wot about the likes of trashie (and most others) who only has one bike to use for racing, it would be a huge ask to convert it back to stockish for one race.....NZ is small, this would need to allow ALL types of bike....

[Tony.OK]

I'd prefer to watch longer seperate races than a 6 hr,more like a sbk round,6-8 laps goes too quick.Promotion is what is sadly lacking in bike racing in NZ,no tv coverage to speak of.Local rags never tell me theres a race on anywhere.
Wanganui works for me because if theres a class that doesnt interest me theres time to check out the pits or stalls etc.......Girls are always nice to admire (drool over).
Good luck with it............if its in Taupo I'll be there regardless.

[What?]

The Castrol 6 hour was Mecca to me. The five hour ride to get there was part of the fun, and I always watched as much of the race as I possibly could - just a quick break or two to attend to the whims of my guts and bladder.
BUT - many of my friends were not so keen on getting home at midnight when they had to go to work at 7 the next morning, thus did not go, so perhaps running the event in the middle of a long weekend might help attendance? Or maybe it would do the opposite - bit of a gamble.

Funny thing with the 6 hour - in the early days, Manfeild was PACKED. The fields were also large. By 1985 it was going into decline, and by 1988 (the final event), the field was tiny and the number of spectators was not much better. The entries dropped off, by and large, due to cost, combined with a general decline in bike sales making the scene even worse for dealers and distributors. I guess the decline in spectator attendance was directly related to the decline in bike sales (due to cheap Jap import cars + over-protective PC parents).
Motorcycling is having a small revival at the moment, so an event like this could be viable as long as it offers plenty of attractions (as noted repeatedly in other posts), and has the support of dealers everywhere to help promote it. It would also be necessary to keep the racer's costs as low as possible - an Open Production event is doomed to failure, but something that would allow entries in 2 or 3 existing classes might just do the trick.

[PeteJ]

Tony, big praise to you for asking us all to tell you what we want.

NZACU/MNZ and the affiliated clubs have been grappling with all these issues for about 90 years now.

Every problem can be fixed with money and population bases which NZ does not have. So there needs to be some other solution.

Production racing or mod/prod is the only area where there could be substantial manufacturer support; if they cannot see sales for them, there is nothing in it.

WSB started here, failed here not just because of Flammini but also because of insufficient local money.

We are competing for spectators not just with other motorcycle codes, but also with an ever-increasing number of other participatory and spectator events. And, as we found with NZCMRR, after a shockingly short period, the spectator support dwindles to just a few hard core people compared with the first few years of comparative novelty when you get lots in through the gates.

We are all praying that you can crack on to the right formula.

[FROSTY]

keep it coming folks--EVERYONES opinion is welcolm--AND has equal validity
-bsicly I need to know what would attract YOU
now not name dropping but I had a chat with MNZ --one point they raised was that at the 3 hour there were basicly only 3 or 4 teams who could win the thing right from the getgo-- I think that would be --well BORING -worse if the top guys combined resources and reduced the number still further.
To me a "freight train" (LINE OF BIKES FIGHTING IT OUT) would be exciting

[Mr Merde]

I note there is talk about running classes.

Take a leaf out of the le mans 24 hour.

They run multiple classes in the same race.

There is an over all winner but there are also class winners.

Variety.

Enthusiasts can watch the exotics and the run of the mill rider can follow a bike similar to their own ( and dream).

Thats what you are promoting. Not a race but an avenue for people to dream.


Merde

[FROSTY]

NZACU/MNZ and the affiliated clubs have been grappling with all these issues for about 90 years now.

Every problem can be fixed with money and population bases which NZ does not have. So there needs to be some other solution.

We are all praying that you can crack on to the right formula.
Mate you have it on the head there -- if the old formulas dont work we need to find formulas that do
I know this sounds like ego at work but I swear it isn't -If someone can get a formula that will attract say 5000-7000 people to a race meeting
and we can repeat the formula it will have a trickle down effect to grass roots racing and to the general bike riding population
We just need to capture the imagination of mr joe average --even mr joe average petrol head would be a big start

[PeteJ]

Something else that MNZ would have no objection to in principle (I have discussed this, too): a closed-roads gravel and seal speed event like a car rally on 2 wheels.

Advantages:

1. No circuit hire;

2. Manufacturers each have several models that could be in with chances to win, and lots of promotion for accessory and clothing sellers;

3. You take the event to the spectators, but it is still An Event;

4. Still relatively easy to record/televise, because everything is action;

5. It would be a shitload of fun for everyone.

Disadvantages:

1. Lots of coordination needed with local authorities and Transit NZ and local inhabitants;

2. You need lotsa helpers.

Our shop would probably enter 2 or 3 machines for a 2 or 3-day closed-road rally, where we just could not be bothered any more for a 6-hour. (Did that all those years ago, do not need to do it now...)

[enigma51]

Its a great idea as long as it becomes a hole weekend thing IE camp there and have lots of entertainment. Bands stunting etc.

So you rock up on saturday see a couple of minor classes do a bit of racing. Do a qualify session for sunday then have a late afternoon stunting exersize and later the evenng a big party and then sunday stalls and smaller things.

Make it like a rally event

I think $10 for the race and $50 for the weekend is not to much to ask

[enigma51]

Mate you have it on the head there -- if the old formulas dont work we need to find formulas that do
I know this sounds like ego at work but I swear it isn't -If someone can get a formula that will attract say 5000-7000 people to a race meeting
and we can repeat the formula it will have a trickle down effect to grass roots racing and to the general bike riding population
We just need to capture the imagination of mr joe average --even mr joe average petrol head would be a big start

I think is not the racing its the fact that the guys winning are always the same people and the reason they are winning all the time is because they have the factory backing and the talent. We should have a stock class ie No engine mods and no carbon fibre Suspension fine tyres fine but everything else should stay the same.

I mean look at jimmy. In my opinion one of the fastest guys out there but his down about +20Hp on the likes of Andrew Strout etc. Also its realy fun to see jimmy racing. Its the same idea around Rossi etc. Its not just the fact that he is fast its his style. Same reason Keven Swantz is one my all time favorites.

I do like watching the top NZ guys but they are just boring (well most of them)

Also then there is the media coverage when they do show it its about 4 months old. NOOOO lets rather watch american baseball cause thats what we like

:Oi: jimmy im not comparing you to rossi or kevin

[Pancakes]

Need to get lots of "buy in" to get crowds. ie. good classes but also and stock 250 couple of laps etc. the more racers there that it is new or a big buzz for the more of their mates they will drag along. As for getting petrolheads in general you could do car v.s bike drags as a between rounds showcase. Just an idea but seminars too? ie RT going through suspention (would be a tease really, don't want to give tricks away and can't cover much in 40 mins) but people get to feel involved and like they are learning and shops can showcase their stuff.

Newcomers shootout? maybe 3 groups of 4 with the winner of each one progessing to the next round? Street bikes again, shops would probably cover a days costs for one of their good customers on a nice roadbike? can be staggered thru the day too with people wanting to see the next race. You want punters to stay all day I bet youd rather have 5000 people ALL DAY than 7000 for a little bit. if it's a great day the longer they stay the more likely thay'll be to return with friends

[PeteJ]

A quick comment or two on rider and event sponsorship - no sponsor wants to associate with loss. That is why the top riders get the best sponsorship. Industry sponsorship is predicated on sales results in some way or another.

Unless you have a good chance to place very well, or spend tens of thousands a year with a shop (or work for it and you have a deal going), no shop is going to sponsor you: why should they?

Same with event sponsorship - sponsorship is not freebies. If you want freebies, beg in the street.

Tony, you and I know how much widespread paid publicity costs. $50K gets you very small reach to the general public of NZ. To get a gate of 5-10,000 at the first event, my guess (based on experience with several of the MNZ-affiliated clubs over the last 30-odd years) the publicity and promotion cost would be about $10 a head, even with some sponsorship.

And then it'll rain - which is what has driven some of the MNZ clubs damn near broke on occasion. Rain insurance costs heaps, too...

[Jorja]

Folks a little team of people is looking to organise a 6 hour race meeting most likely at Taupo track.
To make it work it needs spectators to be there -around 5000 of ya.
15000 of you lot come along to Battle of the streets and similar numbers to Whanganui
So what attracts you there??
What can be done to attract you to a track meeting?
I really would like feedback from non racers please.

You :cool:

But what would bring the kids and make for a fun day would be good food, lots of bikes to get up close to, carnival type things (ie quads to ride), face painting etc.

How about getting bike shops and big companies to sponsor the event? If you can get some sort of coverage it would be advertising for them.

[dveus]

Mate Im not even thinking that far atm-more asking the question of normal folk (as normal as KB folk get) -what would attract them
I figure theres gota be something we in NZ racing are missing and burying heads in the sand isnt gonna solve it

Advertising. At the end of the day your asking the wrong crowd what will get them there. It's joe public that is needed for really big numbers. At the moment the only way you can find out about race meets is to go looking for them.

[FROSTY]

Advertising. At the end of the day your asking the wrong crowd what will get them there. It's joe public that is needed for really big numbers. At the moment the only way you can find out about race meets is to go looking for them.
I used to think that and I dont entirely disagree --but MNZ spent a shit load getting TV advertising for the nationals this year--still only 1500-2000 turned up at each round

[FROSTY]

I kinda wondered about -dare I say it --TAB betting on the race -would that bring people in

[PeteJ]

I kinda wondered about -dare I say it --TAB betting on the race -would that bring people in
Check the MNZ rulebook. You might need to run it as an outlaw meeting.

[Subsequent comment: have just checked the rulebook, as I was sure that there was a rule banning wagering on race results. I was wrong: I cannot find any such rule.]

[FROSTY]

its just an idea -MNZ are I believe just as keen to see some formula succede

[roogazza]

I think is not the racing its the fact that the guys winning are always the same people and the reason they are winning all the time is because they have the factory backing and the talent. We should have a stock class ie No engine mods and no carbon fibre Suspension fine tyres fine but everything else should stay the same.

I mean look at jimmy. In my opinion one of the fastest guys out there but his down about +20Hp on the likes of Andrew Strout etc. Also its realy fun to see jimmy racing. Its the same idea around Rossi etc. Its not just the fact that he is fast its his style. Same reason Keven Swantz is one my all time favorites.

I do like watching the top NZ guys but they are just boring (well most of them)

Also then there is the media coverage when they do show it its about 4 months old. NOOOO lets rather watch american baseball cause thats what we like

:Oi: jimmy im not comparing you to rossi or kevin

Enigma, sorry but you are thirty years late ! We don't have enough good guys and no depth either. We had all that production stuff, but sadly it died. Along with the crowds that watched.
2007 riders aren't interested in production racing, it has been mooted on here forever.

I don't know what the answer is , but if we can start breeding flatout maybe we can get a twenty mill population in 20 years, that might help ?

Gaz.

[scracha]

What would bring ME to watch a race meeting? Well for starters I'd need to know where and when the race meeting was being held and at the moment it's difficult enough for us riders, never mind spectators.

There needs to be ONE website for riders, advertisers and spectators to visit. Individual club websites don't meet this requirement, nor do the MNZ, silver-bullet or motorcyclesport websites. Google adwords are not expensive either.

Motorcycle press & I guess car magazines should have the events listed in them too. Sick a listing in the NZ Herald or local press too? The Sunday motor sport telly program never mentions motorcycle club racing either and I suspect it's because nobody tells them.

Signs on the motorways, service-stations and side roads on the day (and day before) of an event would also be good. It amazes me you can go to a busy town like Taupo or pass the Pukekohe turn-off and there's not one sign advertising the fact that there are motorcycle sports happening. I'm sure a few of the bored tourists would rather go there than play golf or fishing.

On the scale of things, a few LCD monitors and/or projectors around the place showing various parts of the circuit, pits, positions, laptimes and/or on board footage wouldn't cost the earth and be beneficial to spectators (not to mention riders). On-board video cameras could also be handed out at random and would be beneficial to the website and perhaps money could be generated from a DVD at the end of the season.

Some "spectator participation" such as "win a pillion lap at lunchtime on a superbike or side-car".

Umm..music between races. Somewhere covered for when it rains. A marshal or two to direct traffic (or at least some signs telling spectators where to park). A program of events for spectators, perhaps with current standings and bio's of a few of the riders to make it a bit more interesting. A proper little "awards" ceremony is also good for spectators and sponsors.

Basically more co-ordination needs to happen and a little money spent on volounteers expenses as opposed to pissing away frightening sums of money on TV adverts.

[oldguy]

Mate if you could get Rossi or any motoGP or Superbike rider, just to make a guest appearance you would have no problem, would even have people who would never go to a bike race/meeting, its all about who is riding.
Paeroa and Wanganui are street races, and thats what brings the crowds
haven't read all the post in this thread so this may have already been covered.

cheers John

Oh and for me to go to a race meet, would have to be, time of year, money and weather permitting, hate riding in the rain.
Usual lame excuses

[Tim 39]

When you see all these good ideas that aren't currently being utilised, it's no wonder we get bugger all spectators to pur events. The nationals are the events that I think should be the most attended by spectators, but nobody puts any effort into sorting it out. there's usualy 1 scodey toilet approximately 1km from the spectator areas, no other entertainment, no shops or stalls etc etc etc.
maybe we should start actualy trying to get spectators?!!

good on ya guys for bringing this subject up

[Paul in NZ]

After reading this and thinking about it some more....

You need to get it organised by people who are not motorcycle racers...

[James Deuce]

I used to think that and I dont entirely disagree --but MNZ spent a shit load getting TV advertising for the nationals this year--still only 1500-2000 turned up at each round

You're joking? I never saw a single ad on TV. Not one.

In answer to earlier questions, the reality is that you won't see me as a spectator until the spawn are slightly more independent units. It's literally too much like hard work to keep track and do everything for them at a chaotic event like a race meeting, during what would end up being a 12 hour day IF we hung about for the whole thing.

Paul in NZ's idea with the night time running and bands and late finish is great, but would definitely count us out.

[MadDuck]

Some very good constructive ideas and thoughts.

BUT I think you have to ask yourself why Paeroa and Wanganui attract the big crowds? OK they are established calender events for all bikers to the point its a no brainer that you are going to go if you are into bikes. It will take time to become that entrenched.

Their formula kinda works and maybe with some adaptation it could extend to the kind of event you are talking about. Paeora doesnt have the bloody bouncy castles (thank the gods of racing) or fancy gear tents but the racers do camp out there and the spectators can get up close and personal with the riders and watch how they set up their bikes.

As you are asking for personal opinion heres mine....I like to know whos out there racing. KB has been great for that over the last couple of years. Profiles and the chance to meet the guys and gals.


PS:"Racing" is not the right forum if you want to get a GENERAL opinion from the biking community

[James Deuce]

Paeora doesnt have the bloody bouncy castles (thank the gods of racing)


This is what I'm talking about. A lot of motorsport competitors and spectators don't seem to want kids anywhere near a race meeting. Where do the future racers and spectators come from?

The predictable response will be: "They've come to the bloody racing and they should bloody well watch it!"

It doesn't work like that. Sometimes you do things with kids and it appears to make absolutely no impact. Then years later you get, "Remember when....."

[MadDuck]

Its just MY personal opinion thats all.

Last thing I want when I have paid good money to spectate is to have someones ill disciplined kids running around bored as beans accidentally kicking my helmet and slopping ice cream all over me.

[James Deuce]

Did I make a point, or did I make a point?

[Str8 Jacket]

If its free, my mates are racing and I can get there then i'm there!

[car]

This is what I'm talking about. A lot of motorsport competitors and spectators don't seem to want kids anywhere near a race meeting. Where do the future racers and spectators come from?

The predictable response will be: "They've come to the bloody racing and they should bloody well watch it!"

It doesn't work like that. Sometimes you do things with kids and it appears to make absolutely no impact. Then years later you get, "Remember when....."

Give that man a ceegar.

The chances of me dragging my solo ass up to Taupo to watch any event are minimal. The chances of me bringing my family for a weekend away are much greater. But if it's anything like the endurance rounds I attended in the UK (with little more than the racing itself to see) then the chances of me bothering to drive five hours to see it are zero.

[car]

Last thing I want when I have paid good money to spectate is to have someones ill disciplined kids running around bored as beans accidentally kicking my helmet and slopping ice cream all over me.

That's perfectly understandable. If there's stuff for them to do away from the choice spectating spots, the chances of them pissing on your day are reduced, too.

[Paul in NZ]

Did I make a point, or did I make a point?

You made the point... better than I

Certainly i stopped going to race meeting because they were boring bike fests centred on the racers and I'm not a racer... I'm a father with 3 daughters that had to prioritise the family spend

The street events have a rep bigger than their value but they work because they happen in the summer at a great time of the year and bring people to places where people would normally never go - thus getting support from council?..

Meh - I'm bored with this - it will be a club racer thing and a commercial disaster - frankly I wouldn't touch the sponsorship of this with a 100ft pole (no disrespect - I'm just tired)

[FROSTY]

Did I make a point, or did I make a point?
Jim --have you seen Taupo track??
Given the layout -there could be a Funfair tokeep em busy.
Hey folks PLEASE lets not argue please -- The varying opinions are exactlywhats needed
Lets not go there with why this is in the racing section -

[MadDuck]

Did I make a point, or did I make a point?

Maybe in your own little world you did. Did I make mine?

It would be a boring ass old world if we all agreed now wouldnt it? As for me if theres kiddies horsey rides and bouncy castles I will stay far far away....

[James Deuce]

If you're representative of female racers in NZ then you're not much of a role model.

I promise to stay away from motorcycle racing in NZ, particularly with my kids in tow.

[Str8 Jacket]

It would be a boring ass old world if we all agreed now wouldnt it? As for me if theres kiddies horsey rides and bouncy castles I will stay far far away....

Im not to sure that I understand your logic? What racing needs is more spectators and the aeverage kiwi racer can also be a family man/woman..... If these things were there and it increased the number of spectators and therefore ineterest in racing wouldnt that be a good thing? I am not a huge fan of children but I think that we must accept to some degree that alot of these racers, be they man or woman have family.....

[MadDuck]

If you're representative of female racers in NZ then you're not much of a role model.


The topic of the question posed was "What would bring YOU to watch a race meeting". I have merely offered what would or would not entice me to a race meeting.

I have never raced and never will. The ladies that do race are GREAT role models and probably have a completely different opinion to me.

[Clivoris]

One of the things that gets me to events is the anticipation that people I know will be there. There is the buzz of being where everyone else is going to be. That's probably not much help to you Frosty, cos I don't have a clue how to generate that buzz. The weather has a huge impact for me. If I'm going somewhere for a good time I want to be comfortable. Again, difficult to arrange and Paeroa already have the best weekend of the summer nailed down.
My kids fight each other for the opportunity to get to race-meetings because they know people who are competing and spectating. They also know other people's kids who come to the meetings and end up hanging out together. It is bloody hard work to look after them but I get to do a little bit of what I like. The nationals round at Manfield this year was great for the family. My kids got posters and hats signed by superstars (in their eyes anyway). Having the Aussies there was great too.
I think others posting here have picked up on the other things I would like, e.g the festival atmosphere.
Good luck Frosty.

[NUTBAR]

:2thumbsup
GIRLS GIRLS and more GIRLS :done:















oh and
Good food
decent comentator



yes yes lots of them:2thumbsup:2thumbsup

[FROSTY]

The topic of the question posed was "What would bring YOU to watch a race meeting". I have merely offered what would or would not entice me to a race meeting.

I have never raced and never will. The ladies that do race are GREAT role models and probably have a completely different opinion to me.
Madduck/jim--BOTHof your prospectives are equally important
-I can see it working too -keep the roadside stand area as exclusive--like corperate boxes
The OLD pits area set up for kids n stuff with access to a stand looking over the whole infeild area

[Nicksta]

I like what Clivoris had to say.....

I grew up at the track.. not with bikes, but V8's.... since i could crawl we had a tent and plenty of play stuff to do... we didnt get in the way, and when i was big enough i got to change tyres etc... growing up at the track got rekindled the day Bruce took me to Puke for an open day... and i haven't looked back... but i digress...

having the team atmosphere with the posters for kids... the entertainment on the fields... the family things will draw crowds... dad will get the ok if mum and kids are happy... as a racer you are a role model, i dont mind people coming around the pits, checking out the bikes and chatting, yes it can be distracting on the occasion and you do have to be mindful of a kids hands near your hot frame/pipe, but if a kid gets a pic on your bike and a big grin, thats cool in my books..... the families that come may have the next Harris or Stroud with ice cream on their face...

i would come/bring family to a race meet with good food stalls, safe spectator spots (Paeroa scares me for the record with its chicken wire) interation with racers, a fun atmosphere, cheap/free entry for spectators and something for the family ie. signings/posters/interation with racers (maybe meet and greet tents?) tent for shade and childrens entertainment/coffee for mum's / dad's to relax a little in the shade.

oh and Vale, Nicky (and his Bro Tommy) and Danny to drool over please :)

[GSVR]

Electric race and drag bikes. Glad you said "A" race meeting.

[Racey Rider]

BAttle of The Provinces?

Teams events like in stockcars. But add up points to find winning province.

Three riders/3 bikes from Auck/ Well/ BOP/ Taranaki/ East coast in each class.

O,, and one team form the South I guess. :bleh:

Give the spectator a team they feel they can cheer on, even if they don't know the riders name.

Go The Naki!!!

[MVnut]

Probably not a very practical suggestion but what about a 'Bears Standard Production 6 Hour' split in say 3 classes (run all at once obviously), as the Bears meets seem to get much bigger crowds than most.:rockon:

[johnsv650]

get the tab to have betting on it,
trackside to cover it, bokie machines to pay stake monies for place getters (most horse racing funding for stakes is from bokie trusts).
people would pay to watch how there bets are going (oncourse), low tv coverage costs, good for motorbike sponsors.......get 10% of turnover from tab.....
once a year.......one, two hour race for two or three national :banana:classes at once with compusulary pit stop and tyre change (maybe top ten bikes in each class from nationals) for tab numbers.

[deanohit]

BAttle of The Provinces?
Give the spectator a team they feel they can cheer on, even if they don't know the riders name.
Go The Naki!!!

I love that idea!

Go the BOP!!!!


Damn that blue looks sick on the pink. =(

[FROSTY]

This question has be raised in another thread.I think this discussion is still very much valid

[sitting duck]

Hi Frosty. Try to get to Wanganui regularly and really enjoy it but haven't been to a track since the 80s. looking at getting back into going to meetngs and all your initial points are good. I also thought the idea of somewhere to keep gear (at a cost) was great. you see a lot of sweating motorcyclists dragging gear around and it doesnt look like fun. I would also like to see a pit pass (additional cost) available which would intitle you say, view bikes up close, attend pre and post interviews, beer with riders afterwards, corp tent etc. Some people would like to follow a rider not just a bike and to do that you need to get up close.

[Bikernereid]

I found the whole commentary being mostly about the sponsorship and not the racing really bloody annoying. I would prefer just commentary on racing- that would encourage me to go back. Advertise the sponsors a different way so that the racing can be focused upon!


Folks The nationals are attracting smaller and smaller crowds.
15000 of you lot come along to Battle of the streets and similar numbers to Whanganui
So what attracts you there??
What can be done to attract you to a track meeting?
I really would like feedback from non racers please.

FEEDBACK SO FAR IS FANTASTIC--THANKYOU ALL THOSE THAT HAVE CONTRIBUTED

1)plentyof clean loos
2)plenty of shade.
3)exclusive seating areas at a premeum price.
4)viewing areas to watch the inpit action up close (viewingthe tight leathers)
5)big screens for the action you missed
6)quality food not just chips and hotdogs
7)other forms of entertainment-possibly a rally
8)entertainment for kids -thinking over EVERY north island track I can picture an area sutable for that
9)bigger range of bike types -not clones
10)local community involvement-
11) good comentary
12)Lots of trade stalls

[flame]

I found the whole commentary being mostly about the sponsorship and not the racing really bloody annoying. I would prefer just commentary on racing- that would encourage me to go back. Advertise the sponsors a different way so that the racing can be focused upon!

Not sure what happens in your part of the world. But as a racer, Im all for my sponsors names getting as much publicity as possible. Im sure most racers would agree. As without the ongoing support of our sponsors there possibly would be no racing, and therefore nothing for you to come and enjoy, let alone bitch about.

[Drew]

I found the whole commentary being mostly about the sponsorship and not the racing really bloody annoying. I would prefer just commentary on racing- that would encourage me to go back. Advertise the sponsors a different way so that the racing can be focused upon!


Thank you to my lady for pointing out the above dumb post.

My bike is, "one of the KTL motorcycles 749r Ducatis", and should be reffered to as such in any comentary. That shop and other investors do OWN it after all. And if at some point I manage to fill my potential and get it to a high profile podium, I want everyone in the crowd to hear the list of people behind getting it there. Are you so self centered to think that YOU are the most important person at the track? I intend to win and I realise I am but a tiny part of the picture.

Thank you Ktl bikes, Rob and Cherry Taylor, Anglo American motorcycle club, Bike Tranz, Henderson Motorcycles, Kerry Dukie (Wellington Ohlins service agent), without these outstanding people Flame and myself wouldn't be able to upset ignorant people by having them hear what it is you do.

[soundbeltfarm]

why is it so expensive to get aussies out here.
i was going to lend my mx bike to a young up and comer aussie mx rider for the super cross but he got injured just before he was meant to come out.
hurley was bringing him out.
a young guy from oz came over and he was loand a bike and billeted out to a local family he was treated well paid his own flight over and the day after the race the club took him to taupo and shouted him a bungy jump.
he was stoked and is def coming back,
the plan is he'l tell others and they'l want to come.and then play on the kiwis vs aussies ,
the young guy really enjoyed being billeted instead of staying in a motel,

as for what i think would bring people.
i asked my wife and she said
a decent grassy area where you can put an ezy up up and take in a chilly bin with food and drink, and just chill out.
where you can watch the kids play around still see the track .
this happens at the horse races around here and its good.
you can turn up with a bit of cash and have a few bets because it does make it a bit more fun.
no pissed up yobbos,
plenty of clean toilets
good entertainment for kids.
decent seating , i mean who wants bloody rimu burns on your arse from sitting on shit seating,
plus i'd want to know its run properly and no bloody cheating or preference to big teams is given ( only now that it been brought to my attention from wt)
and for the mnz rep to have a fucking spine.
not like some of the crap that happened at the tokoroa super cross.
one thing is like in car racing everyone loves crashes or punch ups in other sports. i know its not cool to see riders go down but something thrillin keeps people watchin.
even fmx in middle of the track.
or like they have at the cricket where you can hire a beer bitch for the day.
even bikes race a car or something like that that you can use for advertising.
its about being creative with the resources you have and making people go away talking about it so they tell their friends and come back the following year and bring their friends.
even get some of those kiwi wrestlers ( like the ones off raw and that shit )
that'l target another crowd. they can prob bring a ring and they'd prob be free i mean, shit i seen a bit on tv of the nz guys and i've had more people to a bbq than went to watch them live.
is it pretty new in nz? i dont know.

[Drew]

That's a real difficult format to read mate, doesn't cost a lot to get a bike from here to there, $350 will ship a bike to Oz my sponsor has discovered. There is a shit load of red tape when it comes to liscence I have found tho.

It would mount up to a couple grand, (maybe three or four), return I guess, and that isn't real cheap if you wont be here or there long.

[DEATH_INC.]

Thank you to my lady for pointing out the above dumb post.

My bike is, "one of the KTL motorcycles 749r Ducatis", and should be reffered to as such in any comentary. That shop and other investors do OWN it after all. And if at some point I manage to fill my potential and get it to a high profile podium, I want everyone in the crowd to hear the list of people behind getting it there. Are you so self centered to think that YOU are the most important person at the track? I intend to win and I realise I am but a tiny part of the picture.

Thank you Ktl bikes, Rob and Cherry Taylor, Anglo American motorcycle club, Bike Tranz, Henderson Motorcycles, Kerry Dukie (Wellington Ohlins service agent), without these outstanding people Flame and myself wouldn't be able to upset ignorant people by having them hear what it is you do.
Ah yes, but we need a balance... (and not all of us have sponsors :weep: )
Dunno, but the racing here is generally pretty booring, don't really know how to fix that....

[Bikernereid]

Thanks for that. I am just giving my opinion and asking if there is another solution that still gives credit to the sponsors without having to listen to it during the commenraty all the time. I just think that if you want people to attend the racing then thier opinion counts too. I see people bitching about not getting the spectator number and I am giving you the opinion of a spectator as requested by Frosty.

My bike is, "one of the KTL motorcycles 749r Ducatis", and should be reffered to as such in any comentary. Is one thing but continued talk about this shop and that shop is annoying.

If as a rider you don't give a shit then you are not the type of racer I would want to watch anyway!


Thank you to my lady for pointing out the above dumb post.

My bike is, "one of the KTL motorcycles 749r Ducatis", and should be reffered to as such in any comentary. That shop and other investors do OWN it after all. And if at some point I manage to fill my potential and get it to a high profile podium, I want everyone in the crowd to hear the list of people behind getting it there. Are you so self centered to think that YOU are the most important person at the track? I intend to win and I realise I am but a tiny part of the picture.

Thank you Ktl bikes, Rob and Cherry Taylor, Anglo American motorcycle club, Bike Tranz, Henderson Motorcycles, Kerry Dukie (Wellington Ohlins service agent), without these outstanding people Flame and myself wouldn't be able to upset ignorant people by having them hear what it is you do.

[soundbeltfarm]

That's a real difficult format to read mate, doesn't cost a lot to get a bike from here to there, $350 will ship a bike to Oz my sponsor has discovered. There is a shit load of red tape when it comes to liscence I have found tho.

It would mount up to a couple grand, (maybe three or four), return I guess, and that isn't real cheap if you wont be here or there long.

yeah sorry mate bit pissed up , so sorry about the format thing.
why would it cost 3 to 4 k?
this young fella paid for a ticket here and back.
he was picked up from auckland.
fed for free, stayed for free.
bike for free, fuel for free,
not sure about race entry or medical cover ( if he had any)
and he was here for i think only 4 days

[Drew]

Ah yes, but we need a balance... (and not all of us have sponsors :weep: )
Dunno, but the racing here is generally pretty booring, don't really know how to fix that.... The racing isn't boring if you can see it.With the extra stands going up at Manfield, and Taupo it will be better. More entrants too, and for that we need more sponsors. You yourself are fantastic to watch throwing a bike around cos it wont go of its own accord, someone paying to get you there and enter would be well recieved by everyone that has met you.




My bike is, "one of the KTL motorcycles 749r Ducatis", and should be reffered to as such in any comentary. Is one thing but continued talk about this shop and that shop is annoying.

If as a rider you don't give a shit then you are not the type of racer I would want to watch anyway!

Oh I care, I considder my lady and I on our way up, and want the whole friggin world to see it happen and who got us there. That may sound selfish, but they enjoy seeing us do the bizzo, and people on the whole like to be gratified.

Where in my post did you get that I dont give a shit? If you refer to your opinion, then it is as welcome as any other, I just think it is rediculous to moan about hearing the sponsors and what they do for a rider.

[Drew]

yeah sorry mate bit pissed up , so sorry about the format thing.
why would it cost 3 to 4 k?
this young fella paid for a ticket here and back.
he was picked up from auckland.
fed for free, stayed for free.
bike for free, fuel for free,
not sure about race entry or medical cover ( if he had any)
and he was here for i think only 4 days

Time off work, flights, frieght, international race licence, it all adds up. I was thinking of a longer stay though on ones own machine to seriously contest an event with at least a days set up on each track to be raced, so there is distance to cover between.

I must have mis read your post sorry.

[soundbeltfarm]

Time off work, flights, frieght, international race licence, .

good point on the time off work i never thought of that.

[FROSTY]

Drew --Dude I think you're missing the point.
Its not the people that ARE coming to the track that we need to be asking (not that their opinion isn't important) Those that do come already have the bug.
Its those that are staying away in their thousands that we need to ask -"hey why DON'T you come?"
All those that don't come have valid reasons in their lives. YET 30000 odd people went to a ractrack to watch what was mostly a procession this weekend.
45000 A DAY turned up each day to watch V8 cars go around the most boring track in New Zealand.
Yet at the nationals we get 5000 at most --summat is wrong

[Bikernereid]

I think the more people that race the better and I repsect you and your lady for doing it. But I have spent 34 years going to the races and just prefer to hear what is going on round the other parts of the track that I can't see as opposed to who is sponsoring. We all know what sponsors are doing for riders but at the end of the day if spectators don't come and watch then what the sponsors do will be immaterial anyhoo.

Oh I care, I considder my lady and I on our way up, and want the whole friggin world to see it happen and who got us there. That may sound selfish, but they enjoy seeing us do the bizzo, and people on the whole like to be gratified.

Where in my post did you get that I dont give a shit? If you refer to your opinion, then it is as welcome as any other, I just think it is rediculous to moan about hearing the sponsors and what they do for a rider.[/QUOTE]

[ArcherWC]

one word ADVERTISING, people wont come if its not in there faces for the weeks leading up to the event

[Bikernereid]

I am racing nuts but to be honest I got a bit put off going to other racing in NZ at Wanganui cos of all the sponsor talk. Maybe I am just used to racing in the UK.


Drew --Dude I think you're missing the point.
Its not the people that ARE coming to the track that we need to be asking (not that their opinion isn't important) Those that do come already have the bug.
Its those that are staying away in their thousands that we need to ask -"hey why DON'T you come?"
All those that don't come have valid reasons in their lives. YET 30000 odd people went to a ractrack to watch what was mostly a procession this weekend.
45000 A DAY turned up each day to watch V8 cars go around the most boring track in New Zealand.
Yet at the nationals we get 5000 at most --summat is wrong

[FROSTY]

I am racing nuts but to be honest I got a bit put off going to other racing in NZ at Wanganui cos of all the sponsor talk. Maybe I am just used to racing in the UK.
The sponsor talk is sposed to fill the GAPS between races. Mind you its typical of kiwi racers. We get asked over the tannoy for our profiles to give us a talk up by the commentator --most of us just give a sponsor blurb instead of OUR acheivements. Its the whole not wanting to seem boastful

[Ixion]

Folks The nationals are attracting smaller and smaller crowds.
15000 of you lot come along to Battle of the streets and similar numbers to Whanganui
So what attracts you there??
What can be done to attract you to a track meeting?
I really would like feedback from non racers please.

FEEDBACK SO FAR IS FANTASTIC--THANKYOU ALL THOSE THAT HAVE CONTRIBUTED

1)plentyof clean loos
2)plenty of shade.
3)exclusive seating areas at a premeum price.
4)viewing areas to watch the inpit action up close (viewingthe tight leathers)
5)big screens for the action you missed
6)quality food not just chips and hotdogs
7)other forms of entertainment-possibly a rally
8)entertainment for kids -thinking over EVERY north island track I can picture an area sutable for that
9)bigger range of bike types -not clones
10)local community involvement-
11) good comentary
12)Lots of trade stalls

If you could turn that lot on you might even get me there. You left out a decent program book. If you don't avidly follow racing, the programs are usually total crap, just a list of meaningless names. No 22 Bill Bloggs. So what. Who the fuck IS Bill Bloggs. give me some potted resumes. Tell me why Bill Bloggs is expected to win - or, doesn't have a hope. Like the form books at horse races. And put in some human interest stuff. Let us know about Mrs Bloggs. And how about the mechanics - the unsung heros. Someone keeps the Bloggmocycle running. And tell me about the BIKES, That's what I really go for, the bikes, not the riders. They're just there to make the things go round and round.

And arrange it so I can come and go, a pass out.

And, FFS, I want to be able to get a decent glass of wine. Or a beer. I don't give a fuckers tink about the pious protestations of the blue light brigade. Decent food, and decent grog, please.

And someone else mentioned a gear lockup. They do that at Paeroa it';s really good.

Now, you you expect to get 5000 spectators, you'd need to think broadly. Like organising meeting points along the way. So the whole thing becomes a bit of a social thing.

And sidecars. Y gotta have chairs. And I like the idea of motard type stuff (the European version with gravel and mud)

Don't be afraid to charge. the Puke classics is $25 I'm cool with that, and I'm just a poor old man. FFS where can you get a days entertainment now for less ?

[FROSTY]

first post edited

[Tony.OK]

Would anyone be really interested in going to the V8's or A1 if they had hardly ever seen them on TV?
I'm sure if there was a SBK or GP here it would sell out,all we've had here in the last few years is a 1/2-1hr slot for Wanga's and Paeroa,Tv gets people interested in a sport that they may not be a fan of.
Hopefully the Nats coverage this year will do something to spark an interest.

[Bikernereid]

The whole world has gone mad. Not sure if it is part of the whole pc issue but at the end of the day why not be proud of what you have achieved and done. If you do well why should be be ashamed or embarrassed to tell people about it?

I for one am not really interested in the sponsors (yes they have thier part to play I know) but I am interested in the racers. Love Leon Haslam don't know didly squit about his sponsor history!! Go to watch him do well and support him. As I did with his father before him.


The sponsor talk is sposed to fill the GAPS between races. Mind you its typical of kiwi racers. We get asked over the tannoy for our profiles to give us a talk up by the commentator --most of us just give a sponsor blurb instead of OUR acheivements. Its the whole not wanting to seem boastful

[gav]

OK, its always going to be hard to try and get crowds matching what you get at a street circuit. Both Wanganui and Paeroa have a history, and its something about a once a year race circuit that appeals. Maybe because Joe Bloggs can relate to the circuit more than a "distant" racetrack?
Nothing beats word of mouth, don't be disillusioned if the first event failsto meet expectations, give it three or four events and learn from the experience. Be prepared to back the event for the long run, you will also get the confidence of your sponsers with this approach as well.
Shorter races will appeal more to the crowd than longer events where it can be hard to keep track of who is winning and coming where.
See if you can draw a "name" rider that may appeal to the crowd. How about Aaron Slight or Simon Crafer? Maybe Kevin Magee, Rob Phillis, Malcolm Campbell, Wayne Gardner ..... Think outside the square, it may be easier to entice someone over than you think. Remember, you don't to pay out the $$, sell the experience of living the Taupo or NZ lifestyle. Arrange bungy jumping, jetboating, flyfishing etc, I'm sure a sponser could help provide these items?
This approach worked in golf when the likes of Arnold Palmer and Jack Nicklas played in NZ, a chance for them to have a holiday like no other. You never no, who might say yeah! Doesnt Fred Merkel live in Taupo? :shifty:

[325rocket]

one word ADVERTISING, people wont come if its not in there faces for the weeks leading up to the event

I think that’s a good point. Ive never been to any bike racing as I figured it would be pretty boring. Id go now after watching the fast / race guys at the last manfeild track day.
If you don’t know how good it is you wont go.

[rwh]

See if you can draw a "name" rider that may appeal to the crowd. How about Aaron Slight or Simon Crafer? Maybe Kevin Magee, Rob Phillis, Malcolm Campbell, Wayne Gardner ..... Think outside the square, it may be easier to entice someone over than you think.

A name bike could be good too - I'd be more keen to go if I knew I'd see a Britten on the track, even if it's only some demo laps.

Richard

[DEATH_INC.]

Drew --Dude I think you're missing the point.
Its not the people that ARE coming to the track that we need to be asking (not that their opinion isn't important) Those that do come already have the bug.
Its those that are staying away in their thousands that we need to ask -"hey why DON'T you come?"
All those that don't come have valid reasons in their lives. YET 30000 odd people went to a ractrack to watch what was mostly a procession this weekend.
45000 A DAY turned up each day to watch V8 cars go around the most boring track in New Zealand.
Yet at the nationals we get 5000 at most --summat is wrong
Easy, it's image. These are prestigious international events with lotsa corporate backing. Get a round of wsbk here and get placemakers and co behind it and it'll go off. Go to the nzv8 championship rounds and try to spot the spectators....

[Quasievil]

Im taking Hot chicks to Paeroa, would that help boost the numbers??

[MadDuck]

So I should find some sexy blokes to bring along then ? ....:whistle:

[roogazza]

I pay nearly 10 grand to see two european GP's , but wouldn't cross the road to watch NZ racing, (used to, not now).

Rather have a fang around myself ! Gaz.

[gav]

I pay nearly 10 grand to see two european GP's , but wouldn't cross the road to watch NZ racing, (used to, not now).
Gaz.
Why not? When or what was the last local road racing you went to?

[Chrislost]

how about advertising it so that people who dont come on here actaully find out about it...

i didnt even know the nationals were on till i saw the posts yknow.

do i live with my head under a rock??? perhaps... but then im probably not thaaaat much diferent to anyone else.


i havnt even seen any advertising for paeroa yet.

[N1CK]

how about advertising it so that people who dont come on here actaully find out about it...

i didnt even know the nationals were on till i saw the posts yknow.

do i live with my head under a rock??? perhaps... but then im probably not thaaaat much diferent to anyone else.


i havnt even seen any advertising for paeroa yet.

Yea same here, i dont no when or where they are or where to look for the information. Advertising in different bike mags and newspapers would be good.

[Clivoris]

how about advertising it so that people who dont come on here actaully find out about it...

i didnt even know the nationals were on till i saw the posts yknow.

do i live with my head under a rock??? perhaps... but then im probably not thaaaat much diferent to anyone else.


i havnt even seen any advertising for paeroa yet.

Shit:eek5: That's torn it. I heard they were trying to keep it a secret so you wouldn't go:msn-wink:

[Chrislost]

Shit:eek5: That's torn it. I heard they were trying to keep it a secret so you wouldn't go:msn-wink:

i lie!
i drove past Paeroa on my way home from Mahia.
and saw a couple of signs in a field near there.

but around here i have not heard nada.

[roogazza]

Why not? When or what was the last local road racing you went to?

Because you get one or two or maybe even three guys at the front and the rest a mile off . That doesn't interest me.

Wanganui two years ago and I could see the fall off in interesting classes , depth of talent and racing. (but thats been happening for years) Remember I started in 1970 and I saw the boom years and I watched for years before that !

Why watch the majority, who are very average at best ? When , a couple of times a year I can see the best in the world in Motogp. Gaz.

[Badjelly]

I might be in the target group for this question, because I never used to go to local NZ races, but I went to one last year and plan to do so again.

Why did I start going? Well, I've become a fan of MotoGP and World SBK on TV in the last few years. In 2005 my wife I went to MotoGP at Philip Island and had a fantastic time. (We'll go again some time, but it's too big an expedition to go every year.) Last year we went to A1GP at Taupo; we found the actual A1GP races a yawn but we enjoyed the local classes, so we thought, "Why not go to local racing?" and "Why not motorbike racing, as 2 wheels are better than 4"? So we went to Manfield in February last year and plan to go there this year. Probably nowhere else though, as it's too far.

Hmm, what is it that would make me more likely to go and what would make me less likely to go? I'm not sure really. The thing is, most of the things that would make me more likely to go cost money, and there just doesn't seem to be much money in NZ bike racing.

Better TV coverage would make it easier for me to follow the series.

You can't really complain about the distance to the track, can you? I mean a track closer to Wellington would be nice, but it's not going to happen.

Manfeild is rather ... shabby. That's a minor put-off factor.

Having World SBK back at Manfeild would be great, but it's that money thing again, isn't it?

The racing is good. It's nice to have a mix of elite and all-comers' classes.

I'll think about it.

[Badjelly]

I'll think about it.

Oh yeah, improve the WWW sites. The Motorcycling NZ and NZSBK WWW sites are poor, especially the latter. (I'll be happy to explain why if anyone's interested.) It's much harder to find out what's on & where than it should be.

[gav]

Because you get one or two or maybe even three guys at the front and the rest a mile off . That doesn't interest me.

Wanganui two years ago and I could see the fall off in interesting classes , depth of talent and racing. (but thats been happening for years) Remember I started in 1970 and I saw the boom years and I watched for years before that !

Why watch the majority, who are very average at best ? When , a couple of times a year I can see the best in the world in Motogp. Gaz.
Well, a round of the Nationals is never going to compete with an overseas round of MotoGP, I guess. :love:
But, the superbike racing for the last couple of years has been very entertaining. The inclusion of the Aussies have really helped. Levels had a 4 bike freight train with them finishing less than a second apart after 15 laps :yes:. Good stuff and well worth a look, especially if you havent been for a few years!

[Jorja]

Decent food and shade would be good once I was there.To get me there I would need to know it was happening. Some means of entertaining the kids would be good too

[roogazza]

I must admit , I did see motocross advertised last night on TV , but can't remember if it was Sky or not ?
Anyway its on at Woodville this weekend !
Lets hope the Manfeild Round of National Road Racing gets the same treatment ! ? ? Gaz.

[codgyoleracer]

I must admit , I did see motocross advertised last night on TV , but can't remember if it was Sky or not ?
Anyway its on at Woodville this weekend !
Lets hope the Manfeild Round of National Road Racing gets the same treatment ! ? ? Gaz.

I can confirm that the superbike racing (particularily at Levels) was pretty impressive , so why not drag your old bones to Manfield & wave the kiwi contingent on - the lap record will fall (again).

[dhunt]

I'm just curious what it is costing to get in this year to watch?

The only reason I actually know that the Nationals are on is because of KB & Vic Club. I haven't seen any advertising anywhere for it. Where as for the A1GP it would have been just about impossible not to know it was on. My thoughts anyway.

[FROSTY]

this is still a relivant question .

[enigma51]

this is still a relivant question .

more naked ladies



and that is still a relevant answer :innocent:

[slowpoke]

more naked ladies



Why is it that the only "ladies" wanting to get their kit off are the very ones you wish would keep it on? As you were...........

[Tony.OK]

more naked ladies



and that is still a relevant answer :innocent:

Don't even have to be naked...............:devil2:

[scrivy]

The above animation looks like Mrs Dixon running down pit lane yesterday......:cool::2thumbsup

[CookMySock]

From the perspective of the businesses in the area - basically you are removing their parking for the day, so they have to rethink and target a new crowd, or face a days trading down the toilet. It's easy for a cafe to make money - they just do what whey normally do, but for a gift shop, they have to make a new plan, quick.

Be aware, that at a track or any closed venue, the organisers will often place very heavy restrictions or expenses on mobile traders, which basically fucks it totally for them and they just won't bother.

At a track, I don't think they really care about who comes and who does not, because if they did then "people" would be their core business instead of the "track." It seems to me "people" are not their main revenue stream, but I have no idea. Maybe they should restructure the track so people get a good time.

Steve

[svr]

Having seen a fair bit of racing around the world I still think NZ roadracing offers spectators pretty good value.
Wanganui for e.g. is a great spectacle because you are close to the action, not 100m away. Clean out the drunken, fighting bogans so the families can come back.
Last year I saw a motoGP, a world SBK race and the Isle of Man races, and watching Shirriffs through the esses still ranks as a memorable highlight.
Also, over the years spectator numbers in NZ have been related to rider numbers. The general public will go to watch if people they know are racing. With full grids at the nationals there have been full stands.
My 2 cents.

[roogazza]

I can confirm that the superbike racing (particularily at Levels) was pretty impressive , so why not drag your old bones to Manfield & wave the kiwi contingent on - the lap record will fall (again).

I've been popping along to the last couple of VMCC rounds to have a look Glen, but the weather has been against it a bit.
Hopefully the points rounds at Xmas will change my mind ?

But now that I've retired job wise I'll be seeing more than the usual two Motogp rounds per year thats for sure. Gaz.

[wharfy]

I go to Paeroa and Wanganui races on a regular basis, getting CLOSE is the main drawcard being able to feel the draft from a bike howling down the main street of Paeroa is something you cant get anywhere else. These events have been going for so long they have taken on a life of there own and lots of people not normally interested in bikes or racing attend.
Plus open pits, being able to wander around and talk to riders and pit crew is way cool.
I dont mind paying. I don't care about the sideshow shit either. Overseas riders helps as well.
ADVERTISE the events even bikers have to go looking for info about the Nationals.

[Benk]

Sorry if this has been covered (havnt been bothered to read through all pages) but I would definitely go and watch more racing if it was on the weekends, be it club level, nationals etc.

More publicity would be the other. If your not a member of kiwibiker (or in the racing scene [or mates are etc]) there doesnt seem to be much mention of it anywhere. A show on TV dedicated to motorbike racing would be the one, something like onthegastv on youtube, but on real telly.

The other thing would be a (fantastic) race track in Tauranga, but that is pie in the sky talk, tauranga cant get its shit together with much it seems :oi-grr:

[FROSTY]

draggin this back to life because i believe its very relivant.

[BMWST?]

I dont know about other people but i have to be interested in the actual action.....i will go to a bike race,but i wont pay to go to a car race.I will go to an air show cos i like the old piston aircaraft with the occasional high per jet...And there is a good example,the Masterton Air show.Lots of stalls,lots of eateries,lots of porta loos,lots of displays,different commentaters.Not much in the way of facilities if you werent a gold stand member.
Entry has to be cheap and a couple of give aways would be good...hat,sun screen,program a must.Meeting must also run quickly with something going on all the time.No or minimal (lunch) breaks
Manfeild is a good venue cos you can see the whole track.The PA has to be good.There has to be balance so that stall holders etc will come.Publicity is the hard thing.I was a member of the VIC club when we had the shell two wheelers.Our crowds wwere always poor,no matter how we advertised.Radio in the manawatu,radio in Wellington,papers etc...it never seemed to work and we always lost lots of money.You have to have money to front these up front costs,and i would think that most bike clubs just dont...
Manfeild used to get 10000 peple at the six hour!The stands were packed from the hairpin to the end of the pit wall.

[FROSTY]

Water is DEFINITELY well and truely under the bridge on this one but I started this thread NOT in racing but in GBR
The reason being we (i still think of my self as one) the racers need to be asking the general biker what will attract them to a race meeting.

[Paul in NZ]

Water is DEFINITELY well and truely under the bridge on this one but I started this thread NOT in racing but in GBR
The reason being we (i still think of my self as one) the racers need to be asking the general biker what will attract them to a race meeting.

Sorry but I think you are wasting your time Tony..

No one is coming to watch just motorcycle racing, its confusing, irrelevant and there are no decent tracks near the cities that matter. If you put your mind to it I expect you could arrange to have 450 different classes of bike in 12 different races spread amoungst 57 riders resulting in lotsa first places for all...

Fact is, more people turn up to a boy racers night out in chch or a teenagers text party so ya may as well just organise the races to suit yourselves and don't expect joe public to subsidise it unless you offer them something they want to see. They are spoilt for choice and are not going to waste a day and a tank full of gas unless it's special.

[Kickaha]

They are spoilt for choice and are not going to waste a day and a tank full of gas unless it's special.

Which is why the street races are so popular

[naphazoline]

YEAH.............Street races have something special about them,and could be wider spread through the country,without having to construct additional,purpose built race tracks.:headbang:

[FROSTY]

Paul --Im hearing you loud n clear mate. But I can;t give up hope that you are wrong.


Actually about 20 years ago an aquaintence of me and MVrider came up with a fantastic plan.
It was when the Albany industrial area was just lines on paper and for those too young to remember the Motorway ended at albany.
The idea was to work with the town planners to build an industrial area specifically able to be made into a racetrack.
4 weekends a year it would be closed off for either car or bike racing.

[naphazoline]

The idea was to work with the town planners to build an industrial area specifically able to be made into a racetrack.
4 weekends a year it would be closed off for either car or bike racing.

That sounds cool.

What happened?

[R1madness]

lack of support form user groups. Lack of support from the industry. Lack of interest from the councillors. Usual story Kiwis are just too lasy to do things that will benafit anyone other than themselves directly.......

[svr]

Most of the spectators are friends and family of the racers - they are there to watch people they know race (and hopefully they bring lunch...)

[Kwaka14]

ADVERTISING

The street races always get some free advertising, partly because of road closures, partly because it´s an unusual thing.... If I knew when there was something happening early enough then I´d be there more often (I know I can look it up here or other places, but the G.P. doesn´t).

[Brian d marge]

Having seen a fair bit of racing around the world I still think NZ roadracing offers spectators pretty good value.
Wanganui for e.g. is a great spectacle because you are close to the action, not 100m away. Clean out the drunken, fighting bogans so the families can come back.
Last year I saw a motoGP, a world SBK race and the Isle of Man races, and watching Shirriffs through the esses still ranks as a memorable highlight.
Also, over the years spectator numbers in NZ have been related to rider numbers. The general public will go to watch if people they know are racing. With full grids at the nationals there have been full stands.
My 2 cents.

+1 on this , Im off to Motogp next week shall be looking at the customer experience .... we have talked about this at length , The races I have been to in NZ are an exercise in endurance , , ( Except Paeroa /wanganui ... because I can do other things) , My wife isnt interested in racing , but the kids enjoy it , so what is she going to do at Ruapuna , on a grey sunday afternoon ,,,,,,, I know she can buy a hotdog ,,, with was I have been told is tomato sauce on it ......... whoopie ....

At least at P Island ther are clothing/ trade stalls , a market ( she LOVES markets ) and restraunts , ( I know ) ...but
When I go to the new season bike launches , there is an outlet mall nearby ,,,,with the chance of a bargain , she is off like a flash , leaving me to enjoy ,,,bikes ( and the brolly dollys )

its the enterainment for the whole family , not just blokes going around in circles on noisy bikes .

Stephen

[Kiwi Graham]

+1 on this , Im off to Motogp next week shall be looking at the customer experience .... we have talked about this at length , The races I have been to in NZ are an exercise in endurance , , ( Except Paeroa /wanganui ... because I can do other things) , My wife isnt interested in racing , but the kids enjoy it , so what is she going to do at Ruapuna , on a grey sunday afternoon ,,,,,,, I know she can buy a hotdog ,,, with was I have been told is tomato sauce on it ......... whoopie ....

At least at P Island ther are clothing/ trade stalls , a market ( she LOVES markets ) and restraunts , ( I know ) ...but
When I go to the new season bike launches , there is an outlet mall nearby ,,,,with the chance of a bargain , she is off like a flash , leaving me to enjoy ,,,bikes ( and the brolly dollys )

its the enterainment for the whole family , not just blokes going around in circles on noisy bikes .

Stephen

+2
Trade/manufacturer stands
Tin pan ally
Decent food outlets that sell something other than 'orange fried food'
Bike clubs providing secure parking, gear drop off etc.
Organised entertainment for kiddies.

All this isnt going to happen without the profile being raised, sponsorship and buy in from the trades etc
TV coverage would help but we need a product that sells, look at the success Poreroa has for instance.
We need to invest in our sport to make it appealing, who knows with the profile Hampton Downs will have we could make a start there.

Just some thoughts.

[R1madness]

Its a funny old world. I have asked about having a trade display at the racing for years but have been consistantly told by the orginisers that " noone is interested, they only want to watch the racing". And then they want a commission on my sales or a fee for having the display...... odd.
I could probibly orginise the Major shops and importers in CHCH to support with trade displays as well ( at least here in the south island) but after 20 years of being knocked back i have lost interest in asking the orginising bodys.

[Clivoris]

Its a funny old world. I have asked about having a trade display at the racing for years but have been consistantly told by the orginisers that " noone is interested, they only want to watch the racing". And then they want a commission on my sales or a fee for having the display...... odd.
I could probibly orginise the Major shops and importers in CHCH to support with trade displays as well ( at least here in the south island) but after 20 years of being knocked back i have lost interest in asking the orginising bodys.

The VMCC are happy to have any trade displays at the Actrix Winter Series and always have been. No charge at all. Interest has been light, but it probably makes sense given the effort required against the return.

[wharfy]

The VMCC are happy to have any trade displays at the Actrix Winter Series and always have been. No charge at all. Interest has been light, but it probably makes sense given the effort required against the return.

The Sound Of Thunder at Ruapuna had vendor stalls, one of the biggest was Street and Sport, I guess anyone interested could ask them if it was worth their while. At the Street races there are always a few vendors.

[Big Dog]

Atmosphere. There is none at the AMCC events.
Promotion. In three years of attending AMCC events I have yet to see or hear one advertisement, or meet anyone who does not race or marshall who knows whene the events are.

I attended the classic festival this year, attendance was bigger than at the nationals. I wonder why. It ws promoted and is a fun event for the whole family. The atmosphere was amazing.

[FROSTY]

somewhere in here theres a solution or two.

Myself Ive been thinking that one big boost to summer racing here would be to alighn our premier classes with the Auzzies. So same bike rules ,same race rules. Jumping the ditch then would be a lot easier in both directions.
Good practice for the auzzies before their season kicks off for real

[CHOPPA]

Id go watch racing if it was combined racing with the national V8 series and if we only watched the fast classes like 600s and 1000s.

[Kickaha]

Myself Ive been thinking that one big boost to summer racing here would be to alighn our premier classes with the Auzzies. So same bike rules ,same race rules. Jumping the ditch then would be a lot easier in both directions.
Good practice for the auzzies before their season kicks off for real

Just because the rules would be aligned doesn't mean they would come


Id go watch racing if it was combined racing with the national V8 series and if we only watched the fast classes like 600s and 1000s.

MNZ did that several years ago, end result FAIL

[slowpoke]

Id go watch racing if it was combined racing with the national V8 series and if we only watched the fast classes like 600s and 1000s.

Yep, there'd have to be some flow on effects for the stand alone bike racing as a result. The Lady Wigram event was an awesome experience, with a great atmosphere throughout the pits, even if the bikes were the poor cousins. Had lotsa car folks wandering around the bikes, asking questions and generally very interested.

[R1madness]

Id go watch racing if it was combined racing with the national V8 series and if we only watched the fast classes like 600s and 1000s.

MNZ did that several years ago, end result FAIL

Actually the combined bike car meeting was hugely sucessfull. We got lots of good publicity from it. The car guys wanted us to race with them in the future, all the spectators loved it. There was even talk of making it a regular event. But several the bike guys all did a big moan about the rubber on the track ... oil spills... having to wait their turn... infact anything anyone could winge about the riders did. Also for some reason MNZ would not support it... probibly something to do with them not having total control of the meeting...
Some of the riders looked at setting up a series to run in conjunction with the National V8 series but no support from MNZ and too much appathy from the riders ment it never went ahead. Shame really.

[FROSTY]

Actually the combined bike car meeting was hugely sucessfull. We got lots of good publicity from it. The car guys wanted us to race with them in the future, all the spectators loved it. There was even talk of making it a regular event. But several the bike guys all did a big moan about the rubber on the track ... oil spills... having to wait their turn... infact anything anyone could winge about the riders did. Also for some reason MNZ would not support it... probibly something to do with them not having total control of the meeting...
Some of the riders looked at setting up a series to run in conjunction with the National V8 series but no support from MNZ and too much appathy from the riders ment it never went ahead. Shame really.
Dragging this back up to see what would happen if that was to happen today

[quickbuck]

Well these days it appears car guys don't even want to race at the same meeting as other car guys!
Getting bikes to either one... well, actually we have full enough meetings as it is.

What would bring ME to a meeting (of any type)?
If it has a fossal fuel driven engine, and I have the time, I am generally there....
Be it bike/ car/ boat/ aircraft/ moped.....

[Deano]

Id go watch racing if it was combined racing with the national V8 series and if we only watched the fast classes like 600s and 1000s.

I'm pretty sure the top of Pro Twins/Superlite are faster than some of the Supersport racers. :lol:

[RobGassit]

I'm pretty sure the top of Pro Twins/Superlite are faster than some of the Supersport racers. :lol:

Actually if you go any faster Deano, Billy might make you run in Supersport anyway.
:killingme

[Deano]

Actually if you go any faster Deano, Billy might make you run in Supersport anyway.
:killingme

Hell no ! I tried it once and the speed differential down the main straight at Taupo was fucking horrendous - I damn near shat myself when they blasted past.

[RDjase]

What would bring YOU to watch a race meeting?

A track where you can watch the racing , NOT like HD

Taupo, Manfeild, Ruapuna, Levels, in order of veiwing.

Teretonga is ok.........ish if you stand of the roof of your van in the pits, can't hear the commentry with the rubbish PA and the wind just about blows away the veiw

cant comment on Puke, havnt been there

[Kickaha]

Teretonga is ok.........ish if you stand of the roof of your van in the pits
Rooof of the toilet block was always the prime viewing area

[Deano]

Rooof of the toilet block was always the prime viewing area

Its great you can park up close to the track in your car, for when its hailing/blowing a gale LOL

[Madness]

A track where you can watch the racing , NOT like HD

What he said and naked chicks, of course.

[Deano]

A track where you can watch the racing , NOT like HD



Its ok from the apartments...if you can afford the view.

[jellywrestler]

A track where you can watch the racing , NOT like HD

i kinda like HD as you can watch a race but when they dissappear you can quickly go and look at another part of the race then back, be fucked when they build the corparate suites on the pit sheds though

[ellipsis]

...<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/EM_p1Az05Jo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>...

...racing with cars dont work...full fucking stop...

[SWERVE]

HD is no differnt to most (if not all) big circuits overseas. where as you have to move around to view from various points. Although a grandstand on in side of T1 woul;d be good as wouls anothe between at T4 and up the rise. need to be high so looking down on action.
We are spoilt having race track such as taupo/Manfield/puna where you can see almost all the circuit.
At least at HD you dont miss 2 race getting from one vantage point to another like some tracks in Europe.

[slowpoke]

...racing with cars dont work...full fucking stop...

Thanks for the in depth explanation, that's filled in all the blanks.

[ellipsis]

Thanks for the in depth explanation, that's filled in all the blanks.

... been there, no difference between speedway or asphalt...different crowds with different mindsets...different dollars ...have tried to work with car type people in events, never been treated as anything other than entry money and a piss or hotdog break...cant see it ever changing...does us no good in the end...

...we all seem to have a beef about a liter or two of haemorrhage from a chair or a classic on the race line...check out the obstacles that a rider would have to contend with after a 10 or 15 lap car race...we can do better than that...

[CHOPPA]

Works a treat in ozzy, they have been running with V8s for a few years now. Motorcycle racers dont do much for themselves as far as image is concerned. Everyone knocks old Biggles but if everybody tried to look a tad professional maybe the public would see motorcycle racers in a different light. I watched the coverage from the cemetery circuit, cant imagine any business man looking at the interviews and thinking wow those guys are well presented id like to get my logos on there shirts lol

My family is heavily involved in high end car racing and they are all their friends are surprised how good it is to watch the bikes racing and would love to see them at the racing events. Only the proper ones though that go fast

[Kickaha]

Only the proper ones though that go fast
So only the GSXR1000s then?

[Hugo Nougo]

Speed = excitement ?, Taupo has hosted a drifting / truck racing / motard and people used the motard as an opportunity to check out the pits, it's what floats your boat and you're never going to see more than "an average number" at any event, if that average have money then events are more successful. As a young fella keen to be part of an event (golden handlebars at manfield) camping onsite to cut down expense helped, as did less redtape (cheers Mr Gibbs).

[jellywrestler]

My family is heavily involved in high end car racing and they are all their friends are surprised how good it is to watch the bikes racing and would love to see them at the racing events. Only the proper ones though that go fast
Seems to me they're there to be fashionable rather than because they're actually interested in racing as such
rac·ing
/ˈrāsiNG/
Noun
Any sport that involves competing in races.


in any sport there can't be a first place unless someone is there to get last, and there's various levels of equipment and abilities no matter what the game that's a simple fact and it's poor sportsmanlike attitudes like this that means a lot of 'sports' we have now are in fact businesses first and a sport secondary.
Kiwis need to learn that when two teams walk onto a feild that most of the time one will win and one will come second.

How many out there remember Dave Hiscock's famous quote about there being ' too many bunnies out there' and the backlash that got?

[DEATH_INC.]

Id go watch racing if it was combined racing with the national V8 series and if we only watched the fast classes like 600s and 1000s.

This is definitely a big part of it.
If you aren't a racer a bunch of 250's battling for the lead at 150kph is way less exciting than watching Chop and co playing follow the leader at 250.
Look at where the big motorsport crowds are internationally, F1, Indy, Nascar, Moto gp and WSB, etc.
A lot of the time these are pretty shit racing (Moto gp can be a real yawnfest at times) but they are fast, and loud.
How many People do you think Nascar would get if they raced corollas?

Forget trying to get crowds here, and just get the classes/racing right for the riders.

[crazy man]

if car racing and bike racing were together l never go to it unless l was racing ( cars are boring )

[Billy]

How many out there remember Dave Hiscock's famous quote about there being ' too many bunnies out there' and the backlash that got?

Yip,I do,It was a heat of the moment thing after he got held up badly through the infeild at Manfeild on his TZ350 by a guy on an H1 Kawasaki,Got blown out of proportion really,Who would have thought that could happen in roadracing ?

Racing with the cars for National points is not going to happen,Its been tried numerous times before and just doesn't work,If however the Superbike and 600 guys want to run with the cars as a demonstration,Thats fine,But be prepared to be treated like animals.

[jellywrestler]

But be prepared to be treated like animals. The last car bike meeting I went to had a truck raced right before the bikes, it was spitting and a truck came over the hill at pukekohe and started a burnout which turned into two or three rolling donuts over maybe a couple of hundred meters, looked pretty fucking cool with lots of shit flying off the tyres etc as the rain came in.
bikes went out straight after simply fucking lethal

[RobGassit]

Let's face it, the public want it delivered to their door and in their faces with close access. Street Racing always delivers. Apart from the obvious safety issues, getting off the circuits more often like Methven, Greymouth, Nelson etc still has huge potential for bringing our sport to the people. Look at F1 in Melbourne and the V8's at Adelaide for an example that it can be done safely,,,and yes I know it costs a bloody fortune to set up. Deliver it like Pizza,,and they will eat it up!!

[shoutout]

Speed = excitement ?, Taupo has hosted a drifting / truck racing / motard and people used the motard as an opportunity to check out the pits, it's what floats your boat and you're never going to see more than "an average number" at any event, if that average have money then events are more successful. As a young fella keen to be part of an event (golden handlebars at manfield) camping onsite to cut down expense helped, as did less redtape (cheers Mr Gibbs).

Shoutout Events has been invited to showcase Supermoto racing at there combined Truck/Drift racing, we feel very lucky that the Canterbury car Club has been so supportive of our style of motorsport, we have made a 466 m dirty/clay section which includes jumps, berms and table top, just low one's so a young boy or girl can just roll over them or a rider can double them. We are looking forward to putting on a show to there spectators and grow our rider base and spectators. All this action will be on the "A" track at Powerbuilt Raceway Ruapuna Park

Check out more info on shoutout events on Face Book

[vinducati]

I would like to see F1 and F2 racing at car events.
Possibly within the Supertourer series.
I love bike racing but really it is a minority sport in NZ.

If the top riders can get in front of bigger crowds and that would be great.
Only if the safety is not compromised.
I also enjoy car racing.
Have only had encouraging words from car drivers at combined trackdays.

Also having been to a lot of tracks around the world, I really like HD both as a rider and a spectator.
I view from turn 1, Turn2 and 3. Turn 4, and 5.
Great views, beats the hell out of Pukekohe.


I would rather see fewer classes at the Nationals.
Rather have more races for the 600 and SBK's.

Just my opinion as a rider and fan.

[ellipsis]

... scratch, scratch...broken record...car crowds couldn't give a fuck about motorcycles at 'their' meetings...car clubs dont give a fuck about motorcycles or their welfare...it all sounds like plaintiff cries from those who dont really grasp how much a minority sport we are...sounds good on paper...reality is totally different...pulling our sport into line and building on what we have is all we have as an option...and what do we have...?...a bunch of disparate ideas...moaning, whingeing...people who put a lot of time and effort into what they love , to have their hard work dismantled, dismembered by the next bunch of know alls that reckon they know better...better to look up our own arseholes to see whats going on than to try peering up other unrelated arseholes seeking the truth...

[slowpoke]

... scratch, scratch...broken record...car crowds couldn't give a fuck about motorcycles at 'their' meetings...car clubs dont give a fuck about motorcycles or their welfare...it all sounds like plaintiff cries from those who dont really grasp how much a minority sport we are...sounds good on paper...reality is totally different...pulling our sport into line and building on what we have is all we have as an option...and what do we have...?...a bunch of disparate ideas...moaning, whingeing...people who put a lot of time and effort into what they love , to have their hard work dismantled, dismembered by the next bunch of know alls that reckon they know better...better to look up our own arseholes to see whats going on than to try peering up other unrelated arseholes seeking the truth...

Maybe...maybe not. Doing the Lady Wigram a coupla years ago there were plenty of Joe Public's wandering over for a look/chat, and everyone who stopped by was invariably impressed with the sheer speed of the bikes in comparison to the relatively slow cars. Talk about bikes making 200hp and they were just gobsmacked. Seeing the big bikes coming onto the front straight at Ruapuna wriggling and writhing, front wheel in the air, was a great demo for our sport. The crowd for the following weekend's Nat's was definitely very healthy, probably biggest I've seen for a bike meeting at a "proper' race track.

Times change. Who'd have thought 20 years ago that a few kids doing tricks on motocross bikes could fill some of the biggest and most famous stadiums in the world? 20 years ago who'd have thought you could make a living running track days? Extreme sports are only increasing in popularity, and for better or worse bike racing is seen is "extreme".

So I don't think it's fair to say we've tried it before and it doesn't work. We're a farkin' long way from old GSX1100's and CB900's running stock chrome exhausts and on skinny tyres wobbling around at Kingswood pace.

[DEATH_INC.]

We're a farkin' long way from old GSX1100's and CB900's running stock chrome exhausts and on skinny tyres wobbling around at Kingswood pace.
Yet, the crowds then were better than now........BUT there was no internet, multiple tv channels, playstation etc etc.
Lets just be honest, to a non motorcycle racing person, most bike racing is boring to watch.

[Billy]

Maybe...maybe not. Doing the Lady Wigram a coupla years ago there were plenty of Joe Public's wandering over for a look/chat, and everyone who stopped by was invariably impressed with the sheer speed of the bikes in comparison to the relatively slow cars. Talk about bikes making 200hp and they were just gobsmacked. Seeing the big bikes coming onto the front straight at Ruapuna wriggling and writhing, front wheel in the air, was a great demo for our sport. The crowd for the following weekend's Nat's was definitely very healthy, probably biggest I've seen for a bike meeting at a "proper' race track.

Times change. Who'd have thought 20 years ago that a few kids doing tricks on motocross bikes could fill some of the biggest and most famous stadiums in the world? 20 years ago who'd have thought you could make a living running track days? Extreme sports are only increasing in popularity, and for better or worse bike racing is seen is "extreme".

So I don't think it's fair to say we've tried it before and it doesn't work. We're a farkin' long way from old GSX1100's and CB900's running stock chrome exhausts and on skinny tyres wobbling around at Kingswood pace.

Correct,Last time we tried was 2004....Still didnt work,In fact if anything it was worse,McEwen,Bernard,Stroud,Charlett etc all on gixxer 1000s,Yip long way from CB900s

[yungatart]

First you have to know that there is a a race meeting on.
Full page colour advertising in the Sunday papers, some on the telly and radio...a bit too pricey for club events but surely a priority for NZSBK.
The man in the street can't pay money to watch racing if he doesn't know it is on.

[jellywrestler]

Full page colour advertising in the Sunday papers, some on the telly and radio...a bit too pricey for club events but surely a priority for NZSBK.
that's discriminating towards the colour blind, black and white would be fairer with braille for the visually spastic out there

[crazy man]

If they had KFC at the track l would goalways thinking of your stomach now you have given up racing

[tail_end_charlie]

that's discriminating towards the colour blind, black and white would be fairer with braille for the visually spastic out there

Don't forget about the 'Helen Keller's out there in the world. Newsprint, tv and radio advertising won't help them know that there is a race meeting to go and watch/listen to................................................ ........................................oh wait.

[CHOPPA]

Nothing to stop any of us that think its a good idea from getting out there and making it happen. Billy would know the ins and outs but do MNZ have any rules against it? Or would it have to be done privately?

[wharfy]

Yet, the crowds then were better than now........BUT there was no internet, multiple tv channels, playstation etc etc.
Lets just be honest, to a non motorcycle racing person, most bike racing is boring to watch.

Umm.. yeah, sad but true - I've had people compare it to watching paint dry when I told them it was on - But some people will go to watch someone else play golf, why ???

[jellywrestler]

Nothing to stop any of us that think its a good idea from getting out there and making it happen. Billy would know the ins and outs but do MNZ have any rules against it? Or would it have to be done privately?

as the Sidecar folk, they do it from time to time

[suzuki21]

I am going to be really radical and say the general public only go to street meets so they can watch bikes and drink lots of alchohol. Wanganui and Paeroa dont have "kid friendly playgrounds" and "nice trade displays". And when someone says "oh look at that nice trade display representative" they mean "Ive been drinking all day fuck shes hot". Get over it people as soon as you want more people at a meeting there is a cost. Social or economic it dosnt matter. We are to small a country to have motogp dreams

[Kornholio]

We are to small a country to have motogp dreams

Is it something in the water ya reckon? :/

[sidecar bob]

Political correctness is in part killing racing as a spectator sport.
I understand that Uber Chum, the German with the Kawasaki streetfighter & massive dreads in Pre '89 was stripped of his Pareoa winning points for doing a one handed wheelie.
That is the type of thing the crowds come to see, but the racing is being cleansed back to dead boring.
Would Uber Chum have done that if he didnt believe he was safe doing it?
Back in the days of the "GSX1100 & CB900 going around at the pace of a Kingswood", nobody had any traction & bugger all brakes, wheelstands & slides were the only way to get one around a track & showmanship (not showing off) was encouraged.
Just another small nail in racings' coffin.

[roogazza]

Political correctness is in part killing racing as a spectator sport.
I understand that Uber Chum, the German with the Kawasaki streetfighter & massive dreads in Pre '89 was stripped of his Pareoa winning points for doing a one handed wheelie.
That is the type of thing the crowds come to see, but the racing is being cleansed back to dead boring.
Would Uber Chum have done that if he didnt believe he was safe doing it?
Just another small nail in racings' coffin.

Agree with you SidecarB, As much as a few keep trying to pump it up I'm afraid the writing is on the wall. The two Street meetings left in the north are fading. It's a shame but time moves on. Luckily the Media didn't get hold of the death of poor old Lance L. I can see Paeroa being the next to go.

Also, I think someone put a post up to watch the NZGP for Superbikes at 3 pm yesterday. Well sorry but less than 10 bikes, no crowds and no atmosphere does nothing for bike racing.
I'm a big bike fan and have been for many years. That was just average and does nothing to keep bikes afloat.
Apart from the weather I struggle to see the difference to a Vic club day in winter.

[sidecar bob]

The fire went out of the racers bellies when we "agreed" to exchange prize money for TV coverage.
Theres nothing like a bit of money on offer to encourage a risky & spectacular overtaking move.
Few people, like Craig Shirrifs still perform well in the absence of prize money, but many dont, regardless of weather they are aware of it or not.
As a result, its a procession, & the hero parade is clearly a way more fun procession to watch, if spectator numbers are anything to go by.

[The Chow]

Political correctness is in part killing racing as a spectator sport.
I understand that Uber Chum, the German with the Kawasaki streetfighter & massive dreads in Pre '89 was stripped of his Pareoa winning points for doing a one handed wheelie.
That is the type of thing the crowds come to see, but the racing is being cleansed back to dead boring.
Would Uber Chum have done that if he didnt believe he was safe doing it?
Back in the days of the "GSX1100 & CB900 going around at the pace of a Kingswood", nobody had any traction & bugger all brakes, wheelstands & slides were the only way to get one around a track & showmanship (not showing off) was encouraged.
Just another small nail in racings' coffin.

Totally agree with you Bob about the lack of showmanship allowed. I was one trying to keep the show going over the last few year, but have given up on that now(time for new people I guess) , I've joined the silly old bastards ranks and look back at the Good Old days , and be thankful we lived our youth in less political correct days , not just in racing , but in all activities.

I love all sorts of motorcycle racing , but yes I have to admit the enjoyment factor has decreased as has the spectacle (only my opinion). Thank god for the internet , watched the FX-Superbikes from Aussie yesterday and while there was no one in the stands , the coverage was excellent.

[roogazza]

The fire went out of the racers bellies when we "agreed" to exchange prize money for TV coverage.


Yeah , what happened with that ? Nothing like a few bucks on the line, but besides that, the money kept me racing when on a budget with young family.Like $120 for a win, when a tyre was about $50 mates rates.
Do they get prize money nowdays ?? Like at points races ?

[slowpoke]

Political correctness is in part killing racing as a spectator sport.
I understand that Uber Chum, the German with the Kawasaki streetfighter & massive dreads in Pre '89 was stripped of his Pareoa winning points for doing a one handed wheelie.
That is the type of thing the crowds come to see, but the racing is being cleansed back to dead boring.
Would Uber Chum have done that if he didnt believe he was safe doing it?
Back in the days of the "GSX1100 & CB900 going around at the pace of a Kingswood", nobody had any traction & bugger all brakes, wheelstands & slides were the only way to get one around a track & showmanship (not showing off) was encouraged.
Just another small nail in racings' coffin.

Yeah, agreed mate. The lady Wigram event I attended a few years back was a refreshing change: we were actually encouraged to light it up and stick it on one wheel after the race, after all we were there to "put on a show" as much as race. There were more than a few smiles at the riders breifing when that was said. From memory Mark Butcher gave Andrew Stroud a good run for his money in the burnout stakes, lol.

Sorry, I meant no disrespect towards the old GSX1100/CB900 proddy bikes and have HUGE respect for the pilots, I only meant that cars goin' round back in the day don't look much different to what's circulating these days, whereas bikes in comparison are a helluva lot faster, angrier etc.

I dunno, I don't think anyone expects our sport to be transformed overnight, but it would be sad if everyone just gave up and accepted this is our lot. I don't know if car/bike meetings would work but what's the harm in trying? If someone like Choppa wants to run with it I don't see why we'd want to discourage him. If it falls flat what have we lost? In the meantime others can be working on incremental changes that add up over time (look how the Tri-Series has evolved in just a few years) and also make a difference. It doesn't have to be a one or t'other situation does it?

[sidecar bob]

Yeah , what happened with that ?

There will be a few people covering their faces, saying, oh fuck, dont start bob on that one.
I know exactly what happened & why, but its been covered elswhere, & the damage is done to the sport.

[Billy]

Yeah, agreed mate. The lady Wigram event I attended a few years back was a refreshing change: we were actually encouraged to light it up and stick it on one wheel after the race, after all we were there to "put on a show" as much as race. There were more than a few smiles at the riders breifing when that was said. From memory Mark Butcher gave Andrew Stroud a good run for his money in the burnout stakes, lol.

Sorry, I meant no disrespect towards the old GSX1100/CB900 proddy bikes and have HUGE respect for the pilots, I only meant that cars goin' round back in the day don't look much different to what's circulating these days, whereas bikes in comparison are a helluva lot faster, angrier etc.

I dunno, I don't think anyone expects our sport to be transformed overnight, but it would be sad if everyone just gave up and accepted this is our lot. I don't know if car/bike meetings would work but what's the harm in trying? If someone like Choppa wants to run with it I don't see why we'd want to discourage him. If it falls flat what have we lost? In the meantime others can be working on incremental changes that add up over time (look how the Tri-Series has evolved in just a few years) and also make a difference. It doesn't have to be a one or t'other situation does it?

Nobody will be discouraged by me as roadrace commissioner,As long as they understand it won't be for National points,By all means if the 600 and Supers guys want to go play with the cars,Theyre more than welcome,As long as they do it properly

[Billy]

There will be a few people covering their faces, saying, oh fuck, dont start bob on that one.
I know exactly what happened & why, but its been covered elswhere, & the damage is done to the sport.

By all means Bob,Lets talk about it,The prizemoney was used for television advertising and gave the board more leverage when requesting coverage,As time has gone by,The major channels have lost interest and when I took over and saw the costs involved,I decided we were throwing good money down the road,For not much return so decided to invest some of that money in Ctas and Ian Dawsons NZSBK site as I saw the internet and livetiming as the future and leave some with the clubs to organise some better local advertising,

To be honest,For prizemoney to be offered again,Entry fees would have to increase to pay for it,The reason being,In the time since the prizemoney was taken away,Costs such as track hire etc have risen significantly and entry fees have stayed reasonably low.

[ducatilover]

Obviously a bit late to answer this, but might as well.

I go to watch races because... it's racing. I don't care what classes are running, I just love watching people getting out there (seeing as I cannot afford to join). I like chatting to people in the pits, always learn something neat.
It's the same reason I'm a rally crew member, it's just awesome.
I often go alone because most of my mates aren't bike obsessed, so they get bored

[sidecar bob]

By all means Bob,Lets talk about it,The prizemoney was used for television advertising and gave the board more leverage when requesting coverage,As time has gone by,The major channels have lost interest and when I took over and saw the costs involved,I decided we were throwing good money down the road,For not much return so decided to invest some of that money in Ctas and Ian Dawsons NZSBK site as I saw the internet and livetiming as the future and leave some with the clubs to organise some better local advertising,

To be honest,For prizemoney to be offered again,Entry fees would have to increase to pay for it,The reason being,In the time since the prizemoney was taken away,Costs such as track hire etc have risen significantly and entry fees have stayed reasonably low.

So basically it went exactly as predicted. We took it up the arse for the TV company & they lost interest.
It didnt help that a person of power in the decision also held an interest in the TV company.
Its all aincent history now though & we are now left with what remains.
I wasnt a huge fan of keeping prize money for the sake of my wallett, but in fear of what has now happened.
Entry fees would only need to be increased because the gate take from spectators is virtually nil, due too the poor state of the "show" & people have so many other options for their entertainment dollar.
If entry fees go up, that will wipe out a proportion of competitors, & only make matters even worse. I know several that are feeling completely shafted by the costs of the next two national rounds, garages etc, & even if costs stay as they are, these people have already made other plans for their national money for next year, which dosent include bike racing at all. (Bear in mind you can get 5 nights for two on a tropical island for less than one national round)
I feel your decision to run with Ctas, etc has been bloody brilliant & a huge step in the right direction, however, with all respect to Ctas, I wonder how many people stay home now & log on to whats happening instead of actually turning up & paying, or if those "spectators would not actually go to the meeting anyway.

[gripper]

lose the sidechair thingies imo

[Billy]

So basically it went exactly as predicted. We took it up the arse for the TV company & they lost interest.
It didnt help that a person of power in the decision also held an interest in the TV company.
Its all aincent history now though & we are now left with what remains.
I wasnt a huge fan of keeping prize money for the sake of my wallett, but in fear of what has now happened.
Entry fees would only need to be increased because the gate take from spectators is virtually nil, due too the poor state of the "show" & people have so many other options for their entertainment dollar.
If entry fees go up, that will wipe out a proportion of competitors, & only make matters even worse. I know several that are feeling completely shafted by the costs of the next two national rounds, garages etc, & even if costs stay as they are, these people have already made other plans for their national money for next year, which dosent include bike racing at all. (Bear in mind you can get 5 nights for two on a tropical island for less than one national round)
I feel your decision to run with Ctas, etc has been bloody brilliant & a huge step in the right direction, however, with all respect to Ctas, I wonder how many people stay home now & log on to whats happening instead of actually turning up & paying, or if those "spectators would not actually go to the meeting anyway.

Not quite correct but close,The production company haven't turned their backs,Its the networks as they feel they get a better audience with other sports(Probably Golf and Croquet),TV 3 was a last minute thing rhis year and was organised by Paul Stewart.

Re Ctas and the spectators;

Yes I wondered the same thing when I fist came up with the idea,But it can also have the reverse effect in as,If you were watching the ChCh round at home in Timaru,It might enthuse those to go out to Levels the following weekend,Also MCI said it was the best year theyve had yet,I think all sports are suffering when it comes to getting people to their events and it doesn't help that most of ours are a good distance from the built up areas,People are naturally lazy and times have changed,Its much easier to get your jollies at home now on the internet(NO not just the porn sites) and we have to be able to change with the times,A classic example was mentioned in another thread last week re competitors getting their info from their local clubs at club nights,As opposed to visiting a member specific website for information or discussion of the important stuff,Yea....Its not 1970 anymore and people have got better things to do with their time than sit in a hall and have to listen to the minutes of the last meeting etc just to ask a couple of questions.

Another thing that I was warned a wee while ago would damage our sport is trackdays,As it has done overseas,For a couple of reasons,1/ Trackday companies do not have most of the costs involved in running a permitted event and they have a client base that doesn't spend every penny they earn on racing and can therefore afford to be at the track more regularly,This gives the track owners another client that they can use as a lever to raise track hire,2/ People who would have in the old days had a go at racing,Now just go and do trackdays,3/ No training or tutoring the rules or machine prep and maintenance required if they do decide to go racing,This includes the likes of CSS.

[sidecar bob]

lose the sidechair thingies imo

That would be a little more convincing if it came from an individual with a tad more than a year three education.

[Paul in NZ]

People are still interested in some things.

The Southwards open day last weekend was HUGE. People everywhere..... and they paid to get in....

Motorcycle racing might have to recognise that its not the main event anymore and build up a following by hanging onto the coat tails of something else. Look at the classic festival and burt munro - both offer more choices than just racing.

Find another event that needs an extra dimension and join with it.

[quickbuck]

Also, I think someone put a post up to watch the NZGP for Superbikes at 3 pm yesterday. Well sorry but less than 10 bikes, no crowds and no atmosphere does nothing for bike racing.

.
On that... I think there were more than 10 people in the crowd. In 2010 there was over 20000 ar Ruapuna.....
I think the TV Coverage ripped us off though. I mean on-board shots are really cool, but there were far too many! No offence to Choppa, Robbie, and co who carried the cameras...
The races were cut to peices, and to be brutally honest we got better coverage from CTAS and the steamed coverage on the day thanks to Grant Collingwood and his SINGLE camera!
Oh, and Spyda, you and Neil did a better job of the commentry than Phill too....

It is little wonder joe public don't take motorcycle racing seriously if one of our major TV Networks put up coverage like that....
Okay, I get that it is better than nothing... but come on! In this HD age we are better than that.

[Grumph]

Yeah, agreed mate. The lady Wigram event I attended a few years back was a refreshing change: we were actually encouraged to light it up and stick it on one wheel after the race, after all we were there to "put on a show" as much as race. There were more than a few smiles at the riders breifing when that was said. From memory Mark Butcher gave Andrew Stroud a good run for his money in the burnout stakes, lol.

Sorry, I meant no disrespect towards the old GSX1100/CB900 proddy bikes and have HUGE respect for the pilots, I only meant that cars goin' round back in the day don't look much different to what's circulating these days, whereas bikes in comparison are a helluva lot faster, angrier etc.



Only just seen this sorry...The last Lady wigram revival a few months back raised some questions. Yes we were told at briefing it's a demonstration not a serious race....then when the guy I was assisting who had been backing a big pre 82 into the hairpin ( and wheelieing out of there plus the dipper too ) lit it up at the hairpin post last race he got his hand smacked big time....at the car club's insistence !!

Do they or don't they want entertainment ? I've heard from several sources that the car club did a survey of spectators to work out what was popular - and at car bike meetings like this one, the bikes were VERY popular.

Sorry, Billy - this is a bit of a favorite rant of mine - the bloody fun's been taken out of racing....

[sidecar bob]

People are still interested in some things.

The Southwards open day last weekend was HUGE. People everywhere..... and they paid to get in....

Motorcycle racing might have to recognise that its not the main event anymore and build up a following by hanging onto the coat tails of something else. Look at the classic festival and burt munro - both offer more choices than just racing.

Find another event that needs an extra dimension and join with it.

Absolutely.
I was chatting yesterday with a pre '65 car racer that thought if car & bike racing was combined at some levels we would all benefit, & I fully agree.

[Paul in NZ]

Absolutely.
I was chatting yesterday with a pre '65 car racer that thought if car & bike racing was combined at some levels we would all benefit, & I fully agree.

Yup - or say the inter marque concours (cars), HOG rally, air show's etc.

OR stage something extra to bring people. Decent band, festival etc. Run an 60's / 70 / 80's (what ever) festival - music, dress up comp, cars, bikes. Hook up with one of the clubs - display and swap meet?

[DidJit]

For a long time I’ve thought these guys (http://www.d1nz.com/) are doing it right in terms of mixing up the right ingredients to put on a good local show. Well presented, well organised, well followed.

Even if you’re not into that scene (I'm not, but I respect what they’ve achieved), you can still appreciate they have a slick operation going and an avid following. Maybe a leaf or two could be taken out of their book (https://www.facebook.com/D1NZOFFICIAL)?

[Deano]

Yup - or say the inter marque concours (cars), HOG rally, air show's etc.

OR stage something extra to bring people. Decent band, festival etc. Run an 60's / 70 / 80's (what ever) festival - music, dress up comp, cars, bikes. Hook up with one of the clubs - display and swap meet?

Wet t-shirt competition!!

[Billy]

Only just seen this sorry...The last Lady wigram revival a few months back raised some questions. Yes we were told at briefing it's a demonstration not a serious race....then when the guy I was assisting who had been backing a big pre 82 into the hairpin ( and wheelieing out of there plus the dipper too ) lit it up at the hairpin post last race he got his hand smacked big time....at the car club's insistence !!

Do they or don't they want entertainment ? I've heard from several sources that the car club did a survey of spectators to work out what was popular - and at car bike meetings like this one, the bikes were VERY popular.

Sorry, Billy - this is a bit of a favorite rant of mine - the bloody fun's been taken out of racing....

Yerr,I didnt say it couldnt or wouldnt happen,Just that it won't be part of a National series,I fully agree that in some cases it can be an advantage,When I first started racing racing I never did a meeting at a closed circuit without cars being there as well.

[Paul in NZ]

Wet t-shirt competition!!

Mr Jelly wrestler would win that (according to his avatar) hands down...

[Stirts]

Wet t-shirt competition!!

Tighty Whiteys contest!!

[jellywrestler]

Political correctness is in part killing racing as a spectator sport.
I understand that Uber Chum, the German with the Kawasaki streetfighter & massive dreads in Pre '89 was stripped of his Pareoa winning points for doing a one handed wheelie.
while it's great to see and Patrick is a very capable showman what happens when every other rider whose ever tried a wheelie tries and lights up and it ends in a coroners court
Just another small nail in racings' coffin.

Ever been a witness in a Coroners Court, I have after a racing fatality, they show no mercy and they have the power to finish that coffin off with just one nail, they don't need lots of small ones.

[yungatart]

Ever been a witness in a Coroners Court, I have after a racing fatality, they show no mercy and they have the power to finish that coffin off with just one nail, they don't need lots of small ones.

My understanding (please correct me if I am wrong) is that wheelies do not break any rules

[jellywrestler]

Also, I think someone put a post up to watch the NZGP for Superbikes at 3 pm yesterday. Well sorry but less than 10 bikes, no crowds and no atmosphere does nothing for bike racing.
I'm a big bike fan and have been for many years. That was just average and does nothing to keep bikes afloat.
Apart from the weather I struggle to see the difference to a Vic club day in winter.

You've been negative towards the Nationals for some time, seems a mindset more than anything else to me.
There were 12 bikes on the grid for the first race at Ruapuna, check mylaps it'll tell you and that is a signifcant drop from last season where there were 19.
The economys taken a hit and with the rego rise a couple of years back we're lucky there's even a dozen. don't forget the other classes which are reasonably well subscribed and the racing in pretty well all the classes is anything but processional The crowds were as big as I've seen at Ruapuna, that's life it's not 1978 and the malboro series any more.
No Atmosphere, were you there? I was and there was a good vibe around the place, not the same as a street circuit but pretty damn good.

You've watched all levels of bike racing for long enough to know that one day there'll be a shit fight out there, the next it'll be a procession...