Where are all the 'different' bikes these days [Archive]

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martybabe

19th May 2009, 11:57

Where are all the different /unique/ innovative bikes these days. In a time when we perhaps have more bike choice than any generation before us, when you get down to the nitty gritty details they are much of a muchness aren't they?

The case 1: In a well known bike spot in Englandshire a woman said to me " ok, I'll be interested, what is it about this particular bike that is so good?" she waved her hand in the direction of the forty or so bikes parked up in a line. "Which one do you mean?" says I. "these, you've all bought the same bike, there must be something good about them" She genuinely thought she was looking at forty identical bikes just in different colours. To a biker it was obvious that there were umpteen different models/brands/capacities. She was a none biker for sure but doesn't she have a point, even the most anal of us, looking from a distance, wouldn't be able to tell one sports bike from another parked in a line.
Yes I know the K9 has 3 more horse power than the k2 or that the GSX is .5 of a second standing quarter faster than the R1 but aren't they pretty much the same thing?

2: Cruisers, just how many v twin american style cruisers are there in this world, look at Yamahas line up, 10 or so vtwin heavy, low slung, looky likeies, Suzuki the same. without a model designation, I couldn't tell them apart in a magazine much less on the road. Stick HD and the others in the equation and you've got, I dunno, maybe 100 bikes that are essentially the same.

History is littered with innovative bikes, most of them failures popularity and sales wise but I do miss them. Yamaha GTS 1000 Hub centre steering, Suzuki GT 750, 3 cylinder water cooled two stroke:msn-wink: The original Vmax, v4 with yummy Vboost, R5 rotary, all them troublesome turbos, cbx and Benelli six cylinder monsters and my particular favourite and very popular as I recall, the CX500 plastic maggot, an across the frame vtwin for the masses, sold millions then dropped like a stone. loads more that my shite memory won't recall.

If it doesn't make money from a business point of view, it ain't worth making, I accept that but it's a bloody shame, whilst it is almost impossible to buy a bad bike these days, I find it increasingly difficult to find a bike that I can lust after, that is a country mile different to all the others.

Top of my head produces the Triumph rocket, that's it, can you think of any more that aren't just a fraction faster or better looking than the hundreds of other similar bikes.

This ain't a rant, just a chat, has everything new in the bike world been done before, in ten years time are we still gonna be looking at a line up of brand new R1s and Gixxers. Anyone got a crystal ball? :msn-wink:

MisterD

19th May 2009, 12:04

...and there in a nutshell is one of the biggest reasons I have for loving my Lammy. There's not another one exactly like it in the country...

MSTRS

19th May 2009, 12:12

The only truly innovative bike in the last 20 years would be the Britten. Somebody holds the patent rights and is not using them...

martybabe

19th May 2009, 12:14

...and there in a nutshell is one of the biggest reasons I have for loving my Lammy. There's not another one exactly like it in the country...

Hardly a nutshell MD, a bit long winded even if I do say so myself :laugh: but your on it, I lust for anything different, lammys are cool btw.

Do you think this is why all the old fellas get moist when a Norton commando or a can am trike rolls into town, not because it's a great bike, though it may well be but because it just stands out as something different and interesting.

Drogen Omen

19th May 2009, 12:18

skidMark

19th May 2009, 12:23

Without experimental with the turbos etc etc.... how do you find out what works and what doesn't?

some people want something a bit more exclusive a bit different to other bikes, the turbo bikes for example came with a hefty price tag...

I don't like any bike stock, there has never been a single bike i have looked at and gone "perfect" i always know what i want to change the moment i see it.

Why have the exact same as everybody else?

Biking is about freedom to me, my bike has to be the same.

skidMark

19th May 2009, 12:24

I would like to see some of these on NZ roads...

Am getting pricing on one and also checking import and road registering costs...

It looks like somebody crashed a z1000 into a segway. :eek:

James Deuce

19th May 2009, 12:25

I would like to see some of these on NZ roads...

Am getting pricing on one and also checking import and road registering costs...
Why? It's just something else to get stuck in traffic on.

BMWST?

19th May 2009, 12:28

hahaha thats one reason i bought my ol pd......i bet there only ever be one in the bike park,and love or loath the BMW twins ARE different

Big Dave

19th May 2009, 12:30

You must live in a different world to me.
I enjoy the wide diversity of vehicles on the market today.

Pinstripe

19th May 2009, 12:54

From what I've read here and there it's really an economic thing. Radical styling and technology doesn't sell too well usually,see Yamaha GTS with its James Parker RADD suspension for example.

That said, there is some more avant garde stuff out there if you have the cash, wakan, confederate etc, Buells and some of the BMW models are definitely interesting.

Drogen Omen

19th May 2009, 13:12

It looks like somebody crashed a z1000 into a segway.

More like a Yamaha R1 mate... R1 Ass, R1 Engine, 17" mags and some fiberglass... :blank: so that makes it 40% R1 and 60% Other....!!!

Why? It's just something else to get stuck in traffic on.

Because its different... isn't that what this post is about...??? :weird:

I already have my Street fighter (Buell Lightning XB12Ss) for lane splitting... but maybe on Saturday or Sunday I want to ride something different... The Lazareth Triazuma is just that, something different...

martybabe

19th May 2009, 13:18

I would like to see some of these Lazareth Triazuma trikes on NZ roads...

Comparison:
Triazuma
R1 1000CC liquid-cooled 4-stroke DOHC 16 valves engine
170HP (unrestricted)
weight 453Kg's

Can-am Spyder
1000cc BRP-Rotax V-twin 8-valve, dual-cam, fuel-injected engine
106 HP
weight 316 kg

Am getting pricing on one and also checking import and road registering costs...

Well it sure is different, an amazing looking thing, viva la difference I say.

Without experimental with the turbos etc etc.... how do you find out what works and what doesn't?

some people want something a bit more exclusive a bit different to other bikes, the turbo bikes for example came with a hefty price tag...

I don't like any bike stock, there has never been a single bike i have looked at and gone "perfect" i always know what i want to change the moment i see it.

Why have the exact same as everybody else?

Biking is about freedom to me, my bike has to be the same.

Well said Mark, I think that's how we all get round it, buy something mass produced and make it our own even if it's only in a little way. :niceone:

hahaha thats one reason i bought my ol pd......i bet there only ever be one in the bike park,and love or loath the BMW twins ARE different

There ya go, maybe we don't deserve radically different bikes, to much of a gamble for manufacturers to put something out that the masses are too conservative to accept, witness the trike above, maybe not my thing but worthy of a long inspect and chat whilst sipping a coffee at the roadside surely.

You must live in a different world to me.
I enjoy the wide diversity of vehicles on the market today.

I'm glad you've come on board, I value your opinion as a man of the people with an insight into the way things are done in the 'business' and yes we do live in different worlds unfortunately.:(

Can you offer anything that is radically different to everything else. I'm really keen on that new Thunderbird but I'm willing to bet it'll be similar to the America/speedmaster, bigger engine, maybe more get up and go but will it change the way people think about cruisers, faster than a vmax? handle as well as buell, kill of BMW tourers because it's simply the best touring motorcycle ever made, I doubt it me old mate, just another big cruiser, looks good and goes well but nothing to write home about, mores the pity.

Set my biker taste buds afire BD, anything in the pipe line worth selling my house for?

Drogen Omen

19th May 2009, 13:40

Set my biker taste buds afire BD, anything in the pipe line worth selling my house for?
How about some of these Lazareth Custom Modified bikes... hahahaha

Lazareth Dokujya - Honda VTR1000
Lazareth SWE - Yamaha VMax
Lazareth - Ducati Monster 1000

Now that's customizing to the extreme....! :Punk:

sorry bout the Lazareth stuff... just been stuck on their website for a couple days perving at all the sexy bikes...

Big Dave

19th May 2009, 14:15

And now for something completely different: Victory Vision. DN-01. Spyder. BMW Megamoto. KTM SM990. Honda Predator. Speed Triple. Granpasso. 1125CR. XB12X.

A Goldwing makes a great cruiser too - as well as the Rune.

Big Dave

19th May 2009, 14:18

sorry bout the Lazareth stuff... just been stuck on their website for a couple days perving at all the sexy bikes...

I think they are great art. And impracticable vehicles.

Big Dave

19th May 2009, 14:20

If it was down to sheer indulgence - sans budgetary considerations - I would buy a BMW Megamoto and put all the goodies on it.

James Deuce

19th May 2009, 15:12

The Lazareth Triazuma is just that, something different...
It'd be different if it were a bike. It's just a 3 wheeled sportscar with bars. I'd rather have a Honda S2000. At least I could put the roof up when it rains.

James Deuce

19th May 2009, 15:14

FWIW, I don't care what Granny NoRide thinks of my bike. I'm having too much fun when I'm riding to waste time thinking about it.

AllanB

19th May 2009, 15:18

The Pastor

19th May 2009, 15:24

i built / am building my own custom bike

greminn

19th May 2009, 15:31

Big Dave

19th May 2009, 16:12

i built / am building my own custom bike

<img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2133/2239148531_b5f377d2e4.jpg?v=0">

martybabe

19th May 2009, 16:48

How about some of these Lazareth Custom Modified bikes... hahahaha

Lazareth Dokujya - Honda VTR1000
Lazareth SWE - Yamaha VMax
Lazareth - Ducati Monster 1000

Now that's customizing to the extreme....! :Punk:

sorry bout the Lazareth stuff... just been stuck on their website for a couple days perving at all the sexy bikes...

nah that's cool, I think the last one is a bid ugh but the other two are sweet and more like it for the wow factor. Exile cycles is cool too and many more small outfits and individuals across the globe, it just seems to me the big companies are happy to turn out much the same thing year after year, great bikes that they are, we don't seem to get those landmark bikes anymore, like...

BMW R100RS . First Fully faired production bike, I think, certainly of my era, all kinds of hideous befaired things came after.

Fireblade. first superbike ? certainly the forerunner of R1 and gixxer missiles

The Goldwing, frankly a joke at the time, 1000cc out run by many a little smoker but it evolved into a benchmark for two wheeled winebegos.

FJ 1100 sports bike, outdone by that Kawasaki thing GPZ ? but evolved into the FJ 1200 sports tourer and I still think it holds it's own in that class all these years later and so on in to boringdom.

I did see a ducati custom/cruiser once, it was a one off unless your minted but it's the kinnda thing that makes you go, cripes that's different.

Drogen Omen

19th May 2009, 16:48

FWIW, I don't care what Granny NoRide thinks of my bike. I'm having too much fun when I'm riding to waste time thinking about it.

the bike on your profile looks like a Harley Davidson TX1000 or XT1000... cant remember...!!! am i wrong?

seen a black and orange one on the hutt motorway, turns off at the avalon lights... they look mean...:devil2:

Is it just me, or do some of these things look photoshopped?!!

no ... thats what they realy look like... and they are for sale on the www.Lazareth.fr web site

greminn

19th May 2009, 17:02

no ... thats what they realy look like... and they are for sale on the www.Lazareth.fr web site

Its just that some of the pics dont look real.

Forest

19th May 2009, 20:11

The only truly innovative bike in the last 20 years would be the Britten. Somebody holds the patent rights and is not using them...

The problem with the Britten is that there are severe problems with the engineering and materials that make it unsuited for production.

The reason why the few remaining examples were never raced competitively isn't due to the rarity, but rather the fact that they're simply not strong enough to cope.

It's a deeply flawed bike. But still very beautiful in its own way.

Ocean1

19th May 2009, 20:21

The problem with the Britten is that there are severe problems with the engineering and materials that make it unsuited for production.

Care to elaborate?

Thunder 8

19th May 2009, 20:23

Where are all the different /unique/ innovative bikes these days. In a time when we perhaps have more bike choice than any generation before us, when you get down to the nitty gritty details they are much of a muchness aren't they?

:msn-wink:
:niceone: Could'nt agree more. After owning a shitload of bikes over the years i've got a bit jaded at the choices available which is why i built my own. Dont get me wrong i still love all types of motorcycles and there are some new ones that i might even consider owning but theres that dam many that are so similar to each other i dont lust after them.

Matt_TG

19th May 2009, 20:59

Drogen Omen

19th May 2009, 21:17

I don't know whether this makes me vomit or if I like it. It's like a car crash, you can't stop looking at it, but don't know why.

Victory Vision 2008 on TradeMe (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=218006774)

damn..... kinda hypnotic isn't it... looks like that designer watch too many of the old batman cartoons...

:drool: smooth lines.....

martybabe

19th May 2009, 21:39

I don't know whether this makes me vomit or if I like it. It's like a car crash, you can't stop looking at it, but don't know why.

Victory Vision 2008 on TradeMe (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=218006774)

I'm with ya there Matt. I'm glad they made it but I'm not sure why, I spose because it's different but then again isn't it just an Ultra glide on drugs, same woman different dress.:niceone:

martybabe

19th May 2009, 22:26

:niceone: Could'nt agree more. After owning a shitload of bikes over the years i've got a bit jaded at the choices available which is why i built my own. Dont get me wrong i still love all types of motorcycles and there are some new ones that i might even consider owning but theres that dam many that are so similar to each other i dont lust after them.

Good lord, I just checked your profile, what a fantastic bike, bloody well done mate, nothing samey about that monster, your the man. :first:

Shadows

19th May 2009, 23:10

the bike on your profile looks like a Harley Davidson TX1000 or XT1000... cant remember...!!! am i wrong?

seen a black and orange one on the hutt motorway, turns off at the avalon lights... they look mean...:devil2:

You're thinking of an XR1200 - now there's something a little different. :yes:

Forest

19th May 2009, 23:19

Care to elaborate?

It's been discussed ad infinitum.

The problem with the Britten is that it was operating right at the material limits of its components. This is an acceptable trade-off in a race-bike, but it means that bike could never be put into production.

Almost all of the Britten bikes have ended up as static displays. They're literally too fragile to ride.

Big Dave

19th May 2009, 23:54

Forest

20th May 2009, 00:45

Ok. That's fair enough.

I didn't mean to imply that they are made from tissue paper - because they aren't.

Big Dave

20th May 2009, 11:15

Ok. That's fair enough.

I didn't mean to imply that they are made from tissue paper - because they aren't.

Yes - and a few parade laps isn't a race season either.

MSTRS

20th May 2009, 11:31

It's been discussed ad infinitum.

The problem with the Britten is that it was operating right at the material limits of its components. This is an acceptable trade-off in a race-bike, but it means that bike could never be put into production.

Almost all of the Britten bikes have ended up as static displays. They're literally too fragile to ride.

Be that as it may...innovation is simply a new idea being tried. Whether it works or not. As far as 'production' bikes are concerned, all the innovation has been done long ago and practicality/market forces determine the end result. Hence the plethora of bike lookylikey in every genre.
As technology in materials progresses, we may find bikes like the Britten are suddenly possible.
This sort of thing is nothing new. Case in point (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desmodromic_valve)

buellbabe

20th May 2009, 12:04

Where are all the different /unique/ innovative bikes these days. In a time when we perhaps have more bike choice than any generation before us, when you get down to the nitty gritty details they are much of a muchness aren't they?

Proud to ride a Buell that stands out from the crowd :devil2:

Even when it is occasionally in the company of other X1s (at a Buell rally) it is still unique. :love:

martybabe

20th May 2009, 12:22

Proud to ride a Buell that stands out from the crowd :devil2:

Even when it is occasionally in the company of other X1s (at a Buell rally) it is still unique. :love:

Yes your right if I had to award a trophy for the company that dares to be different, it would go to Buell, especially in light of that recent sports bike departure. Having said that, whilst the brand is different and kudos for that, a lot of their models are very very similar.

Personally I'd like to see them take all their quirky design features and take their hotted up Harley engines and go backwards, I could really see all that innovative stuff used in a kind of confederate cruiser type thing, that would be something. I doubt the parent company would like them treading on their toes though.

Well done you individual you. :niceone:

A custom Buell like this one below stuffed full of all the Buell clever stuff,great handling, fack off brakes and a 100bhp engine, where do I sign up :drool:

buellbabe

20th May 2009, 12:30

Yeah thats what I like about the X1. When it was first produced it featured new innovations and also it certainly didn't look like the earlier models.
It was considered top of the range.
Then Erik got all fancy and brought out the XB and because they were a radical departure from the 'tuber' range the X1 maintained its uniqueness ...YEEEEEE HA!

Gremlin

20th May 2009, 17:30

And now for something completely different: Victory Vision. DN-01. Spyder. BMW Megamoto. KTM SM990. Honda Predator. Speed Triple. Granpasso. 1125CR. XB12X.
I was going to mention the supermoto... its not radically different, but it doesn't really fit the traditional "classes". There are very few of them on the road, and I can't think for the life of me why people don't want them? Price maybe?

Best bike I have ever owned... well, now that its been modified :msn-wink:

ukusa

20th May 2009, 17:37

2: Cruisers, just how many v twin american style cruisers are there in this world, look at Yamahas line up, 10 or so vtwin heavy, low slung, looky likeies, Suzuki the same. without a model designation, I couldn't tell them apart in a magazine much less on the road. Stick HD and the others in the equation and you've got, I dunno, maybe 100 bikes that are essentially the same.

and some people say Triumphs are Harley clones, at least they don't have a V twin:bleh:

cheshirecat

20th May 2009, 19:07

98tls

20th May 2009, 19:18

I sort of prefer some of the classics. I still lust after the old MV Agusta 750 with it's straight through pipes and gravel crushing sound of the gear cam drive.
A friend has an old CB550 and she has heaps of fun on it and it's great to fiddle with - All I can do with my VFR is polish it and change the oil. Mate you can do heaps if you set your mind to it,besides the babillon aftermarket providers theres always a lathe to produce bits that make a bike different,great for filling in rainy days as well.:niceone:niceone:Mucking about with bikes is almost as good as riding the finished product.

martybabe

20th May 2009, 19:27

And now for something completely different: Victory Vision. DN-01. Spyder. BMW Megamoto. KTM SM990. Honda Predator. Speed Triple. Granpasso. 1125CR. XB12X.

.

And now for something almost exactly the same:

pic 1. slightly jazzed down Victory vision? or ultra electra glide.

2. Honda Predator? or z1000

3. spyder? or whatever that thing is

4.Granpasso? or Stelvio

5.Dn-01? or automatic motorcycle from elsewhere

OK, I admit it, I was bored and it's raining but I did get quite a few, stumped on the speed triple and the Buells but I'm not saying there aren't any 'different' bikes , just that with x amount of bikes on the market, an awful lot of them seem to be almost the same bike with a different badge.

Please don't come up with anymore, I'm tired :bleh::niceone:

Ocean1

20th May 2009, 19:32

I didn't mean to imply that they are made from tissue paper - because they aren't.

They sort of were. Well, paper mache. Thin-shell “monocoque” structures in any composite material can be hugely rigid for their mass. Until something disrupts the surface shape. So yeah, not particularly abuse resistant or crash-proof. Doesn’t make the technique invalid for a lot of structures, without it F1 cars would be totally fookt.

As technology in materials progresses, we may find bikes like the Britten are suddenly possible.

Exactly. There’s been clever bastards around long before most of us shat yellow, so there’s not too many “new” ideas. The successful innovations are invariably a mixture of adapting and refining old ideas and reviewing modern materials and construction methods.

It’s also true that Bike manufacturers are not there to entertain us technophiles, they’re there to sell bikes. That means minimising design risk, optimising build techniques to suit mass production and spending lots on marketing. See, we SAY we want radical, but we BUY the run-of-the-mill low tech stuff on offer. When consumers do that long enough all the clever bastards give up and fuck off.

martybabe

20th May 2009, 19:42

It’s also true that Bike manufacturers are not there to entertain us technophiles, they’re there to sell bikes. That means minimising design risk, optimising build techniques to suit mass production and spending lots on marketing. See, we SAY we want radical, but we BUY the run-of-the-mill low tech stuff on offer. When consumers do that long enough all the clever bastards give up and fuck off.

I fail to disagree, well said.

Big Dave

20th May 2009, 20:17

And now for something almost exactly the same:

I think you need a new glasses prescription.

That is a remarkable array of diverse vehicles.

BMWST?

20th May 2009, 20:33

I think you need a new glasses prescription.

That is a remarkably array of diverse vehicles.

ehhh....
the harley is something they have been doing for yonks.....
the kawi is a a UJM in different clothes
spyder....morgan
bmw g/s copy
DN01 it IS innovative

98tls

20th May 2009, 20:49

A bit off topic but different all the same,came across this today,plenty of TL bits which interested me and as a package looks pretty good to me.

martybabe

20th May 2009, 23:21

I think you need a new glasses prescription.

That is a remarkably array of diverse vehicles.

You were attempting to display the diversity between the bikes in the list.

I took it to be a list of what you thought were very individual bikes with no doppelgangers.

Crossed wires BD, never mind, It's been interesting. :niceone:

Big Dave

21st May 2009, 00:48

'Remarkably array.' Sober I promise.

If you want a unique motorcycle I like the work of Dave Anderson and his Road Rage Customs - downstairs at AMPS.

martybabe

21st May 2009, 08:06

'Remarkably array.' Sober I promise.

If you want a unique motorcycle I like the work of Dave Anderson and his Road Rage Customs - downstairs at AMPS.

Well thanks for the tip next time I'm that way I'll try and get a look see.

Truth be told, I'd love to build my own but don't have the skills, time or money and it would probably look crap in the flesh anyway. I think I'm just waiting for the day I see my vision made a reality by someone else and get a bit frustrated by the 58th version of the GSXR1000 when they could be making my 'cruiser Brutal' could be a long wait eh, I'll put the jug on. :laugh: