Keep Wellington motorcycling free - sign the petition!

[Scuba_Steve]

I see the Spyder still likes to park in bikes parks (a bit more considerate now tho) but the council (or they're contractors) are starting to take photos of it, guess maybee they're trying to work out if it's supposed to be there or not too

[StoneY]

I see the Spyder still likes to park in bikes parks (a bit more considerate now tho) but the council (or they're contractors) are starting to take photos of it, guess maybee they're trying to work out if it's supposed to be there or not too

My take on that is its registered as a CAR and should use a car space
Especially with our current fight

I have been meaning to drop a note on it but never anywhere nearbye....

[buellbabe]

Blingedy bling bling to you Stoney! Even tho I don't live in Welly I signed the petition to support you guys cos as it was pointed out if Welly bikers lose parking spaces its only a matter of time before other councils follow suit. Kudos to you Stoney for standing up and being counted yet again

[Scuba_Steve]

My take on that is its registered as a CAR and should use a car space
Especially with our current fight

I have been meaning to drop a note on it but never anywhere nearbye....

Well if the council (or their minions) are taking photos of it they might drop a note on it for you

[cheshirecat]

Ok, initial meeting done

This was NOT a formal consultation (yet) and was a brief discussion on strategy and direction, a meeting of minds so to speak.
I for one was impressed at the approach they took, we were listened to and ASKED for input and advice.

Present for Motorcyclists was Peter Mac from Ulysses, Cherie Flintoff from WIMA (CherryB here on KB) and Anthony Foreman from MAG NZ.

Tentatively, we have an understanding that we will not LOSE any parking we curtrently have, although a reshuffle of locations and some area's with heavy retail focus MAY get time limited... guess thats a reality we need to face.

Council will push hard to all private parking providors to provide ecconomiccaly viable access (eg 50$ a month) which should include Gear Lockers, and low level access so we dont have to ride clutches up ramps.
This will not be used as a replacement for our existing free parking. BUT they are running out of options

Council is encouraging us (thats YOU and ME) to approach our employers in regards access to parking off street on company grounds where we can, to aleviate pressure on roadside parking.
They also were very open to us as a community finding locations suitable to be marked as Motorcycle parking - eg where we find spots no car could use but 2-3 bikes can - I made an exapmle with the space in Courtenay Place by the old public loo at Taranaki st, small paved culdesac no pedestrians ever use for ANYTHING - ideal 6 bike parking spot.

Jon Visser was present and his boss the Director of Infrastructure, both were amiccable and


We also had a member of the public present who seemed to want Wellingtons Footpaths turned into Parisian Cafe's!
He stormed out after a rant, was quite entertaining!
Only one nay sayer from Council was in the room, he saved up a bit of a serve on bike safety till the end.
We will be responding with some figures for this gentelman to ensure he gets his facts right.

I will be handing this issue off to Paul Ellen BRONZ Wgtn VP (Bald Eagle here on KB) and Byron Cummins BRONZ Wgtn (The_Dude) for future ongoing consultation as I have more than enough to do with ACC etc

I think we have made our point in the opening discussion and I was surprised how open to our input Council actually is in this matter (or seem to be)
The Petition definitely got some attention thats for sure!

Encuraging stuff. Particularly intrigued by the fact they believe we are an community - which we are of course if you like herding stray cats - but it's nice to think they think can make contributions to the civic monolinth

[Jon Visser]

I like the proposal to have a forum on potential new spaces. Rather than lots of ad-hoc submissions, we should maintain a register of sites so that they only need to be proposed and considered once. Could also be good to have a guideline for proposing new sites, i.e. what to look for such as safety (sight lines and features that stop them from being walked/driven into), accessability (how bikes will get to/from the spaces without riding on footpaths) and demand (not just from riders but also other road users, e.g. rubbish collections, tree maintenance etc), and what not to bother asking for because it will be rejected. A simple submission form on our external website would be good, like we did for resident parking:
http://www.wellington.govt.nz/servic...ea-request.pdf
I'll have a think about getting this added to our web site, and leave it up to this forum to consider starting a thread.

The Courtenay Place location will be looked into - we met recently to discuss the Courtenay Precinct in general and there are lots of things being considered, so I'm afraid there won't be any immediate response (i.e. it will all be addressed as a "package").

A coleague just advised we have made a change in Martin Square and there is now a parking space that is too small for a car, and he has observed a few scooters parked up on the footpath. A motorcycle parking bay has therefore been suggested as a suitable use for this space.

Jon Visser
Manager - Infrastructure Performance

[StoneY]

Thanks Jon
Very encouraging stuff indeed

As always thanks for the positive spin on making progress and including us all in such a pro-active manner

Brent

[cheshirecat]

Thanks Jon
Very encouraging stuff indeed

As always thanks for the positive spin on making progress and including us all in such a pro-active manner

Brent

So do we put a thread up here?

[caseye]

On you guys and girls of the Welly BRONZ Ulysses, Wima and MAG-NZ.
Also to Jon for taking an active(though not strictly speaking his baby anymore) part in proceedings.
This is a good outcome, so far.
I look forward to seeing you folk from Wellington really getting into this and providing Jon and his team with lots of alternatives that work for us all.

[StoneY]

So do we put a thread up here?

Unsure - I think one was already opened after the last thread in '09?
If not by all means run a new one

I think it would be a far more credible exercise for all if you actually opened it and made the FB link to mate

[cheshirecat]

done - even got the fing FB link to work

[Bald Eagle]

Well as we are all working towards obtaining mutually beneficial parking outcomes for Wellingtonians here's an interesting scenario.

A major corporate is currently occupying premises in the CBD. The site has some non car friendly internal space on two internal parking levels. Staff are permitted to park motorbikes in these spaces at no cost.

Said corporate is about to relocate into a refurbished building in the CBD. Staff have been replied to on enquirying that the following will apply.

"Motorcycles will share 3 bikes to a car park and will each pay a third of the costs which works out to be $1733.33 per annum/per person (the costs of a full car park is $5200). These are costs set by the landlord"



This breaks down to a return of $433.33/month for a parking space.



Commercial parking buildings operating in the CBD provide single bike parking with 24/7 access at a rate of $50.00/month.



This sort of corporate / landlord behaviour doesn't not help the commuting public or the council in attempting to manage a limited resource as people are more likely to be non compliant when 'compliant' behaviour becomes to costly.

[Kendog]

This sort of corporate / landlord behaviour doesn't not help the commuting public or the council in attempting to manage a limited resource as people are more likely to be non compliant when 'compliant' behaviour becomes to costly.

I would of thought that is helping to manage a limited resource. Low supply = high price to manage demand.
I am guessing the council would see this as an opportunity to promote public transport.

[davebullet]

Well as we are all working towards obtaining mutually beneficial parking outcomes for Wellingtonians here's an interesting scenario.

A major corporate is currently occupying premises in the CBD. The site has some non car friendly internal space on two internal parking levels. Staff are permitted to park motorbikes in these spaces at no cost.

Said corporate is about to relocate into a refurbished building in the CBD. Staff have been replied to on enquirying that the following will apply.

"Motorcycles will share 3 bikes to a car park and will each pay a third of the costs which works out to be $1733.33 per annum/per person (the costs of a full car park is $5200). These are costs set by the landlord"



This breaks down to a return of $433.33/month for a parking space.



Commercial parking buildings operating in the CBD provide single bike parking with 24/7 access at a rate of $50.00/month.



This sort of corporate / landlord behaviour doesn't not help the commuting public or the council in attempting to manage a limited resource as people are more likely to be non compliant when 'compliant' behaviour becomes to costly.

Just a small correction on your comparison - that's $144 not ($433) per bike per month compared to $50 per bike per month. I know you said "$433 per car parking space" - but that is for 3 bikes - right?

Still - nearly 3 times the price ($144 > $50) is crazy.

[Bald Eagle]

Irony, have just found out the landlord in the above example is "The Wellington Company."

Who also are in the Parking business

[oneofsix]

Just a small correction on your comparison - that's $144 not ($433) per bike per month compared to $50 per bike per month. I know you said "$433 per car parking space" - but that is for 3 bikes - right?

Still - nearly 3 times the price ($144 > $50) is crazy.

You are both right, Bald Eagle quoted $433 per SPACE per month whilst Dave has worked out the per BIKE per month price.

[caseye]

Either way it's a damnd disgrace.
I wonder, do they realistically expect their employees to pay $100.00 per week for the ability to park a car, at or near to their work?
Hope they are getting a damn big salary and doesn't it make you wonder, if they are paying big enough salaires to accomodate this they are damn well ripping off their own employees knowingly.

[KevinD]

WCC are reviewing the use of on-road motorcycle parking, which may include the introduction of fees / charges.

Do your bit by signing the "keep it free" petition:
http://www.wellington.govt.nz/haveyo...ep/details/147

Here is a link to the policy:
http://www.wellington.govt.nz/plans/...ing2007-09.pdf

The Policy was drafted September 2007 with an implementation timeframe of 3 - 5 years. The motorcycle section in question is on pg 28 which states:
"f. Review the provision for motorcycle parking,
including investigating issues such as quantity of
spaces, location, parking price and motorcycle
parking provision in town and suburban centres"

PS: Kudos and credit to BRONZ for organising this.

EDIT: Even if you aren't a Wellingtonian (I don't blame you, honest) - sign the petition. If parking fees for motorcycles goes ahead here, you can guarantee one council will set a precedent for other councils "justifying" fees to be a nationwide thing.

The whole problem here is if you have to pay, in many cases it also makes sense (convenience) to bring the car instead of the bike. Therefore there is one less car space, instead of a bike space. That a bit illogical to me if the objective is maximum optimization of parking space.

[Reckless]

The whole problem here is if you have to pay, in many cases it also makes sense (convenience) to bring the car instead of the bike. Therefore there is one less car space, instead of a bike space. That a bit illogical to me if the objective is maximum optimization of parking space.

You got that right a lot of bikers will elect to take the car if its raining or if they have sport or and appointment, if they have to pay! Charging bikes for parking might be the straw that breaks the camels back and they will join he que of people driving round and round looking for a park!
Charging bikers could well make their parking problems much worse! But do they really care?? Its about revenue and I bet they get council parks provided so they aren't effected.
They don't give a shit about ease of traffic movement or the cities parking availability to tourists, visitors or rate payers other wise they wouldn't be banging on and on about costs per parking space etc etc! Its about money and from a councils point of view it damn well shouldn't be, it should be about the good of the city!
And I say the above as a born and bred Wellingtonian!!

[StoneY]

We managed to get agreement at the opening 'csual conversation' meeting that we will not lose any of our existing free parking numbers (500 bike slots as it stands)

Might end up with some time limits here and there near heavy retail zones is the expected situation at this time, council have engaged on our behalf with the parking buildings to get fair prices and gear lockers arranged for those who desire secure off street parking -