Black boxes on bikes?

[awa355]

Coming to a bike near you someday??? Probably not in my riding lifetime but something tells me they will be required by law one day.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-20143969

What are your thoughts?

[Gremlin]

I suspect on my BMW it's already recording some stuff, as the dealer can see stuff like throttle openings and get a general idea of how the bike is being ridden. Of course they angle it in terms of fault finding, ie, you apply 100% throttle for the fault to occur.

Only difference is that the police can't just plug into it. So we're probably not that far away already?

[rastuscat]

Be afraid, be very afraid.

For the next three weeks anyway.

[nzspokes]

Already happening in the form of phone apps that track you for better rates at insurance companys.

[Voltaire]

there was something similar on the tele last night, some local bus company were trialing a box that showed when you were driving the best.

I did see a thing on Google that shows where your phone travels on a map....eek

I imagine insurance companies could give you a 'discount' to load an app like the walking ones to track you speed.

( so Sir, your phone says you were doing 140 kmph when you stopped suddenly.."

[Swoop]

The technology is already, definitely, there.

Anyone on home detention is fully GPS monitored now (in the last month or so there was a change in bracelet that is worn) and this is fully tracking the individual.
The parole officer can look up exactly where the person has been and at what time.

Exactly the same as vehicular tracking ability. Big Brother says "hi!".

[rastuscat]

Already happening in the form of phone apps that track you for better rates at insurance companys.

You know those signs in the major cities that tell you the travel time to a place you might be going to? They work by polling inactive bluetooth devices passing by.

A sensor detects the ID of a bluetooth device which is switched on, even if it isn't connected to a device. It detects it anyway. When that same bluetooth ID passes another detector, the system knows how long it took that device to travel between the two sensors.

It then uses that gathered info to predict a travel time, and auto updates the signs.

No privacy is breached, as the system doesn't know who had which bluetooth ID, so it's not tlike they track us. But that's a couple of steps from being possible.

[Mike.Gayner]

I did see a thing on Google that shows where your phone travels on a map....eek

Anyone who has location services turned on (that's most people with an Android phone) can see where they've been in the last 30 days here:
https://maps.google.com/locationhistory/b/0

My map:

[TheDemonLord]

So you mean you could get your morning speedru.. I mean commute verified and set a record?!?!

Awesome!

[caspernz]

You know those signs in the major cities that tell you the travel time to a place you might be going to? They work by polling inactive bluetooth devices passing by.

A sensor detects the ID of a bluetooth device which is switched on, even if it isn't connected to a device. It detects it anyway. When that same bluetooth ID passes another detector, the system knows how long it took that device to travel between the two sensors.

It then uses that gathered info to predict a travel time, and auto updates the signs.

No privacy is breached, as the system doesn't know who had which bluetooth ID, so it's not tlike they track us. But that's a couple of steps from being possible.

Yes, one of your colleagues explained that to me about a year or so ago. The funny thing is, how long until this innocuous technology (and corresponding legislation) is "upgraded" to dish out speeding tickets as we cruise on by...

[pritch]

There was an article in the motorcycle press maybe two years ago now (?). They were concerned that there are one or two manufacturers who are already fitting black boxes as described in the original post to some models. The box is not part of the engine management system, it is seperate and designed to perform a similar function to the ones in aircraft

Could be a problem if following an accident you were in court telling the judge your side of the story and the stands up and says, "According to the data we recovered from his machine he was doing 160kph in 4th gear while heading east at 2.00PM - in a school zone."

Can't remember which makes were guilty of installing this nastiness but have a vague idea Kawasaki might have been one.

[R650R]

You know those signs in the major cities that tell you the travel time to a place you might be going to? They work by polling inactive bluetooth devices passing by.

A sensor detects the ID of a bluetooth device which is switched on, even if it isn't connected to a device. It detects it anyway. When that same bluetooth ID passes another detector, the system knows how long it took that device to travel between the two sensors.

It then uses that gathered info to predict a travel time, and auto updates the signs.

No privacy is breached, as the system doesn't know who had which bluetooth ID, so it's not tlike they track us. But that's a couple of steps from being possible.

A similar system operates on GPS nav devices in cars. A story came out about five years ago of TomTom actually selling the data to the USA Highway Patrols. Its anonymous like you say but all of a sudden the cops are staking out the good bits of road where lots of people are speeding that they previously ignored. Suspect something similar is happening in NZ as Highway patrols are now getting too good at hiding in remote places where they never used to go.

The data is not really anonymous either. Although the 'system' doesn't know who that Bluetooth ID is it can be found out in the event of a major investigation. Many of these system record this info long term like the cellphone companies do, whats that you say??? The cellphone companies sell data to advertisers and other interested parties on cellphone movements. Everytime you move between towers that is a data set about a consumers movements and shopping habits. For the phone companies its about where to build more towers, for others it gives data on what times people shop and what places they prefer.
Now all of this data is stored as data storage is very cheap.
Now once a device is found in a vehicle involved in a major fatal accident the appropriate warrants can be used to access all this data. Yes its time consuming and difficult hence why you don't hear of it being used much as often police have other evidence already backing their case, but it is out there.

There was a case in HB quite a few years back when cellphones weren't as flash as they are now. A bunch of young ones went through a red light and got killed in collision with a truck, no witnesses.
The police accessed celltower records that showed in the five to ten mins before hand that the car was averaging high speeds above limit and there fore likely to have been the one that ran the red light.

[baffa]

The systems you linked are hardwired into the vehicle, which is something of a concern, as you have no control over them.

The only Insurance Company in NZ using this technology, is Tower, with the Smart Driver app. Big difference is that this is an app on your phone, that you control, and you have a gaurantee data will never be shared with authorities or used to determine fault in a claim.

The principal is sound, evidence has shown that smooth careful drivers have less claims, so I think it is a good idea, but then I am biased.

The idea of little black boxes being installed into cars or bikes though would have me worried.

[Ender EnZed]

The article is more than 2.5 years old. I wonder what the case is these days.

Can't see it being good business for the first motorcycle insurance company to try it in NZ.

[rastuscat]

I have a black box on my private bike.

I keep my gloves in it when I'm not riding.

Just sayin.

Sorry team, I'm becoming more and more frivolous as my big day becons.