IMPORTANT - Submission To The Government

[p.dath]

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Re the ABS thing I suspect all it would take is someone to point out to him that a lot of bikes don't actually come out with ABS brakes for him to reconcider.
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I made a submission, and was generally in favour of ABS - in the future, but not right now. I put forward that there is quite some variation in the "quality" of ABS systems between manufacturers at this point in time, and that legislating their use poses some risk.

[Grahameeboy]

Well, I wish I had two bikes - but why should I pay more in ACC levies on my rego if I have 2 bikes than someone that has 1 bike. Suppose I have 2 bikes and someone else has 1 with the value of his 1 equal to my 2 and both of us doing the same kms.

2 bikes = 2 regos = fair enough
but
2 bikes = 2 ACC levies = not fair!

If I won Lotto I would probably have 5 bikes (at least) but then the ACC levy could be shrugged off much easier. Someone that has a weekday commuter + weekend ride + family car/van/whatever would be paying a lot more than their fair share of ACC levies! A wealthy person with one expensive car has more money, spent more on vehicles and pays less in ACC levies.

It seems that they don't really care if it isn't fair, they aren't interested in being fair - they just go with whatever is easiest to administer.

It's the same in other countries dude...life ain't fair eh?...or is if different in the NZ....

[FROSTY:Me]

A lot of experienced drivers drive pissed.

I'd say it's stupid drivers that are the issue.....

I'm not going into the drink driving debate as thats a whole other ketle of fish. There statisticly does seem to be a relationship more with inexperienced drivers ,alchohol and accidents than with experienced drivers,alchohol and accidents.
Ie the more common denominator is lack of experience --Gee go figure

[cowpatz]

Devils Advocate. Do we really want such a fine grained billing system so as to target people ring down to their age?

No we don't and I was not suggesting that this be done. I was just trying to come to grips with the 40 plus blip in casualty statistics.

[Grahameeboy]

No we don't and I was not suggesting that this be done. I was just trying to come to grips with the 40 plus blip in casualty statistics.

Why should age not be targeted...ACC is an insurance....insurance target age which is the best way, maybe not always the fairest way, to approach this

[Usarka]

Why should age not be targeted...ACC is an insurance....insurance target age which is the best way, maybe not always the fairest way, to approach this

What does insurance have to do with road safety?

[Coldrider]

I made a submission, and was generally in favour of ABS - in the future, but not right now. I put forward that there is quite some variation in the "quality" of ABS systems between manufacturers at this point in time, and that legislating their use poses some risk.

Why would you want to impose ABS brakes on me, never needed them, perhaps you should get off motorcycles and leave them to those that can ride without being wrapped up in cottonwool. Perhaps all learners should be made to ride moto cross & enduroes so thay getsome idea of how to handle a bike, instead of getting straight to road bike, or dear where is that cruise control buttom again.

[Squiggles]

Theres every chance that new bikes will come with ABS around 2015 anyway... just as few new bikes can have their lights turned off

[MarkH]

It's the same in other countries dude...life ain't fair eh?...or is if different in the NZ....

So the rest of the world has ACC levies as well? Oh well, if it is done in an unfair way elsewhere then I guess there is no point in trying to do it any better here. As long as we aren't the worst in the world at whatever then I suppose we can consider ourselves to be doing REALLY well eh?

[Coldrider]

You mean the bikes are going to be covered in stickers:
ABS,Dynamic Stability Control, Power Assist Braking, Air Bag, Supplementary Air Bag, might as well take the car before motorcycles have to have four wheels to remain upright, shit am I grumpy today.

[cowpatz]

Why should age not be targeted...ACC is an insurance....insurance target age which is the best way, maybe not always the fairest way, to approach this

So are you suggesting we also target high risk sports and activities.....motorsport, rugby, netball, squash, basketball, sky diving, push bikers, infants and those that do things with Gerbils? Better still make it age based. Kinda cuts right across the population doesn't it? So why target motorcyclists?

[MarkH]

Someone did make some mention to adding an ACC level to petrol. I'm still mulling that over, but I think it has some merit - until electric or non-petrol bikes start becoming the normal thanks to a market distortion caused by an added "tax".

Surely anything that encourages the development and use of alternative power sources such a electric would be a good thing? The supply of petrol wont last forever and with the increasing demand from China and India it is only going to get more expensive. Obviously there will come a time when electric vehicles achieve a high enough percentage of NZs vehicle fleet that they will have to be levied somehow - but that isn't a problem for today.

I notice that the 2009 model of my scooter is available with an ABS option, but I don't know what percentage of bikes will offer that in 2015 - I guess there could be quite a large number of bikes that wouldn't be available in NZ if they brought in the ABS legislation. Maybe they should just put a $500 or $1000 levy on non-ABS bikes over 600cc to encourage riders to opt for the ABS models, while keeping the bikes without ABS available for those that couldn't give a rat's arse about ABS.

[Grahameeboy]

What does insurance have to do with road safety?

Okay..ACC is the issue..it's an insurance policy that levy's pool into...

[Coldrider]

Surely anything that encourages the development and use of alternative power sources such a electric would be a good thing? The supply of petrol wont last forever and with the increasing demand from China and India it is only going to get more expensive. Obviously there will come a time when electric vehicles achieve a high enough percentage of NZs vehicle fleet that they will have to be levied somehow - but that isn't a problem for today.

I notice that the 2009 model of my scooter is available with an ABS option, but I don't know what percentage of bikes will offer that in 2015 - I guess there could be quite a large number of bikes that wouldn't be available in NZ if they brought in the ABS legislation. Maybe they should just put a $500 or $1000 levy on non-ABS bikes over 600cc to encourage riders to opt for the ABS models, while keeping the bikes without ABS available for those that couldn't give a rat's arse about ABS.

And add GST onto ABS increased prices as well,what coffa does that go into.

[Grahameeboy]

So the rest of the world has ACC levies as well? Oh well, if it is done in an unfair way elsewhere then I guess there is no point in trying to do it any better here. As long as we aren't the worst in the world at whatever then I suppose we can consider ourselves to be doing REALLY well eh?

I was talking about Rego...I think ACC is great but it also targets certain categories where the issues for me start..but that's life.

ACC is just another tax to fund the Health System...