Vote NO on stuff.co.nz

**Reckless** · 16th October 2009, 13:46

Originally Posted by imdying

It hasn't been left up, it was down, but has been put back up so that Fairfax can have a 'Fair Go' at manipulating the people. They pay well for the privlege, and were upset that motorcyclists should see fit to use their poll for their own means, as only Fairfax are allowed to manipulate people via that particular vehicle.

Well play their game and vote more than once then that'll screw them up!

**Murray** · 16th October 2009, 13:48

needs a programme written to do it quicker. I was going as fast as I could and it was stil going up 10x as fast

**kwaka_crasher** · 16th October 2009, 13:52

Originally Posted by Reckless

This is what you will be up against! Might as well post the other side of the argument.

Angel #404 19 min ago (On Stuff)

NZTA stats show 67% of motorcycle accidents involve another vehicle, and that of those accidents in 62% of them the driver of the other vehicle is at fault. So in 58% of all motorcycle accidents it's the motorcyclist's fault. So howabout they divvy up the costs that way? 58% of $62 million - the motorcyclists still aren't paying their costs.

Hold on??
But it doesn't make sense to her argument? Does IT???
Isn't her 58% assumption Wrong?? don't these figures suit us?
I've read it so many times now I'm screwed LOL!!

No - the maths is correct. 62% of 67% is 42%. So that's 58% of the multi-vehicle accidents are the riders fault. However, what is the cost of that 58% compared to the 42% that were not attributable to the ride? I would say not 58% of the cost of the 67% of multi-vehicle accidents. I would go so far as to theorise that the cost of the 67% of multi-vehicle accidents were not 67% of the total cost - how hurt can you get when you just fall off compared with hitting another vehicle?

**MSTRS:Me** · 16th October 2009, 13:56

Originally Posted by kwaka_crasher

No - the maths is correct. 62% of 67% is 42%. So that's 58% of the multi-vehicle accidents are the riders fault.

You what?
58% of all types of crashes involving a bike are presumably rider error. That's very different...
Bike only. Assume rider fault = 100%
Bike/car. Rider fault 38%

**Katman** · 16th October 2009, 13:57

Originally Posted by kwaka_crasher

how hurt can you get when you just fall off compared with hitting another vehicle?

I've heard that lamp posts are not very forgiving.....

or farm fences......

or tarseal......

or kerbstones.........

or a whole lot of other things.

**klingon** · 16th October 2009, 14:02

Can someone please link to the actual poll? I went to the Stuff homepage but it's not obvious...

**Murray** · 16th October 2009, 14:06

Go to the first post in the thread. But wait its now going the other way. well done whoever did that

**Reckless** · 16th October 2009, 14:07

Originally Posted by klingon

Can someone please link to the actual poll? I went to the Stuff homepage but it's not obvious...

I had the same at first?

Its on the right 1/2 way down under Mariah Careys pic.
I think you have to vote in the that page so can't do a link.

Edit oh shit eveytime it reloads the pics changes LOL!!! says Opinion poll in a grey heading in the right column!

**BMWST?** · 16th October 2009, 14:08

45,000 no,40,000 yes

**kwaka_crasher** · 16th October 2009, 14:08

Originally Posted by Katman

Sorry, but it's your maths that doesn't stack up.

Nor does yours.

Originally Posted by Katman

According to the quote above - 67% of motorcycle accidents involve another vehicle. Therefore 33% of motorcycle accidents involve no-one other than the motorcyclist.

Correct. But...

Originally Posted by Katman

Of that 67%, 62% is the fault of the other driver. Therefore 38% of multi vehicle accidents are still the fault of the motorcyclist.

No. 62/100 x 67/100 is 42/100 so 42% of multi-vehicle accidents are the riders primary responsibility.

Originally Posted by Katman

Single vehicle and multi-vehicle percentages need to be combined. 38% of 67% is approx. 25%.

25% + 33% = 58%

Now, that's complete arse. It would actually be 42% + 33% = 75% of all crashes attributable to the rider assuming that all 100% of all single-vehicle accidents were the riders fault. However, single vehicle crashes aren't neccessarily the fault of the driver of that single vehicle. Unpredictable things that simply cannot be reasonably anticipated can happen that will mean a driver will crash, but not into another vehicle. No driver can cover every possible eventuality.