Emergency breaking: wet vs dry

[Milts]

Hi,
I've been practicing emergency braking often when I'm out riding on a straight and empty piece of road. So far I've only ever locked up my rear wheel once or twice, never my front one (I have no idea where the limitations of my bike's traction are and I don't want to bin it just yet).
The other day I had a go in the wet, and twice I had my front start to lock up - at least I assume that's what it was, the bars started to twist and it seemed to skid a bit, and I didn't hold on to see what happened next, I let go pretty damn quick. It got me thinking. When in the wet, it seems you can tell when the front is locking with plenty of time to release the breaks before you actually go over. However, is this the same in the dry? Do you still get this half second or second in which to release the break before the bike totally loses it when the road is dry? Or does everything go west much faster (or slower) compared to on a wet road?

[Ocean1]

However, is this the same in the dry? Do you still get this half second or second in which to release the break before the bike totally loses it when the road is dry? Or does everything go west much faster (or slower) compared to on a wet road?

I suspect it just seems like a half second or second, but yes, if you're upright you'd normally expect a bit of vagueness or a slight squirming by way of warning.

The back’s not usually a problem, any lockup there isn’t likely to get you too far out of line and won’t detract too much from your overall braking performance. Some even advise you to ignore the rear during emergency braking, the distraction being a more important negative than any braking advantage it can contribute.

More importantly the rear is more or less a negative feedback thing, the worse it gets out of line the more it tends to self correct, (up to a point). The front is the other thing, the more lateral drift you get the higher the forces get that cause it. Hard to practice without losing paint and/or skin.

Also, I’ve come to understand that my tyres have a LOT more braking traction in the wet than I thought going by the general feel I get from the odd twitch or slither. Unfortunately the only real way to get a good feel for how your bike behaves at such times is to be there a lot. The most cost effective way to do that is on a reasonably priced dirt bike, in a wet paddock.

[vifferman]

Unfortunately the only real way to get a good feel for how your bike behaves at such times is to be there a lot. The most cost effective way to do that is on a reasonably priced dirt bike, in a wet paddock.

... and unfortunately, that doesn't necessarily translate to the same experience on the road, given that the bikes, tyres, surfaces, etc. are all different.

By the way - it's FAR better (and cheaper, and less painful) to practice emergency braking than breaking.

[TygerTung]

I would suggest that you will notice it tucking under.

If you are on the sort of road which squeals, you can have the front tire squealing under brakes. I have only done this on the track though as I don't ride that hard on the road.

[lostinflyz]

Hi,
I've been practicing emergency breaking often when I'm out riding on a straight and empty piece of road. So far I've only ever locked up my rear wheel once or twice, never my front one (I have no idea where the limitations of my bike's traction are and I don't want to bin it just yet).
The other day I had a go in the wet, and twice I had my front start to lock up - at least I assume that's what it was, the bars started to twist and it seemed to skid a bit, and I didn't hold on to see what happened next, I let go pretty damn quick. It got me thinking. When in the wet, it seems you can tell when the front is locking with plenty of time to release the breaks before you actually go over. However, is this the same in the dry? Do you still get this half second or second in which to release the break before the bike totally loses it when the road is dry? Or does everything go west much faster (or slower) compared to on a wet road?

I have a dislocated shoulder that tells you that its not that easy to tell when the front will go in the wet.

Alot of it depends on tyres. ive found with cheapish or none good wet tyres you can roll on the front and its pretty easy to skid it as they tend to not have enough grip to wet. It like riding a dirt bike

on race wets you cant lock the front. Till you sliding at 90 to where you were, but you can brake till your scared shitless.

[CookMySock]

I think it is better to practice avoiding an emergency in the wet, than to practice getting yourself out of one. It's so much easier to do, and with much less risk.

It's all very good to think we can learn this crap, and maybe to some extent we can, but if you get a bad fright in the wet, pretty much all your fancy practice and training goes down the toilet, followed by you, only to be replaced by "experience" - about ten seconds after you really needed it.

Just slow down in the wet and increase your following distances, and make sure you always have a way out.

Steve

[Hans]

Have a read of this, it's related to your question and although it doesn't provide a direct answer, it's still handy.

[Tone165]

I think it is better to practice avoiding an emergency in the wet, than to practice getting yourself out of one. It's so much easier to do, and with much less risk.

It's all very good to think we can learn this crap, and maybe to some extent we can, but if you get a bad fright in the wet, pretty much all your fancy practice and training goes down the toilet, followed by you, only to be replaced by "experience" - about ten seconds after you really needed it.

Just slow down in the wet and increase your following distances, and make sure you always have a way out.

Steve

I'd call this a silly unproductive answer.

Yes slow down in the wet....that is obvious to all but the dumbest biker and he is not going to read this, practice anything, or be around very long anyway.

"Always have a way out" is also good advice.

but....

Learning and practicing good skills or as you call them "crap" will in fact help out most riders. its too late to remember ther right way when the truck in front of you suddenly stops.

It is not compulsory to learn from your mistakes, better to learn from the mistakes of others and plan to avoid making them yourself.

Important to remember though..

Practice does not make perfect, it does make permanent....so be sure to practice the CORRECT techniques. BRONZ courses and trackdays are a great place to get some points to work on during your day to day riding.

Those ppl practicing wet braking...good work...it will pay off eventually.