Making excuses (pt II)

[Foxzee]

"accidents happen" sounds like to much of a cop out to me

Cop out...cop out of what? Have you never had an "accident" in your life or if you do you always have an explaination or an avenue of blame to direct the cause of that accident to.....

[Ronin]

Okay, so let's be constructive here - what would be a better way of conveying the message?

Attacking the very group your trying to save does not seem to me to be the best way because at the moment, the message is lost in what seems to be frustrated rants. If your audience wont listen then find a way to get through to them, don't condemn them for not having the same way of communicating that you do.

What would be the most appropriate place?

Anywhere that doesn't have a grieving widow/family in it.

We all know many riders, and chances are many of us know a few or more that have wound up dead. Sorry for the blunt talk, it's my upbringing.

Are we so PC that we can't talk about these things without fear of upsetting people, or is it that we as motorcycle riders can't bring ourselves to drop the "bulletproof" mentality that so many of us have adopted?

There is a world of difference between 'blunt' and 'arrogant'. We all as riders know that there are people that shouldn't be or won't be for long. Not all bikers are fuckwit road hoons or rossi wannabe's and object to being lumped with them.

You are correct, being to PC has killed a lot of people. All I'm suggesting is that perhaps there is a middle ground that will encourage more people to listen?

[Foxzee]

Personally, I'd rather see motorcyclists pulling their fucking heads in and riding to the conditions.

So cancel all race meetings then......hell a cloud may come over and shadow a perfectly good corner within 2 seconds.......

[PrincessBandit]

The outcome of the accident seems to have a huge influence on people's opinions on here.

My accident was relatively high speed, I survived with minimal injuries (although bad enough in their own way) - no one gave me shit about it when it happened and I can say, without saying too much, Katman treated me no differently than he would any other on here. His point is nothing personal, even extending to members of his own family.

I have no issue with that, and feel that his point was entirely justifiable.

As soon as there is death though people's emotions obviously go into overdrive in response to statements, which in themselves are not incorrect.

As for the posts being moved to PD they were not personal insults to the person/people involved - yes I did go in there to read them.

[Katman]

So cancel all race meetings then......

Sorry, but that retarded contribution to the thread doesn't warrant a reply.

[PrincessBandit]

So cancel all race meetings then......hell a cloud may come over and shadow a perfectly good corner within 2 seconds.......

At least on a race track all those who are on it know the score and are there to specifically ride in a way that is not generally accessible to them on the public road.

[Foxzee]

Sorry, but that retarded contribution to the thread doesn't warrant a reply.

So as a retard I can no longer make a point on this thread Katman????

You did not answer the question should we can anything dangerous as a cloud...cold track...etc...these people are still motorcyclists and experienced people..who give a lot of us education in riding and can still lose their lives.....if you could be useful and give your idea's on what education you would like to see maybe this can be a reality....

[Donor]

Attacking the very group your trying to save does not seem to me to be the best way because at the moment, the message is lost in what seems to be frustrated rants. If your audience wont listen then find a way to get through to them, don't condemn them for not having the same way of communicating that you do.

Attacking? So the public service ads about drink driving, speed, watching out for cyclists, children and small kittens are a bloody waste of time - and those who want more awareness of motorcyclists broadcast to the car drivers, are clearly wanting our tax dollars burned for no good reason.

Anywhere that doesn't have a grieving widow/family in it.

Any time someone dies - there's going to be somebody affected - granted, the timing of the messages regarding motorcycle riding and safety could be better timed on this site, it will and must never end - to allow that would be irresponsible of those who A) give a shit and B) have to pick up the pieces.

There is a world of difference between 'blunt' and 'arrogant'. We all as riders know that there are people that shouldn't be or won't be for long. Not all bikers are fuckwit road hoons or rossi wannabe's and object to being lumped with them.

You are correct, being to PC has killed a lot of people. All I'm suggesting is that perhaps there is a middle ground that will encourage more people to listen?[/QUOTE]

There is no middle ground - and alas there never will be, because let's face it (and working under the assumption 99% of motorcycle deaths/injuries are male) we're just so bloody bulletproof, we don't need to accept our mortality.

[Katman]

You did not answer the question should we can anything dangerous as a cloud...cold track...etc...

Since when has a cloud or a cold track been dangerous to those who anticipate (and react adequately to) those very circumstances and possibilities?

[bogan]

While we continue to blame environmental circumstances for our accidents we will continue to be seen as a joke by the powers that be and by the general public.

whats wrong with blaming environmental circumstances? sometimes they are to blame! general public blames environmental factors for their accidents so I'm sure we wont be judged too harshly.

Is it a good idea be prepared for, and able to avoid incidents when encountering such circumstances? yes imo we should

Do we have the right to dictate how others ride? course not, far better we educate them to the consequences instead, so they are able to decide for themselves

[Foxzee]

Since when has a cloud or a cold track been dangerous to those who anticipate (and react adequately to) those very circumstances and possibilities?

So a road you now don't have those very circumstances????

[Katman]

whats wrong with blaming environmental circumstances? sometimes they are to blame!

Bullshit.

An individual's failure to factor in environmental circumstances is what is to blame.

[cowboyz]

So a road you now don't have those very circumstances????

you do realise that you are making yourself seem argumentative and just plain stupid. Im surprised Hitcher hasnt been past with a grammar check too.

In any case, I have to agree with Katman. In the theory anyhow. As far as the practicial side goes, I say.. Do what you want to do.

[bogan]

Bullshit.

An individual's failure to factor in environmental circumstances is what is to blame.

blame isnt as clear cut as that, who's fault is it when a biker gets knocked hit by a car going straight through a give way sign? (biker has right of way)

[cowboyz]

ok. being as we are asking random questions..

Whos fault is it when a bike is travelling round a 65k country road corner at 140k/hr and hits gravel midcorner and crashes?