Emergency stop practice - gear change problem

[george formby]

Thats why I said IF its the only way to avoid an accident, if you can steer around it great sometimes you won´t even get that option and it´ll be a panic for your brain to do something if your reflex is to hit the rear brake first thats not a good thing in my opinion. If the choice is slamming into the side of a car thats just pulled out, hitting oncoming traffic or coming to an embarrassing stop in gear and having a little wobble and stalling its still better than the other two options.

I agree with your opinion. Any save is a good save

[robertvi]

Thanks everyone for your advice! For the record, I did a beginner's riding skills course today (definitely worthwhile), and the drill was throttle off, clutch in, onto front brake smoothly, progressively harder and apply back brake lightly at the same time, work down the gears if you can manage.

Today I also used the trick of slightly releasing the clutch to get the gears to click-in when down shifting while stopped - thanks for the tip, this will save me a lot of bother practising emergency stops where I don't manage to down shift before I stop!

[thehovel]

Haven't you read the rest of the thread? We have already established that rear brake can be initially applied hard if you want, but as you progress with the front brake the rear needs to be reduced due to loss of grip on the rear wheel while braking hard - or at least kept at the same level; in now way pressed harder.

If the engine is in gear, even "slamming" the rear brake while the front is not applied yet would not lock the wheel. That is another reason I keep the clutch engaged until the last moment - even if I end up pressing the rear brake too much, the engine will prevent locking in 99% or the cases.

i have seen stoppies on a GN250, 100% stock. Before we started the practical part, the BHS instructor showed us what the bike can do, trying to prove that a good rider can do many things even with a rubbish bike - wheelies, stoppies, scraping pegs on very low speed corners, etc...

Ride in front of me

[Metastable]

Lots of conjecture & speculation about braking but I believe the essence is control. The front is the most effective, the rear is a variable & the topic of this thread, gear changing is the final point of maintaining control. If you cannot ride away from an emergency stop in a prompt & controlled manner during the proficiency test, you fail. Well, back in the day that was the case. Front, rear & engine breaking have vastly different effects on different types of bike's, roads, tyres, cambers, linked brakes, BMW's etc.
Somebody has already said, that being able to get out the way after braking may be the biggest safety benefit.

I was wondering if someone was going to mention being in the right gear.

In a true emergency braking situation, with a sportbike or similar, you are better off doing a quick stab of the rear as you are starting to load the front.... this is basically happening at the same time. You grab a handful of clutch lever and you start knocking down the gears (or up if GP shift). THERE IS NO TIME TO ENGINE BRAKE! You need to be in the right gear too take off and not get nailed from behind. You will have more than enough to process, that you shouldn't be trying to blip through gears.... that's just mental overload. Keep it simple.

At the track, hopefully you don't have to emergency brake.... but you don't use much engine braking there either on a lap by lap basis. Brakes are for braking, the engine is there to make you go fast. You are either on the gas or on the brakes with very little coasting.... well if you're really fast you are... I'm not, so I catch myself coasting.

Note to the OP and newbies.... good on you for practicing emergency braking. If you go X speed, you should practice emergency braking from that speed, so that you know what it will be like.... otherwise how are you suppose to learn?

Also - on a bike like a cruiser, the amount of rear brake use is much more significant. I can understand that American MSF suggestion. On a cruiser (the majority of bikes there are cruisers) you want to keep that rear brake on hard as well as the front, but there is much less weight transfer.... if you use the front only, you'll take a lot longer to stop. It was interesting seeing the California Highway Patrol doing emergency braking... when they used both they stopped a bit quicker (BMW RTs I think)... rear only took forever to stop... front only was pretty good, but not as good as both. There was another one I saw with a cruiser and a Fireblade..... roughly the same distance for both... that was impressive. More rear brake usage on the cruiser obviously.

One last tidbit, be careful in a parking lot. It can sometimes be a bit dusty. If you are practicing emergency braking, the front wheel might lock on you. BUT.... that's actually a good skill to learn too, how to quickly release the front brake if the front locks, so that it doesn't tuck. There is plenty of time, but you have to again, know what to expect, otherwise you won't release the front brake quickly enough.

[CookMySock]

If you want some damn good emergency stopping practice, try a track day. Every corner is an emergency stop!



Steve

[scracha]

If you want some damn good emergency stopping practice, try a track day. Every corner is an emergency stop!

Steve

Absolute pure pish.



Unless a superdooperfragilisticmotord sticks it in front of you mid-corner.

[SMOKEU]

Anything that is going to slow you down faster has got to be good.

Including crashing into the back of a truck?

[dragon_fly]

holy crap you guys are confusing
emergency breaking is part of my new practising too....
i put my clutch in at the moment and even though as a woman i am a master at multi tasking.... cough cough...... i would be struggling to change down quickly.... clutching in and out (or do you do it with the clutch out and just slam it down??) as well as trying to feel if im starting to lock up.... lol as well as analysing how far it is taking me to stop......... major brain strain......

[centaurus]

holy crap you guys are confusing
emergency breaking is part of my new practising too....
i put my clutch in at the moment and even though as a woman i am a master at multi tasking.... cough cough...... i would be struggling to change down quickly.... clutching in and out (or do you do it with the clutch out and just slam it down??) as well as trying to feel if im starting to lock up.... lol as well as analysing how far it is taking me to stop......... major brain strain......

I'm not gonna reiterate the change gear/don't change gear during emergency braking, but If you really want to change down, you don't release the clutch. Pull the clutch in and while the bike is slowing down keep changing down. Just make sure that when you engage the clutch again you are stopped (or almost stopped) and in first gear. You don't want to lock up the rear wheel by being in the wrong gear and while you are braking for your life you can't be expected to keep track of what gear you're in vs. your speed.