The chance of a lifetime: You are asked to start a bike shop. How should it be done?

[bogan]

And I thought I had an argumentative disposition....................................... .....I think you should put up by starting a venture like you have outlined and just prove how wrong we who have been in the industry a long time really are. Preferably do it with your own money though.

How is that argumentative, I merely explained my position. And as explained before I have no desire to start up such a venture, it was just interesting to think about how it could be done, kinda like the thread title aye

[Conquiztador]

And I thought I had an argumentative disposition....................................... .....I think you should put up by starting a venture like you have outlined and just prove how wrong we who have been in the industry a long time really are. Preferably do it with your own money though.

No Robert. Nobody in this thread has to prove anything. That is not what this is (was) about. It was very clearly about ideas, brainstroming. Not about reality. You are beating the same tired message over and over. We have understoood you. Thank you. Running a bike business in NZ is not for thoose who expect to carve gold with a knife. But see, nobody here did belive that to be the case. To keep on telling us: "It is fucking hard, you guys have no idea" is not what this thread is about. As it clearly is what you want us to know, how hard you work and how decent you are, why not start a thread re that?

This thread is, and always was. about what the customer would like. Not about how stupid we, the customers, are who do not realise that we can not have cheaper bits, better service, faster deliveries. In this thread we dont give a shit re reality, re some fucking volcano that stops airfreight, or that the bits that take 2 months to arrive are superior to Korean ones that are here inside 2 days.

I do not think you realise that you are doing your self no service by posting these tired posts on KB, and with your company details attached. Wonder what the result would be if I started a thread asking how many potential customers you have alienated with your ramblings???

[bogan]

No Robert. Nobody in this thread has to prove anything. That is not what this is (was) about. It was very clearly about ideas, brainstroming. Not about reality. You are beating the same tired message over and over. We have understoood you. Thank you. Running a bike business in NZ is not for thoose who expect to carve gold with a knife. But see, nobody here did belive that to be the case. To keep on telling us: "It is fucking hard, you guys have no idea" is not what this thread is about. As it clearly is what you want us to know, how hard you work and how decent you are, why not start a thread re that?

This thread is, and always was. about what the customer would like. Not about how stupid we, the customers, are who do not realise that we can not have cheaper bits, better service, faster deliveries. In this thread we dont give a shit re reality, re some fucking volcano that stops airfreight, or that the bits that take 2 months to arrive are superior to Korean ones that are here inside 2 days.

I do not think you realise that you are doing your self no service by posting these tired posts on KB, and with your company details attached. Wonder what the result would be if I started a thread asking how many potential customers you have alienated with your ramblings???

Exactly the points I was trying to get across If only you had threatened that when he first started butting in , would have been a good thread then.

[Morcs]

I woulda thought running a bike shop in NZ would be about the lifestyle aspect rather than profits. Even if you only make a decent enough wage to make a reasonable living, whilst going to work doing something you love, would be the reason you would do it.

[DMNTD:Me]

I woulda thought running a bike shop in NZ would be about the lifestyle aspect rather than profits. Even if you only make a decent enough wage to make a reasonable living, whilst going to work doing something you love, would be the reason you would do it.

Heh! Ironically it has almost put me off bikes several times.
Imagine being in lust with some super model...then imagine being around her 55+hours per week.
I can assure you that the bitch would get 'old' real quick!

[T.W.R]

The reality is I bear no malice whatsoever with you. I cannot be bothered dredging through to find out who said what but whatever it was Ive lost no sleep. I dont recall meeting you personally (not that I have the foggiest idea who you are and also place myself at a disadvantage in that respect ).

No malice here either, but the general tone of responses to valid posts put up you attempt to place yourself above the poster you're replying to....your reply to the explaination of McDonalds business ethic litterally was saying that the approach had no bearing in relation to this industry....supply & demand in both respects & marketing are exactly the same.....product for the consumer and competing for market share are the same no matter what the product

I just happen to disagree with a few things that you have said and have challenged that, in fact there are a few things that you have said that I also agree with. But I certainly dont have a pin cushion modelled on you!!!.

Ditto

Linear fork springs and emulators are made by Race Tech and my beloved viking mates make nothing for that bike. Yes indeed most people would choose to limit their expenditure on a 30 year old trailbike, no argument with that mindset. But its also fair to point out that not all of us subscribe ( for example only! ) to a 1970s mentality of ''preload the springs with a few coins or washers and throw heavy oil in it'' You would actually be surprised at the number of people that actually are prepared to upspec the suspension ( or whatever ) on their seemingly worthless old bikes..

who said anything about that mentality....see this is one of the issues I have with you....you try to belittle another poster by taking the negative perception approach and using it as your arguement for what you believe is the positive.

The reality is a persons bike is their bike, their ride, & their joy be it 1yr old or 50yrs old. Some people are realistic about their expenditure on their bikes and it's their right to do so, some people can afford to spend lots & some can't and then there's a majority who sit in the middle ground aswell.
Most know what they'd like to fit to their bikes and some have no idea. Some will understand the benefits of better components & make full use of that extra bit of quality....there's also a lot who can afford the top line items and readily throw these bits at their bikes and still couldn't ride a hot knife into butter to save themselves.
Some people have budgets they have to work around, know what they'd like to have but are realistic about what they can afford and what benefits they'll actually achieve from their expenditure.
Once apon a time Motorcycling was about Motorcycling....now days it's more a fashion statement with all the big name bling items that the market pushes on the general motorcycling populous.

Just as one example I currently have a 75 RM250 in my workshop that Im about to custom build a set of Ohlins twin shocks for at a little over 2k, front fork internals upgrade at maybe a little under or a little over 1k. And also a 82 Maico that the guy initially took the cheap option with and installed a shock made in Thailand. The guy who sold it to him was ''pushing the product'' but it failed to deliver!!!!! It nearly killed him so hes now doing it properly and at both ends. So he probably thinks it wasnt too bright listening in the first place to the guy pushing the dodgy Thai made shocks.
These bikes have got value to the customers, so each to their own.
There does seem to be a bit of ''sport'' going on in this forum of condemning people who are prepared to spend the time and money to do things properly. Each to their own.

Be honest here...these examples are both VMX bikes and completely evident from the context of the paragraph both are intended to used as such....pretty different to a guy just asking what fork oil & what capacity to put in a trailbike.

It's dealing with each customer as an individual and dealing with their individual needs and respecting what they want, advice can be given freely but advice in the wrong form can manipulate the individual too

[Robert Taylor]

No Robert. Nobody in this thread has to prove anything. That is not what this is (was) about. It was very clearly about ideas, brainstroming. Not about reality. You are beating the same tired message over and over. We have understoood you. Thank you. Running a bike business in NZ is not for thoose who expect to carve gold with a knife. But see, nobody here did belive that to be the case. To keep on telling us: "It is fucking hard, you guys have no idea" is not what this thread is about. As it clearly is what you want us to know, how hard you work and how decent you are, why not start a thread re that?

This thread is, and always was. about what the customer would like. Not about how stupid we, the customers, are who do not realise that we can not have cheaper bits, better service, faster deliveries. In this thread we dont give a shit re reality, re some fucking volcano that stops airfreight, or that the bits that take 2 months to arrive are superior to Korean ones that are here inside 2 days.

I do not think you realise that you are doing your self no service by posting these tired posts on KB, and with your company details attached. Wonder what the result would be if I started a thread asking how many potential customers you have alienated with your ramblings???

Not too many by the look of it given the workload. And I reject much of what you have said as I was merely infusing some reality into some ideas that ( to be kind ) were a little bit off the wall.
One big point of difference is that while saying exactly what I think I put my name to it.

[Robert Taylor]

No malice here either, but the general tone of responses to valid posts put up you attempt to place yourself above the poster you're replying to....your reply to the explaination of McDonalds business ethic litterally was saying that the approach had no bearing in relation to this industry....supply & demand in both respects & marketing are exactly the same.....product for the consumer and competing for market share are the same no matter what the product





Ditto



who said anything about that mentality....see this is one of the issues I have with you....you try to belittle another poster by taking the negative perception approach and using it as your arguement for what you believe is the positive.

The reality is a persons bike is their bike, their ride, & their joy be it 1yr old or 50yrs old. Some people are realistic about their expenditure on their bikes and it's their right to do so, some people can afford to spend lots & some can't and then there's a majority who sit in the middle ground aswell.
Most know what they'd like to fit to their bikes and some have no idea. Some will understand the benefits of better components & make full use of that extra bit of quality....there's also a lot who can afford the top line items and readily throw these bits at their bikes and still couldn't ride a hot knife into butter to save themselves.
Some people have budgets they have to work around, know what they'd like to have but are realistic about what they can afford and what benefits they'll actually achieve from their expenditure.
Once apon a time Motorcycling was about Motorcycling....now days it's more a fashion statement with all the big name bling items that the market pushes on the general motorcycling populous.



Be honest here...these examples are both VMX bikes and completely evident from the context of the paragraph both are intended to used as such....pretty different to a guy just asking what fork oil & what capacity to put in a trailbike.

It's dealing with each customer as an individual and dealing with their individual needs and respecting what they want, advice can be given freely but advice in the wrong form can manipulate the individual too

And thats exactly what we do, deal with each customers requirements. With respect to that TT250 guy I was merely pointing out that he could make those forks a LOT better, his choice in the end.
We had a guy several months back who wanted to spend over 2k on his GB500 with custom build Ohlins piggybacks and fork upgrade. We didnt manipulate him into it as we tried to sell him cheaper single tube shocks. His bike was worth 2k, if lucky. Each to their own.
How about those that ''can ride to save themselves'' and can afford those ''blingy bits'' that god forbid actually improve function?

[R-Soul]

Heh! Ironically it has almost put me off bikes several times.
Imagine being in lust with some super model...then imagine being around her 55+hours per week.
I can assure you that the bitch would get 'old' real quick!

heh yeah like they say: "It doesn't matter how hot she is - someone, somewhere, is putting up with her shit!"

[steve_t]

heh yeah like they say: "It doesn't matter how hot she is - someone, somewhere, is sick of putting up with her shit!"

Fixed it for ya

[lakedaemonian]

As predicted this has turned into yet another "Stupid customers don't deserve the industry" thread.

What I already get from the bike shops and really like:

Friendly service
So far a good follow up rate on the commitments that are important to me
Occasional use of the steam cleaner
Coffee when I just pop in for a chat and they are quiet
Organised rides and events than I am invited to
Being told by the workshop of issues that are likely to crop up with my bike in the near future
Dealing with the same guy that I bought a bike off 25 years ago
I was impressed when buying gear for The Moll that there was a biker chick working there that could understand all the chick stuff


What I'd really like to see:
Much more selection of gear, most places seem to stock entry level and top end stuff, with not much middle of the range. I'm not worried about it being in my size, just being able to look at it, feel it, gauge the quality etc. Then with a tape measure check the size and get the right one in, within a timeframe of say a week or two. Before I go in I will already have an idea of online prices and if the shop doesn't compare I will say so there and then, rather than sneakily taking the measurements etc and ordering online as suggested by some on here.

What I really don't like:
Being looked down on by twerps in "status" shops
Being ignored while staff & mates huddle in the corner with coffee (I know I said earlier i like coffee & a chat, and I will always expect the staff to leave their chat and deal with a customer 1st - if they get busy actually making a living I will finish my coffee quietly and go, perhaps putting in a good word for them to the prospective buyer as I leave)
Cheap crap with a status symbol logo on it that costs twice as much as something decent.

Having said all of that I'm planning a trip to the states at end of year, does anybody know of a huge ass motorcycle superstore, (kind of like the bass pro shops, but for motorcycles, if anyone knows them) preferably in the South?

About an hour's drive from the Los Angeles Airport is a place called Bert's:

http://www.bertsmegamall.com/

I think they are the biggest non-Harley dealer in the US, possibly the world....I visited last July to see if there was anything to learn.

When I went there in July, 2009 the only time a staff member approached to talk to me was to tell me to stop taking photographs of their Honda Fury.

Down south, the only one's I know of are Harley-centric dealerships such as:

Bruce Rossmeyer Chain of HD Dealerships:

http://www.brucerossmeyer.com/

Barnett's HD in Texas:

http://www.barnettharley.com/


I hear ya on the Bass Pro shops...I went to the one in Nashville in 2007...not their biggest store, but the staff and selection was awesome...it was Christmas in July.

On the other hand, I was in Bass Pro mega Store on the way to the Denver Airport last year and the only things I wanted (fairly high volume generic items like .223 & .308 bore snakes and a popular common Leupold VX scope) I was told, we're out of stock by not very helpful staff.

The lesson I learned there is biggest definitely doesn't make best

I hope you have a great trip.....please let us know about your experiences in US motorbike dealership upon your return.

I think this is a great thread...while there may be a couple customer misconceptions about the current structure of NZ motorbike dealers....it's feedback and perceptions that aren't always easy to elicit from customers.

So rather than jumping in with my own industry opinion, I'm just going to see if there's anything I can pick up on for my business to mull over.

Funnily enough, a couple of the items mentioned so far provide some additional anecodatal support for an internal project we have been working on.

Customer/industry feedback that isn't emotionally charged, but well framed and considered in opinion is always a good thing.

Just my 0.02c

[R-Soul]

Fixed it for ya

right - what he said...

edit: it loses the effect somewhat without a really hot girl posing semi naked - so that you can take a step back from looking at her and think about it...

[Morcs]

Heh! Ironically it has almost put me off bikes several times.
Imagine being in lust with some super model...then imagine being around her 55+hours per week.
I can assure you that the bitch would get 'old' real quick!

I do know what you mean.
I quit one of my hobbies as i do it full time as a job now... lol

[aff-man]

Sourcing parts for my ZX6RR
parts from a shop in the states $450 NZD which includes shipping.
Parts from shop here $740.....

If the kwaka shop in the states has a mark up and i'm paying for pretty good freight (as in they could get cheaper freight for bulk orders) they are making a lot of cream..

[Robert Taylor]

Sourcing parts for my ZX6RR
parts from a shop in the states $450 NZD which includes shipping.
Parts from shop here $740.....

If the kwaka shop in the states has a mark up and i'm paying for pretty good freight (as in they could get cheaper freight for bulk orders) they are making a lot of cream..

No thats an assumption, I know what dealer markup is on genuine parts. Its okay but nothing sensational. Dont blame the dealer!

Now rework your $US costings as if the current exchange rate was 60 cents and maybe even 55 cents.

Have you factored any clearance charges at the border and gst? Probably at that dollar value it wouldnt be accorded those, thats pretty unfair when commercial operators always incur those costs.