Police killing us again!

[Biggles08]

Edit: By the way, your rant and finger pointing should lay with the New Zealand justice department, not the officer. He was charged, stood trial, and his sentence handed down.

I quote myself from an earlier post Whitetrash (oh and underline and bold for your eyes to focus better):

"My comments are based solely on the 'appearance' of justice being done (or lack of) rather than bagging on about the cop being an idiot (in which he clearly is). I am not stating all cops are like this and indeed I personally believe this particular one is an exception to the rule. My anger in this whole situation is the Judgment handed down by the judge. It is an insult to the value he placed on human life and more so an insult directly at the family of Paul Brown, regardless of Paul's choices good or bad."

I think you will find we agree on this subject if you read carefully.

[Jack Miller]

Didn't say that. Trying to put forward a different point of view on a public forum is all. Bad decisions were made, some people paid a higher price than others. That's not to say constable dibble hasn't paid a fairly hefty price in the daily knowledge he alone paid the deciding part in another man losing his life.

So do you agree with the judge reducing the charge and the $250 penalty or not?

[Jack Miller]

Yes you can, you clown.

Once the braking has started, the braking distance covered is the same whether started from a "calm" state or a "paniced" state.

The distance left over is the distance you can be as paniced as you like in.

Unless your panicked state causes you to lock up or otherwise stop imperfectly.

[Katman]

Unless your panicked state causes you to lock up or otherwise stop imperfectly.

Let's not forget that in this instance we're talking about a motorcyclist to whom extreme braking technique would have been second nature.

[Kickaha]

The PIG however does this move once & is currently at a 1-1 kill ratio... Safety???

You're assuming he had only done it once to get the 1-1 he could have pulled the same maneuver hundreds or thousands of times over in his time in the job

Rather than pushing learn from your fuk ups you only ever push the biker is wrong.

You must be fairly thick if you think that is Katmans message

The investigator said that at 101 k and he couldn't have stopped in time

It has been quoted on here that he said "may not have been able to stop in time"" that is a lot different than "couldn't"

[FJRider]

Let's not forget that in this instance we're talking about a motorcyclist to whom extreme braking technique would have been second nature.

Unless his braking "option" was not his first choice of action ... He left 30 odd metres(I stand to be corrected on this) of skid-mark ... and still hit the patrol car with enough force to send him a further 70 metres down the road. Not something I would expect from one which "extreme braking is second nature"

His first view of the patrol car would have been of the disco's (even over the crest of a hill would easily be seen before the actual car could be seen)... and guessed they were for him. Avoidence of being stopped would (in my opinion) have been his first choice.

[BoristheBiter]

And the other paid with a $250 fine. It doesn't seem right that the penalty for a road safety professional guilty of making a mistake which lead to the loss of a life wasn't something a bit more in keeping with what you or I would expect for a mistake with such a serious consequence, from someone that we should expect better from.

My idea of leniency would have been something like $2500 fine & 3 months loss of license. I would consider that a very lenient judgement indeed, but maybe reasonably fair in this case. A $250 fine just doesn't come close to justice appearing to be done, IMO.

I agree with what you are saying but until other drivers are handed out this sort of sentence then there is nothing more to say in this case. Regardless of what his occupation is, regardless of the reason why he tried to do a u-turn he made a bad decision like many motorists do every day.

The whole justice system is fucked, we all know that. Just like when scum get let off with community service for bashing cops, others get off for bashing and killing their, or others, kids.

So maybe instead of bagging the police maybe you should have a go at the courts and the sentences handed down in all cases.

[Gearup]

yeah on here as there are alot of X sperts

Ya don't have to be an Xpert to know that some things are just really wrong.

[Katman]

Ya don't have to be an Xpert to know that some things are just really wrong.

Widen your gaze a little.

It just gets worse.

[White trash]

I quote myself from an earlier post Whitetrash (oh and underline and bold for your eyes to focus better):

"My comments are based solely on the 'appearance' of justice being done (or lack of) rather than bagging on about the cop being an idiot (in which he clearly is). I am not stating all cops are like this and indeed I personally believe this particular one is an exception to the rule. My anger in this whole situation is the Judgment handed down by the judge. It is an insult to the value he placed on human life and more so an insult directly at the family of Paul Brown, regardless of Paul's choices good or bad."

I think you will find we agree on this subject if you read carefully.

Thanks bud, I'm seeing your point now thanks to the underlining. But only a little better.

[FJRider]

I think you will find we agree on this subject if you read carefully.

Perhaps ... those in court that heard ALL the evidence against him ... may choose to disagree ...

How many KB members were there ... in court ... to hear it ... ???

[White trash]

Unless his braking "option" was not his first choice of action ... He left 30 odd metres(I stand to be corrected on this) of skid-mark ... and still hit the patrol car with enough force to send him a further 70 metres down the road. Not something I would expect from one which "extreme braking is second nature"

Unless he was travelling FUCKING quickly of course.

His first view of the patrol car would have been of the disco's (even over the crest of a hill would easily be seen before the actual car could be seen)... and guessed they were for him. Avoidence of being stopped would (in my opinion) have been his first choice.

Maybe, maybe not.

Here's the deal, I'm not saying anyone is blameless, and that no one should be held accountable. But there's allways two sides to a story, and motorcyclists are notorious for only seeing their side of it.

I'll give you another scenario.

Parallel to Tinakori road in Thorndon is a street called Alexander Rd (I think). Anyway, I used to travel this road every day on my way home from work because it had less congestion. There's fuck all traffic on this oad and it's dead straight, with a really cool crest towards the northern end. I learned that at certain speed, you could do a pretty sweet jump off this crest on the way home from a hard days yaka at work. So one Friday evening, after a beer or two on my way home, I steadily hit 7K on the tach of my GSX400 twin in each gear towards the crest. 7K in 6th seemed to be the magic number for a sweet jump, you understand. So anyway, at 7K in 6th, I bust over the top of this crest, thinking I was Travis Pastrana before he was even born, to find a Toyota Starlet in the middle of the road. Hit the back of it before the wheels hit the ground, totaled my bike, the car and more importantly my wrist without having the chance to hit the picks. In my months of FMX practice, I'd never even noticed the tiny little church on the left or the driveway exiting just north of my take off ramp. The woman driving the car admitted she "hadn't seen me" before pulling out onto the road, and thinking back, how the fuck would she?

Anyway, had I been travelling at 50kph I probably still would have hit her car. It certainly wouldn't have been written off though. My bike would have possibly survived and my wrist, ulner and radius would be nowhere near as fucked as they are today.

Interestingly, we both faced careless use charges, hers causing injury. Which is fucked up, as there wouldn't have been an injury had I not been being a fuckwit. Poor bitch. As I was charged and convicted, as was she, our insurance companies decided neither was at fault and covered their own policy holder only.

If I'd have died, who'd be hung out to dry?

[blueblade]

The cop fucked up big time - no question about that.

The Judge fucked up big time also - most seem to agree about that.

To me the most important factor in this whole sorry saga is that the biker also fucked up big time.

If he had been doing somewhere around the legal limit, he might have avoided the collision totally or perhaps just ended up with a bent bike and a few bruises or broken bones.

If you continually approach blind corners or crests at very high speeds, leaving very little or no margin for evasive action, you will eventually come unstuck. Hopefully when that happens you will only hurt yourself and not some other road user.

If you have been out on the roads or following Kiwibiker over the past few years you will have seen many instances of so called "skilled or experienced" riders killing or seriously injuring themselves by ignoring this relatively simple and obvious fact.

I once shared the same piece of road with Mr Brown on a group ride. I was no angel and often enjoyed some very "spirited" riding - having done numerous track days on both high powered sports bikes and motards.

The riding and passing manoevers I saw on that particular ride put the shits up me to the extent that I backed right out and spent the majority of the ride well and truly on my own.

I have seen first hand one mate killed in a high speed head on that resulted in injury to others. I dont ever want to be a witness to anything like that again.

If they were honest, I dont think any of Pauls mates would be particularly surprised that he died on a motorcycle. Yes - the circumstances are tragic and unforgivable as it relates to the cops actions - but I think that its almost more of a shame that those circumstances should overshadow what should be the bigger message from this event.

Motorcyclists should stop using the road as a race track and ride with a very big margin of safety up their sleeves - to cover those unexpected and sometimes idiotic things that will continue to happen out there.

I learned my lessons the hard way but was lucky enough to survive (and it was only luck!!!!)
After that I decided I would rather be around to kick a ball with my grandkids - rather than just a memory.

[Gearup]

Widen your gaze a little.

It just gets worse.

It would be a bit boring if we all agreed though.

[_Shrek_]

Ya don't have to be an Xpert to know that some things are just really wrong.

steady there Gearup, just trolling