Motorcycle accident myths - A public presentation on the facts

**shrub** · 10th May 2010, 13:39

Charley and one of his post graduate students undertook a very detailed and thorough study of the official crash analysis data collected by Police and have come to some interesting conclusions. Knowing how he works, he will welcome anyone challenging his findings, but they will need to really know their stuff or will be very quickly dispatched.

**mashman** · 10th May 2010, 13:43

I'd also love a listen... Could someone ask if his base data is available to joe public please?

**PirateJafa** · 10th May 2010, 14:55

Any spokesperson (Ixion, Mom, StoneY?) given the media a heads-up?

**R-Soul** · 10th May 2010, 15:14

Yeah I 'd be really keen on his observations.

HI VIS RULES!!

**Bass** · 10th May 2010, 16:08

Originally Posted by bogan

yes but single vehicle accidents caused by what? rider error, speed, road conditions, mechanical failure, largest single determinant relies heavily on how you group the determinants.

You miss my point. The excerpt quoted specifically excludes single vehicle events. I don't doubt that Charley is forthright and thorough, he always was. I am however querying a statement that infers a major determinant but excludes 45% of the available data.

Originally Posted by shrub

Charley and one of his post graduate students undertook a very detailed and thorough study of the official crash analysis data collected by Police and have come to some interesting conclusions. Knowing how he works, he will welcome anyone challenging his findings, but they will need to really know their stuff or will be very quickly dispatched.

I don't doubt it for a second. It's been decades since I spoke to him and he knows my Mum better than he knows me. I never knew that he was into bikes.
I cannot attend and would like to know more about what he has to say.

**bogan** · 10th May 2010, 16:28

Originally Posted by Bass

You miss my point. The excerpt quoted specifically excludes single vehicle events. I don't doubt that Charley is forthright and thorough, he always was. I am however querying a statement that infers a major determinant but excludes 45% of the available data.

hmmm, thats not how I read it, interview should clear it up though.

**shrub** · 10th May 2010, 17:16

Originally Posted by Bass

You miss my point. The excerpt quoted specifically excludes single vehicle events. I don't doubt that Charley is forthright and thorough, he always was. I am however querying a statement that infers a major determinant but excludes 45% of the available data.
.

I happen to know the study was based on a fairly exhaustive analysis of the crash analysis reports for every motorcycle accident in Auckland and ChCh in 2008. I think Charley is far too professional to exclude any relevant data.

**p.dath** · 10th May 2010, 17:20

I would love to attend, but can't. Could we please post up a set of slides or a web link? Could someone video it and put it up on YouTube?

**Squiggles** · 10th May 2010, 17:24

A vid of it would be great

**schrodingers cat** · 10th May 2010, 19:02

Looking forward with interest to this.

I hope I don't learn that I have to take some responsibility for my own actions tho. Hasn't the last decade taught us that everything is someone elses fault?

**Usarka** · 10th May 2010, 19:10

Originally Posted by schrodingers cat

I hope I don't learn that I have to take some responsibility for my own actions tho. Hasn't the last decade taught us that everything is someone elses fault?

You don't even know where you're going!

**shrub** · 10th May 2010, 21:24

Originally Posted by schrodingers cat

Hasn't the last decade taught us that everything is someone elses fault?

Yeah, the previous government's fault. Everything is their fault. Bastards.

**Berries** · 10th May 2010, 21:40

Originally Posted by Bass

However, this excerpt implies pretty strongly that he is dealing with multi vehicle accidents.

I agree, but many of the myths surround those crashes where another vehicle is involved and we are all quick to blame the car driver, when on closer reading perhaps the rider could have done one of several things to avoid becoming a statistic. Not sure if that is the aim of the talk but it would be good to be able to view the presentation, hopefully something can be posted in this thread after the event. I am sure he will clarify which crashes he is dealing with.

Originally Posted by Bass

My understanding is that in NZ anyway, about 45% of motorcycle accidents are single vehicle events.

Closer to 30% for NZ as a whole, but might be higher in larger urban areas like Chch and Dorkland. I posted a few numbers in another thread here which might be of interest - http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...post1129569477

**Bass** · 11th May 2010, 08:20

Originally Posted by shrub

I happen to know the study was based on a fairly exhaustive analysis of the crash analysis reports for every motorcycle accident in Auckland and ChCh in 2008. I think Charley is far too professional to exclude any relevant data.

I sincerely hope that you are right - I was simply commenting on the excerpt that you quoted. Often, we see negative comments about statistics and sadly, they are usually true because the stats have been misapplied. However, properly applied statistics is probably the most powerful analysis tool that I have ever been given and so I would welcome a rigorous analysis of the available data.

Originally Posted by Berries

I agree, but many of the myths surround those crashes where another vehicle is involved and we are all quick to blame the car driver, when on closer reading perhaps the rider could have done one of several things to avoid becoming a statistic. Not sure if that is the aim of the talk but it would be good to be able to view the presentation, hopefully something can be posted in this thread after the event. I am sure he will clarify which crashes he is dealing with.

Closer to 30% for NZ as a whole, but might be higher in larger urban areas like Chch and Dorkland. I posted a few numbers in another thread here which might be of interest - http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...post1129569477

I tend to agree with everything you say but you are asking for us to take responsibility for our own actions - that's not going to happen, is it?
The data you quote is useful, thank you. However, it is injury accident data and not all accident data

**Mom** · 11th May 2010, 08:25

Originally Posted by shrub

A detailed analysis of the New Zealand Ministry of Transport accident data questions the commonly held view of what is causing New Zealand’s motorcycle accidents

Unable to attend for geographical reasons but would be really keen to have a transcript of this speech if possible. Wonder if you could let me have some contact details for Mr Lamb so I can approach him directly?

Originally Posted by PirateJafa

Any spokesperson (Ixion, Mom, StoneY?) given the media a heads-up?

I have no doubt there will be media there.