Motorcycle accident myths - A public presentation on the facts

[Mom]

A detailed analysis of the New Zealand Ministry of Transport accident data questions the commonly held view of what is causing New Zealand’s motorcycle accidents

Unable to attend for geographical reasons but would be really keen to have a transcript of this speech if possible. Wonder if you could let me have some contact details for Mr Lamb so I can approach him directly?

Any spokesperson (Ixion, Mom, StoneY?) given the media a heads-up?

I have no doubt there will be media there.

[Flip]

Who is organising this?

What's the catch?

Who is paying for the band and hall so what else is going on here, there is no such thing as a free lunch.

[shrub]

Who is organising this?

What's the catch?

Who is paying for the band and hall so what else is going on here, there is no such thing as a free lunch.

Charley is organising this, and paying any costs - why? Because he thinks it's important to get the full story out there.

[bogan]

Charley is organising this, and paying any costs - why? Because he thinks it's important to get the full story out there.

good man! and on that note, will the figures he has gathered be released as well?

[Berries]

The data you quote is useful, thank you. However, it is injury accident data and not all accident data

Can post that tomorrow if you want it - MOT/Police crash data that is.

[Bass]

Can post that tomorrow if you want it - MOT/Police crash data that is.

I would be interested but I wonder how accurate/complete it is, given that there is no legal requirement to report non-injury accidents to the cops.

Is there actually any database out there that will have complete data?

[mikeey01]

I'll see if I can video it and post up on u-tube for those that can't attend but may need to see what he's on about.

It's worth a shot, I'll see what I can do for ys.

[mikeey01]

I'll ask Charley if that's possible.

If at all possible....
Can you ask if I can video it, setup lights etc.
Do you know how long his talk will be?

[Berries]

I would be interested but I wonder how accurate/complete it is, given that there is no legal requirement to report non-injury accidents to the cops.

Is there actually any database out there that will have complete data?

No. The insurance companies won't release their data to help provide a better picture so there will never be a true record of the number of incidents, even if you assume people claim on the insurance. Which they don't. Even if they have insurance. We assume all fatal crashes get reported but have factors to account for the under reporting of minor and even serious injury crashes (based on hospital data), as well as non injuries, which is something like 1:14. You basically have to go with what is available, which is the MOT database, knowing the deficiencies. That includes no requirement to report a crash that did not result in injury as you mentioned. It is massively flawed if you want to know accurate figures, but the best that is available.

Will stick the info in this post tomorrow.

[Bass]

No. The insurance companies won't release their data to help provide a better picture so there will never be a true record of the number of incidents, even if you assume people claim on the insurance. Which they don't. Even if they have insurance. We assume all fatal crashes get reported but have factors to account for the under reporting of minor and even serious injury crashes (based on hospital data), as well as non injuries, which is something like 1:14. You basically have to go with what is available, which is the MOT database, knowing the deficiencies. .

I thought that there might not be a complete database which is why I asked, but I didn't realise that the insurance companies refused to release data. That seems a bit strange to me but I can understand that it might be commercially sensitive.
It's a bit communist I know, but I wonder if there might not be a case to force them all to release the data.
Sorry but I'm a bit unclear on exactly what your 1:14 ratio refers to.
Is it injury:non-injury accidents?

[Maki]

“The largest single determinant of accidents is visibility issues affecting drivers of other vehicles involved in motorcycle accidents"

The largest SINGLE determinant. I reckon it is true. What I can not understand is why people ride around wearing black helmets, black clothes and bikes that are painted in dull colors. Are they just plain stupid or is something else driving their behavior?

[bogan]

“The largest single determinant of accidents is visibility issues affecting drivers of other vehicles involved in motorcycle accidents"

The largest SINGLE determinant. I reckon it is true. What I can not understand is why people ride around wearing black helmets yup, black clothes yup, with a bit of red on my jacketand bikes that are painted in dull colorsyup, but its shiney too!. Are they just plain stupid or is something else driving their behavior?

Do you wear high vis? And we have to have headlights on now so other motorist should see that before pulling out in front of us.

[davereid]

“The largest single determinant of accidents is visibility issues affecting drivers of other vehicles involved in motorcycle accidents"

Thats one of the things about his bluudy lights on law.

I always used my headlight as a warning device - flashing it at any car that I thought was, or could, turn into my path. Often I would see the motorist take a second look - I had achieved what I wanted which was their attention. Now the best I can manage is a "flick" onto HI which seems much less effective.

Same as my brake lights. The transition from OFF to BRIGHT used to be really noticeable. But now, it goes from park to brake, merely a change in intensity.

[Maki]

Nope, I don't wear hi vis but I have a brightly colored bike and helmet. I think it makes a world of difference compared to some fo the invisible people out there.

[bogan]

Nope, I don't wear hi vis but I have a brightly colored bike and helmet. I think it makes a world of difference compared to some fo the invisible people out there.

to a point yes, but its all a question of degree, how much is enough visibility? you cannot be bright enough to stop all motorists cutting you off (i was hit with light on, white bike, red jacket, sunny day with no glare), and there is still the looming effect even if they see you.

Thats one of the things about his bluudy lights on law.

I always used my headlight as a warning device - flashing it at any car that I thought was, or could, turn into my path. Often I would see the motorist take a second look - I had achieved what I wanted which was their attention. Now the best I can manage is a "flick" onto HI which seems much less effective.

Same as my brake lights. The transition from OFF to BRIGHT used to be really noticeable. But now, it goes from park to brake, merely a change in intensity.

yeh it seems a slippery slope when they start legislating us all to the lowest denominator for safety reasons, I sometimes have to bump start my bike so leave the headlight off to charge the baterry on my short commute, shouldn't do that anymore, please mr gubbermint, can I have some personal responsibility! /rant