what if you.....

[Rainbow Wizard]

An expert, tells me that the trial employment period has no real standing in law. Dismissal provisions still apply. And verbal agreements aren't worth the paper they're written on.
Basically, self-employed people are not protected by employment law. Why else are employers so keen to contract out.

Surely he must then be by default, an employee; and the employer is breaking the law by not having a written contract! Law's gotta be on your mates side surely. If not then the lawyer's letter is the way to go, civil suit stuff - damages and the like.

[ManDownUnder]

As above, On the first opportunity he has, he needs to give them a letter demanding signed copies of all and any evidence and/or testimony that they have against him, under threat of legal action.

Even though he may only be a trial basis, even if there isin't a single piece of paper that resembles a contract, he has rights guarding him against defamation - for those of us who live by our reputations, unwarranted slander can mean the end of a business that's taken years to build.

At the risk of being pedantic - use "request" in place of "demand". It'll change the whole tone of the thing, make them less offside etc. Of course you need to follow it up and it's an item you can put on the weekly meetings agenda.

Just make sure the Police get involved as soon as possible. They'll be more independant than the employer and your inviting them to the party will speak volumes to the employer... and put whoever actually is telling porkies on notice.

Don't get vindictive - this is your chance to come out looking like the white knight... proving your employer was wrong to accuse you, that you are cool and calm under pressure etc... they're likely to appreciate it in the long run unless there is the alterior motive of simply wanting to get rid of you.

MDU

[ManDownUnder]

Why else are employers so keen to contract out.

Because in NZ it's hard to dismiss staff without very good reason... one of which is you going to the wall financially.

If I have someone on contract their contract would end LONG before I ever went broke - I'd be an idiot to comtract out work to someone to the point where I knew my cashflow/bank balance was in peril

[Beemer]

I'd certainly be wanting the allegations brought out into the open and resolved or the mud will definitely stick to your friend. If he walks and the thieving continues, do you think they're going to ring him and say "whoops, sorry, looks like it wasn't you after all?" No way! He needs to know exactly what he is being accused of and by whom, and if they can't provide that detail, I would be advising them that if the allegations continue, or if my contract was suspended without any proof of wrongdoing on my part, I would be suing them for defamation.

As for verbal contracts, they can be enforced. I went after a job as an editor of a weekly newspaper years ago and was called on the Friday afternoon to say the job was mine and given a starting date. I was at Manfeild that weekend for a Stay Upright course so turned my mobile off while doing the theory session that night. When I turned it on again, there was a message from the woman who had offered me the job, saying they had made a mistake and they couldn't actually afford to employ me! I was (and still am, for this very reason) a member of the union so they contacted her and told her it was a breach of contract and she would have to pay me at least four weeks salary in compensation. Sure, I still didn't have the job, but at least I had the satisfaction of making her pay me for nothing!

[ajturbo]

my mate wishes me to pass on a great big thanks for all the CONSTRUCTIVE advice on this matter, i can tell you all that he is still very upset by the whole thing, also tomorrow is the end of his months trial, he has told me that ALL the customes cannot speek to highly of his workmanship, HONESTY in dealling with them and his naturel charm..(think he is blowing his own trumpet on that one ..hahahaha)

andy

[gav]

So what'd ya nick?

[ajturbo]

So what'd ya nick?

i feel like ..woops i mean my mate..... feels like taking their van and driving off to Matata and hope for a wee bit of rain ...

[ajturbo]

I'd certainly be wanting the allegations brought out into the open and resolved or the mud will definitely stick to your friend. If he walks and the thieving continues, do you think they're going to ring him and say "whoops, sorry, looks like it wasn't you after all?" No way! He needs to know exactly what he is being accused of and by whom, and if they can't provide that detail, I would be advising them that if the allegations continue, or if my contract was suspended without any proof of wrongdoing on my part, I would be suing them for defamation.

As for verbal contracts, they can be enforced. I went after a job as an editor of a weekly newspaper years ago and was called on the Friday afternoon to say the job was mine and given a starting date. I was at Manfeild that weekend for a Stay Upright course so turned my mobile off while doing the theory session that night. When I turned it on again, there was a message from the woman who had offered me the job, saying they had made a mistake and they couldn't actually afford to employ me! I was (and still am, for this very reason) a member of the union so they contacted her and told her it was a breach of contract and she would have to pay me at least four weeks salary in compensation. Sure, I still didn't have the job, but at least I had the satisfaction of making her pay me for nothing!

hahahha.... sounds like a job i got a few years ago... then got a letter saying i didn't.. i didn't push the issue as i was the wrong colour...................and they would have just reclaimed it back some other way...

[texmo]

Same thing happened to a firend he shurgged it off until they fired im he took them to court sued them for defomation, firing him with out proof and a few other things he got $15k out of it.

[ajturbo]

I reckon there probably is someone flogging stuff, but its someone else. Your friend is just being used as a target as he is the new guy...

no they are pointing the finger at ...my "mate" seams he has been booking stuf up and not using it all..... see where this is going..... but my "mate" just said, have they looked in my work van yet??? anything he didn't use is in there!!!

fuck em!!!

[ajturbo]

Same thing happened to a firend he shurgged it off until they fired im he took them to court sued them for defomation, firing him with out proof and a few other things he got $15k out of it.

mmmmm me thinks my "mate " may just go and see someone... $$$$ that'll piss them off... but i don't think there is much hope ... the boss is a lady and has chosen her works VERY carefully........

[ManDownUnder]

mmmmm me thinks my "mate " may just go and see someone... $$$$ that'll piss them off... but i don't think there is much hope ... the boss is a lady and has chosen her works VERY carefully........

If they are in writing - I'd lopve to see them (PM or email if poss).

I like picking holes in words... call it a hobby...

Course if you want to let it lie I respect that too - it's easy for me - it's not really my battle...
MDU

[ajturbo]

If they are in writing - I'd lopve to see them (PM or email if poss).

I like picking holes in words... call it a hobby...

Course if you want to let it lie I respect that too - it's easy for me - it's not really my battle...
MDU

WILL do!!!
I wanted to finish the job i started and the boss said yes... so nice of her eh... but i have done all the hard work ... sanding etc .. and for someone else to come in and do the easy stuff ....... make it look good...... stuff them!!

but the lady also wants her windows done inside....... and i'm such a nice man, she may just want me to paint them for her..... and not the "other " team...