Are you registering your bike?

[davereid]

That's right. Nobody thinks that the levies are fair but they were increased to address the fact that accidents involving bike riders on average cost significantly more than those which don't. The concept is called sharing the load. Similar principle to the tax and welfare system.

Factually incorrect. In fact motorcycle injuries cost less on average than the injuries of other road users.

There are always those that don't want to share the load. They generally don't make good team players because they are only out for themselves. Dole bludgers and benefit fraudsters fit in the same category. Self centered blood sucking freeloading good for fuck all parasites. Thanks for increasing my burden

Also incorrect. I am very prepared to share the load.

But I am being asked to carry most of it, not just a share.

[flyingcrocodile46]

Factually incorrect. In fact motorcycle injuries cost less on average than the injuries of other road users.

It depends on how you tally the cost. Try dividing the total cost by the number of registered bikes and do the same for cars. Riding unregistered bikes makes it even worse and will likely be used to further the increases.

Also incorrect. I am very prepared to share the load.

But I am being asked to carry most of it, not just a share.

Actually it was not an incorrect statement. Try re-reading it as it was written

[mashman]

Probably because cars account for way more than 75% of vehicles on the road.

That's a poor excuse. How many pedestrians had road injuries in 2009? Less than motorcyclists. How many pedestrians are there? An injury is an injury. there's still a person riding or driving a vehicle, the vehicle type is secondary in my book and shouldn't be used as a financial punishment.

As for risk. For a laugh: 3,000,000 cars. 100,000 motorcycles. 20000 road incidents.

30 cars for every motorcycle (78% injury of all road injuries and likely higher for all incidents) . Chances of a car being in an incident 1 in every 150 incidents, chances of a motorcycle being in an incident 1 in every 20000 incidents. I'd rather stay on a bike please

[flyingcrocodile46]

That's a poor excuse.

So is comprehension failure and denial of established facts by way of substitution with unsupported theory.

Proof of 100,000 registered motorcycles please??? even so that is only 3.3% of road users. so if your figures are correct (78% of accident for cars??) are bikes (3.3%) responsible for the other 23%? Something is wrong with that logic if that is what you mean?

[mashman]

So is comprehension failure and denial of established facts by way of substitution with unsupported theory.

What established facts? What unsupported theory?

Would you think that more or less motorcycles would actually make a difference?

[flyingcrocodile46]

What established facts? What unsupported theory?

Would you think that more or less motorcycles would actually make a difference?

I was prepared to accept that your initial statement (below) may have been based in some fact (as you said it was fact)

Nooo no no no. An injury is an injury (THEY COST THE SAME), you can get injured just as badly, if not worse in a car incident. The only thing they can "risk" us for, and it looks like that's how they calculate the levy, is being more at risk because we have less safety gear and that we have a high number of crashes per user in our user group (hard to avoid with such a small user group and such a HUGE number of cars). The FACT that cars cause over 75% of ALL road injuries doesn't seem to concern ACC or TPTB. Why not?

Then take your 75% from the 100% and that leaves 25% caused by 3.3% of registered road users... or are some of that 25% made up by cyclists and pedestrians?


This however appears to be non factual theory

That's a poor excuse. How many pedestrians had road injuries in 2009? Less than motorcyclists. How many pedestrians are there? An injury is an injury. there's still a person riding or driving a vehicle, the vehicle type is secondary in my book and shouldn't be used as a financial punishment.

As for risk. For a laugh: 3,000,000 cars. 100,000 motorcycles. 20000 road incidents.

30 cars for every motorcycle (78% injury of all road injuries and likely higher for all incidents) . Chances of a car being in an incident 1 in every 150 incidents, chances of a motorcycle being in an incident 1 in every 20000 incidents. I'd rather stay on a bike please

And in answer to your question in your last post...

Would you think that more or less motorcycles would actually make a difference?

Funnily enough I rather imagine that more bikes will equal more accidents involving bikes. I know that may seem strange to you, but try to imagine how many accidents would involve bikes if there weren't any on the road then work from there.

[bogan]

heres some numbers! (oh i do like numbers )

unregestered bike % oct 2009 15.791, oct 2010 16.039 thats a 0.248% rise in unregistered bikes. Don't think thats going to put up all the levies for the rest of us.

2010 licensed bikes (including on hold)
scoots 32,471
bikes 112,772

total excluding bike on hold (but including scoots)
about 121,000 depending on the month.

So are you registering your bike, the overwhelming answer is however next year when the changes actually kick in for us organised folks I expect there to be a few more on hold

[flyingcrocodile46]

heres some numbers! (oh i do like numbers )

Heh! and you even appear to know how to quote them so they don't make you look like an ass.

I've had enough of this. It's too much like having a logical debate with women.

[pc220]

Probably because cars account for way more than 75% of vehicles on the road.



If you are paying your rego for your bikes only while you are riding them (i.e putting them on hold when not using them) then we are taking the same approach. So I am guessing that your observation re 'liking' being bent over, is something you have decided that you are qualified to assess and comment on eh!
Oh yeah! you sure are a 'Stand up dude'

I didnt say I wasnt using it, just not enough to justify the rego cost over that period. So over a 12 month period I am paying no more than under the old fees.

[Conquiztador]

This was about "Are you registering your bike?" I am almost 100% certain that this means "Are you paying the license fee?" as registration is done when you enter the bike in the system and the bike will stay registered until you cancel it (take in the plates) or the license has been unpaid (not put on hold) for 12 months.

The argument here for not paying the license tends to be that the increase in the fee (as a reult of the higher ACC fee) for bikes has gone up unfairly and too much. After all, that was what we protested against a year ago when we rode to Wellington.

I would almost bet on that each and everyone here are prepared to pay their share of the license fee including their share of the ACC fee. IF this all was fair. I can see that the brainwashing that the gummint has entered in to is working. Suddenly many here is "accepting" that as riding a bike is more dangerous we bikers should pay more. That so many of you are prepared to swallow this saddens me. This is NOT about an insurance scheme. This IS about the NZ ACC. ACC was ALWAYS supposed to be about that we all pay the same and when someone needs it it is there for them. This is now slowly being eroded and brainwashed out of everyone. Considering that the NZ ACC has more than once been considered the best setup in the world one can only conclude that this is done purely for sefish reasons: To sell of ACC as an insurance to bolster the gummints coffers so the end of period finances look good enough so that they will stay in power one more term allowing them to sell of other assets. KiwiBank is next in line.

As a result I have one bike paid up, but I pay in 3 months lots. No need to give them more than that to get interest of. The rest of my bikes are either unregistered or on hold and will stay so.

[red mermaid]

So with roughly 1 in 6 bikes not registered, does that mean that those people who are registering there bikes currently are paying extra for those that aren't?

Or in percentages, an extra 16% of the licence fee they pay, equating to $84.60 for an over 600 cc bike.

If this is correct, then thanks you bludgers unless of course you injure yourselves and then dont use the medical services I pay for.

heres some numbers! (oh i do like numbers )

unregestered bike % oct 2009 15.791, oct 2010 16.039 thats a 0.248% rise in unregistered bikes. Don't think thats going to put up all the levies for the rest of us.

2010 licensed bikes (including on hold)
scoots 32,471
bikes 112,772

total excluding bike on hold (but including scoots)
about 121,000 depending on the month.

So are you registering your bike, the overwhelming answer is however next year when the changes actually kick in for us organised folks I expect there to be a few more on hold

[pc220]

Heh! and you even appear to know how to quote them so they don't make you look like an ass.

I've had enough of this. It's too much like having a logical debate with women.

Grammer Police please. Logical and woman can never be used in the same sentence.

[Bonez]

Grammer Police please. Logical and woman can never be used in the same sentence.

Goodness and what's your excuse?

[mashman]

I was prepared to accept that your initial statement (below) may have been based in some fact (as you said it was fact)

I've had the numbers from several sources. You could have found them yourself instead of assuming that I hadn't already

Page 16 Year 2009. Actual figures for - TYPE OF ROAD USER KILLED AND INJURED YEAR ENDING 31 DECEMBER

Cars: 8017
Passengers: 3370
Above Combined: 11387
Motorcycles: 1369
Other: 1758
Total: 14541

What's the percentage of car/passenger combined (they are car accidents) as a total of all road user injuries?

They have a similar figure for road deaths also.

Why would I care how many of them there are. There are people inside or on top that are guiding and pointing their vehicle of choice. They're the ones that are doing the damage. I think there should be less of them on the roads. Their figures prove them to be a menace.

Motorcyclists do have a few issue to address, I agree.

[mashman]

heres some numbers! (oh i do like numbers )

unregestered bike % oct 2009 15.791, oct 2010 16.039 thats a 0.248% rise in unregistered bikes. Don't think thats going to put up all the levies for the rest of us.

2010 licensed bikes (including on hold)
scoots 32,471
bikes 112,772

total excluding bike on hold (but including scoots)
about 121,000 depending on the month.

So are you registering your bike, the overwhelming answer is however next year when the changes actually kick in for us organised folks I expect there to be a few more on hold

Did you get those numbers for cars?