Racing - relative risks? (Split thread)

[Edbear]

I don't want to sound critical of one who was so obviously a nice guy and well liked and respected, but I have a question that perhaps only those who race can answer. Perhaps, too, I am influenced by my own recent crash and the fact that I very nearly died.

I understand, as a rider, the thrill and enjoyment of riding and too, of going fast, so I fully understand the love of racing by those who race, and I do watch the MotoGP. However, most racing is done on race tracks which are designed for it and it is rare for a rider to be killed on the track due to the safety features. The IoM TT is a notoriously hazardous circuit and the number of deaths and serious injuries testify to the heightened risk of racing in such an environment.

My question, as a husband and father, is regarding the wisdom of placing oneself at needless risk in light of the real chance of bereaving one's family. How are the children expected to feel and cope with the loss of their father? The potential consequences would stop me from pursuing activities that greatly increase the risk of death or serious injury.


Please don't rabbit on about daily risks. I am suffering a broken back and the guilt - even though not my fault - of nearly dying and thus bereaving my own family. Rather, I'm referring to choosing an activity that greatly increases the risk when one has family responsibilities which should be one's first priority.

[Edbear]

Mate there's a time and a place for questions like that...............this is neither of them.

Sorry I don't mean to offend, I'm just saddened by the premature death of such an obviously well liked person.

[Vegetableman]

Whilst I can see your argument I would say you have to be your own person.
Yes, in this case it does cause alot of sadness to the family and friends. However to me this is better than waking up one morning in 30 or 40 years time thinking 'I wish I had done...'
I think families would rather if they had to loose a loved one it would be in a situation where the family member died doing something they felt so strongly about.
Not to lessen in any way the impact this is having, just my personal feelings on the matter.
To quote Andy Dufresne (Not sure of the original speaker) 'Get busy living, or get busy dying.'

[PirateJafa]

Edmund Hillary should have stayed safely in front of his fireplace, sipping hot cocoa, yes. For his family's sake.

Robin Knox-Johnston should have kept living on his yacht, tied safely up in England. Rather than becoming the first person ever to sail around the world non-stop, by himself.

Charles Lindbergh should have stayed as a small-time airmail pilot, rather than becoming the first person to fly solo across the Atlantic.

And don't even get me started on Christopher Columbus. That "discovering the New World" shit be dangerous!

Not everyone gets a kick out of crochet, I'm afraid.

[miloking]

I don't want to sound critical of one who was so obviously a nice guy and well liked and respected, but I have a question that perhaps only those who race can answer. Perhaps, too, I am influenced by my own recent crash and the fact that I very nearly died.

I understand, as a rider, the thrill and enjoyment of riding and too, of going fast, so I fully understand the love of racing by those who race, and I do watch the MotoGP. However, most racing is done on race tracks which are designed for it and it is rare for a rider to be killed on the track due to the safety features. The IoM TT is a notoriously hazardous circuit and the number of deaths and serious injuries testify to the heightened risk of racing in such an environment.

My question, as a husband and father, is regarding the wisdom of placing oneself at needless risk in light of the real chance of bereaving one's family. How are the children expected to feel and cope with the loss of their father? The potential consequences would stop me from pursuing activities that greatly increase the risk of death or serious injury.


Please don't rabbit on about daily risks. I am suffering a broken back and the guilt - even though not my fault - of nearly dying and thus bereaving my own family. Rather, I'm referring to choosing an activity that greatly increases the risk when one has family responsibilities which should be one's first priority.

Why dont you race cages instead until the kids are 18 and then if you are still up for it you can go back to racing bikes.....either way its your choice to make, whether you going to live your whole life based on caring for others or by living it your way...still there is always a third option.

[blackdog]

I don't want to sound critical of one who was so obviously a nice guy and well liked and respected, but I have a question that perhaps only those who race can answer. Perhaps, too, I am influenced by my own recent crash and the fact that I very nearly died.

I understand, as a rider, the thrill and enjoyment of riding and too, of going fast, so I fully understand the love of racing by those who race, and I do watch the MotoGP. However, most racing is done on race tracks which are designed for it and it is rare for a rider to be killed on the track due to the safety features. The IoM TT is a notoriously hazardous circuit and the number of deaths and serious injuries testify to the heightened risk of racing in such an environment.

My question, as a husband and father, is regarding the wisdom of placing oneself at needless risk in light of the real chance of bereaving one's family. How are the children expected to feel and cope with the loss of their father? The potential consequences would stop me from pursuing activities that greatly increase the risk of death or serious injury.


Please don't rabbit on about daily risks. I am suffering a broken back and the guilt - even though not my fault - of nearly dying and thus bereaving my own family. Rather, I'm referring to choosing an activity that greatly increases the risk when one has family responsibilities which should be one's first priority.

we must do that which we love

[Headbanger]

Follow your own road, leave others to ride theirs.

[Mystic13]

If you want to minimise risks that would mean giving up driving, going for swims at surf beaches, etc.

The IoM TT is a challenge and were it scheduled pretty much anywhere else in the world would probably be gone.

Some people choose to LIVE more than others. I ride motorcycles because I love it and the feeling I get from it.

We did a family skydive last year for the first time. My kids 16,14 and 9 decided to jump and my 15 year old decided not to. My 9 year old made his own choice and loved it. personally I really wanted to say to him "no I'm not letting you do it" and came close. I was wrapped to see him touch down safely.

I think it's part of being human to LIVE LIFE to the level that you want to.

I had a guy in his late 50's admiring my bike and as we got to talk you could see the passion he had for bikes and really wanting one. I then learnt he hadn't ridden. He explained when he was younger his mum wouldn't let him. So I said so why don't you learn now. He replied "my wife won't let me". Now that's not living.

The funny thing is as a parent I can see what my kids are like. The 15 year old (who didn't jump) is most likely to have money problems, relationship problems and I think will choose to have a tougher life. Her fears and being limited by what others think seems to me to be more of a problem. I don't for one minute think she should be more adventurous because me and my wife are.

[CHOPPA]

I was thinking the same thing and i personally would never ride there although i sorta want to.

It put things into perspective when i read Pauls wifes press release. That race ultimately cost him his life but on the flipside it seemed that it was a huge part of his life and sorta what he lived for. His wife said that for the other 48 weeks of each year they would be planning the next years event so it was a family thing, obviously they had talked about the risks as a family and had decided that if the worst was to happen that his ashes remained at the place he loved and that his death should not be mourned but his life celebrated. It put things into perspective for me....

Racing was his and his familys life.....

[scott411]

im with CHoppa on this one, i would never race at the Isle of Man, but i respect the rights of those that want to, although i think someone with a family and children should take those risks into account it is ultimately their decision, I have stopped racing top level mx in nz because i can not afford to be hurt now, when you are racing seriously you need to be able to take risks if you want to be at the pointy end of the field,

i do not think other people (except medical specialists) should tell you when to stop racing, it should be a personal decision,

[Matt Bleck]

Funny I was talking about this in the weekend, I would personally love to race there, but when it was highlithed to me what my family would be going thru for two weeks each year it sorta changed my mind.

But if your family understands and is behind you 100% then I personally feel that you should do it,

[rachprice]

i do not think other people (except medical specialists) should tell you when to stop racing, it should be a personal decision,

Even then, a lot of them don't understand
Plus the old paternal approach to medicine is well on its way out
I have always been a fan of quality over quantity including life

And what about mick doohan....if clinica mobile hadn't of saved him he might have lost his leg.....

[Edbear]

I was thinking the same thing and i personally would never ride there although i sorta want to.

It put things into perspective when i read Pauls wifes press release. That race ultimately cost him his life but on the flipside it seemed that it was a huge part of his life and sorta what he lived for. His wife said that for the other 48 weeks of each year they would be planning the next years event so it was a family thing, obviously they had talked about the risks as a family and had decided that if the worst was to happen that his ashes remained at the place he loved and that his death should not be mourned but his life celebrated. It put things into perspective for me....

Racing was his and his familys life.....

im with CHoppa on this one, i would never race at the Isle of Man, but i respect the rights of those that want to, although i think someone with a family and children should take those risks into account it is ultimately their decision, I have stopped racing top level mx in nz because i can not afford to be hurt now, when you are racing seriously you need to be able to take risks if you want to be at the pointy end of the field,

i do not think other people (except medical specialists) should tell you when to stop racing, it should be a personal decision,

Funny I was talking about this in the weekend, I would personally love to race there, but when it was highlithed to me what my family would be going thru for two weeks each year it sorta changed my mind.

But if your family understands and is behind you 100% then I personally feel that you should do it,

I understand your points and Paul's wife's comments were enlightening as she obviously supported him in his racing. I guess the principle that one shouldn't bet money one cannot afford to lose, applies to one's life as well. Some poster's comments fail to see the difference between racing the IoM TT and other endeavours. The fact that this race, as exciting as it is, would be banned in most other countries shows the difference, I believe, and my question is about the wisdom of choosing to do something that genuinely greatly increases the risk of death or serious injury that will mean very sad consequences for those left behind.

Certainly, many activities carry risk - racing in general, climbing mountains, sailing the seas, and we accept that we can't all live boring and "safe" lives, never extending ourselves or exploring the limits in order to discover. But as a husband and father, who has seen first hand and very recently the effect of his own accident and near-death on his wife and children, it is sobering and gives one pause for thought. Life for those left behind is never the same again, and never easy, and I personally feel guilty and upset at what I have put my family through despite it not being my fault and that no-one, including the Police, blames me in any way. For this reason, I would not undertake an activity that has a very real risk of death, a risk out of proportion to the general risk of the activity. WHat I mean is that racing on a track designed for racing, where you see riders crash at high speed and walk away, is not the same as racing at those same speeds on a road that has no consideration for safety and where almost any crash is going to hurt bad or result in death.

People take extensive safety precautions for most adventurous activities, but such as the IoM TT cannot be made "safe". Paeroa and Wanganui are not really in the same league as speeds are much slower there, yet even there it is a street circuit with minimal run-off areas.

[imdying]

m referring to choosing an activity that greatly increases the risk when one has family responsibilities which should be one's first priority.

Should? Perhaps 'maybe should' would be better. It's not going to be the end of the world if you die, mum will still be able to look after the kids, and if not, your or your wifes parents. Children will be fine if their father dies, it's not the end of the world, and your wife would just remarry (after a suitable mourning period, or course).

Children are just children, they're not the most important most awesomest thing in the world that requires you to drop your entire life and loves over... sure they need consideration in almost every decision, but you're still your own person.

You don't have a burning passion for motorcycle road racing, so it will never make a lot of sense to you... but maybe some of PirateJafa's examples will help get across that family != end of your life/ambitions, even if those are a little (or a lot) dangerous.

That the IoM would be banned in other countries just shows those countries up as being the frightened little nanny states they are.

[imdying]

He explained when he was younger his mum wouldn't let him. So I said so why don't you learn now. He replied "my wife won't let me". Now that's not living.

You're right, not at all... that's called being a pussy whipped beyatch. His mum's decision I can understand and respect, but his wife...? Mind you, I don't blame her... he's the man of the house, the head of the home, he should be telling her what's what, not the other way around, but that aside, who is retarded enough to marry someone who is going to be opposed to living their dreams out?