It's amazing what an oil change can do

[scumdog]

what..just have the kill switch off.....crank until pressure light goes off...

Hmm..OK - but note onearmedbandits comment.

And it means your starter is fighting compression - and the motor has a load on it (of sorts) sans oil pressure - and at times it can take a bit on some motors for oil pressure to build.

In a multi I guess taking the plugs out could be a chore but on a naked V-twin it's less than 5 minutes total out and back in.

[imdying]

It's all moot... automotive oil systems in service (i.e. not a dry rebuild) can happilly handle an oil change situation, you guys are debating nothing.

[scumdog]

It's all moot... automotive oil systems in service (i.e. not a dry rebuild) can happilly handle an oil change situation, you guys are debating nothing.

But it's so much fun doing so...

[imdying]

I didn't say you had to stop

But less techy people reading this shouldn't fear an oil change just because they've read a bit of bluster in this thread.

[Banditbandit]

Up until today, I hadn't changed the oil in about 5,000km and I hadn't changed the oil filter in about 10,000km.

Over the past few months, the gear changes on my bike have become rougher and rougher. Sometimes it would take 5 or 6 goes just to get it into neutral, and from neutral into first would sometimes take 3 or 4 attempts.

So I did an oil and filter change today, and it made a huge difference, it feels like new again! The gear shifts are so much smoother, and I can get neutral first time, every time. I no longer sometimes hook neutral instead of 2nd gear when attempting 18,000RPM gear shifts either.

It's amazing what an oil change can do!

I'd worry if that was my bike ... oil should be changed about every 5-6,000ks and the filter every second change. One change of oil and filter should not have that dramatic an impact ... maybe the fact that you were attempting 18,000 gear changes has done something ? I presume you mean without a clutch ? Even without a clutch I drop the revs before clickign the lever ...

One thing that does have a dramatic impact on the gear changes is the drive chain tension ... you didn't retension the chain at the same time per chance ?

[SMOKEU]

I'd worry if that was my bike ... oil should be changed about every 5-6,000ks and the filter every second change. One change of oil and filter should not have that dramatic an impact ... maybe the fact that you were attempting 18,000 gear changes has done something ? I presume you mean without a clutch ? Even without a clutch I drop the revs before clickign the lever ...

One thing that does have a dramatic impact on the gear changes is the drive chain tension ... you didn't retension the chain at the same time per chance ?

I always shift gear with the clutch fully pulled in, I tried to do some clutchless shifts a couple of times at low revs but it didn't want to change gear with the 'normal' amount of pressure applied to the gear shifter, and I didn't want to force it.

I always keep the chain at the correct tension, I haven't needed to tighten it in a few thousand km.

[Banditbandit]

ummmm. my bike takes 3.8L oil

with 30% left behind that means I should only pay for 2.5L when i do my oil change but for some reason.. it always wants me to add 3.8L to fill it up......

why?????

Most bike manuals will quote a figure for litres-of-oil with a filter change and without a filter change ... check yours and if the shop charges you the full amount without changing the filter then scream at them ... well, maybe politely point it out ..

[tamarillo]

With my shocking mechanical skills, I thought I probably wouldn't be able to put it all back together once I took the filter out. Surprisingly enough, I managed to do it on my own without any issues. I'll definately change the filter at every oil change from now on. Filters are cheap enough anyway. I cleaned out the filter mechanism with petrol as well.

Totally agree - oil and filter are cheap insurance.

[Banditbandit]

I change my engine every 5000km and keep the oil. Have I read my manual incorrectly?

Ummm ... yeah .. ummm ... what else do you do that the manual tells you ?

[cowboyz]

Most bike manuals will quote a figure for litres-of-oil with a filter change and without a filter change ... check yours and if the shop charges you the full amount without changing the filter then scream at them ... well, maybe politely point it out ..

bike shop hasnt been near my bike in years.. and they wont unless its a real emergency. I refuse to pay someone $70 per hour to do a job in twice the time it takes me to do it.

[Banditbandit]

You guys must have waaaay too much money or listen too much to the bike shop mechanic inspired propoganda. Modern engines are bulletproof. After the initial running in period the main problem they have to cope with is moisture. Put in a good quality oil and change it once a year. Warm it up properly and ride gently for first 10 kays. Done this for past 17 years on all my road bikes*, had NO problems** and many of the bikes I did pretty high kays (6 years of regular commute to Edinburgh*** and back did 23,000K a year, never mind the other riding) and usually owned for 3 or 4 years. Engine strip down on 1 of them revealed no damage and mates who bought the bikes from me had no problems.

If for some reason I did blow up an engine then I've more than paid for it with the saved time and money (plus think of all the wasted oil I've NOT polluted).

Black engine oil does not mean it needs changed. It's an old wives tale...again I reckon inspired by grease monkeys. Correspondingly, non-black engine oil does not mean it doesn't need changed.

Changing your engine oil every 1000 kays is a crock of shite and causes MORE engine damage.

*bar the three Suzuki 2 strokes I owned cos they seize/hole pistons every 3000Km or 2 months
**ok...and bar GPX750 POS that was owned for 3 weeks (and oil changed) when previous spanner monkey overtightening cylander head bolts causing them to crack caused engine to implode.
**bearing in mind regular well below freezing conditions compared to godzone that the engine had to start in

Hmmm ... remind me to never buy a bike you've "worked on" ...

[Grubber]

Thanks for the link - lots of good info (I'm only about 20 pages in).

On a related note:
Does anyone know where I can find Mobil 10W-40 4T oil? I tried to find it when I got the scooter because I had been using Mobil 1 in the car and the manual recommended 10W-40 oil, but I've yet to see the stuff anywhere.

Yup i do!
You can got it from Waitomo Brennan in Pukekohe.
I get all mine there. Is it the racing 4t that your looking for?

While we are on the topic of oil changes.....I do mine every 10k and do the filter at the same time. Recommended by the book. I have had heaps of bikes of all shapes and sizes over the years and have not had one let me down yet. I just stick to the Owners Manual for the k's and do a major checklist for the oil type to suit. Seems to work ok for me.

[Banditbandit]

bike shop hasnt been near my bike in years.. and they wont unless its a real emergency. I refuse to pay someone $70 per hour to do a job in twice the time it takes me to do it.

Sorry .. that was a blonde moment ... well, a geriatric grey one at least ...

If you take out the oil plug and leave it to drain for a while I don't believe that 30% gets left behind - some does in the filter and a small amount around the working parts ... but I've always found that what the manuals say the engine will take - it takes ...

And if I've left it to stand a while it frequently takes just a little more than the book says - After an oil change I run the engine for a while - let it cool down - then check the oil levels and top up as needed - and do so frequently.

[cowboyz]

Sorry .. that was a blonde moment ... well, a geriatric grey one at least ...

If you take out the oil plug and leave it to drain for a while I don't believe that 30% gets left behind - some does in the filter and a small amount around the working parts ... but I've always found that what the manuals say the engine will take - it takes ...

And if I've left it to stand a while it frequently takes just a little more than the book says - After an oil change I run the engine for a while - let it cool down - then check the oil levels and top up as needed - and do so frequently.

oh. while we are here... I dont believe 30% is left behind either!... That was dipshits claim i think?

i think there would be less than 100ml left behind. with gravity being what it is and the hole being at the bottom of the engine in all... I wouldnt be surprised if that number was closer to 20ml. Of course.. if you dont take the filter out then that leaves a bay where oil can sit.....

[imdying]

I don't know what average percentage is left in galleries, the pump, the oil cooler, around the cam area, clung to gears, clung to the internals etc etc, but it's definitely more than 100ml in the average IL4, and yes, all 4 stroke motors have three oil capacities listed in their service manuals, dry, with and without filter.

Here's some pics to help you visualise how long and complicated even a bike engines lubrication system is:







Funky shit