Down hill decreasing radius bends?

[TonyB]

On another forum, a member has asked the question "how are you supposed to deal with down hill decreasing radius bends?" I have Keith Codes book Twist Of The Wrist II. In it from memory he says that the only correct line for a corner is the one that allows you to steadily roll on the throttle to keep the bikes ideal 40/60 front/rear weight distribution. Then he says the only exception to this rule would be on down hill decreasing radius bends (i think he also throws in 'off camber'). But I'm sure he doesn't give a way of dealing with it, which is a shame, because the real world is full of the fuggen things!

So, does anyone have the answer?

[FROSTY:Me]

to start with you need to establish if you A come across it unexpecctedly or B know its there
Knowing its there I'd simply enter the corner slower /wider than normal and when I sight the corner exit accelerate as per normal.
Unexpectedly -Ya know I dunno -Ive done one of two things --In a big corner Ive stood the bike up for a moment and washed a load of speed off then had another crack at the corner. In a tight corner ive hung off some more and leaned more.

[Pwalo]

On another forum, a member has asked the question "how are you supposed to deal with down hill decreasing radius bends?" I have Keith Codes book Twist Of The Wrist II. In it from memory he says that the only correct line for a corner is the one that allows you to steadily roll on the throttle to keep the bikes ideal 40/60 front/rear weight distribution. Then he says the only exception to this rule would be on down hill decreasing radius bends (i think he also throws in 'off camber'). But I'm sure he doesn't give a way of dealing with it, which is a shame, because the real world is full of the fuggen things!

So, does anyone have the answer?

I think that the steadily rolling on the throttle comment applies to corners where you can spot the apex and exit. Ideal on a race track, but not perhaps so good for the road.

Common sense would seem to say that caution is the word. Gentle braking, watching the vanishing point, and rolling on the throttle when you have a clear indication of corner exit.

Sorry I can't think of a foolproof system for corners on the road. Even the same corner can be different on different days, or times of the same day. You really can't apply race rules on the road.

[Ixion]

A downhill right hand S bend with both parts tightening would have to be the corner from hell!

I think the only thing you can do is brake really hard before the corner, slow down way below "normal" speed and then accelerate all the way through the corner (not just from the apex). Gently until you see the exit, then hard(er).

Still don't think that's good though, but everything else seems worse.

In theory having a pillion should help, putting more weight rearward. Maybe stop and wait until a hitchhiker turns up?

[bugjuice]

with a bend like that tho, unless you know it (in which case, this is pointless), I think you have to get steady n slow, and keep it wide, cos you just don't know what's coming up, and if you have to tighten up.

On saying 'keep it wide', remember that large vehicles like trucks and buses will often cut into the corner, so don't ride the centre line. A good measure would probably be stick in the right wheel lines of the road, then use those 'run in' marks as a guide as to what's coming and what line you should take. I pretty much use car lines as a guide to what's coming up next, as the best line is often the one that's beaten into a road. The exception here is newly laid roads. Then just really take it easy.

Id be inclind to select a higher gear and let the engine do most of the braking for you too, but not so that it's screaming. Feather the throttle to 'adjust' the amount of braking the engine is doing for you, and use the back brake more than the front. Then if/should the worst happen, the front isn't cooking up as you're riding the brakes, and you have that bit more braking at the ready.

Then just slow n steady does it.. Watch the furthest point you can see, then when the exit comes up, change down a gear and ride it out as normal

[White trash]

What you do is you head in far too fast, as you start to turn in, bang your motard down two gears to many to facilitate a "compression lock" of the rear wheel. This will allow the rear to swing waaaaayy outta line with the front, thus scrubbing more speed. Slide your inside foot up in front of you along the tarmac as you lean further to scrape the peg in order to emulate your hero, Boris Chambon.

Once at the later apex of a decreasing radius turn, get HARD on the gas to spin the rear wheel and thus keep it "hanging out" on the exit.

Piece of piss.

[bugjuice]

What you do is you head in far too fast, as you start to turn in, bang your motard down two gears to many to facilitate a "compression lock" of the rear wheel. This will allow the rear to swing waaaaayy outta line with the front, thus scrubbing more speed. Slide your inside foot up in front of you along the tarmac as you lean further to scrape the peg in order to emulate your hero, Boris Chambon.

Once at the later apex of a decreasing radius turn, get HARD on the gas to spin the rear wheel and thus keep it "hanging out" on the exit.

Piece of piss.

nice.. gonna practise that on the 636...

[Ixion]

What you do is you head in far too fast, as you start to turn in, bang your motard down two gears to many to facilitate a "compression lock" of the rear wheel. This will allow the rear to swing waaaaayy outta line with the front, thus scrubbing more speed. Slide your inside foot up in front of you along the tarmac as you lean further to scrape the peg in order to emulate your hero, Boris Chambon.

Once at the later apex of a decreasing radius turn, get HARD on the gas to spin the rear wheel and thus keep it "hanging out" on the exit.

Piece of piss.

Ah well,and if we're on gravel of course then the whole thing becomes simpler. Just go round sideways.

[ManDownUnder]

nice.. gonna practise that on the 636...

Ya huh - sounds easy... just don't ask me to do it. 200kgs of RF pushing that hot exhaust into my legs is NOT my idea of fun.

As for the corner - lose speed, stind the bike up and throw out all the anchors, punch the indise handle bar and drop the bike into the turn, easy on the brakes, keeping enough weight on the rear to maintain traction, survive the corner... take the tightest line you can so you've got room to go wider if/when you need to.

Take photos of the wreck and put your claim through as quick as you can (a la Swanny)
MDU

[TonyB]

Dear Mr Trash,
Can you please come back to Chch and demonstrate this technique on your GSXR on some of the down hill decreasing radius corners on the Akaroa run? I will video you, so that this techinque can be demonstrated to the appreciative KB public..... Should your attempts fail, we can then post them on the web so that bikers all over the world can have a giggle

Oft have I wondered wether Keith Codes advice really applies well to the road. Even in racing, when you watch the on board cameras from MotoGP they don't exactly seem to be braking deep into the corner, then slamming it down for a short time, then standing it up and accelerating away... I wonder sometimes SOME if his advice is now out of date, as bikes handle far better than they did 10+ years ago....

[White trash]

Dear Mr Trash,
Can you please come back to Chch and demonstrate this technique on your GSXR on some of the down hill decreasing radius corners on the Akaroa run? I will video you, so that this techinque can be demonstrated to the appreciative KB public..... Should your attempts fail, we can then post them on the web so that bikers all over the world can have a giggle

No need mate.

Anyone who's seen the state of my VERY second hand Gixxer is already giggling their arses off.

[justsomeguy]

What you do is you head in far too fast, as you start to turn in, bang your motard down two gears to many to facilitate a "compression lock" of the rear wheel. This will allow the rear to swing waaaaayy outta line with the front, thus scrubbing more speed. Slide your inside foot up in front of you along the tarmac as you lean further to scrape the peg in order to emulate your hero, Boris Chambon.

Once at the later apex of a decreasing radius turn, get HARD on the gas to spin the rear wheel and thus keep it "hanging out" on the exit.

Piece of piss.

Wow drifting on a bike...... good luck - if you're name isn't Gary McCoy.......

So far buggy's making the most sense.

[White trash]

Wow drifting on a bike...... good luck - if you're name isn't Gary McCoy.......

Or any number of Motard wannabes.

Seen Mr Briggs doing it quite nicely at Wangavegas a year and a half ago.

[eliot-ness]

Ahh! The last unanswered question, (Assuming all bikers know the meaning of life.)
BJS got it as right as is possible for us mere mortals. One thing I've found useful is the speed advisory sign, Usually highly pessimistic, but I've noticed that when they advise
35kms on a corner that looks like a 70 minimum then the unexpected is about to happen. I change down two gears instead of one, forget the fastest line into it, then I can (sometimes) pick the best line out. Doesn't always work. On the worst ones there's usually no sign, but it's kept me in one piece for a long time.
P.S. W.T. Wasn't that your mangled helmet I saw posted yesterday ?????????????

[Ixion]

.. One thing I've found useful is the speed advisory sign, Usually highly pessimistic, but I've noticed that when they advise
35kms on a corner that looks like a 70 minimum then the unexpected is about to happen. ..

Yes , those signs are good. Add something to the higher ones (I've found it pays to be careful on the 25kph ones. Often they DO mean 25kph). But as you say, the real benefit is when what looks like a nice 80kph is signposted as 35kph, And the similar looking corners before it have been signed at 55. Hm, something gonna be odd here.