Cyclist accidents v motorcycle accidents

[Scuba_Steve]

I rode my pushbike to work yesterday for a bit of exercise, 14kms...down Dominion Road.

my observations were:

Visy vests ....? are they like a cloak of invisibility?

Most drivers were 'focused' on getting to work/home

You really need a rear view mirror on a push bike

Theres quite a lot of scooters using bus lanes

I don't think I'd be keen on riding on the open road

Not much protection in a pair of shorts and a t shirt.

yes Vis vest are the "cloak of invisibility" or the cloak of "hit me I'm here"

Scooter's (like bikes, proper ones with engines) are allowed to use bus lanes... unfortunately

No shorts & shirt don't provide much protection, Lycra even less! I'm not that trusting to the piece of polystyrene they wear on their head either.

[MSTRS:Me]

The single commuter nips in and out of traffic and quite possibly is oblivious to what is behind and around him/her.

The lycra brigade just bulldozes there way through the traffic hogging the entire lane sometimes ignoring traffic lights and pedestrian crossings and all done in high density areas!

Surely the two types you describe are as bad as each other. One of the former just lost her life for the very reason you mention...oblivious.

[baptist]

I would say that the car driver in question did 'see' you, just didn't notice you. I believe that in the overwhelming majority of SMIDSY events the car driver concerned did see the bike, but didn't notice them, so didn't change their actions... I want motorcyclists to be valued by other road users, but it's hard when we don't see that we have any right to demand that.

That is a scay thought actually. You are right I ride a small bike, a Scorpio, but being that close to the guy, and in my Dayglo vest I must have been seen...

As a new rider I have to say looking at all the concern over the deaths of the cyclists recently (which is awful) and the way Motorcyclists that die are looked at is worrying. I have said it in other posts, car drivers need to be made more aware of us and the dangers we face (I know Katman says it is all up to us but car drivers who look for us properly would help), so maybe a little more education for four wheel (or more) drivers about the vulnerability of all two wheel users would be of benefit?

[Pascal]

so maybe a little more education for four wheel (or more) drivers about the vulnerability of all two wheel users would be of benefit?

I'm all for a mandatory two year period on a motorcycle before you're allowed to drive a car, because I can't see any other education program really working. How many years have drivers been taught:

(a) Distractions are bad, they disrupt your concentration. And yet many continue to yak on their mobile phones while veering all across the road.

(b) Driving under the influence of alchohol and drugs are bad. Your ability to react and operate the vehicle is impaired. And yet, how many times do you see them on the road. Time after time after time. After how much education?

You can tell cagers as many things as you like, but unless it comes with a sharp, pointed lesson I don't think they will learn. Perhaps if the police started focussing on dangerous / distracted driving and had the ability for those items to really bite - maybe then we'd see an improvement.

[MarkH]

I'm all for a mandatory two year period on a motorcycle before you're allowed to drive a car

I agree 100% with this idea - it would force many drivers to learn useful skills. And those that just don't learn, well that idea would work like adding some chlorine to the gene pool - Darwinism would improve our species! It's not like there is a worldwide shortage of human beings anyway and those that just can't learn are never going to be the most valuable members of our society.

It would be nice to think that severe penalties for doing stupid shit in a car would be all we need - but it clearly doesn't work. Many drivers don't stop to think about the consequences of their actions, they act on impulse and sometimes someone dies - like the driver that opened the door in the path of the cyclist.

I've had to emergency brake for a car that didn't see me - I know he didn't see me because I could see his head through the side window, he was doing a 3 point turn and looking directly ahead at where he was going, not even bothering to look in the direction any other traffic might be coming from. Fuckin' taxi drivers! People like that could do with a little Darwinism IMO.

[shrub]

That is a scay thought actually. You are right I ride a small bike, a Scorpio, but being that close to the guy, and in my Dayglo vest I must have been seen...

As a new rider I have to say looking at all the concern over the deaths of the cyclists recently (which is awful) and the way Motorcyclists that die are looked at is worrying. I have said it in other posts, car drivers need to be made more aware of us and the dangers we face (I know Katman says it is all up to us but car drivers who look for us properly would help), so maybe a little more education for four wheel (or more) drivers about the vulnerability of all two wheel users would be of benefit?

Katman is right in that the only person you can influence RIGHT NOW is you, and constant concentration and working on your skills will save your life. I know a lot of riders that haven't had an off for 15, 20 years and more - my last off was in 1986, and that's not luck, it's how you ride. There is every chance you'll never have an off, but the odds of you making it unscathed will be much better if we can get other road users to act responsibly as well.

Get rider training, read books, listen to old farts about what we did wrong and TRUST NO CUNT AT NO TIME; but best of all get out on your bike as much as you can because the more you ride the better you'll become.

[Katman]

The reason that the idea of making it mandatory to spend a couple of years on two wheels before getting a car license will never happen is that amongst the powers that be there are far too many that would never want to see their kids on a motorcycle.

[baptist]

Get rider training, read books, listen to old farts about what we did wrong and TRUST NO CUNT AT NO TIME; but best of all get out on your bike as much as you can because the more you ride the better you'll become.

Agreed, BHS was a joke so before I even took my bike on the road I went on the competent rider course with riderskills and practised basics in car parks and then quiet daytime roads. Current book is also on handling skills (some is way over my head, more for the track, but the basics are very good) .

"TRUST NO CUNT AT NO TIME" my cage instructor used the same words to me 26 years ago!!!!! never forgot them.

[Hitcher]

and in my Dayglo vest I must have been seen...

The primary reason I'm opposed to dayglo clothing -- the unsubstantiated confidence it gives its wearers who would be more conspicuous if they could ride naked or completely invisible.

[MSTRS:Me]

The primary reason I'm opposed to dayglo clothing -- the unsubstantiated confidence it gives its wearers who would be more conspicuous if they could ride naked or completely invisible.

Plus anecdotal evidence that their wearers tend to be more cautious, thus avoiding 'trouble'.

[baptist]

The primary reason I'm opposed to dayglo clothing -- the unsubstantiated confidence it gives its wearers who would be more conspicuous if they could ride naked or completely invisible.

There was a little sarcasm in my remark, to be next to someone in that vest and not be seen... I will wear it (certainly in rainy and low light conditions) but I have to say I think you have a point it does not seem to matter what you wear (not up for riding naked... people are more likely to crash when they are)

[Zookey]

The sad fact is ; that there are one hella of a lot of morons out there and like your happening they just don't give a stuff ,no matter whether you are in a car push bike motorbike or just plain walking,and it happens everytime you leave ya door.

[Drunken Monkey]

I'm all for a mandatory two year period on a motorcycle before you're allowed to drive a car, because I can't see any other education program really working...

...and at least a class 2 truck. Then everyone _should_ have a better appreciation for other road users (maybe even show you can ride a pushie safely on the road before you can sit your motorcycle BHS cert). Can't see it happening though.

[PrincessBandit]

Don't say my name three times while looking in a mirror!

Katman Katman Ka.....




no, somehow it just sounds wrong......

[Spearfish]

There was a little sarcasm in my remark, to be next to someone in that vest and not be seen... I will wear it (certainly in rainy and low light conditions) but I have to say I think you have a point it does not seem to matter what you wear (not up for riding naked... people are more likely to crash when they are)

Overall I think it helps in town centres but its a bit like all the safety devices in cars
it makes the driver more passive in their responsibility of managing risk...
ABS= don't need following distance
Front airbags= cant get hurt overtaking
Side airbags=don't need patience waiting to pull out
Traction control= don't need to slow for corners

Some things that seem limit high vis working front on are screens or a retina burner going, even the difference between a cruiser and sport bike sitting position lowers the visible area or a pack rack on the rear but they always see you side on. (just before you go over the roof??)
Not from experience but from looking at the visibility other riders.