VIOLENT NEW ZEALAND FEED UP !!

**scumdog** · 17th June 2005, 15:25

Originally Posted by idb

And I thought Dirty Harry was based on a true story...
"I know what you're thinking....you know, in all this excitement I've plum forgot myself.... but the question you've got ask yourself....well do ya - punk!?"
And then he shot him right between the eyes when he had the helpless chick held right in front of him - with a .44 magnum!
Man those American cops can shoot! Quite obviously youse guys need to get .44 magnums.

Oooh Yeah!! 44 Magnum!! Wouldn't make me shoot any better but the misses would be exciting!!
Imagine the damage I could do to a bystander with one of them!!

Seriously though, having used one I would say 'too much gun' for the average situation! (plus I reckon 17 shots in a mag is just enough, 6 shots in a revolver is 11 shots too few for me!

**WINJA** · 17th June 2005, 15:32

Originally Posted by justsomeguy

Oye!!! Leave my favourite Worthless Incompetent Neutered Jerk-off Arsehole alone will you. It's not his fault that he is a mentally retarded, incoherent, homosexual cripple........ he was born that way.

And doesn't he just add a bit of colour to the situation anyway.

You M are very much the bigger man. Please ignore the idiot.

IM GLAD YOU AND ZED HAVE YOUR OPINION , EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE INPUT ON THIS SITE CONSTRUCTIVE OR NOT

**Zed** · 17th June 2005, 15:43

Originally Posted by WINJA

IM GLAD YOU AND ZED HAVE YOUR OPINION , EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE INPUT ON THIS SITE CONSTRUCTIVE OR NOT

What sort of a reply was that? Seriousness does not become you Whinger!

**Indiana_Jones** · 17th June 2005, 15:45

The 1st image that pops into my mind of youngins' running from cops is Renton in trainspotting lol

"Lust for life!"

-Indy

**Biff** · 17th June 2005, 16:00

Originally Posted by Drunken Monkey

Yes you do sound like an old man. Are you saying there was no such thing as teen violence before the advent of T.V. or films?

Errrr - not at all. But the facts are that violent crime has increased dramatically over the last 10-15 years globally, it's also a fact that most media formats appear to glorify violence and depict it as normal.

During my university years I worked as a doorman at a nightclub in the UK (strangely enough one of the reasons I was named Biff), and I remember very clearly when the number of pissed kids beating the shit out of one another increased dramatically. I also remember the increase in 'hoodies' hanging around outside the club in which I worked, selecting victims at random then beating the shit out of them 'for a laugh'. It may be purely coincidental that this all happened around the same time that 'gangsta rap' was introduced as the nightclubs 'themed' music, the same music listened to by the wasters outside. All you’d hear is "shoot da fkin police", “death to the west side m**fkers” etc blaring our of their 25" subs. Ok - I'm no sociologist or psychologist, and there may well be no direct correlation between gangster rap and violence, but there's no doubt in my mind, based upon the stats available, that the increase in violence, particularly by the younger generation, has grown significantly since the demise of censorship laws and life values.

Pure coincidence?

**Drunken Monkey** · 17th June 2005, 16:04

Originally Posted by Toast

...Such a thing is being looked at seriously in the UK after a whole lot of soccer fights, and in Aussie within the NRL I think. These such people are some of the fuckers who need to be held responsible for being poor role models to kids.

There's a good reason sporting associations have looked after their own, and that's the way it should stay. Quite frankly I find the idea of bringing every playing minor field scuffle into a court room ridiculous in it's entirety. A few handbags being thrown about on a footy field is far removed from street thugs gang beating a kid.

**Ixion** · 17th June 2005, 16:05

Originally Posted by Drunken Monkey

Yes you do sound like an old man. Are you saying there was no such thing as teen violence before the advent of T.V. or films?

Well, when I was a teen, sure there was occasional violence (all those Christians vs Lions for one

), but 20 - 30 onto 1 ?

That's pretty cowardly. Don't think that would have happened. Tis the sort of violence that has changed, it's no longer a case of two blokes sorting it out with their fists, it's gotten real nasty. Degenerate is the word I'd use.

**Drunken Monkey** · 17th June 2005, 16:11

Originally Posted by Biff

...Pure coincidence?

No, your observations are accurate. However media merely influences the style, but the violence is inherent. The general perceived (or not) rise in violence is more to do with a remarkable reduction in violence post WWII. I can't remember the reference material, but it's some fascinating reading about violence in different societies over a much longer studied period of time.
Ultimately the past 10-15 years you mention are the only directly relevant times to us, but you only have to research pre 1940's newspaper articles to see how horribly common random street beatings were, even here in NZ (especially in early colonial times).

Originally Posted by Ixion

... Tis the sort of violence that has changed, it's no longer a case of two blokes sorting it out with their fists, it's gotten real nasty. Degenerate is the word I'd use.

In many cases these days, yes. However gang violence is not a new thing.

**Indiana_Jones** · 17th June 2005, 16:14

I don't really see how one could blame TV. I mean teens should be able to tell the difference between fact and fiction.

-Indy

**ManDownUnder** · 17th June 2005, 16:22

Originally Posted by Indiana_Jones

I don't really see how one could blame TV. I mean teens should be able to tell the difference between fact and fiction.

-Indy

Yes they can - sort of...

Desensitisation thorugh constant exposure to all manner of nasties means the perception of what they're doing gets altered.

Video games (with impressive realism) incenting people to shoot, run down, maim etc do affect people. Some more than others. Then combine that with someone of low self worth getting into a mob, not being able to stand up and form/hold an opinion of their own, being further desensitised by boose, in a gang/pack situation... ("I did'nt do it... we all did" = "I'm not responsible")

... yup behavious changes.

Do the lot of them. Those that were doing the hitting, and those egging them on.

While you're at it, make 'em pay. I say the punchment should fit the crime. so maybe the need to spend a few 100 hours of community service as part of their reparation... in the hospital cleaning up after patients with brain injuries. They could start with the bed pans...

**Toast** · 17th June 2005, 16:22

Originally Posted by Drunken Monkey

There's a good reason sporting associations have looked after their own, and that's the way it should stay. Quite frankly I find the idea of bringing every playing minor field scuffle into a court room ridiculous in it's entirety. A few handbags being thrown about on a footy field is far removed from street thugs gang beating a kid.

I'm not saying every minor scuffle should be taken to court, but when you get dunb shits like John Hopoate sticking flying elbows in to people's heads, it's not acceptable behaviour in front of potentially as brainless, easily influenced kids with parents who have neither a clue nor give a shit (but let's not get in to the issue of parenting here). These guys have a responsibility to act right, because they are in the public spotlight, and they are role models, and more serious repercussions for being hot headed twats may help them realise this.

Although, admittedly, bringing a question of degree in to it (as I did above) just about destroys the viability of the idea.

Originally Posted by Ixion

Well, when I was a teen, sure there was occasional violence (all those Christians vs Lions for one

), but 20 - 30 onto 1 ?

That's pretty cowardly. Don't think that would have happened. Tis the sort of violence that has changed, it's no longer a case of two blokes sorting it out with their fists, it's gotten real nasty. Degenerate is the word I'd use.

Good point, kinda hard to walk away from it when you're encircled by them.

**N4CR** · 17th June 2005, 16:25

If I had to do an NZ Hearald and blame something it would be 'that darn rap music and the maaaooorrriiiieeeeeeeesssss'. Gross generalisation time I think.

It seems there are *genuine* Hip hop/rap etc lovers and then there are the whole 'thuggz crew dark riders chrome 26" impalazz bitches and hoes' type scenes. Those 'scenes' seem to follow some of the idealogies of the music and subculture they surround themselves in, just to be 'in' or cool. It's cool to beat people up (sorta like stealing rep or something) and cool to be just like all the major artists that have a influence on their 'crew'.

Recently looking through my cousins latest 50cent album, (a rap 'artist' for the unintiated) all I observed was pictures of Mr 50c with guns, more guns, guns and women, guns CARS AND WOMEN AND DRUGS. Note the 'similarity' between how these 'crews' tend to operate and one of the idols, Mr 50c. Violence portrayed as cool - hmph.

Anyway... i'll end the ranting.

I do think more police patrols and public (neighborhood watch type projects) operations could help this. Further education in school could benefit too. Sorry to hear that you (Quasi) got to see the grim reality of the bad sides of some of the screwed up sub cultures we seem to have in NZ.

**Biff** · 17th June 2005, 16:27

Originally Posted by Drunken Monkey

The general perceived (or not) rise in violence is more to do with a remarkable reduction in violence post WWII. I can't remember the reference material, but it's some fascinating reading about violence in different societies over a much longer studied period of time.
Ultimately the past 10-15 years you mention are the only directly relevant times to us, but you only have to research pre 1940's newspaper articles to see how horribly common random street beatings were, even here in NZ (especially in early colonial times).

Mmmmm - interesting.

Originally Posted by Indiana_Jones

I don't really see how one could blame TV. I mean teens should be able to tell the difference between fact and fiction.

-Indy

"Should?" - yeah. 'Do?' - I don't think it's a matter of knowing the difference, just the acclimatisation to violence, believing it's acceptable. Seeing it day in day out on TV or film will harden you up to violence. Especially the young and easily led.

I was only talking to a school teacher the other week, she said she was "horrified" by the increase in violence in the playground (5-10 year olds). She claimed it was due to the increase in violence in cartoons (Japanese mostly). In my day we had Scooby Doo, Dangermouse and Batfink. I'm a bit surprised we didn't all walk around thinking we were talking animals.

I'm not trying to be a misery guts and say this shit should be banned. I love action movies, especially gory ones, I love watching UFC and cage fighting. I also listen to Eminem and believe he's a very talented, if misunderstood, guy. But to say that it's now acceptable for a 12 year old to watch, what were, X rated films in my day is wrong. Bloody liberal namby pambies to thank for this I guess.

**Drunken Monkey** · 17th June 2005, 16:31

Case(s) in point. Hopoate was banned for 12 weeks for those 'interference' incidents. NRL Players don't get paid match fees when they're banned. After his second inappropriate stunt early this year, he was sacked. Out of the game for good.
Message - act inappropriately, you will lose your quite considerable livelihood.
All handled by the League's own system.

And really, it's not like he beat other players so bad they ended up in the casualty ward covered head to toe in cuts & brusies. That's the kind of assaults courts deal with.