Interesting article on traffic lights

[rok-the-boat]

http://mises.org/daily/4745

According to Quinn, many who vehemently oppose virtually every sort for government regulation and intervention often concede that regulations are indeed necessary for traffic control. The long-held belief is that, in the absence of road signs and traffic lights, traffic would be at a perpetual standstill, if not worse. Quinn writes that videos of real-world cases of complete traffic deregulation conclusively demonstrate that roadway anarchy is the ideal situation for both drivers and pedestrians. He uses praxeology to explain the seemingly odd phenomenon of roadways that were once the commuters' nightmare becoming uncongested through deregulation. The evidence Quinn proffers to support his call for immediate removal of all traffic lights and signs is truly astounding and worth viewing — especially if you happen to be stuck in traffic and have a smartphone.

[george formby]

http://mises.org/daily/4745

According to Quinn, many who vehemently oppose virtually every sort for government regulation and intervention often concede that regulations are indeed necessary for traffic control. The long-held belief is that, in the absence of road signs and traffic lights, traffic would be at a perpetual standstill, if not worse. Quinn writes that videos of real-world cases of complete traffic deregulation conclusively demonstrate that roadway anarchy is the ideal situation for both drivers and pedestrians. He uses praxeology to explain the seemingly odd phenomenon of roadways that were once the commuters' nightmare becoming uncongested through deregulation. The evidence Quinn proffers to support his call for immediate removal of all traffic lights and signs is truly astounding and worth viewing — especially if you happen to be stuck in traffic and have a smartphone.

Apparently they are conducting a test in a Dutch city which demonstrates exactly this. No road markings, traffic lights, pedestrian crossings, nuthin. The road users including cyclists & pedestrians are far more careful & respectful of each other so traffic flow is better & accident rates have plummeted. Go figure

[Ronin]

Bloody good post that. I watched his videos and bugger me if the concepts don't make sense. Once you get past all the wanky words that is. How often has someone come back from the middle east or asian country laughing about no traffic control and the fact that it just works. In fact, in vietnam I have heard of tourists being trained to just walk out into traffic. If they bugger around and try to work out what the traffic is doing they are unsafe, walk out and the traffic takes them into account.

[rastuscat]

I'm considering campaigning to have most stop signs removed from the town I am living in.

Having so many stop signs that people don't stop at actually increases the risk at the stop signs that actually need to be stopped at, by creating an apathetic attitude toward the important ones.

This is part of my heartfelt desire to remove as many traffic signs as possible, given that inflicting more and more signs on drivers just makes the important ones disappear in a sea of visual clutter.

Interesting concepts from the Martin bloke.

Donuts.

[Bassmatt]

I'm considering campaigning to have most stop signs removed from the town I am living in.

Having so many stop signs that people don't stop at actually increases the risk at the stop signs that actually need to be stopped at, by creating an apathetic attitude toward the important ones.

This is part of my heartfelt desire to remove as many traffic signs as possible, given that inflicting more and more signs on drivers just makes the important ones disappear in a sea of visual clutter.

Interesting concepts from the Martin bloke.

Donuts.

I have had a couple of close calls with cars nearly rear ending me at stop signs because "nobody actually stops mate". Well i do, and it bothers me the amount of cars(mostly) that I am following that just go straight through stop signs.

[scumdog]

How about '4-way stops' as per US?

Worked while I was there.

But then most of their driver behaviour was a light year ahead of NZs...

[Pascal]

But then most of their driver behaviour was a light year ahead of NZs...

Yeah, that's the bit that makes me think this won't work. It seems as if the vast majority of roadusers in NZ drives / rides with a big old "Fuck you" chip on their shoulder.

I can't see any form of deregulation working here with the general NZ attitude towards other road users.

[piston broke]

get rid of the lights,
put in traffic islands.

[swbarnett]

How about '4-way stops' as per US?

You don't actually need the signs. The give way to right rule is enough. It's like this on all minor crossroads and works well. They also have the

But then most of their driver behaviour was a light year ahead of NZs...

Maybe that's because they're treated as if they have a brain and are expected to use it.

[swbarnett]

get rid of the lights,
put in traffic islands.

Get rid of the lights, yes, but be very careful as to where roundabouts are placed (I presume that's what you mean?). The trouble with roundabouts is that they only work when the traffic flow is even from all directions (or very light). There's a four-way roundabout where Link Drive hits Sunnynook Rd. that often has heavy traffic on Link Drive and one direction of Sunnynook Rd. The traffic on Link Drive flows through for ages while that on Sunnynook Rd. has to wait for ever. There's nobody coming from the other two directions to break up the flow.

[mattian]

How about '4-way stops' as per US?

Worked while I was there.

But then most of their driver behaviour was a light year ahead of NZs...

Thats because over there you get hog-tied tazered for jay walking.....lol
I watched an episode of cops last night. JEEEeezus! they dont take any shit over there.

[scumdog]

Maybe that's because they're treated as if they have a brain and are expected to use it.

But..but..NZ drivers on the whole DON'T have a brain and are treated accordingly....

[Toaster]

But..but..NZ drivers on the whole DON'T have a brain and are treated accordingly....

Exactly. Crashes big and small just keep on a happening, road signs or not.... some people will always be stupid.

It's why we have prisons.





And the green party.

[fliplid]

It's why we have prisons.

And the green party.

Don't go there!

[swbarnett]

But..but..NZ drivers on the whole DON'T have a brain and are treated accordingly....

There is a difference between someone's potential intelligence and that which is displayed on a daily basis. The average NZ driver is quite capable of intelligent driving. However, they are treated as if they do not have a brain and so that's how they act.

It is a trait of basic human nature that people will act in response to how they are treated. If we expect drivers to think then the average apparent intelligence of drivers will rise. If we tell them not to think by trying to do all the thinking for them then the average apparent intelligence of drivers will fall. By taking away signs and traffic lights drivers will be forced to think more (those that don't will most likely not last long). Because of this, drivers will be more capable and you will get less dumb driving (cutting blind corners for example) because they are more able to think.