Announcement on ACC funded $2m scheme

[mashman]

I believe they wanted someone with experience in the financial sector who has already been involved in one of their working groups (Tax Working Group). I'd say its a bonus that he's a motorcyclist and not an outsider in that respect..

yeah, people in charge of finance "running" the show... that's worked for the country so far ... not having a go, but the Chairperson should not also be in charge of the finances. The Chairperson should be the one with the "social" agenda... leave the money maker to make money and advise what is and isn;t available... With that in mind, i'm kinda with Murray and Bogan.

[Squiggles]

You only have to read the Australian motorcycle magazines to see the universal opprobrium heaped on the Victorian safety council by motorcyclists.

A notable achievement was the series of motorcycle safety ads that made bikers look like a bunch of moronic antisocial outcasts.

http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/Home/...cleSafetyLevy/

Iirc, there was only one ad that got people worked up...

[Kickaha]

A notable achievement was the series of motorcycle safety ads that made bikers look like a bunch of moronic antisocial outcasts.

So profiled them pretty much spot on then

[riffer]

And so begins the rot from the uneducated. Allow me to add some sanity to the mix:

There's a number of other names there who deserve mention:

Paul Searancke, Deputy Chairperson (Commissioner: Recreation/Leisure of Motorcycling New Zealand)
Peter McIntosh (President Ulysses Club of NZ Inc)
Yvonne Forrest (Representative of Women's International Motorcycle Association)
Bill Grice (former Chairman of the Motor Industry Association Motorcycle Division)
Brent Hutchison (President of Wellington branch of Bikers Rights Organisation of NZ)
Jess Corbett (Representative of Scoot NZ and the NZ Classic Scooter Club)

You have a representative from MNZ, a representative from Ulysses, a representative from WIMA, a representative from the Motor Industry, a representative from BRONZ, and a representative from the Scroters.

Led by a person who has an enviable record in New Zealand business and with quite a bit of economic nous too - and who's done some pretty cool biking.

The MSF will work through the government's GETZ tendering programme - which means it's totally transparent.

We all have access to StoneY here on KB - and as a friend of mine I know how committed he is to ensuring motorcyclists are put first. Say what you like about Peter Mac but there's no arguing the organisation he represents represent a large proportion of motorcyclists.

I'm just stoked that Mike Noon wasn't allowed on the committee. I wouldn't have been happy about that.

[MadDuck]

And so begins the rot from the uneducated.

It has been said before. NONE of those people you mention represent me. I am not a member of ANY of their organisations. How then do I have any say whatsoever in how my money is spent. I DONT!

BTW I am quite well educated thank you very much.

[riffer]

It has been said before. NONE of those people you mention represent me. I am not a member of ANY of their organisations. How then do I have any say whatsoever in how my money is spent. I DONT!

BTW I am quite well educated thank you very much.

Then go and create yourself your own little organisation then Cherie. Hopefully you'll have some great ideas of your own and people will follow you and then you'll get to have a say with TPTB.

In the meantime these people are representing possibly 250,000 people in New Zealand. I'm not sure of the actual figures so this may not be accurate. Either way, they DO have credibility.

AFAIK (it's early days yet) How you have a say in how your money is spent is by coming up with an idea, presenting it to the MSFC. They meet, discuss the ideas they have, decide which will go ahead, and put them out to tender.

What ideas have you got that you don't believe the aforementioned groups don't have? I'd be delighted to hear.

[rustic101]

It has been said before. NONE of those people you mention represent me. I am not a member of ANY of their organisations. How then do I have any say whatsoever in how my money is spent. I DONT!

BTW I am quite well educated thank you very much.

Could not agree more around your statement MD.

Further more - Each of those organisations have an over inflated opinion of their value and representation, they are toothless ineffective and will be misguided in their direction towards safety. This forum and group will be turned and used to extend the current manipulation of data and information to create self generated issues to justify their existence.

There are three kinds of lies; "Lies, damned lies, and statistics"!
Mark Twain

[Shadows]

For $2 million I'll undertake to remove every WRB in the country installed either on the roadside or within less than 3.5 metres of the traffic line.

WRB's are only responsible for one motorcycling fatality in this country that I'm aware of. That, and that in order to actually to hit one, a rider must already be in the shit -and that shit won't be as a result of the WRB being there. Root cause and all that.

I hate WRB's too, but I'd rather my money was spent, among other things, to educate truck drivers and roading contractors that leaving diesel and gravel all over the roads is unacceptable, and towards enforcing the laws surrounding that.

Teaching drivers to move their heads slightly to look over their shoulders before changing lanes wouldn't go amiss either.

[riffer]

Could not agree more around your statement MD.

Further more - Each of those organisations have an over inflated opinion of their value and representation, they are toothless ineffective and will be misguided in their direction towards safety. This forum and group will be turned and used to extend the current manipulation of data and information to create self generated issues to justify their existence.

There are three kinds of lies; "Lies, damned lies, and statistics"!
Mark Twain

And as I said before, WHERE'S YOUR BETTER IDEAS?

[IdunBrokdItAgin]

Never mind

[rustic101]

And as I said before, WHERE'S YOUR BETTER IDEAS?

I have a tonne, believe me, ranging from interpersonal attributes of individuals through to infrastructure.

So you say they will represent 250,000 motorcyclists, give or take. That figure is an example of my previous post; a gross exaggeration, in fact my first thought was 'Bullshit' or will the group force their ideas onto any individual that rides?.

The individuals within that group are interested in one thing more than safety - Its their own personal interests, I will not be drawn on commenting on here or singling out specific individuals..

[riffer]

I have a tonne, believe me, ranging from interpersonal attributes of individuals through to infrastructure.

So you say they will represent 250,000 motorcyclists, give or take. That figure is an example of my previous post; a gross exaggeration, in fact my first thought was 'Bullshit' or will the group force their ideas onto any individual that rides?.

The individuals within that group are interested in one thing more than safety - Its their own personal interests, I will not be drawn on commenting on here or singling out specific individuals..

For sure mate, but the point of the MSF is safety. So therefore that's the framework that we have to work in, for better or for worse. The government didn't have to set this up. They could have just said "Stuff you you're paying another $500-odd".

Wouldn't you rather have some motorcyclists making choices than accountants? Because I tell you what, the accountants are running ACC at the moment.

And how's that working out for you? It ain't working out so good for me...

I have yet to see the terms of reference the MSF works under. I have a bit of info, not much more than you. So I can't really comment on whether individuals self-interest will over-ride their judgement. Time will tell of course.

But I seriously think we need to start coming up with some ideas to present to MSFC rather than bagging the people on it.

[Ocean1]

...educate truck drivers and roading contractors... Teaching drivers to move their heads slightly to look over their shoulders before changing lanes...

Dude, I'm an engineer. The REAL art of the possible. I leave all that educating, training and teaching shit to people who believe in it.


They're wrong, but at least there's meaning in their lives, eh?



*One old Kenworth and an 800hp Jiffy saw and I'd be finished in a month.*

[rustic101]

For sure mate, but the point of the MSF is safety. So therefore that's the framework that we have to work in, for better or for worse. The government didn't have to set this up. They could have just said "Stuff you you're paying another $500-odd".

Wouldn't you rather have some motorcyclists making choices than accountants? Because I tell you what, the accountants are running ACC at the moment.

And how's that working out for you? It ain't working out so good for me...

I have yet to see the terms of reference the MSF works under. I have a bit of info, not much more than you. So I can't really comment on whether individuals self-interest will over-ride their judgement. Time will tell of course.

But I seriously think we need to start coming up with some ideas to present to MSFC rather than bagging the people on it.

There is nothing new this group will establish that either does not already exist in NZ Policy, Legislation, Council By Law, Coronial Recommendation or International Best Practice.

There are currently a number of Govt Agencies and NGO's already in place to manage and administer all of these, further more there are private companies providing safety advice and training.

What has just occurred is another layer of bureaucratic self importance. If you think this group will reduce or affect the number of deaths on our roads, believe me when I say they won't. The one thing they will never shape is the human mind for every second it is behind the handle bars with the hand on the throttle.

I've said it before this is a generated solution for a generated issue that does not exist. An example is all the individuals that are anti WRB, yet only one rider has been killed by these and it was not the WRB fault, believe me I've read the facts for that case...

[riffer]

The one think they will never shape is the human mind for every second it is behind the handle bars with the hand on the throttle.

And this is a big problem because if you are proven to be right they may just well decide that we're not worth allowing to continue our practice.

Real helpful.

FWIW I disagree. And I find this "extra layer of burearacy" a whole lot more positive than another bunch of anti-speeding ads or simply spending 2 million dollars on some more hidden speed cameras.

Start preparing your submissions.