Compulsory ATGATT Yay or Nay

[steve_t]

BUT since I'm not one for a nanny state and since I believe people should have a choice in how seriously they take their own safety I think a better solution would be to provide incentives for and subsidize those that do reduce the risk of injury by wearing ATGATT.

If you actually could have a system that subsidises ATGATT riders, who is going to pay for the shortfall? Do you raise rego by $200 across the board and then look to give subsidies to the ATGATT's while not subsidising the NoGears?

[Hellzie]

If you actually could have a system that subsidises ATGATT riders, who is going to pay for the shortfall? Do you raise rego by $200 across the board and then look to give subsidies to the ATGATT's while not subsidising the NoGears?

There will be no shortfall, raise the NoGears rego, and leave the ATGATT's rego as is.. or raise both but proportionally less for ATGATTs.

The thing that bothers me is the defeatist attitudes, why is it that if an alternative is suggested, for something that rewards good behaviour, everyone puts it in the impossible or too hard basket??? (not directed at you Steve_T)

[bogan]

The thing that bothers me is the defeatist attitudes, why is it that if an alternative is suggested, for something that rewards good behaviour, everyone puts it in the impossible or too hard basket??? (not directed at you Steve_T)

But does it reward good behaviour? It rewards people who put on more gear, good gear does not make good riders! Higher on the list would be to reward good riders, no claims bonus for instance.

Either way, look at the big picture, start down this road, and the risk factors must be applied to everything. The only logical conclusion being private accident (and likely health) insurance for everything, is that what you want?

[Hellzie]

But does it reward good behaviour? It rewards people who put on more gear, good gear does not make good riders! Higher on the list would be to reward good riders, no claims bonus for instance.

Either way, look at the big picture, start down this road, and the risk factors must be applied to everything. The only logical conclusion being private accident (and likely health) insurance for everything, is that what you want?

That's true, but in the case of an accident (which can happen to good riders) good gear is likely to result in less damage which should result in less ACC payout. And yes, I agree, reward good riders via no claims bonus and reduced rego etc for people that do certain courses etc.

Why is private the logical conclusion? In the same way that different CC ratings incur different rego amounts, you could do the same for ATGATT and / or courses / good riders (good track record).

[bogan]

Why is private the logical conclusion? In the same way that different CC ratings incur different rego amounts, you could do the same for ATGATT and / or courses / good riders (good track record).

Different cc amounts have been around for less than a year, and already people are calling for ATGATT discounts and no claims bonus's. If that happens, how long until bikers who pay more for their risk, call for rugby players to pay for theirs? or cyclists to pay for theirs? At which point opening it up to market competition will look like the best way to ensure fair levies for all, private insurance.

[grbaker]

Motorcycling is self correcting.

If you are stupid enough to wear shorts whilst riding a Wasp or Bee will see you right... a slide along the road will make a big point of your stupidity.

[Murray]

I think EVERYONE should be made to wear bubble wrap all the time!!! even when in bed in case they fall out during their sleep!!!

[Ocean1]

It's different when we have a socialist health system and we pay for eachothers choices

Get fucked. If you’re not happy paying for something you’re not getting then stop voting for socialist governments.

I think a better solution would be to provide incentives for and subsidize those that do reduce the risk of injury by wearing ATGATT.

and how exactly do you propose we do that then?

Easy. Better health care delivery.

With respect - Where's option five? 'Get. Fucked'.

Aye. Big black dog etc.

I'm getting brick marks on my forehead can someone else explain this better?

Yes.

GET FUCKED.

[Usarka]

Thanks Ocean1!

There will be no shortfall, raise the NoGears rego, and leave the ATGATT's rego as is.. or raise both but proportionally less for ATGATTs.

And what happens when everyone complies? I'll tell you - everybody's fees will increase because some one needs to pay for this new beuracracy that you've created.

The thing that bothers me is the defeatist attitudes, why is it that if an alternative is suggested, for something that rewards good behaviour, everyone puts it in the impossible or too hard basket??? (not directed at you Steve_T)

What bothers me is people who live in fairyland (directed at you). This has been talked about many times before (do a search) and has had reasoned debate. No one has come up with a workable solution (and most people don't want one).

You put forward an idea, people have said it's not workable with clear examples of why it would be very difficult to implement, and you haven't provided any logical counter to any of these points. You expect the government to wave a magic wand and it not cost us anything and call those of us who don't believe in magic defeatists. However some of us understand how legislation works and what pitfalls, issues, and loopholes exist in the real world.

If you want to get past the "defeatists" then answer some of the issues that have been identified. I'm not saying write the legislation, but for starters you need to tell us how in practice the person enforcing this law knows if a piece of kit is acceptable or not.

[Mom]

Where is the option - Bring back the man with the red flag?

[steve_t]

Where is the option - Bring back the man with the red flag?

Red flag? Do you mean yellow hat?

[Mom]

Red flag? Do you mean yellow hat?

? Fluro Vest even. A complete P/T in case someone misses it.

As bikers/motorcyclists (cause I know that some dont like to be reffered to as bikers) there is only one person that can keep us safe, that is US! Up to us if we chose to wear gear or not, there really is no excuse (in my mind) for not wearing the best protection you can afford, but dont you dare try to MAKE anyone wear it. We have compulsory helmets, let that be an end to it.

[NONONO]

That's true, but in the case of an accident (which can happen to good riders) good gear is likely to result in less damage which should result in less ACC payout. And yes, I agree, reward good riders via no claims bonus and reduced rego etc for people that do certain courses etc.

Why is private the logical conclusion? In the same way that different CC ratings incur different rego amounts, you could do the same for ATGATT and / or courses / good riders (good track record).

2 words, fuck off.
Whoever started this thread, where the fck have you been?
Here's an idea..make the gear part of the WOF, limited shelf life, as we know the functionality of anything decreases with time and new innovation..If it's not within that time frame, you don't get a WOF.
Make ALL gear day glo yellow, oh and how bout little flashing lights?
If you have an accident and you are not wearing every bit of gear, and it's not all within regulation time approved condition....no pay out.
Hey, why not add another 2 wheels, that will reduce the RISK.
Put a shell around the chassis and why not add a couple of seat belts?
FFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[steve_t]

? Fluro Vest even. A complete P/T in case someone misses it.

LOL, sorry, if you've not heard of the man in the yellow hat, he had a monkey named Curious George. You may be too young to remember them

[Latte]

Why not go full attgatt - wrap 3-4 inches of steel around us , and add 2 extra wheels for stability. Maybe a belt to stop us impacting the steel as well.

If we did it right we could even make space for passengers etc......