Motorcycle ACTION Now!

[idleidolidyll]

Fair enough, opinion respected, but is cutting all ties with these groups that have so much more to offer in both expertise, experience and knowledge a good move?

Any action needs support from all factors. These groups can provide access to media and people of influence. Is it wise to totally discount this?

I’m not saying do not get stuck in and have a crack, I’m merely saying that to paint all the biker groups with the ‘chicken stick’ can do more damage to the overall campaign.

No, it is NOT worthwhile organizing with the extant groups. Some have officially eschewed such action already and others have made it clear they are not interested.
This is an independent action they can disavow but point to in discussions as evidence of just how pissed off bikers are at being ignored, deliberately discriminated against and disrespected.

[SPman]

Perhaps you need to import some French motorcyclists. They seem to know how to organise good protests of a disruptive nature.
But then...the French are more inclined to take to the streets...having been right royaly fucked over so many times in the last 2-300 years, they know and value their freedoms more than most antipodeans seem to.........

[idleidolidyll]

Perhaps you need to import some French motorcyclists. They seem to know how to organise good protests of a disruptive nature.
But then...the French are more inclined to take to the streets...having been right royaly fucked over so many times in the last 2-300 years, they know and value their freedoms more than most antipodeans seem to.........

Yep, I favor the French and even the Aussie models.
Its well past time for New Zealand bikers to stand upright, pull up our trou and face our enemy with determination and action. The words our verbal advocates speak on our behalf will be all the stronger for it.

[Fatt Max]

No, it is NOT worthwhile organizing with the extant groups. Some have officially eschewed such action already and others have made it clear they are not interested.
This is an independent action they can disavow but point to in discussions as evidence of just how pissed off bikers are at being ignored, deliberately discriminated against and disrespected.

Ok, so what you are saying is that if these groups wanted to support you in your action, you would not accept their help unless it is in line with your intended activities.

What if this is support in respect of solid media coverage that will fly the biker flag and not sensationalise? What if a group came to you and said “look, we have some heavyweight media contacts that can carry this banner for us and get it out there”? What if a group offered you the support of their numbers? What if your action turns to shit and you find yourself out on a limb, could the weight of groups supporting you show that there is a united front?

Have you considered that this crusade of yours, admirable as it may be, could fall flat on its face and leave you and your cohorts with your dicks in the wind while those who we all want to make stand up and listen merely sip their Pimms and say what a bunch of dicks those bikers are…??

Its like cutting away the flesh that you may need to protect your exposed bones

[Fatt Max]

But if you are going to war you dont take the Salvation Army.

Fanny.

Nice one, I actually like that mate

[cheshirecat]

Those of you who've been watching know I'm dismayed and frustrated by the inaction of those who claim to represent motorcyclists in NZ.

We have any number of people talking on our behalf but that's been happening for years and we've seen little to no movement from government except appoint a group to investigate. I believe that will be a whitewash or dismissed in the run up to, and following the general election.

With that election looming, NOW is the right time to hit the streets and take real action. Given debate and discussions here over the last month or so, it seems there is little likelihood that one of the existing groups representing us will take action any time soon.

I've been asked to help recruit and guide people on appropriate action we can take individually and in groups to bring real attention to our various causes.

Those of you prepared to get out and be seen to be doing something, those of you thinking that civil disobedience or similar just might be necessary; please pm me and register your interest.

I'll need your location and a contact phone number; preferably a mobile number to be able to receive text messaging. Flash Mobs are a good way to circumvent those who would delay or misdirect us in our action.

As I live in Auckland, I'll have to start here. However, I do get around the country a bit and can make side calls on business trips. Even if you live outside Auckland, register your interest as we can share ideas and recruitment options.

Discussion of actual action options should be carefully worded. don't drop yourself in it with the law who are watching. Register first and we can work out communication methods via pm, txt messaging, email etc.

Set up a FB ad twiter page - you'd be surprised (pleasantly I hope) as to how many sign up

[DougieNZ]

EASY:
Have a go at those "proporting to represent motorcyclists"
Say that they are "in the pockets of the politicians"
Moan that they "are not doing what us REAL motorcylists want them to"

MORE DIFFICULT
Organise your own campaign AND win the hearts and minds of your fellow motorcyclists
Be more effective than those that you are complaining about
Having to back up works and rhetoric with effective action

I find that the many campaigns on here that have promulgated illegal behaviour or complained about the various campaigns either do not get the required support to be effective or find that things are perhaps a little less easy than what they think and quickly give up the fight and disappear never to be heard from again. I don't want to prejudge anything - but - anyone that won't divulge details of their plans because of a police presence on the forum make me very suspicious that they intend to get up to some activity which unecessarily impinges on the rights of other citizens to go about their lawful business.

I, for a vast array of reasons, will not be involving myself in such a campaign. History will say that public opinion wins and loses battles like this. Annoy the public at large and you will not only lose the battle but will be dong motorcyclists a huge disservice - just what you are accusing others of doing now. Ironic!

[nodrog:Me]

EASY:
Have a go at those "proporting to represent motorcyclists"
Say that they are "in the pockets of the politicians"
Moan that they "are not doing what us REAL motorcylists want them to"

MORE DIFFICULT
Organise your own campaign AND win the hearts and minds of your fellow motorcyclists
Be more effective than those that you are complaining about
Having to back up works and rhetoric with effective action

I find that the many campaigns on here that have promulgated illegal behaviour or co mplained about the various campaigns either do not get the required support to be effective or find that things are perhaps a little less easy than what they think and quickly give up the fight and disappear never to be heard from again.

I don't want to prejudge anything - but - anyone that won't divulge details of their plans because of a police presence on the forum make me very suspicious that they intend to get up to some illegal activity which impinges on the rights of other citizens to go about their lawful business.

I, for a vast array of reasons, will not be involving myself in such a campaign. History will say that public opinion wins and loses battles like this. Annoy the public at large and you will not only lose the battle but will be dong motorcyclists a huge disservice - just what you are accusing others of doing now. Ironic!

God you sound like a right Cream Puff! I suppose you were the one of many who went out and "taught ACC a lesson" by purchasing 15 months of registration?

Fanny.

[idleidolidyll]

Ok, so what you are saying is that if these groups wanted to support you in your action, you would not accept their help unless it is in line with your intended activities.

What if this is support in respect of solid media coverage that will fly the biker flag and not sensationalise? What if a group came to you and said “look, we have some heavyweight media contacts that can carry this banner for us and get it out there”? What if a group offered you the support of their numbers? What if your action turns to shit and you find yourself out on a limb, could the weight of groups supporting you show that there is a united front?

Have you considered that this crusade of yours, admirable as it may be, could fall flat on its face and leave you and your cohorts with your dicks in the wind while those who we all want to make stand up and listen merely sip their Pimms and say what a bunch of dicks those bikers are…??

Its like cutting away the flesh that you may need to protect your exposed bones

Given the almost complete lack of decent media coverage since 2009: I doubt that the media contacts they hold are of any use to us.

However, I and others in this initiative are happy to talk to anyone and evaluate opportunities as they arise. If something valid is proposed, of course we will listen. However, I'm not going to commit anyone he to be guided by the rules and regulations of any of the extant orgs.

BTW; the are a lot of diffent fallacy argument. One is to put your own words or opinions into anothers mouth. Instead of telling me what I think, try asking. I said nothing of the sort and I reject your fallacy argument.

It seems obvious that you do not support this initiative and I suspect you have an allegiance to one of the other groups talking to government. that's fine but no, the extant groups have shown no initiative so far with respect to action and for that alone I would not support aligning officially with them. Of course our objectives are the same. They have rejected the action path and that is their right. we have not and will do so with or without their help.

[idleidolidyll]

Set up a FB ad twiter page - you'd be surprised (pleasantly I hope) as to how many sign up

Great idea, I'll do that today and post details

That will also achieve another goal; to take us away from the whim of KB moderators and management as this is a private forum and they have often said it is a dictatorship not a democracy

[SPman]

get up to some activity which unecessarily impinges on the rights of other citizens to go about their lawful business.

Oh...you mean like.......a demonstration or protest.
It seems the only way you can get many people to even notice, these days, is exactly that - impinge on the rights of others!
Let's face it, those in charge have no qualms at all, impinging on the rights and freedoms of the citizens - it's about time to start impinging on their fucking pockets for a change, the thieving, lying, corrupt, hypocritical arseholes!!

[idleidolidyll]

Oh...you mean like.......a demonstration or protest.
It seems the only way you can get many people to even notice, these days, is exactly that - impinge on the rights of others!
Let's face it, those in charge have no qualms at all, impinging on the rights and freedoms of the citizens - it's about time to start impinging on their fucking pockets for a change, the thieving, lying, corrupt, hypocritical arseholes!!

The fact is that government and council policies are effectively killing us, driving us off the road and silencing our voices.

WHAT ABOUT OUR RIGHTS?

[Fatt Max]

Given the almost complete lack of decent media coverage since 2009: I doubt that the media contacts they hold are of any use to us.

However, I and others in this initiative are happy to talk to anyone and evaluate opportunities as they arise. If something valid is proposed, of course we will listen. However, I'm not going to commit anyone he to be guided by the rules and regulations of any of the extant orgs.

BTW; the are a lot of diffent fallacy argument. One is to put your own words or opinions into anothers mouth. Instead of telling me what I think, try asking. I said nothing of the sort and I reject your fallacy argument.

It seems obvious that you do not support this initiative and I suspect you have an allegiance to one of the other groups talking to government. that's fine but no, the extant groups have shown no initiative so far with respect to action and for that alone I would not support aligning officially with them. Of course our objectives are the same. They have rejected the action path and that is their right. we have not and will do so with or without their help.

Well, good luck with it then sweetheart, keep the faith and all that xx

[BoristheBiter]

The fact is that government and council policies are effectively killing us, driving us off the road and silencing our voices.

WHAT ABOUT OUR RIGHTS?

We are only a small group so your voice is very low anyway.
What are these government and council policies?

This is the same sort of thing that has been happening to gun owners for god know how long. I watched as various groups, yes i was in one, talked about what the best way forward was and as no one could agree it, like the motorcycling community, still remains divided.

If everyone could put there differences aside we could get quite a big group but i can't see that happing and as we are too small a group to have a big voice the government, no matter who is in power, have bigger things to worry about than if someone is on a bike or not.

I went down to wellington and shouted bullshit with everyone else, little difference that it did. They played us, and everyone else, so no one noticed when diesel ACC went up.

Direct action, unless it has a massive backing by the general public, will do nothing but add demerit's or convictions and as most of the public couldn't give a shit i would say your pushing shit up hill, but good luck anyway i think you might need it.

[idleidolidyll]

I'm adjourning for a bit.
Christchurch has just been hit with another devastating earthquake and this time people have died.

I lived there for 10 years and have many friends in and around the city.
I'm out for a while sending txts to check out if they are OK.